The Logic Off Topic list

> Is it just possible that you are by degrees a victim of the emperers new
> cloths? That if one took e's in a math class they
> might also experience a trance?

Don't be silly. I merely suggested that they greatly affect the way the
music is perceived.  Nothing more.  It is 10 years down the line now since I
started clubbing.  Any naive illussions I may have had, have long gone.
Doesn't it say something that after all this time I still have such great
enthusiasm for it all?

> Your right, there is "some" good trance,
> like there is "some" good in almost any music or musical concept!
> But basically i find most trance and techno heads to
> be pretty small minded. They inflict their imagined little
> dance club rules onto themselves and onto each other. It's a peer
> pressure thing. The reality is, a bunch of computer geeks
> got a hold of sequencers and the lack of depth to their
> musical abilities and depth of their computer abilities left them with
> default minimalism.

You get all sorts of people in the club scene, it is very big after all. It
would be small minded of you to generalise or tar everyone with the same
brush.   Were individuals.  Nobody follows a set of rules laid down by
anyone else.

> In general i find almost all of the little sub genres
> of techno laughable. Change the feel of the high
> hat and rename the genre sort of stuff. It's all about over defining,
> so that the defining justifies the lack of inspiration. And voilla
> we have over defined disposable music that's often concept justified only,
> rather than substance justified.

The sub genre names are just descriptions to allows people to know what is
being talked about.   They have no actual effect on the scene.   I do not
see how a loose description such as 'energy trance'  can seriously affect
the way anyone actually writes it.


>   By the way, Kids dance. Kid's have always danced. Kids like to think
> their into something new. Kids have always liked to think
> they were into something new. Because lots of kids dance to trance
> does not mean that the bulk of it is good. Although i know that most
> conservative people these days think that "success equals good", remember
> that there have also been alot of successful fascists who were supported
by
> the bulk of their populations.

This statement is in total agreement with stuff I wrote in earlier postings.
Read my posts again.  I have to listen to 10 records to find one good one.


> I find your comment that you wouldn't play this or that
> out at a club very typical. Why not? You might break a "club rule"????
> Don't you have different spontanious moods thru out a night? Can't you be
> true to yourself rather than true to a invented genre??

Firstly clubs have music policies.  Crowds expect certain types of music.
You play what you perceive _they_ want to hear.  Only a detroit techno dj
would be so self-important and arrogant to think that they could play
anything and to hell with what the crowd wants.  If a crowd doesn't like the
music policy of  a club there are plenty of others that will offer what they
want.   When I say that I would not play something at a club, I am talking
about just those clubs _I_ play at.  I am not saying that it is not suitable
for any club.   8 years of dj'ing experience has taught me what music the
crowds I play to are more likely to enjoy.   The example I gave before was a
BT track.   I personally would not play it because it a breaks tune, not
trance.   The last time I tried to play some breaks to a trance crowd,
people came up and suggested that I stick to trance.   I am one of the more
adventerous dj's when it comes to trying out new stuff on a crowd,  but
ultimately I follow their wishes.

> I was in europe in the early 90's, having electronic dance guys
> come and borrow my adats so that they could make people think
> that the led's on them were actually doing something while
> they played a dat in the backround....lol ..fraud......

Well I can tell you that people in the crowd don't give a flying f***.
Only people in the music industry seem to care about that one.    I know
bands that play off DAT and they have never received any complaints from
people in the crowd.  Dance music is totaly preprogrammed most of the time
and cannot be played live.    Those that attempt to play  live, offer music
that is way below the standard of their vinyl releases thus dissappointing
the audience.  As long as the audience is happy, all the other critics can
go to hell.

>  I absolutely beleive that there is good music to be found
> in trance, and i absolutely beleive that by and large most
> of it is shite!

90% is shite agreed.   The remaining good 10%  accounts for maybe 30-40
records a week and is plenty enought to keep the scene going.

>I watched a couple of friends pump out dance
> singles in a weekend just to get the 1000 pound checks.
> And they were considered very credible, lol...., if you only new how
> little they cared!

Again, it would be small minded to believe that everybody has this cynical
approach.   I believe most do it for the love of it and get little financial
reward.


> A good song or good music has nothing to do with whether it
> has this or that in it! Vocals no vocals, analogue or digital.
> Remember when all the techno producers blathered on and on about
> analogue???

??? This is in total agreement with stuff I have already wriiten.  Re-read
my posts.


> I like rebellious music, music without laws. Music that uses, or doesn't
> use, any tool at any time without being restrained by some pointless
attempt
> to fit into neat little (and i mean very little) sub genre boxes.

I don't know why you think trance should be rebelious.   It is simply a tool
with a job to do and it does it very well.   You seem to be very hung up on
'sub genre boxes'.   I can assure you that they do not influence anything.
They are merely a means of description.

> I say To hell with all the little conservative sub genre stuff. How bout
> really being free and just playing and writing anything you feel like at
any
> time, instead of playing with self imposed rules to make the conservative
> kids happy??? What do ya say Hector?

Your free to write what you want.  So is everybody else.   There are no
lemmings.   Some people make a particular type of music because it has been
shown that crowds like it.   There is always room for
experimentation/innovation within a genre without having to do something
drastic like replacing a '4 to floor' beat with a breakbeat or whacking in a
saxophone solo.    Music policies/restrictions exist at clubs so that
punters get to hear what they paid to hear.   There is always a club
somewhere that will cater to their tastes.   There is no point in going out
for a night to a techno club, expecting to hear that music, and then have
some 'rebelious' dj play a new garage/country hybrid music at them.  You can
just imagine people complaining to the dj,  and getting the reply; "F*** off
you conservative w*nk*rs, I'm doing this for your own good!"

regards Hector.