The Logic Off Topic list

I do not state that Saudi Arabia faces imminent revolt.  Far from it.

Some of these links don't seem terribly independent, particularly
ain-al-yaqeem - take a look through their stories.  NDU's a pretty good
resource though and despite what some think is fairly independent.

The NDU article along with the article at
http://www.fas.org/asmp/profiles/saudi_arabia.htm both highlight how the
public welfare rises and falls with oil and its fortunes.  The problem is
not so much that people are turned into the streets but that as the social
state declines you generally increase unrest; it's all about relative
deprivation.  The standard of living in France in 1798 was pretty good
all-in-all, but it was a hell of a lot worse than it had been a generation
prior.  The French of that day still lived very much in the first world, so
to speak, as well.

You do have an underlying problem very similar to the Shah's Iran.  Saudi
Arabia is a brutal totalitarian state by all accounts and like many of those
the level of dissent is usually there but masked.  You might recall that
popular opinion (not academic opinion) considered the Shah's Iran quite
stable.

The most thorough article I could find that was reasonably objective was at
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/meria/journal/1999/issue4/jv3n4a4.html .This
is a LOT of reading if you're not too interested but if interested it seems
to sum up the various issues pretty well.

Is it stable/durable?  Perhaps, perhaps not.  There is no factual way to
know.

But I think factually there simply are a lot of issues and there are a
"large" number that oppose the government in a fundamental way.

----- Original Message -----
From: "marc lindahl" <marc@...>
To: <logic-ot@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2001 9:21 PM
Subject: Re: [L-OT] Re: OT Goodbye


>
>
> > From: "Wilson Zorn" <wilson.zorn@...>
> >
> > The article indicates, "In the current Arab climate of hostility to
Israel
> > and its US backers, many Saudis resent their government's friendship
with
> > the West. "  "Many" I take to be "large", though whether it's a majority
or
> > simply significant, it's unclear.
>
> Yes it is, and a prime example of how media can subtly 'slant' a story.
>
> >  However, the article also states, "Their
> > immediate problem is unemployment. Unofficially it is running at more
than
> > 25%. " and "For the last few years per capita income has been falling
and
> > many poor Saudis are getting poorer. "  It is almost unheard of in any
> > nation for these conditions not to result in a large portion of the
> > population not disliking the leadership.
>
> Under what you or I might take as accompanying circumstances.  But this
> thought occurred to me -- does unemployment equal poverty in Saudi Arabia?
> I don't know, but it's a very rich place, and they might have a gold
> embroidered safety net.
> (http://www.ain-al-yaqeen.com/issues/19971124/feat8en.htm)
> I'm reminded of visiting Norway years ago, and seeing these clean, well
> dressed youth hanging out on park benches.  My friend said "those are the
> heroin addicts."  In NYC, put it this way, junkies wish they had it so
good!
>
> Indications are that Saudis live very much in the so-called first world:
> http://www.ifc.org/camena/saudi.htm
> http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0107947.html
>
> I have yet to dig up anything that supports the claim of 25% unemployment,
> but it's undeniable that, like most countries, Saudi Arabia is complex and
> changing:
> http://www.ndu.edu/inss/strforum/forum125.html
>
> None of which support eminent revolt...
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>