Yamaha CS80 group photo

Yahoo Groups archive

Yamaha CS80

Index last updated: 2026-04-28 23:44 UTC

Thread

CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter envelope

CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter envelope

2009-05-31 by Max Fazio

Hi all
Sorry if I make too boring question, I would just need to understand some of the process; by looking at the circuit diagram I see that the TR1 through 9 and the "F " (both FH1/2 and FL1/2) CVs do mix together but I didn't understand in what way: I see a mixing filter before the mixing pin .

The F signal mixes all the modulation signals (velocity, aftertouch and LF modulation), but I care for the velocity; as I could understand the TWS board creates a fixed 10s decay envelope whose amplitude is driven by the key velocity, its amount as a modulation signal is balanced into the TRG1; both the signals, envelope and modulation, mix together.

What I can't understand is: what operation is made there:is it a sum or a multiplication between the signals?

Can anybody solve my problem?
Please reply
M

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter envelope

2009-06-07 by Max Fazio

Hi
Seems that I'm unlucky even with the experts here; anybody have a clue at my question?
Through the help of a friend I found that the link between filter-eg and velocity is a simple sum between signals, with the obvious calibrations at some points , the unsolved mystery is: why do I hear the overall level of the envelope increase, that is even AL is pushed on, if I'm getting a simple addition?
I can only guess that the passive RC located at the TWS board can equal to a variable decay time AD envelope, but I don't get the same effect if  the CS is played with neither IL or AL doing any modulation....can anybody shed some light on this?
Thanks to anybody wanting to help me
Max
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Max Fazio 
  To: yamahacs80@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 6:23 PM
  Subject: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter envelope





  Hi all
  Sorry if I make too boring question, I would just need to understand some of the process; by looking at the circuit diagram I see that the TR1 through 9 and the "F " (both FH1/2 and FL1/2) CVs do mix together but I didn't understand in what way: I see a mixing filter before the mixing pin .

  The F signal mixes all the modulation signals (velocity, aftertouch and LF modulation), but I care for the velocity; as I could understand the TWS board creates a fixed 10s decay envelope whose amplitude is driven by the key velocity, its amount as a modulation signal is balanced into the TRG1; both the signals, envelope and modulation, mix together.

  What I can't understand is: what operation is made there:is it a sum or a multiplication between the signals?

  Can anybody solve my problem?
  Please reply
  M

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter envelope

2009-06-07 by Laurie Curry

My guess Max....

your velocity test is engaging the aftertouch pads at the bottom
of your keystroke....

I believe the sum of the amplifiers in the vca EG and Velocity and
aftertouch work like amp and preamp do...and that is what eventually
causes distortion in the chorus circuit...overdriving....
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original message-----
From: "Max Fazio" faxiomas@...
Date: Sun, 07 Jun 2009 09:20:40 -0600
To: yamahacs80@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter
envelope

Hi
Seems that I'm unlucky even with the experts here; anybody have a clue
at my question?
Through the help of a friend I found that the link between filter-eg
and velocity is a simple sum between signals, with the obvious
calibrations at some points , the unsolved mystery is: why do I hear
the overall level of the envelope increase, that is even AL is pushed
on, if I'm getting a simple addition?
I can onlyguess that the passive RC located at the TWS board can equal
to a variable decay time AD envelope, but I don't get the same effect
if the CS is played with neither IL or AL doing any modulation....can
anybody shed some light on this?
Thanks to anybody wanting to help me
Max
----- Original Message ----- 
From: Max Fazio 
To: yamahacs80@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 6:23 PM
Subject: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter
envelope





Hi all
Sorry if I make too boring question, I would just need to understand
some of the process; by looking at the circuit diagram I see that the
TR1 through 9 and the "F " (both FH1/2 and FL1/2) CVs do mix together
but I didn't understand in what way: I see a mixing filter before the
mixing pin .

The F signal mixes all the modulation signals (velocity, aftertouch
and LF modulation), but I care for the velocity; as I could
understandthe TWS board creates a fixed 10s decay envelope whose
amplitude is driven by the key velocity, its amount as a modulation
signal is balanced into the TRG1; both the signals, envelope and
modulation, mix together.

What I can't understand is: what operation is made there:is it a sum
or a multiplication between the signals?

Can anybody solve my problem?
Please reply
M

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter envelope

2009-06-07 by Max Fazio

Hi Laurie
Thx for replying at least ;-)
I was talking about the production of velocity itself : it's easy to hear these changes, G.Poropat sent me two files recreating a kind of guitar2 patch on the panel, the first using the filter's eg, the other without using the eg; in the first file the sound behaves like both the signals (eg and velocity) are multiplied, while if is there no engagement of the envelope, I can only hear the velocity decay; the files are set so that no aftertouch is going into the patch; I'm uploading them in the files section of the group.
M
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Laurie Curry 
  To: yamahacs80@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 8:19 PM
  Subject: Re: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter envelope






  My guess Max....

  your velocity test is engaging the aftertouch pads at the bottom
  of your keystroke....

  I believe the sum of the amplifiers in the vca EG and Velocity and
  aftertouch work like amp and preamp do...and that is what eventually
  causes distortion in the chorus circuit...overdriving....
  -----Original message-----
  From: "Max Fazio" faxiomas@...
  Date: Sun, 07 Jun 2009 09:20:40 -0600
  To: yamahacs80@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: Re: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter
  envelope

  Hi
  Seems that I'm unlucky even with the experts here; anybody have a clue
  at my question?
  Through the help of a friend I found that the link between filter-eg
  and velocity is a simple sum between signals, with the obvious
  calibrations at some points , the unsolved mystery is: why do I hear
  the overall level of the envelope increase, that is even AL is pushed
  on, if I'm getting a simple addition?
  I can onlyguess that the passive RC located at the TWS board can equal
  to a variable decay time AD envelope, but I don't get the same effect
  if the CS is played with neither IL or AL doing any modulation....can
  anybody shed some light on this?
  Thanks to anybody wanting to help me
  Max
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Max Fazio 
  To: yamahacs80@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 6:23 PM
  Subject: [yamahacs80] CS80 diagram question: velocity and filter
  envelope

  Hi all
  Sorry if I make too boring question, I would just need to understand
  some of the process; by looking at the circuit diagram I see that the
  TR1 through 9 and the "F " (both FH1/2 and FL1/2) CVs do mix together
  but I didn't understand in what way: I see a mixing filter before the
  mixing pin .

  The F signal mixes all the modulation signals (velocity, aftertouch
  and LF modulation), but I care for the velocity; as I could
  understandthe TWS board creates a fixed 10s decay envelope whose
  amplitude is driven by the key velocity, its amount as a modulation
  signal is balanced into the TRG1; both the signals, envelope and
  modulation, mix together.

  What I can't understand is: what operation is made there:is it a sum
  or a multiplication between the signals?

  Can anybody solve my problem?
  Please reply
  M

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Move to quarantaine

This moves the raw source file on disk only. The archive index is not changed automatically, so you still need to run a manual refresh afterward.