Digital BW, The Print

I have a new 3800, Cone refillable cartridges and hextone inks.

I cannot stop this combo from clogging. One ink clears, two others disappear. I have cleaned the wiper, the print head (paper towel trick), Windexed it to death. 

Anyone? Please???

David,

We no record for a sale of inks to you...but we do have a record of sale for your 3800 cartridges. 

So, it may be hard to trouble-shoot the use of another company's brand of ink in our carts - but you are welcome to contact our tech support to determine if the carts are functioning correctly - and if we can help with the inks we will.

Please write techsupport (at) inkjetmall (dot) com

I'll alert Dana to expect your email.

Thanks,

Jon Cone

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "davidkachel" <david@...> wrote:

>
> I have a new 3800, Cone refillable cartridges and hextone inks.
> 
> I cannot stop this combo from clogging. One ink clears, two others disappear. I have cleaned the wiper, the print head (paper towel trick), Windexed it to death. 
> 
> Anyone? Please???
>

Hi David:

I don't have the Cone system and inks, but I use the inkrepublic  
system. Other than the ink, it is the identical system.

Judging from my experience with the inkrepublic system I am willing to  
wager the problem is not clogs per se but rather pressure.

_some_of these cartridges cannot maintain enough pressure to keep the  
ink flowing. The 3800 pressurizes the cartridges and that pushes the  
ink through. However, the aftermarket cartridges are a different size.  
Perhaps that is a contributing factor.

To cut to the chase, try putting more ink in the cartridge and do some  
cleaning cycles. The ink should come back. I was sitting with only  
half my nozzle colours for a week before I stumbled upon this  
solution. Even though there may still be ink in your cartridge, it  
will be too low to get to the printhead because the pressure is too  
low. Some cartridges are good though.

Give that a try, do some cleaning but you may not get them all back  
immediately. I have had no problems since.

Leslie Otterbein

On May 18, 2010, at 6:56 PM, davidkachel wrote:

> I have a new 3800, Cone refillable cartridges and hextone inks.
>
> I cannot stop this combo from clogging. One ink clears, two others  
> disappear. I have cleaned the wiper, the print head (paper towel  
> trick), Windexed it to death.
>
> Anyone? Please???
>
>

Check with Tech Support at Inkjetmall. I never have had this problem in my
3800 but I did with my 4800 when I wasn't using it regularly, however,
what I would do is get a set of refillable cart's (get them from
Inkjetmall if you like) and fill them with piezoflush and do a couple of
cleaning cycles and a purge pattern or two. Once you have perfect nozzle
checks try a different set of inks. Perhaps go back to Epson inks (shake
them first and regularly thereafter) before trying another after-market
set.

Best of Luck!

> David,
>
> We no record for a sale of inks to you...but we do have a record of sale
> for your 3800 cartridges.
>
> So, it may be hard to trouble-shoot the use of another company's brand of
> ink in our carts - but you are welcome to contact our tech support to
> determine if the carts are functioning correctly - and if we can help with
> the inks we will.
>
> Please write techsupport (at) inkjetmall (dot) com
>
> I'll alert Dana to expect your email.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jon Cone
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "davidkachel"
> <david@...> wrote:
>>
>> I have a new 3800, Cone refillable cartridges and hextone inks.
>>
>> I cannot stop this combo from clogging. One ink clears, two others
>> disappear. I have cleaned the wiper, the print head (paper towel trick),
>> Windexed it to death.
>>
>> Anyone? Please???
>>
>
>
>

On May 19, 2010, at 8:12 AM, R.Ternbach wrote:

> what I would do is get a set of refillable cart's (get them from
> Inkjetmall if you like) 

I already have a set of refillable cartridges from Inkjetmall. If as another poster suggested, they are the source of the problem, I don't think sinking another whopping $300 into a second set of also potentially defective cartridges is going to be the answer.

David Kachel



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

David,

What brand of ink are you trying to print in them?

