Lpc2000

Hi,

I'm using a TinyARM eval board which worked fine with a 10MHz crystal.
Then we replaced it with a 3.6864MHz crystal and now Philips Flash
utility says that it can't connect to the test board.

When measuring the UART TX pin with a scope, there is some traffic
when trying to connect. But Philips flash utility somehow doesn't
recognize.

My flash utility settings are:
Device: LPC2106
XTAL Freq. (kHz): 3686
Use Baud Rate: (have tried all available baudrates with no success)
Time-Out (sec): 10
"Use DTR/RTS" is unchecked (there are only Rx & Tx connected)

3.6864 MHz seems to be a fairly common clock rate and there should be
some standard baudrates available (divisor 32 for 115.2 kBaud, for
example)

Is anyone out there using LPC2106 w/ 3.6864 crystal and knows how to
use the flash utility for this setup? If not, are there any
alternatives to using the philips flash utility?

Obviously, I can't use a own bootloader because there is no
possibility to initially put it on the chip, when the flash utility
doesn't work.

Best regards,
Patrick

You have to use a crystal with a frequency higher then 10MHz or you 
can't use boot mode to program flash and so download your program. This 
is written on Philips user manual.
Best regards,
Massimo Manca, Micron Engineering

rattencremesuppe wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I'm using a TinyARM eval board which worked fine with a 10MHz crystal.
> Then we replaced it with a 3.6864MHz crystal and now Philips Flash
> utility says that it can't connect to the test board.
>
> When measuring the UART TX pin with a scope, there is some traffic
> when trying to connect. But Philips flash utility somehow doesn't
> recognize.
>
> My flash utility settings are:
> Device: LPC2106
> XTAL Freq. (kHz): 3686
> Use Baud Rate: (have tried all available baudrates with no success)
> Time-Out (sec): 10
> "Use DTR/RTS" is unchecked (there are only Rx & Tx connected)
>
> 3.6864 MHz seems to be a fairly common clock rate and there should be
> some standard baudrates available (divisor 32 for 115.2 kBaud, for
> example)
>
> Is anyone out there using LPC2106 w/ 3.6864 crystal and knows how to
> use the flash utility for this setup? If not, are there any
> alternatives to using the philips flash utility?
>
> Obviously, I can't use a own bootloader because there is no
> possibility to initially put it on the chip, when the flash utility
> doesn't work.
>
> Best regards,
> Patrick
>
>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

At 02:30 PM 8/11/04 +0000, you wrote:
>I'm using a TinyARM eval board which worked fine with a 10MHz crystal.
>Then we replaced it with a 3.6864MHz crystal and now Philips Flash
>utility says that it can't connect to the test board.

My data sheet shows the minimum crystal frequency as 10MHz.

Robert

" 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself.  There are always restrictions,
be they legal, genetic, or physical.  If you don't believe me, try to
chew a radio signal. "

                         Kelvin Throop, III

"rattencremesuppe" <tricknology@...> writes:

> I'm using a TinyARM eval board which worked fine with a 10MHz crystal.
> Then we replaced it with a 3.6864MHz crystal and now Philips Flash
> utility says that it can't connect to the test board.

Everyone agrees, apparently, that we need at least a 10 MHz crystal.
That's too bad.  

I've had in mind the idea of "de-tuning" the LPC210x to make it somewhat
of a PIC or MSP430 replacement.  I find the ARM much more pleasant to
program than the PIC and it would be nice to stick with a single CPU and
instruction set etc. etc. ("one size fits all").  Of course, the power
supply and sometimes the clock will still be more complicated than with
the PIC.

I'm using Martin Maurer's lpc21isp program from

   http://www.engelschall.com/~martin/lpc21xx/isp/index.html

as the bootloader running under Linux.  Here is the command I use with
my Olimex LPC2106 board with a 14.7456 MHz crystal:

     lpc21isp -bin combo.bin /dev/ttyS0 115200 14746

So, your crystal at 3.6864 MHz is exactly one fourth that speed.  I
wonder if you could use either the Philips bootloader or the Maurer
bootloader and /say/ the crystal speed is 14746 even though it is only a
quarter of that.  The bootloader (at least Maurer's) might not actually
set the serial port speed, I'm not sure.  In which case you might really
set the serial port speed to 9600 but say the baud rate is 38400, e.g.

     lpc21isp -bin combo.bin /dev/ttyS0 38400 14746

There might be some way to trick the bootloader and the chip into
programming the Flash.  Perhaps the Flash time periods would then be
off.  It might still work.

