Digital BW, The Print

Martin, 

I think you make very good points in your post below and I completely agree with most of them.  

I also understand the difference between the profiles.  Color profiles are easy to get.  Grayscale profiles are next to impossible.  Another reason why I think the 30 or so profiles included with Piezo are a great deal. 

I think you got my point (which was made by rhetorical questions) about the cost difference in Do it Yourself Profiling versus Piezo Profiles. 

With Kind Regards,  

Steadman


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Martin Wesley 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 9:38 PM
  Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Profiles: Are they valuable? Does Piezo have an Advantage? was FS


  Steadman,

  Actually I don't believe you can order a grayscale printer profile 
  from a color management company. (If I am wrong, someone please let 
  me know where.) As always B&W is more difficult. If is not just a 
  profile you need but the separation curves are necessary to get the 
  right inks into the right tonal ranges.

  It is my understanding that none of the current profiling software 
  packages will create a usable printer profile for a grayscale ink 
  set. Profiler Pro will create a monitor profile of a grayscale ink 
  set but not a useable profile.

  Another point. You can buy just the Piezo software. Just order a 
  Piezo kit for an 1160, toss the cartridges, if you are not interested 
  in the Piezo ink, and use the printer and inks of your choice. It is 
  still one of the best bargains around and well worth the price. A 
  good monitor calibration package will cost you $200 to $400. I don't 
  see a big deal in paying $335 to get into Piezo.

  I am very happy that there are now alternative inks to go with this 
  driver. That just broadens the choices for the end users which is 
  best for all concerned.

  Martin

  --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Steadman Uhlich" 
  <steadmanuhlich@k...> wrote:
  > Michael...
  > 
  > You mention below that  "you can have almost any profiling 
  > service profile your inks and papers as printed on YOUR 
  printer ..." 
  > 
  > Yep you could. But at what expense?  
  > 
  > Consider that Piezo software comes with professionally made 
  profiles for about 30 papers or so.  
  > 
  > How much would that cost if done separately or through a profiling 
  service?  
  > 
  > Venture to guess? 
  > 
  > And are they Grayscale profiles for quadtones or profiles for color 
  inks? 
  > 
  > And what about the hassles of printing the targets and sending them 
  to the profiling service and the time and expense of actually 
  shipping them and the time wasted waiting for them to return...etc...
  > 
  > And what about low cost future additions to the profile list?  How 
  much would that cost from the hypothetical profiling service?  
  > 
  > I think the profiles included with the Piezo system are the best 
  bargain on the market for accurate and working and effective 
  printing...assuming you want professional results.  
  > 
  > Of course someone may want to do their own profiles and buy their 
  own software and other hardware tools needed to do so.  I sure 
  don't.  I don't have the time. 
  > 
  > I like the fact that the profiles for Piezo are so....easy...and 
  relatively cheap.   Yup...easy, inexpensive, effective,  and 
  they "came in the box."  
  > 
  > Steadman
  >   ----- Original Message ----- 
  >   From: Michael J. Kravit 
  >   To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y... 
  >   Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 1:50 PM
  >   Subject: Re: [Digital BW] FS
  > 
  > 
  >   "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@t...> wrote:
  >   ...BTW FS really is pretty close to ppiezo inks, slightly cooler, 
  and 
  >   you need to do a slight curve action to reduce contrast on files 
  done 
  >   for piezo inks, but once you have the monitor working space set 
  up it 
  >   is plug n play."
  > 
  >   Actually from testing done by a number of well placed experts 
  (sound 
  >   like a political spin) the MIS FS inks print with a 1 stop 
  density 
  >   loss using the Piezo Driver and a 1-1/2 stop loss in contrast.
  > 
  >   This should be easily fixable either in the ink formulation or as 
  you 
  >   suggest in using an adjustment curve.
  > 
  >   When working on new files I find this to not be an issue. But 
  when 
  >   printing old files that were created for Piezo, the density loss 
  >   becomes evident so I have to create a second file to print with 
  the 
  >   MIS FS inks.
  > 
  >   A commercial RIP that has ICC/ICM profiles for papers and inks 
  should 
  >   take away this problem. That is the biggest difference between a 
  >   professional RIP and the Piezo system. With the Piezography 
  system 
  >   you are dependent on IJM to profile your papers and provide you 
  with 
  >   the profiles. On an open RIP, you can have almost any profiling 
  >   service profile your inks and papers as printed on YOUR printer 
  and 
  >   get accurate profiles.
  > 
  >   The plug and play aspect of the Piezo system is really very 
  >   convenient and a big plus. Right now the Pro version of the Piezo 
  RIP 
  >   had new profiles for almost everyone of the newest papers on the 
  >   market. I suspect that Cone will make them available for the Pulg-
  In 
  >   versions of the software very shortly.
  > 
  >   Mike
  > 
  > 
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