MOTM

Have you taken the time to try and record and send in demo's before trashing 
the ones on the site? Just curious? Lots of folks have worked hard on their 
own time to create these MOTM demo's and those songs you mentioned were 
produced in major label studios most likely with highly trained composers, 
technicians and producers. Just wondering,

Thomas(current apprentice to the innumerable Masters in the world)White


>From: "jar5831" <jar5831@...>
>Reply-To: motm@egroups.com
>To: <motm@egroups.com>
>Subject: [motm] Feeble MOTM demos!
>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 02:50:58 -0500
>
>I pity the pathetic MOTM site demos, when held against the standards of the 
>MASTERS..download 2 examples of 2 of the master's work from  napster
>
>1. Minotour  Dick Hyman 1969
>2. Sun Ra-Minimoog  Sun Ra date ???

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On Sun, 21 Jan 2001, jar5831 wrote:

> I pity the pathetic MOTM site demos, when held against the standards
 of the MASTERS..download 2 examples of 2 of the master's work from  napster

Oh, boy, now we have someone who fancies him/herself to be THE music
critic. I'm probably just as stupid to reply to this inane comment, but in
hope of some 'positiveness' coming out of this
(1) the demos are not meant to be 'works of art', but to demo certain
features or combinations of features of modules, and
(2) it is easy to select a musician's 'best' work to 'compare' (deride)
others' works, but how about the other 'less well known' pieces of those
same musicians?
(3) Which 'masterful' motm demo(s) is(are) yours?

I'll be the first to acknowledge that I am not a 'master.'  However, I
enjoy the experience of challenging myself with e-music and I'm at least
willing to seriously consider others -/+ thoughtful comments about my own 
'works'. You've obviously a bit to learn about the 'art' of critiquing
others' works.

Oh please--only a handful of critics who make such asinine comments actually
produce anything that can be held up against any "master's work."

So Jeffrey, I respectfully submit that your point 3) is moot. Of *course* he
hasn't produced a demo that compares (even by his own standards) to the
mentioned Hyman and Sun Ra works. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Jeffrey Pontius
To: motm@egroups.com
Sent: 1/21/01 10:45 AM
Subject: Re: [motm] Feeble MOTM demos!

On Sun, 21 Jan 2001, jar5831 wrote:

> I pity the pathetic MOTM site demos, when held against the standards
 of the MASTERS..download 2 examples of 2 of the master's work from
napster

Oh, boy, now we have someone who fancies him/herself to be THE music
critic. I'm probably just as stupid to reply to this inane comment, but
in
hope of some 'positiveness' coming out of this
(1) the demos are not meant to be 'works of art', but to demo certain
features or combinations of features of modules, and
(2) it is easy to select a musician's 'best' work to 'compare' (deride)
others' works, but how about the other 'less well known' pieces of those
same musicians?
(3) Which 'masterful' motm demo(s) is(are) yours?

I'll be the first to acknowledge that I am not a 'master.'  However, I
enjoy the experience of challenging myself with e-music and I'm at least
willing to seriously consider others -/+ thoughtful comments about my
own 
'works'. You've obviously a bit to learn about the 'art' of critiquing
others' works.

Um,
I have an Arp 2600 that used to be in the Sun Ra Arkestra. It doesn't 
even work. Compare that to MOTM which often endures the feeble 
construction of the even feebler minded, yet oscillates with impunity. 
Take that...

Just ignore this guy and let him go back to AH. Its the best medicine.

pow333@... wrote:

> Um,
> I have an Arp 2600 that used to be in the Sun Ra Arkestra. It doesn't
> even work. Compare that to MOTM which often endures the feeble
> construction of the even feebler minded, yet oscillates with impunity.
> Take that...

<TIRADE>
Well, congratulations, everyone. Apparently this list has gotten 
large enough that we're now eligible to have trolls and flamewars 
just like AH. Goodie goodie. I for one am NOT willing to trade in the 
wonderful spirit of cooperation and appreciation of different tastes 
that we have enjoyed until now. If you've been on this list awhile, 
you know what I mean. If you are new, you are participating in a GOOD 
THING, so don't screw it up.
</TIRADE>

Moe

>Have you taken the time to try and record and send in demo's before trashing
>the ones on the site? Just curious? Lots of folks have worked hard on their
>own time to create these MOTM demo's and those songs you mentioned were
>produced in major label studios most likely with highly trained composers,
>technicians and producers. Just wondering,
>
I'd be surprised if the Sun Ra tune he refers to was produced in a major
label studio! Ra generally worked way under the radar, long before "indie"
music was even a concept.


____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

At 2:50 AM 1/21/01, jar5831 wrote:
>I pity the pathetic MOTM site demos, when held against the standards of
>the MASTERS..download 2 examples of 2 of the master's work from  napster
>
>1. Minotour  Dick Hyman 1969
>2. Sun Ra-Minimoog  Sun Ra date ???

I know I shouldn't get pissed about this post, the guys obviously trolling,
but, hey, I can't help making a few comments.

Firstly, I know both of these records. I'm guessing the Sun Ra tune is from
"My Brother the Wind, Vol II" (I may be wrong about the title, I'm too lazy
to check my cd's. Hey, at least I PAID for the disc unlike jar5831). The
Hyman tune is a pretty charming little piece of 60's moogsploitation, but I
wouldn't say that it stands up as an example of brilliant synthesis. I
mean, I'm sure it was innovative for its time, but I wouldn't call Hyman a
master synthsesist, the patches he uses are fairly generic, he was just
among the first to use them, especially in pop music. I'd say some of W.
Carlos' work from the period still stands up, as does Moprton Subotnick's,
but I wouldn't put Hyman's work at that level. Neother would he, I bet,
he's been pretty dismissive of his moog recordings in interviews. The Ra
pieces are a set of improvisations on Minimoog that are pretty cool,
especially for the time, but again not brilliant examples of synthsis.

Secondly, I'm responsible for some of the demo's on Paul's site,
specifically for the 410 filter. I can't speak for everyone who has demos
on the site, but at least mine were never meant as complete, stand-alone
compositions. The night I finished building the 410, I spent a few hours
running everything in my studio through it. Whenever I found something
interesting, I recorded a minute or so, and sent the best of 'em to Paul.
I'm not embarrassed that the demos are there for everyone to hear, but I
feel like the intent was not some grand musical statement, just to
demonstrate a cool filter, and maybe inspire a few people to get one
themselves.

And thirdly, Jar5831, where are the examples of your music? It doesn't seem
fair to criticize without giving us the same oppportunity.

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________