Jon

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:

>
> 
> On May 19, 2010, at 8:12 AM, R.Ternbach wrote:
> 
> > what I would do is get a set of refillable cart's (get them from
> > Inkjetmall if you like) 
> 
> I already have a set of refillable cartridges from Inkjetmall. If as another poster suggested, they are the source of the problem, I don't think sinking another whopping $300 into a second set of also potentially defective cartridges is going to be the answer.
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

If you want to evaluate the cart's you have, drain the ink out of them, flush the with distilled HOH, drain the distilled HOH, and fill with piezoflush at least to the half-way level. this may be the cheapest way to isolate the problem and resolve it at the same time.

Best,

RT

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:

>
> 
> On May 19, 2010, at 8:12 AM, R.Ternbach wrote:
> 
> > what I would do is get a set of refillable cart's (get them from
> > Inkjetmall if you like) 
> 
> I already have a set of refillable cartridges from Inkjetmall. If as another poster suggested, they are the source of the problem, I don't think sinking another whopping $300 into a second set of also potentially defective cartridges is going to be the answer.
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

If I was in your circumstance I'd first install the Epson OEM ink carts
that came with the 3800, let the cleaning cycles run, and then see if I
still have clogs.  Long time ago this was my method when I ran a bulk ink
set up with third-party inks on my old 1160.  This would often clear things
up and I'd switch back to the bulk inks and be back in business again....


-- 
Richard S.
Albany, CA (San Francisco bay area)

My Photography Website
http://www.lightshadowandtone.com

My Flickr River
http://flickriver.com/photos/rich8155/popular-interesting/

On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 10:00 AM, rternbach <RT@...> wrote:

>
>
> If you want to evaluate the cart's you have, drain the ink out of them,
> flush the with distilled HOH, drain the distilled HOH, and fill with
> piezoflush at least to the half-way level. this may be the cheapest way to
> isolate the problem and resolve it at the same time.
>
> Best,
>
> RT
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com<DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com>,
> David Kachel <david@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> > On May 19, 2010, at 8:12 AM, R.Ternbach wrote:
> >
> > > what I would do is get a set of refillable cart's (get them from
> > > Inkjetmall if you like)
> >
> > I already have a set of refillable cartridges from Inkjetmall. If as
> another poster suggested, they are the source of the problem, I don't think
> sinking another whopping $300 into a second set of also potentially
> defective cartridges is going to be the answer.
> >
> > David Kachel
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On May 19, 2010, at 12:41 PM, Richard Sintchak wrote:

> If I was in your circumstance I'd first install the Epson OEM ink carts
> that came with the 3800, let the cleaning cycles run, and then see if I
> still have clogs.  Long time ago this was my method when I ran a bulk ink
> set up with third-party inks on my old 1160.  This would often clear things
> up and I'd switch back to the bulk inks and be back in business again....

Thanks, but the original install of the hextone inks, along with the problems I have had, have used up a lot of ink and I don't have enough left to try your experiment.

David Kachel

On May 19, 2010, at 9:24 AM, piezobw wrote:

> What brand of ink are you trying to print in them?

OVI/Tom Mallonee, hextone.

David Kachel



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

David,

Please do not take this harshly, but I believe that you have not properly evaluated the system Tom made for you, and yet you're asking for some technical support from others who have no idea what you are experimenting with. Missing nozzles in an established product are easier to tech support, than a whole litany of issues that can be at hand when you begin experimenting with custom inks.

If you want some advise on how to properly evaluate a new ink formulation or a custom ink formulation please ask me. It might be helpful to others as well. But, you're sitting with an expensive printer right now that has missing gaps, no more ink to print, and you may be too pissed to take my advice in. If you can take it in, I think it will help you.

In the meantime - you were given excellent advise to test the printer first with OEM inks. Also flushing! Not all inks can intermix with the OEM in the print head. I don't know what Tom is doing. I only know his excellent printmaking.

