Casio CZ/ VZ/ FZ - Pro Series

--- In CZsynth@y..., Summa <flotorian@y...> wrote:
> Hi Todd,
> 
> so you finaly found the list... ;)

Hey Summa-
Just found it cause you told me of its' existance.

> I compared the output of the VZ-1 to the FS1R and with certain 
setting I got
> the same results...
> The frequency Ratio between two VZ oscillators set to phase is 
1:2 (I first
> thought it's 1:1 but that was a mistake)... If I use the same 
waveforms with
> the FS1R I get (with slight differences) the same outputs...
> If you use another "phased" pair of oscillators and connect 
those 2 pairs
> with phase you can adjust the frequencies of the pairs 
(unfortunately not of
> the single osc.) and then (when I'm not mistaken) you'll get the 
following
> FM algorithm....  
> 
> 1
> |
> 2 3
>  \| 
>   4  

I'm not sure this is mathematically the same thing- I know it is 
sonically similar (due to a factory VZ slap Bass sound that has a 
very similar sounding DX FM equivalent).

> When you set the connection between 1 and 2 to mix you'd get 
(not 100% sure,
> since I'm still have to try out certain settings to prove...)
> 
> 1 2 3
> \ | /
>   4

That implies 1,2, and 3 are equally phase modulating 4- I don't 
recall the VZ being able to do that - but you're probably correct 
(you are assembling that tutorial !).

> 
> >-you heard right- I said inferior (yes it's only my opinion).
> >Why would I say such a thing about my beloved VZ ?
> >- well- I tend to use my TX81z more than my VZ.
> >But the TX is 12 bit and the VZ is 16 bit- should'nt the VZ be a 
> >little better ?- yes it should- but it really lacks the BITE you get 
> >from FM (that's the best word I can think of to describe it).
> 
> The TX81z has (as far as I know) 16 Bit converters too, at least 
according
> to a german magazine... anyway the TX sounds colder and 
more metallic, more
> crispy and quite agressive, that's true. But most synths have 
problems to
> sounds that crispy and the VZ can be quite agressive too. 
> Due to the saw waveforms and the VZ can create richer an 
warmer sounds then
> the TX, I even created nice warm Pad and impressive 
voice/choir sounds ...
> the TX waveforms are less rich on overtones ok, feeback can 
help a lot, but
> it's limited to one operator...  
> Also the ringmodulation of the VZ enables this thing to create 
sounds an FM
> synth can't do...

The TX81z has 12 bit DACs (as does the original DX7) the FB01 
had 10 bit DACs (TX802 & DX7II have 16 bit DACS). Remember 
Summa- Ringmod and FM create the SAME sidebands at select 
mod indexes- so they can sound very similar (and in some 
cases exactly the same).

> It's all a matter of taste...

most definitely !

> >sorry for the long post- i'll be posting a link to my sounds for 
the 
> >VZ soon (at which time I'll expect scathing reviews from 
Summa)
> 
> Do I realy have that bad image out there? Ok, I like a good 
discussion, that
> may could be missunderstanding... Maybe my english just isn't 
good enough so
> I may sound rude?  

Not at all- you have a kind web presence- (& I'm envious of 
anyone who's multi-lingual- I only speak Texan)- I just expect 
heavy criticism on my sounds due to my harsh opinions.

> >I'm crossposting this VZ opinion on the EZVZ page.
> 
> Why? :) I have nothing to do with that page...

I know- I'm just letting folks know so they don't think I'm being 
overly redundant  (sharing with other VZ'rs who aren't on this list)

Todd ;-)