The Logic Off Topic list

Hi Arvid,

>Sorry for asking this on this list since we are not supposed to talk about
>the list on the list, but I have sent mails directly to Joeri that haven't
>been answered (yet - sent 20/5).
>
Yes, and there are many older ones that I haven't answered yet either. 
I'm working my way back, but it takes time.

>Me and the LUG go way back and I miss a feature now that it had earlier.
>After moderating the posts to the LUG we can't have _really urgent_ help
>here anymore.
>
True. :(

>We should really have a urgent-logic-users@yahoogroups.com mailing list that
>isn't moderated.
>It could be moderatet so that people that misuse it would get banned,
>but....You'll get the picture :)
>What's your oppinion?
>
The idea is nice, but there are some issues:
1. How to create the subscriber base? Port everyone or just mention that 
the list exists and hope many people subscribe?
2. I wonder whether people will actually use it for urgent matters only.

If we can resolve these matters, then it could be a good idea imo.

Cheers,
Joeri

>
>
>--
>Arvid Solvang
>http://www.viagram.no/
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
>
>
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>  
>

-- 
(I have recently switched from an azerty keyboard layout to qwerty, so please disregard any typing errors in this mail)

Joeri Vankeirsbilck
joeri@...

Belway Productions      -     http://www.belway.com
List-admin   Logic-users/SoundD*ver-users/Logic-TDM

>
>  >Me and the LUG go way back and I miss a feature now that it had earlier.

Me too :-)

>  >After moderating the posts to the LUG we can't have _really urgent_ help
>  >here anymore.
>  >
>True. :(

Only as it is presently implemented.

>  >We should really have a urgent-logic-users@yahoogroups.com mailing list that
>  >isn't moderated.
>  >It could be moderatet so that people that misuse it would get banned,
>  >but....You'll get the picture :)

Any email admin can block the address of spammers and the like 
without actually having to read/vet every post. A seperate list is 
not necessary.

>  >What's your oppinion?
>  >
>The idea is nice, but there are some issues:
>1. How to create the subscriber base? Port everyone or just mention that
>the list exists and hope many people subscribe?

Pass thru any post marked "urgent"  or "help" without delay. Keep it 
on the main list. Simple. Fast. No fuss.

>2. I wonder whether people will actually use it for urgent matters only.

If people use the "help" tag as a ruse to post spam, propaganda, porn 
etc etc - put them in the killfile. If the odd off colour post gets 
thru before admin can attend to it I think the subscribers would be 
more than understanding.

Thoughts from the mind of Joeri Vankeirsbilck, 26-06-2002:

>  >We should really have a urgent-logic-users@yahoogroups.com mailing list that
>>isn't moderated.
>>It could be moderatet so that people that misuse it would get banned,
>>but....You'll get the picture :)
>>What's your oppinion?
>>
>The idea is nice, but there are some issues:
>1. How to create the subscriber base? Port everyone or just mention that
>the list exists and hope many people subscribe?
>2. I wonder whether people will actually use it for urgent matters only.
>
>If we can resolve these matters, then it could be a good idea imo.

A separate group won't work imo,unless youforce everyone to subscribe 
to it -- in which case many wouldstart using it as a new unmoderated 
LUG, I'm afraid.

Would it be possible to have an [URGENT] tag in subject lines, such 
that 1) the original post marked with it passes thru unmoderated but 
2) replies are moderated as usual?
In that case, someone answering such a mail should do so privately 
(since it's urgent), people simply keeping old subject lines for new 
subjects would still be moderated (since replies are moderated), and 
all you have to worry about is those few that would misue the tag to 
get their posts through unmoderated (which should be easy eanough to 
catch and "punish").

>(I have recently switched from an azerty keyboard layout to qwerty, 
>so please disregard any typing errors in this mail)

Welcome in the regular world :-).

-- 
Hendrik Jan Veenstra  <h@...>
Omega Art: http://www.ision.nl/users/h/index.html

----- Original Message -----

From: "Joeri Vankeirsbilck" <joeri@...>

> The idea is nice, but there are some issues:
> 1. How to create the subscriber base? Port everyone or just mention that
> the list exists and hope many people subscribe?

We could create the group called.
urgent-logic-users@yahoogroups.com
port all users and have a very strict list rule sent out to all subscribers.

> 2. I wonder whether people will actually use it for urgent matters only.

In the beginning a lot of people probably will missuse it and they should be
banned from the list immidiatly and they should activly have to resubscribe
to get on to the list again.