You may have simply been dealing with tiny air bubbles and needed to turn the printer off for a day or two to let it dissipate. The carts may not have pressurized fully. We can't possibly know without your having more ink to continue the experiment.

Jon Cone

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:

>
> 
> On May 19, 2010, at 9:24 AM, piezobw wrote:
> 
> > What brand of ink are you trying to print in them?
> 
> OVI/Tom Mallonee, hextone.
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

On May 19, 2010, at 2:26 PM, piezobw wrote:

> Please do not take this harshly, but I believe that you have not properly evaluated the system Tom made for you, and yet you're asking for some technical support from others who have no idea what you are experimenting with. Missing nozzles in an established product are easier to tech support, than a whole litany of issues that can be at hand when you begin experimenting with custom inks.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "properly evaluated the system..." I have followed instructions to the letter. Neither am I experimenting with anything. I thought I was using a well-tested printer (the model, not the particular machine) with proven cartridges and an established ink set.

> If you want some advise on how to properly evaluate a new ink formulation or a custom ink formulation please ask me. It might be helpful to others as well. But, you're sitting with an expensive printer right now that has missing gaps, no more ink to print, and you may be too pissed to take my advice in. If you can take it in, I think it will help you.

I would be delighted to have your advice. I don't understand however why you think I am "pissed". Frustrated, yes. To be "pissed" I would have to blame someone and I don't see any reason or advantage to laying blame. I just want to get up and running. I am $1500+ into this, need more ink and have yet to make a single print.

> In the meantime - you were given excellent advise to test the printer first with OEM inks. Also flushing! Not all inks can intermix with the OEM in the print head. I don't know what Tom is doing. I only know his excellent printmaking.

I think this is a misunderstanding. I started out with a new, unused (though second hand) printer and OEM inks. I made prints until one of the OEM cartridges ran out. Only then did I switch to the B&W inks. The printer definitely works fine, unless of course I have somehow damaged it since making the switch to the B&W ink system.

> You may have simply been dealing with tiny air bubbles and needed to turn the printer off for a day or two to let it dissipate.

Been there. Done that. Turned it off for a day. Turned it off for two days, twice. No difference. If anything, it might have been worse.

> The carts may not have pressurized fully. We can't possibly know without your having more ink to continue the experiment.

Cartridges are not empty. Ink levels are still above the lines on all cartridges. How do i get them to "pressurize fully"? Also, is there any kind of ritual for removing and reinstalling the cartridges? I have had to change the waste tray four times now and as per your instructions, it is necessary to remove the ink cartridges to do so. Is there a specific method that helps to repressurize the ink cartridges correctly?


David Kachel



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On May 19, 2010, at 2:26 PM, piezobw wrote:

> Please do not take this harshly, but I believe that you have not properly evaluated the system Tom made for you, and yet you're asking for some technical support from others who have no idea what you are experimenting with.

Oops, i forgot to mention, I went to the list at Tom's suggestion.

David Kachel



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:
>
> 
> I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "properly evaluated the system..." I have followed instructions to the letter. Neither am I experimenting with anything. I thought I was using a well-tested printer (the model, not the particular machine) with proven cartridges and an established ink set.


David,

I did not know that Tom has an established ink set. Sorry about that. I don't get out that often and I also don't pay too much attention to what others are doing, as I have barely enough time for the things that I am trying to do. If others on this list are using his inks they may have better advice for you.

I had thought that you were after an exceedingly warm ink set and that Tom agreed to make a custom one for you. Then he decided not to - then we all got involved in a conversation with you about how there is not a lot of custom warm ink making, or established warm inks about...and suggested to you that you print in color. I would have to look up the old thread on this list to find it - but I recall a conversation to that direction. 

So let me just speak to the carts...

The carts stay pressurized after you take them out of the printer. Make sure the printer was on for awhile. Remove the carts and very carefully remove the silicone stopper... you will hear the air escape and it may cover you with a little ink spray. So do it carefully. That is how you test pressurization. You could actually invest some money and get a readout of pressure, etc...  but if no air is escaping, no pressure!

