At 18:35 08.06.01 -0000, you wrote:
>--- In CZsynth@y..., Summa <flotorian@y...> wrote:
>> Hi Todd,
>>
>> so you finaly found the list... ;)
>
>Hey Summa-
>Just found it cause you told me of its' existance.
Just was a little remark since it wasn't the first time I talked about that
list in one of my K5k postings... ;)
>> I compared the output of the VZ-1 to the FS1R and with certain
>setting I got
>> the same results...
>> The frequency Ratio between two VZ oscillators set to phase is
>1:2 (I first
>> thought it's 1:1 but that was a mistake)... If I use the same
>waveforms with
>> the FS1R I get (with slight differences) the same outputs...
>> If you use another "phased" pair of oscillators and connect
>those 2 pairs
>> with phase you can adjust the frequencies of the pairs
>(unfortunately not of
>> the single osc.) and then (when I'm not mistaken) you'll get the
>following
>> FM algorithm....
>>
>> 1
>> |
>> 2 3
>> \|
>> 4
>
>I'm not sure this is mathematically the same thing- I know it is
>sonically similar (due to a factory VZ slap Bass sound that has a
>very similar sounding DX FM equivalent).
>
>> When you set the connection between 1 and 2 to mix you'd get
>(not 100% sure,
>> since I'm still have to try out certain settings to prove...)
>>
>> 1 2 3
>> \ | /
>> 4
>
>That implies 1,2, and 3 are equally phase modulating 4- I don't
>recall the VZ being able to do that - but you're probably correct
>(you are assembling that tutorial !).
As I said I'm not 100% sure, but it seems so, when you create the "phase"
connection between two pairs everything that normaly gets to the output no
matter if it set to mix or ring or phase modulates the carrier of the next
pair...
>> >-you heard right- I said inferior (yes it's only my opinion).
>> >Why would I say such a thing about my beloved VZ ?
>> >- well- I tend to use my TX81z more than my VZ.
>> >But the TX is 12 bit and the VZ is 16 bit- should'nt the VZ be a
>> >little better ?- yes it should- but it really lacks the BITE you get
>> >from FM (that's the best word I can think of to describe it).
>>
>> The TX81z has (as far as I know) 16 Bit converters too, at least
>according
>> to a german magazine... anyway the TX sounds colder and
>more metallic, more
>> crispy and quite agressive, that's true. But most synths have
>problems to
>> sounds that crispy and the VZ can be quite agressive too.
>> Due to the saw waveforms and the VZ can create richer an
>warmer sounds then
>> the TX, I even created nice warm Pad and impressive
>voice/choir sounds ...
>> the TX waveforms are less rich on overtones ok, feeback can
>help a lot, but
>> it's limited to one operator...
>> Also the ringmodulation of the VZ enables this thing to create
>sounds an FM
>> synth can't do...
>
>The TX81z has 12 bit DACs (as does the original DX7) the FB01
The first generation of DX synths work with 10 Bits (DX7, DX9, FB01, DX21,
TX816 ...)
>had 10 bit DACs (TX802 & DX7II have 16 bit DACS). Remember
The TX81z was released 87 (also the year I bought mine) together with
DX7II/IID/S, TX802 that work with 16 Bit DACs too
>Summa- Ringmod and FM create the SAME sidebands at select
>mod indexes- so they can sound very similar (and in some
>cases exactly the same).
Yep, you can create similar sounds, but with different parameter setting,
anyway I also tested the VZ - FM with the Saw waveforms of the VZ and since
the FS1R is also able to create a halfway usable Saw, I got the same results...
Also when you look at the description Yamaha did in their patents and
compare it to the description Casio made in the CZ manual, you probably (if
they described it the same way in the english version of the manual) find it
to be very similar
http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US04175464__
http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US04249447__
Also the DX synth isn't an FM synth it's an Phase Modulation synth... you'll
recognise that when you using set the modulator of your FS1R to fixed and a
low frequency to use it like an LFO and modulate a Carrier with for instance
the ALL1 waveform and skirt set to 7... you will hear a phasing instead of a
vibrato... I was kind of confused when I discoverd that...
Also look at this URL for further descriptions....
http://www.funet.fi/pub/sci/audio/misc/pm-intro
>> It's all a matter of taste...
>
>most definitely !
>
>> >sorry for the long post- i'll be posting a link to my sounds for
>the
>> >VZ soon (at which time I'll expect scathing reviews from
>Summa)
>>
>> Do I realy have that bad image out there? Ok, I like a good
>discussion, that
>> may could be missunderstanding... Maybe my english just isn't
>good enough so
>> I may sound rude?
>
>Not at all- you have a kind web presence- (& I'm envious of
>anyone who's multi-lingual- I only speak Texan)- I just expect
>heavy criticism on my sounds due to my harsh opinions.
I had to learn english in school, other then that I enjoy watching for
instance Star Trek and some movies in english, since some words/jokes etc.
get lost with the tranlation...
For me it's totaly ok if someone has harsh opinions as long as he states
them appropriate.
>> >I'm crossposting this VZ opinion on the EZVZ page.
>>
>> Why? :) I have nothing to do with that page...
>
>I know- I'm just letting folks know so they don't think I'm being
>overly redundant (sharing with other VZ'rs who aren't on this list)
Well, this is a free internet ;)
I maybe take a look at that page to see if you get a reaction ...
Summa
+
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+ Nicknames : Summa or SumGhost
+ AIM : Flotorian
+ Born : 1967
+ Profession : Student of Computer Science
+
A Touch of Future - Project : http://www.mp3.com/AToF/
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Re: [CZsynth] Re: Intro (new Member) VZ8m user
2001-06-08 by Summa