Digital BW, The Print

I should be very gratefull if you poste  your profiles and 
intrucction to the files area
manuel


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "nevnevsf" 
<nev@s...> wrote:
> This is very interesting, indeed. It makes sense, though, that soft 
> proofing works. A profile contains two mappings, one from the color 
> connection space (PCS) into the printer space (if you want a 
> particular color, what set of RGB values should be sent to the 
> printer), and one from the printer space to the PCS (for each RGB 
> value sent to the printer, what color is produced). 
> 
> When you generate a profile using x-tone inks, the profile should 
> accurately represent the 2nd mapping, from the printer space to the 
> PCS. In other words, for a given RGB value sent to the printer, the 
> profile will know what grey tone is produced, since it measured it 
on 
> the target.
> 
> When you soft proof, Photoshop figures out each RGB values it 
should 
> send to the printer for the set profile and rendering intent, then 
> uses the profile to figure out what color the printer should 
actually 
> produce. 
> 
> The tricky part with an x-tone profile is that the gamut of the 
> printer space (tones of gray) is much, much smaller that that of 
the 
> working space (such as Adobe RGB), so the success of a profile 
really 
> depends on how the profiler handles out-of-gamut colors. Apparently 
> Profile Prism handles them gracefully. A bad profile would freak 
out 
> when, say, bright green needs to be printed. a good profile would 
try 
> to squeeze it sensibly into the x-tone color space. For a Roark 
> workflow, the best situation would probably be to pass the RGB 
values 
> in the image directly to the printer, without color management, and 
to 
> use preview to see what the printer will produce. Passing the RGB 
> values would preserve the output part of the Roark workflow. That 
> seems to be your workflow as well.
> 
> A better way to approach this would be to produce a custom profile 
> that does a partitioned PCS to x-tone mapping. For example, the 
> lightness (grey value of the image) could be carefully mapped with 
> proper ink partitioning, but the amount of tinting could be 
controled 
> by the a- and b- channels in the L*a*b* space (all that means is 
that 
> the color of the image would render the image cooler or warmer, but 
> the luminosity would determine how the gray inks are partitioned).
> 
> Sorry if this was a bit technical and long.
> 
> FYI, I have made just such a set of ICC profiles for the MIS-FS 
> Neutral inks on an 1160 printer on Enanced Matte and Crane Museo 
> papers. I had to write my own software to do it, but it finally 
works 
> well. I use a fully color-managed workflow and get very good, 
> consistent results, with highly accurate previews. I can even mimic 
> color filers, and see the effect on-screen! The inks are 
partitioned 
> to minimize the dot patterns. I imagine the profiles are similar to 
> the profiles produced by the Piezotone guys, but I found out about 
> their efforts after I was nearly done, and they don't seem to have 
> anything for MIS inks. 
> 
> I posted a very rough version of the profiles earlier in the year. 
If 
> anyone wants the profiles and instructions I can get them posted in 
> the Files area. Alas, I doubt that many people are using MIS FS 
> Neutral inks on an 1160 anymore, with these fancy Ultratones...
> 
> I think I can profile just about any ink set, including Ultratones, 
> but it'd be months before I could get to it because I'd have to 
modify 
> the software to do full-color previews (right now it just does 
> previews of lightness, which works fine for a neutral inkset). If 
> anyone wants to contact me off-group, we can discuss it.
> 
> A patchwork approach might be to try to imbed Paul Roark curves 
into a 
> profile, while using the profiler to generate the preview. That I 
> might be able to do faster. 
> 
> - Steven
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Editor P.O.V. 
> Image Service" <editor@p...> wrote:
> > Ok, some years back when the VM-S set hit the streets, I wondered 
> aloud 
> > on this list about profiling it with a commercial profile 
package..
> > 
> > It created a stir, and I tried doing it with some then 
commercially 
> > available packages... Results were VERY disappointing and 
resulted 
> in 
> > huge amounts of posterization.
> > 
> > Since then I've played with a bunch of products and had been 
having 
> > surprising success on color profiles with ProfilePrism of all 
> things..  
> > I never even thought to try a "low-end product" like Profile 
Prism 
> on 
> > the previously uncompleted task of properly profiling the VM-S 
set..
> > 
> > Well, I've been a tad bored lately and was running a bunch of 
other 
> > tests, creating actions, etc.,  So, I figured, "what the hey, why 
> not 
> > give Profile Prism a shot at profiling the VM-S inkset?"
> > 
> > Amazingly, it created a profile that is both usable for printer 
> > profiling and  soft proofing (a necessary component to getting 
this 
> > right)..  The workflow is pretty straightforward, but it works.. 
> Color 
> > me astonished. (I'm guessing that Profile Prism does more simple 
> point 
> > to point mapping and less interpolation as far as: rendering 
intent, 
> > smoothing, etc. - meaning a profile for something like this would 
be 
> > more likely to be usable)
> > 
> > While some of the output still needs a tad bit of tweaking in the 
> > shadows (and that can be accomplished with a curve if necessary), 
> this 
> > workflow should allow split toning at will with the VM-S and VM 
> inksets, 
> > as well as perhaps the UltraTones...
> > 
> > If there's interest, I'll put together a complete 
> workflow/explanation 
> > and send it to Martin Wesley to add to the group files..
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > Keith Krebs
> > 
> > "Just some guy," caretaker of the Multiverse's largest EPSON 
printer 
> > User Community (highly recommended by Vogon Poets and MegaDodo 
> > Publications), at:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EPSON_Printers/
> > and  the Multiverse's largest Canon printer User  Community at:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Canon-printers
> > "For the rest of you out there, the secret is to bang the rocks 
> together 
> > guys"