First I though this was going to be a lot of job, but basicly this list
shouldn't have more than a mail a day or something.

--
Arvid Solvang
http://www.viagram.no/

Hi,

>> >What's your oppinion?
>> >
>>The idea is nice, but there are some issues:
>>1. How to create the subscriber base? Port everyone or just mention that
>>the list exists and hope many people subscribe?
>>    
>>
>Pass thru any post marked "urgent"  or "help" without delay. Keep it 
>on the main list. Simple. Fast. No fuss.
>
That would mean someone should monitor the LUG at all times to approve 
it... unless it's automated.

>Would it be possible to have an [URGENT] tag in subject lines, such 
>that 1) the original post marked with it passes thru unmoderated but 
>2) replies are moderated as usual?
>In that case, someone answering such a mail should do so privately 
>(since it's urgent), people simply keeping old subject lines for new 
>subjects would still be moderated (since replies are moderated), and 
>all you have to worry about is those few that would misue the tag to 
>get their posts through unmoderated (which should be easy eanough to 
>catch and "punish").
>
It's not possible at Yahoo to pass mails without moderation based on 
their subject lines.
HOWEVER, it is possible to do "unmoderate" specific email addresses.... 
so if we set up an email address that forwards the email to the LUG, we 
have the same effect. The person who has an urgent question then simply 
mails to that address and the email is forwarded to the LUG.
We'll have to make sure the email address is only used for real 
emergencies though.

So, what's the best name for that email address? All suggestions 
welcome. (only the part before the @ is relevant... e.g. "urgenthelp@...")
As soon as we have a name we all agree on, I'll set it up for a test-run.

Cheers,
Joeri

-- 
(I have recently switched from an azerty keyboard layout to qwerty, so please disregard any typing errors in this mail)

Joeri Vankeirsbilck
joeri@...

Belway Productions      -     http://www.belway.com
List-admin   Logic-users/SoundD*ver-users/Logic-TDM

Arvid Solvang wrote:

>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Joeri Vankeirsbilck" <joeri@...>
>
>>The idea is nice, but there are some issues:
>>1. How to create the subscriber base? Port everyone or just mention that
>>the list exists and hope many people subscribe?
>>    
>>
>
>We could create the group called.
>urgent-logic-users@yahoogroups.com
>port all users and have a very strict list rule sent out to all subscribers.
>
I personally prefer the alternative idea to set up an "urgent" account 
within the existing lists. It's easier, both for the users as well as 
the admins, and imo it'll be more effective..

Is that idea ok for you?


-- 
(I have recently switched from an azerty keyboard layout to qwerty, so please disregard any typing errors in this mail)

Joeri Vankeirsbilck
joeri@...

Belway Productions      -     http://www.belway.com
List-admin   Logic-users/SoundD*ver-users/Logic-TDM

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Joeri Vankeirsbilck" <joeri@...>

> I personally prefer the alternative idea to set up an "urgent" account 
> within the existing lists. It's easier, both for the users as well as 
> the admins, and imo it'll be more effective..
> 
> Is that idea ok for you?

Of course - do what you think is best.
As long as it is possible to get urgent help it is OK for me.

-- 
Arvid Solvang
http://www.viagram.no/

Thoughts from the mind of Joeri Vankeirsbilck, 26-06-2002:

>HOWEVER, it is possible to do "unmoderate" specific email addresses....
>so if we set up an email address that forwards the email to the LUG, we
>have the same effect. The person who has an urgent question then simply
>mails to that address and the email is forwarded to the LUG.
>We'll have to make sure the email address is only used for real
>emergencies though.
>
>So, what's the best name for that email address? All suggestions
>welcome. (only the part before the @ is relevant... e.g. "urgenthelp@...")
>As soon as we have a name we all agree on, I'll set it up for a test-run.

logic-urgent seems to make sense -- next to logic-users and logic-ot...

-- 
Hendrik Jan Veenstra  <h@...>
Omega Art: http://www.ision.nl/users/h/index.html

Hendrik Jan Veenstra wrote:

  >So, what's the best name for that email address? All suggestions
  >welcome. (only the part before the @ is relevant... e.g. "urgenthelp@...")
  >As soon as we have a name we all agree on, I'll set it up for a test-run.

  logic-urgent seems to make sense -- next to logic-users and logic-ot...

