Digital BW, The Print

Paul,

You don't need all of the data columns.  Just a single column of  
either visual density (labeled either D or V) or Lab L (L label)  
data.  The icc-create droplet will simply assume zero values for Lab  
a and Lab b if no actual data are present.  The density or L values  
can also be in any order and will be automatically sorted (high to  
low for L and low to high for D).  This with the 2.3.1 version on a  
Mac but I assume it is the same for the PC version.

Carl


On Oct 17, 2005, at 11:56 PM, Paul Roark wrote:

> Walt,
>
> Thanks for the information, that clarifies it somewhat.
>
> I have an X-Rite where I'll have to create the text file manually.   
> What
> format is used?  I see what appear to be some sample files in the  
> i1 folder,
> but it's not really clear how I'd plug in the L values for the 21  
> steps.
> Since I only have the 2.3.1, I may have to just wait until that  
> version is
> fixed.
>
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>
>
>
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>> [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of  
>> wwodets
>> Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 7:04 PM
>> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] ICC v. Transfer Function in Epson driver
>>
>> Paul,
>>
>> To try and clarify:  The Create ICC.exe is a "droplet" program.  You
>> take the text file with the data and drag and drop it onto the
>> program (and not a shortcut to the program). Create ICC will then
>> create the ICC profile in the same folder as the text file.  When you
>> do this, a window will open momentarily while the program is creating
>> the ICC profile,  but the program does not "run."  I keep a copy of
>> the program on my desktop (not a shortcut to the program) and then
>> drag and drop the text file on it.  I then have the ICC profiles on
>> the desktop and move them to the color folder.
>>
>> There is a text file in the Eye One folder of the QTR folder and it
>> explains the use of the program.  Although Steve has described
>> something different, I had problems with the output (to the printer)
>> with Create ICC 2.3.1, so I have returned to the version in QTR
>> 2.3.0.  In a post on the QTR forum, Roy actually suggested using the
>> 2.3.0 for output until he corrected the problems in 2.3.1.
>>
>> Best,
>> Walt
>>
>>
>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
>> <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Carl,
>>>
>>> Are you using Windows XP?  I think one problem I'm having is that
>>>
>> the Create
>>
>>> ICC program doesn't seem to want to run at all.  I assume this is a
>>> different program than the Create Curve program -- or am I totally
>>>
>> confused?
>>
>>>
>>> Paul
>>> www.PaulRoark.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>>>> [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
>>>>
>> Of Carl
>>
>>>> Schofield
>>>> Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 5:02 PM
>>>> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] ICC v. Transfer Function in Epson driver
>>>>
>>>> Paul,
>>>>
>>>> A simple text file with a column of Lab L values or density values
>>>> measured from a 21 step wedge is probably all you need (use a
>>>>
>> column
>>
>>>> heading of D for density values or L for Lab L values).  Just drag
>>>> and drop the text file onto the Create-icc script and it should
>>>> create both the icc profile and a text file with a plot of the
>>>>
>> data.
>>
>>>>
>>>> Carl
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 17, 2005, at 8:42 PM, Paul Roark wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Steve,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, does black point compensation mean the curve hits (0,0)?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes.  ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> OK, BPC is used to take care of the end point issues, as I
>>>>> understand it.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> ... in XYZ (for B&W we only care about Y)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought Y in CIE XYZ was green.  Or do you mean the Y in xyY?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>> BPC scales the data such that the curve begins at 0,0.
>>>>>> So when you send pixel value 0 to the printer
>>>>>> it gets left at 0 and hence prints as dark as the printer
>>>>>>
>> possibly
>>
>>>>>> can.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> This is what I'd want.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Is the QTR Curve Creator Linearization tab a look-up take
>>>>>>>
>> interface?
>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now it is.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I think I'm only able to open the Curves Creator and not the
>>>>> "QTR-Create-ICC.exe."  Is this just a Mac program, or does it
>>>>> require i1?
>>>>> (It's in the i1 folder.)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> ... [Roy's] aim is to proof hue and luminance correctly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Ultimately, that could be useful, but for the B&W I'm targeting
>>>>>
>> now
>>
>>>>> it's
>>>>> complexity that gets in the way of the basics of B&W printing.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> ...  ICC profiles have the advantage
>>>>>> that people can set up soft proof in the normal fashion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> That sounds like another complex story.  If we're in PS the
>>>>>
>> custom
>>
>>>>> dot gain
>>>>> curves do it, but we do need to get a simpler method.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Is there a place that describes the specific ways in which a
>>>>>>> Windows XP user
>>>>>>> can use QTR to make an ICC that can be used in the Print with
>>>>>>> Preview
>>>>>>> workflow and then the Epson driver?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not sure but it is really very easy.  Print a step wedge with
>>>>>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>> workflow
>>>>>> of your choice eg Epson Adv B&W with a particular set of
>>>>>> settings.  Scan
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> step wedge with an EyeOne or other device that will provide the
>>>>>> sort of
>>>>>> data
>>>>>> QTR Create ICC can read. ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm not sure I can even open Create ICC.  So far I just get a
>>>>> momentary
>>>>> flash on the monitor.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Are those ICCs useable in the Print with Preview procedure
>>>>>>> with the Epson driver?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>   Yes I use them all the time.  I have profiled my Epson Adv
>>>>>>
>> B&W
>>
>>>>>> settings, one for each hue - neutral, warm, sepia and cool.  I
>>>>>>
>> do
>>
>>>>>> not mess
>>>>>> with the darker and other settings (other than hue).  I prefer
>>>>>>
>> to
>>
>>>>>> edit the
>>>>>> image in PS rather than in the driver which has limited editing
>>>>>> ability.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The possible advantage with using the driver controls as much as
>>>>> possible is
>>>>> that they may well be doing hardware linearization in the
>>>>>
>> driver --
>>
>>>>> with no
>>>>> loss of grayscale steps.  The ICC or TF in the Print with
>>>>>
>> Preview
>>
>>>>> -- or
>>>>> anywhere in PS -- loses some information with each
>>>>>
>> transformation.
>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Interesting stuff, but I don't seem to have an easy way to make
>>>>>
>> the
>>
>>>>> ICCs at
>>>>> this point.
>>>>>
>>>>> Paul
>>>>> www.PaulRoark.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>