The Logic Off Topic list

you ignore the 2 important things :
1. In 1947 NOBODY forced the Arab palesteins who lived in haifa / jaffa /in
Israel  to leave they listened to their own leadership who promised them "we
will destroy the Jewish country and you will return " the same leadership
that was in Lebanon and other Arab countries.
NOBODY forced them to leave their homes !.
the Arab DID force or threatened the Jews from the Arab worlds ! I know
because my family came from an Arab country and they lived in fear .- unlike
the Arabs here .
2. we want to live together with the Arab here in peace, not war . 
I think the only reason Sharon/ who ever rules in Israel has not declared a
Palestine country is their fear of uncontrolled terror and war from a
country which is only 30km beside you.
again enough facts for this thing.
you can search in neutral site, official site , and not
Arab-islam/israel-jewish sites and find that at least most ( in some things
they exaggerate )of the fact i forwarded were right.



-----Original Message-----
From: GAmoore@... [mailto:GAmoore@...]
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2001 3:40 PM
To: undisclosed-recipients
Subject: Re: fwd [L-OT] ... Holy Lands


Tiran wrote:
>   Crash Course on the Arab Israeli Conflict. 
>Here are some conveniently overlooked facts in the current Middle East
>situation. 
>HERE'S THE BRIEF FACTS ON THE ISRAELI CONFLICT TODAY....

I think its great that you offer another perspective. Was this your work, 
or where did it come from? It appears to be from some right wing Israeli 
source. Its too bad that we can't get an unbiased neutral background of 
the whole thing, and then have the parties come to a fair and equitable 
solution. I'll give my understanding history but I freely admit it may be 
flawed.

I think this document proves little - other than the fact that Israeli's 
are digging down to the bottom of the barrel to justify one of the most 
terrible invasions and displacement of another people. 
- When Hitler invaded areas, and removed the Jews to displaced them with 
Germans, I think the Germans were full of justifications of a former 
greater Arian father land. I know they used that reason to seize Allsace 
and Lorraine in France, Austria, and people German heritage in 
Czechoslovakia. The Germans were very much into their own mythology of 
greatness and they did have a long civilization that was never conquered 
by the Romans, and in fact ambushed and completely three legions. But 
despite the history, the displacement of Jews by Germans was viewed as 
horrible, and that aggression was fought back as a part of WWII. It did 
not stand.
- When Iraq Invaded Kuwait, and took over, and many fled. That was naked 
aggression, and it was not allowed to stand. 
- However, what Israel has does is slightly more gradual, but the affect 
is the same.

Yes, there was some sort of Jewish government in ancient times, although 
it was under the control of the Romans for a period about 2,000 years 
ago. At some point, and I'm not sure why or how, the Jews seemed to have 
fled and dispersed all over the world - some in Africa, some in the 
Middle East, many in Russia and Europe. In the intervening 2,000 years, 
that area was inhabited by Arabic people.

When you complain that they didn't identify themselves as Palestinian 
until the 1960's, you need to understand that the Arabic people that 
inhabit the middle east were largely one group of people speaking a 
common language. The countries as we know them now - Jordan, Syria, 
Saudi, Iraq, Kuwait, etc. were not created the same way France and 
Germany were created as groups of people speaking the same language and 
with a common history. No, these borders were drawn up on a map somewhat 
arbitrarily by the colonial powers, I think England. Thats why you have a 
kurdish people living in Turkey and Iraq. Thats why Iraq was not too 
bothered about changing the border he was given.

So those people living peacefully in their homes and farms in the 1940s 
may not have had a name, but that doesn't mean they didn't exist, and had 
not lived there for generation after generation. The Jewish foreigners 
who came to Palstine to create Israel had less right than the Indians to 
come back to New York City and kick out the white people and take it over 
again. That was only 300 years ago they lost out, not 2,000 years ago.l

The desecration of the Jewish Holy sites (about 40 years ago) was 
unacceptable. But no justification for the conquest of that land. If 
someone desecrates a Church in Russia, should the US invade and take over 
that land as the 51st state?



 

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