Now re-pressurize the carts and remove them a second time. Hold them port side down in a sink and carefully insert a paper clip into the port to release the ink. It should spray out. This tells you at the least whether the carts are pressurizing and whether the internal valve is working. There is not much more to them.

Regards,

Jon Cone

Cool!  http://www.ovimaging.com/inks.html    Everyday is a learning experience for me around here. I just learned about 3MK two years after its release.


So, if the carts pressurize - ok - get some OEM carts and retest the printer. If you are certain its working perfectly - then get some more ink from Tom and have a second go. If you run into the same problem - your feedback with Tom should get you running smoothly.

I would not think that excessive or inadequate humidity is a problem anywhere in the USA at this month - but check your environment to make sure that you're not below 20% humidity which will dry out the heads. We like to stay above 30% and below 55%. Also, clean your capping station. If it can not seal properly, it can introduce air into your print heads...

Didn't you look at my how to maintain your inkjet printer video!!!

take a look it may help:  
http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c.362672/it.I/id.222/.f

Most of the practices in that will help you get your 3800 in shape in case you do have a dirty head or capping station.


Jon Cone
Piezography





--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:

>
> 
> On May 19, 2010, at 9:24 AM, piezobw wrote:
> 
> > What brand of ink are you trying to print in them?
> 
> OVI/Tom Mallonee, hextone.
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

David,

Did you by chance not fill your carts up with at least 80ml of ink? The chip will only read depleted after it has consumed 15ml of ink. Epson leaves 15ml of the 80ml in the cart (so you don't push air.) Is it possible you thought you had more ink in the cart than there was? You should not let the cart fall below 15% of full which in the case of the refillables (which hold 100ml) is 15ml of ink. Otherwise you can push air....

Jon Cone
Piezography

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:

>
> 
> On May 19, 2010, at 2:26 PM, piezobw wrote:
> 
> > Please do not take this harshly, but I believe that you have not properly evaluated the system Tom made for you, and yet you're asking for some technical support from others who have no idea what you are experimenting with.
> 
> Oops, i forgot to mention, I went to the list at Tom's suggestion.
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

On May 20, 2010, at 1:33 PM, piezobw wrote:

> Did you by chance not fill your carts up with at least 80ml of ink? The chip will only read depleted after it has consumed 15ml of ink. Epson leaves 15ml of the 80ml in the cart (so you don't push air.) Is it possible you thought you had more ink in the cart than there was? You should not let the cart fall below 15% of full which in the case of the refillables (which hold 100ml) is 15ml of ink. Otherwise you can push air....

I filled them as far as possible. To the top line.

David Kachel



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well its ink under the bridge now...better to contact us for help when the problem is going on and we're both in a position to troubleshoot it. 

I understand you are getting more ink sent to you. (Tom is a really great guy - besides being a great photographer and printmaker.)

If I was you, I would return the printer to Epson inks first and make sure that you have one that works properly. You might be chasing something that you inherited in the used printer. So you want to rule that out. The OEM carts test will do that, even though it means buying new carts. Then reinstall the refill cart system. This would be the right way to do it.

If you're pressurizing - that will rule out a lot also...

You may have dampers leaking...which can introduce air. I understand that you had a lot of air in the ink lines...

Good luck with your experiments!  

Jon Cone
Piezography

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:

>
> 
> On May 20, 2010, at 1:33 PM, piezobw wrote:
> 
> > Did you by chance not fill your carts up with at least 80ml of ink? The chip will only read depleted after it has consumed 15ml of ink. Epson leaves 15ml of the 80ml in the cart (so you don't push air.) Is it possible you thought you had more ink in the cart than there was? You should not let the cart fall below 15% of full which in the case of the refillables (which hold 100ml) is 15ml of ink. Otherwise you can push air....
> 
> I filled them as far as possible. To the top line.
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>