I think the source is available for Maurer's bootloader, so if it does
set the serial speed, we might be able to change it to set it to one
quarter of what it will tell the LPC chip.

I hope you will experiment further and let me know how it all works out.

Another possibility might be to have two clock sources.  A fast one used
just to do the initial programming of a custom bootloader (or perhaps
used everytime you program the Flash) and a slow one for normal use to
conserve power.  Just a thought.


-- 
Frank

At 01:01 AM 8/12/04 -0500, you wrote:
>There might be some way to trick the bootloader and the chip into
>programming the Flash.  Perhaps the Flash time periods would then be
>off.  It might still work.
>
>I think the source is available for Maurer's bootloader, so if it does
>set the serial speed, we might be able to change it to set it to one
>quarter of what it will tell the LPC chip.

I think you misunderstood.  The 10MHz limit is listed as the minimum 
operating frequency (for all conditions) not a minimum programming 
frequency.  I'd expect most chips would work at least a little below that 
but more than a factor of 2 is probably wishful thinking.

There are other small ARMs that will work with lower frequency inputs (The 
AD parts come to mind).

Robert


" 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself.  There are always restrictions,
be they legal, genetic, or physical.  If you don't believe me, try to
chew a radio signal. "

                         Kelvin Throop, III

Clarification for possible clocks into the LPC2000 family, applies to
all devices. 

The input to the crystal oscillator can be any frequency from 1-30 MHz. 
The input from the crystal oscillator into the PLL has to be in the
range of 10-15 MHz (hence the spec). 
The ISP program needs the 10 MHz to function properly  but a
modification of the other source file, refered to as Maurer's code
might make it work.

So to exclude any doubts, it is possible to run the LPC2xxx devices at
3.6864 MHz but you can not use the PLL!

Our recommendation for frequencies outside the "mainstream
applications", use a JTAG debugger  that supports programming such as
Ashling, ARM, Nohau, Hitex, Keil, IAR. Hope I did not forget anyone. 

Will be more clear in future User's Manuals, my apologies, Robert

--- In lpc2000@yahoogroups.com, Robert Adsett <subscriptions@a...> wrote:
> At 01:01 AM 8/12/04 -0500, you wrote:
> >There might be some way to trick the bootloader and the chip into
> >programming the Flash.  Perhaps the Flash time periods would then be
> >off.  It might still work.
> >
> >I think the source is available for Maurer's bootloader, so if it does
> >set the serial speed, we might be able to change it to set it to one
> >quarter of what it will tell the LPC chip.
> 
> I think you misunderstood.  The 10MHz limit is listed as the minimum 
> operating frequency (for all conditions) not a minimum programming 
> frequency.  I'd expect most chips would work at least a little below
that 
> but more than a factor of 2 is probably wishful thinking.
> 
> There are other small ARMs that will work with lower frequency
inputs (The 

> AD parts come to mind).
> 
> Robert
> 
> 
> " 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself.  There are always restrictions,
> be they legal, genetic, or physical.  If you don't believe me, try to
> chew a radio signal. "
> 
>                          Kelvin Throop, III

Sorry,
WRONG: > The input from the crystal oscillator into the PLL has to be
in the range of 10-15 MHz (hence the spec). 
CORRECT:  10-25 MHz
Robert

At 08:26 AM 8/13/04 +0000, you wrote:
>Clarification for possible clocks into the LPC2000 family, applies to
>all devices.
>
>The input to the crystal oscillator can be any frequency from 1-30 MHz.
>The input from the crystal oscillator into the PLL has to be in the
>range of 10-15 MHz (hence the spec).
>The ISP program needs the 10 MHz to function properly  but a
>modification of the other source file, refered to as Maurer's code
>might make it work.
>
>So to exclude any doubts, it is possible to run the LPC2xxx devices at
>3.6864 MHz but you can not use the PLL!
>
>Our recommendation for frequencies outside the "mainstream
>applications", use a JTAG debugger  that supports programming such as
>Ashling, ARM, Nohau, Hitex, Keil, IAR. Hope I did not forget anyone.
>
>Will be more clear in future User's Manuals, my apologies, Robert

Just to make sure all the proper places get noted.  I got the 10MHz-25MHz 
oscillator frequency range from the data sheet not the user manual.

Robert

" 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself.  There are always restrictions,
be they legal, genetic, or physical.  If you don't believe me, try to
chew a radio signal. "

                         Kelvin Throop, III