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Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

2018-11-28 by henk9000@...

Hi folks,


I'm trying to turn off local control on a CZ101 to use it as an external instrument in Ableton. I know it has to be done via a MIDI message, which I am not sure about about the syntax or how to transmit it.


I don't know how to transmit this message from my Mac. Ableton seems to almost be able to do it within the Midi clip functions, but it doesn't appear to allow these 'special' control messages above CC119.


I found some useful information in this Yahoo group, but I'm still not quite getting to the end of it.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/CZsynth/conversations/topics/4067

http://templarseries.atspace.com/cz.html

http://templarseries.atspace.com/CZMANUAL.html


The message itself is CC122 to value 0 for off or to value 127 for on. In the CZ MIDI Guide linked above this is written like this:

LOCAL ON send B0 + channel, 7A, 7F

LOCAL OFF send B0 + channel, 7A, 00


SysEx messages appear to be formatted in another way (which I think is hexadecimal?) that start with F0 and end in F7, and I think this is probably how it needs to be written. I know there has to be a 44 in there as that is the Casio code, and some version of the B0 7A 00 message.


I have a few bits of software that can probably do what I need to do; SysEx Librarian (https://www.snoize.com/SysExLibrarian/) seems to be the best candidate. It needs a .syx file to load, and I can't figure out how to make one that will contain this LOCAL ON/OFF message.


also have these two Windows programs running through Wine that I can try too.

http://obds.free.fr/midimon/

https://www.bome.com/products/sendsx


Anyone done this before? Or have any suggestions?


Cheers!

Re: Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

2018-11-30 by smw-mail@...

I have never had a CZ-101, but the CZ-3000/5000 can be used as an external sound module by just connecting your midi out to the CZ midi in--no need to turn local off. You would need to turn local off to disconnect key presses from the synth engine, but that doesn't seem to be what you want to do if I understand correctly.
Steve


Re: Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

2018-11-30 by henk9000@...

It works, I just thought it might work better with local off for some things, like using the CZ keyboard to play something elseover midi.

Although I suppose to an extent I was setting up exactly as Ableton advised to see how it went, and may have just got hung up on this issue.

Re: [CZsynth] Re: Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

2018-11-30 by Summa

Hi,

long ago, when the CZ-1 was my� my only Keyboard, when using the synth in multi mode I set the keyboard to another channel than the rest of the tone generation, not sure if this is possible on the CZ-101. Sending "Local off" ( cc#122 0-63 = off, 64-127 = on ) via MIDI tend to work on some synths.

...Summa
Show quoted textHide quoted text
Am 30.11.2018 um 18:08 schrieb henk9000@... [CZsynth]:
It works, I just thought it might work better with local off for some things, like using the CZ keyboard to play something elseover midi.

Although I suppose to an extent I was setting up exactly as Ableton advised to see how it went, and may have just got hung up on this issue.

Re: Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

2018-12-02 by smw-mail@...

I just went as far as addressing the issue of the CZ being played as an external module, but local off would be good to have (as you and Summa noted) if you want to sent note on/note off commands from the CZ keyboard and not have the CZ synth engine play sounds.

Again, I have experience with the CZ3000/CZ5000, but as Summa suggested, it might work on the CZ-101.

For example, you might have an external device or external software that will take midi notes from the CZ, so something with that note, and the send something to be played from the CZ's synth engine. We can call this midi data processing.

For example, if I had this setup:

Casio CZ midi out (local off) ===> E-Mu Proteus 2000 (with no sound ROMS) midi in ===> Casio CZ midi in

I could play a note on the CZ's keyboard and have an arpeggiator pattern from the P2K play the arp pattern on the CZ's synth engine.

This is the technique I used ages ago to create an infinite keysplit on the CZ-5000, where each note could play a different patch and I could have up to 8 different patches playing at once in realtime from the CZ keyboard itself (well, going through the C64 as a midi data processor, that is)..

CZ ===> Commodore 64 running a custom program I wrote ===> CZ.

I won't go into the details because I probably wrote about them here a few years ago, but the point is, in this case, I had the CZ set to local = off.

I should mention that I had the CZ in the mode where I had 8 consecutive monophonic midi channels. (Basically, my program did a little dynamic channel assignment and channelized the note data to one of the 8 channels. Toot--toot: This was a couple of decades (or maybe close to three decades) IIRC before Rolli or whoever it was "invented" channelizing midi data to make "expressive midi.")

Anyhow, to test to see if the CZ-101 accepts local off commands (control changes, not sysex), turn it off on your basic channel with a control change and see if notes don't reach the synth engine from the keypresses.

The Nov. 1985 CZ Guidebook for MIDI indicates that the CZ-101 does indeed recognize local off/local on. See the page numbered 14 which is page 15 of the pdf.

Also, page 25 of the CZ-101 manual (page 26 of the pdf) shows that the CZ-101 responds to local off.

I hope this helps.

Steve


Re: Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

2018-12-04 by henk9000@...

Thanks for the suggestions.

Steve - that arpeggiator idea is just the sort of thing that would be nice to try out if I can get this to work.

Indeed I have seen that the manual shows that it responds to local off, I simply don't know how to go about sending that control change message. This isn't really an issue of the CZ itself at this point, rather a question of how to communicate with it.

As you advise "turn it off on your basic channel with a control change and see if notes don't reach the synth engine from the keypresses" - that is exactly what I am trying to achieve, I just don't know how to do it.

Re: Turning local control off in a CZ101 via a midi message

2018-12-05 by smw-mail@...

For diagnostics (i.e., to check midi data flow, what data is being sent from my gear), I use an old stand-by: Midi-Ox. There are others; its just that I know how to do what I want with Midi-Ox. I have foun d that it works just fine under Win 10, even though I don't think it was updated in a while.

I have also used midi-ox to receive and send sysex commands. I don't see why Control Change commands wouldn't work.

If you are using the CZ-101 as a sound module, maybe the device that sends it notes can also send a local off command. That way you won't need a separate computer utility.

Hope this helps.

Steve

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