Digital BW, The Print

Sorry, 

I forgot that yahoo groups emails messages unless clicked off - Has 
anyone already mentioned how the yahoo forum format sucks?

anyway, sorry for the confusion.

Alfred



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Voegels Alfred 
<aevoegels@y...> wrote:
> paul,
> 
> somehow the message below got misdirected to me!
> 
> Since I have you here, one question:
> 
> Does it make sense to create ICC profiles for the UT
> inks on the different papers and create cool, neutral
> and warm tones with the ICC profiles?
> 
> Alfred
> 
> 
> 
> --- Paul Roark <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> > Sean,
> > 
> > >What are your current thoughts on using MIS-UT with
> > C82/C84 vs. 1280?
> > 
> > The big differences are that the 1280 can print 13"
> > paper, the dmax is a bit
> > higher (1.62 on cotton v. 1.55, 1.66 on EEM v.
> > 1.55), the 1280 has smoother
> > highlights than the C82 (unknown with respect to the
> > C84), but the C82 is
> > about as good at the 2200 with IP5, so it's not bad.
> > 
> > The C82 is going to be simpler -- no curves, etc. --
> > and cheaper.
> > 
> > >How about newer Epson models like 960 and the
> > mysterious PX-G900?
> > >Reason to delay a purchase decision?
> > 
> > I don't know much about them.  The idea was to get a
> > machine that was as
> > affordable as possible and see what it could do in
> > terms of archival
> > printing.  The results, frankly, surprised me.  I
> > never expected such high
> > quality.
> > 
> > >Finally, I'd love to hear your thoughts about what
> > to recommend for
> > >archival *color* printing, if you do any of that.
> > 
> > Well, the 2200 is a fine machine.  However, the C82
> > with its color Durabrite
> > pigmented inks does a very good job, and it's a lot
> > cheaper.  The Durabrite
> > inks appear to be essentially the same as the
> > UltraChromes, but without the
> > light black -- the lightfastness and longevity are
> > about as good.  So, my
> > recommendation for the scrapbookers and genealogists
> > is to get the C82 (or
> > C84 when the carts arrive) and just switch back and
> > forth between the
> > Durabrite and carbon pigs as needed.  On matte
> > paper, I think this little
> > 4-ink printer at 2880 does an excellent job.   It's
> > a great way to get into
> > digital printing affordably.
> > 
> > Paul
> > http://www.PaulRoark.com
> > ________________________________________
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com,
> > "Paul Roark"
> > <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> > > >I looked in the Epson site and they list a C-84
> > and it is in the
> > right
> > > >price range (@$79 USD) but has a much higher
> > claimed resolution....
> > > >or is the C-82 yet to be released.
> > >
> > > I think the C82 is an older model.  MIS and Amazon
> > have them, but
> > I'm not
> > > sure how many are still out there.  The C84 will
> > be the next one,
> > > presumably, but for now there are no 3rd party
> > carts available. MIS
> > thinks
> > > they use the same inks, but different chips.
> > >
> > > The higher resolution of the C84 is probably
> > visible with color
> > inks on
> > > RC/glossy paper, but with B&W on matte, I think a
> > loupe would be
> > required to
> > > see the difference.  I was, frankly, astounded at
> > how good the C82
> > is at
> > > 2880 (with High Speed off -- it does make a
> > difference with this
> > printer)
> > > and when the same gray ink (MIS UT Light cyan) is
> > in all three color
> > carts.
> > >
> > > The weaknesses I've found so far with the C82 are,
> > first, the dmax,
> > and
> > > second, a possible paper handling glitch.
> > >
> > > While the dmax of the C82 doesn't match that of
> > the 1280, the C82
> > with
> > > PhotoRag hits 1.57 with Eboni black, which is not
> > too bad for
> > cotton.
> > > Recall that the new cotton papers from Epson and
> > Moab were hitting
> > 1.6 -
> > > 1.62 with the 1280 and Epson driver.  I suspect
> > those papers don't
> > do much
> > > better than the C82 when the Piezo driver is used
> > with, for
> > example, an
> > > 1160.  The Piezo driver, like the C82,
> > under-prints the black ink
> > with the
> > > "color" inks.  It's a trade-off between smoothness
> > and dmax.  With
> > EEM the
> > > dmax is 1.55, same with the new Permajet (cotton)
> > ISC (there will be
> > a new
> > > name when released in January).  Some cotton
> > papers are not good,
> > however.
> > > PremierArt was down at 1.46.
> > 
> > [snip]
> > 
> > > I thought my old 1160 was a fine quad, but the
> > dither and smoothness
> > on this
> > > cheap C82 is way ahead of it.  I suspect the
> > vertical placement
> > makes
> > > alignment (and cheap assembly) much less of an
> > issue, because I'd
> > guess it
> > > is mostly machined in the head when it's made --
> > by a very accurate
> > machine.
> > >
> > > The carts for the C82 (and C84) are still a bit of
> > an open issue.
> > It
> > > appears MIS has some new ones for the C82 that
> > might make re-filling
> > > extremely easy, avoiding the foam problems. 
> > (Having only one
> > "color" ink
> > > also makes the process rather easy for both
> > re-fillers and MIS.)  It
> > may be
> > > that with a re-setter, a single set of carts will
> > last a very long
> > time.
> > > The current carts are, apparently, not easy to
> > re-fill.  I'm not
> > certain
> > > when the C84 carts will be ready.
> > >
> > > The independent color carts also appear to be all
> > the same.  This
> > could be
> > > very interesting.  The yellow pumps in less ink
> > than the others.
> > So, if I'm
> > > lucky, a toner might be able to be mixed that, for
> > example, makes a
> > neutral
> > > print when in the magenta spot and medium-warm
> > print in the yellow
> > slot.
> > > Similarly for a sepia toner.  (Having one [already
> > in inventory]
> > gray ink in
> > > all carts -- which just happen to be the same --
> > is also a nice
> > little
> > > inventory and cost benefit to MIS, which hopefully
> > will be passed
> > on the
> > > users.)
> > 
> > [snip]
> > 
> > > Keep in mind that this is a $69 machine.  I don't
> > recommend people
> > throw
> > > their 1280s away, but there are a lot of people
> > who don't want to
> > put out
> > > that kind of cash.  The goal here is to lower the
> > financial and
> > expertise
> > > barrier to outstanding, archival B&W printing by
> > getting a cheap
> > printer,
> > > "no-workflow" inkset, and non-Photoshop image
> > editor competitive
> > with the
> > > best systems -- and the C82 has made me believe
> > more than ever that
> > 
> === message truncated ===
> 
> 
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