    I second that as it follows thew theme of the list. Easy to remember. I think this would benefit everyone. You know sometimes you're in a pinch and you don't have a lot of time to wait for a mail to pass through, either in a session or right before. And you know how sometimes during those moments you just seem to always pass over the info in the manual, never seeing it. Sometimes you mind is just in a bind and it's a really simple problem but just misses you at the moment. I miss that "live" feeling about the LUG. I think the moderators have done an excellent job, it's just you can't help but loose a little character. 

    --Roger



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>
>
>  logic-urgent seems to make sense -- next to logic-users and logic-ot...
>
OK, I'll change it once I see the system works.

>    I second that as it follows thew theme of the list. Easy to remember. I think this would benefit everyone. You know sometimes you're in a pinch and you don't have a lot of time to wait for a mail to pass through, either in a session or right before. And you know how sometimes during those moments you just seem to always pass over the info in the manual, never seeing it. Sometimes you mind is just in a bind and it's a really simple problem but just misses you at the moment. I miss that "live" feeling about the LUG.
>
Note: it should only be used for urgent matters, like you have to make a 
deadline and that deadline happens to be today and suddenly you have a 
problem etc...
I'll try to set up some reasonable guidelines on that.

> I think the moderators have done an excellent job, it's just you can't help but loose a little character.
>
True, it's the price we pay for being a lage list. And yes, we're very 
strict most of the time... it's unfortunately the only way to go with 
such a list.

Bye,
J

-- 
(I have recently switched from an azerty keyboard layout to qwerty, so please disregard any typing errors in this mail)

Joeri Vankeirsbilck
joeri@...

Belway Productions      -     http://www.belway.com
List-admin   Logic-users/SoundD*ver-users/Logic-TDM

I have just setup Hammerfall DSP Cardbus/Multiface combination with Logic
Platinum 5.1.3 on a Toshiba Satellite Pro 4600 - Win 2K, 900MHz PIII with
384 Mb RAM. I can play the EVP88 and ESX24 with low latency though the
Hammerfall as midi and audio interface so RME have got their part of the
equation right.

However, Logic takes 8 minutes ( I am not kidding) to load each time --
this is with about 20 VST plugs installed -- and runs extremely slowly --
all graphics slow scrolling from one end of the Audio Mixer to the other is
glacially slow. This laptop has 16 Mb of
video memory on a Trident card -- not UMA as far as I know.

During loading Logic loads the modules and runs the usual sequence of Init
this and that -- all at a snails pace. My Desktop PIII800 loads same
version of Logic with heaps of Plugins in about 40 secs.

The hard drive is the standard 30 gig job and is running DMA. I have disabled
write behind cache and prioritised background tasks  -- no obvious changes
- any clues on the lack of performance? This is my first shot at laptop audio.

Regards,
Murray

--- In logic-ot@y..., Murray McDowall <murraymc@m...> wrote:
> I have just setup Hammerfall DSP Cardbus/Multiface combination with
Logic
> Platinum 5.1.3 on a Toshiba Satellite Pro 4600 - Win 2K, 900MHz PIII
with
> 384 Mb RAM. I can play the EVP88 and ESX24 with low latency though the
> Hammerfall as midi and audio interface so RME have got their part of the
> equation right.
> 
> However, Logic takes 8 minutes ( I am not kidding) to load each time --
> this is with about 20 VST plugs installed -- and runs extremely
slowly --
> all graphics slow scrolling from one end of the Audio Mixer to the
other is
> glacially slow. This laptop has 16 Mb of
> video memory on a Trident card -- not UMA as far as I know.
> 
> During loading Logic loads the modules and runs the usual sequence
of Init
> this and that -- all at a snails pace. My Desktop PIII800 loads same
> version of Logic with heaps of Plugins in about 40 secs.
> 
> The hard drive is the standard 30 gig job and is running DMA. I have
disabled
> write behind cache and prioritised background tasks  -- no obvious
changes
> - any clues on the lack of performance? This is my first shot at
laptop audio.
> 
> Regards,
> Murray

The problem as I see it is the VST needs CPU to run the plugins as
opposed to LOGIC's integrated EXS-ES2 etc. Also u need separate drive
just for audio 
Also the ATA controller for the hard drives are probably running at 100
mhz bus speed and u need to verify this with your supplier if the
controller cable is ATA 66/100 or 133 etc 
Redo an autoload without VST and see what happens? Also I suggest using 
an emi26 just for plugins and the hammerfall for tracking and see if
that helps. Remember Logic allows 2 or more driver sets silmultaneously

One card in Logic is just not practical these days with ASIO buffer
settings on the Hammefall card running midi and Audio what latency
running midi and audio are u getting with this card??

Goodluck

GRAMJESS