Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

On 12/19/02 3:40 PM, "jesse_medway <medway808@...>"
<medway808@...> wrote:

>> 
>> placement  actual swing  displayed swing
>> 126         52.5%            53%
>> 127         52.92%           53%
>> 128         53.33%           53%
>> 129         53.75%           54%
>> 130         54.17%           54%
>> 131         54.58%           55%
> 
> Wouldn't the seq round to the nearest match?  Seems
> the most logical way they would handle it.

yes but there might be other considerations that drives the design.  My
guess is unless the design is purposefully emulating a previous
implementation you would see variation from design to design.


> 
>> Some final key points.  The fact that importing a sequence from the
> MPC3K
>> into Cubase and it looking "normal" needs to be looked at by
> comparing the
>> same data "swung" by Cubase using the same percentage settings.
> This would
>> reveal any of the above differences, if they indeed exist. Cubase
> and any
>> other high-resolution sequencer should be able to reproduce an MPC
> sequence
>> file exactly as the MPC has it recorded.  So the true comparison is
> not how
>> the MPC file looks in the higher resolution sequencer but how the
> same notes
>> swung with the same percentage compare.
> 
> It's been a while since I did that test but from what I remember
> I was able to get a perfect match with Cubase at many of the settings
> aavailable in the mpc3k.
> 
> That was cubase audio 2.0 at the time, I belive it was 384ppq.
> 
> 
>> One interesting clue in all of this is that in the groove-quantize
> presets
>> in Digital Performer there is a group of ones for the Linn drum
> machines and
>> one labeled MPC60/MPC3000.  This gives some credence that there is a
>> difference.  I dug into the settings for 54% and here is what I
> found:
>> 
>> This is the sequence of 8 swung 16th notes in a 4/4 measure:
>> 1: 129 53.75%
>> 2: 131 54.58%
>> 3: 129 53.75%
>> 4: 129 53.75%
>> 5: 131 54.58%
>> 6: 131 54.58%
>> 7: 131 54.58%  
>> 8: 131 54.58%
> 
> 
> Thats interesting.  The first time I've seen a variation.
> Now whether or not this was intended or merley a timing
> thing would depend on how they captured the data.
> From what I remember the mpc can export a midi file. This
> would take away the timing errors and just give you what
> the sequencer was trying to play.
> 

My guess is that it was somehow captured, probably by observation.
Exporting an MPC3000 sequence as a MIDI File would have been forced onto the
96 PPQN timing that is that MPC's underlying timing. The above pattern
relies on higher resolution (480ppqn).

Its not clear at all to me how the above timing was purposefully generated
in the MPC.  It implies that the sequencer "playback engine" has a higher
timing resolution than the recorded data and that somehow the above pattern
is being used to alter the timing.  If this is indeed what is happening then
the feel in the MPC is far from accidental.


> Does this mean that the MPC is a little imprecise in its timing
>> or are we seeing the evidence of Roger Linn's hand?
>> 
>> I can imagine ways that an instrument like the MPC could have been
> designed
>> so that the above results were planned and predictable.  Maybe the
> MPC's
>> internal timing uses something like that to give the final feel
> Roger Linn
>> was after.  Who can really say?
> 
> If a midi file could be exported we would know for sure.
> 
> Do you happen to have a mpc3k lying around?

Unfortunately no.  I "upgraded" to the MPC4K and that is a higher timing
resolution sequencer.  Still seems to have the same feel but exporting to a
MIDI file from it wouldn't tell up much.

> 
> I should try taking some midi files from the mp-7 along
> with recording the midi out of my sp1200 and compare.  Too
> bad the sp1200 only does 8th note swing.  I could jack up
> the tempo I guess on the mp-7 clock.  But on this last track
> I did I used the mp-7 to actually play the midi to control a
> shaker and tamp in the sp1200 and the swing was nice.
> 
> I'll have to dig out the mpc grooves for cubase and look at them
> again as well.
> 
> But I totaly agree that the resolution will make a difference.
> I just never thought that the swing itself was doing anything
> different as far as intentionally moving some notes more than others.
> From my experments it seemed like there wasnt any variation going on
> with any of the swing settings from different devices.
> 
> Would be nice if we chould store some custom groove settings in the
> mp-7 though....
> 

amen to that!

> Thanks for the info.
> 
> Jesse
> 

Your welcome


drk

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