Digital BW, The Print

If you don't have to draw anything, you'd probably be happier with a 
mouse, but if you
do anything in photoshop like retouching, NOTHING beats the wacom 
tablet.  You have
the best size, in my opinion.

Jerry



Tim Timmermans wrote:

> I read the thread about the Wacom tablets and went out and bougjt the 
> 6x8. So far I hate it. I can't draw to save my soul and I find I have 
> much more control with my optical mouse. The pad seems too big for 
> one thing. It seems to take the dimensions of my monitor screen and 
> reduce it to 6x8 so that the curser goes from end to end.
> 
> If I get the smaller one will it do the same at the smaller 
> dimension? I think if I had a smaller area to deal with I might be 
> more effective. I don't plan on doing any free drawing, just 
> photographic editing and such.
> 
> Does anyone think I'd be better off with the smaller unit? Has anyone 
> else had this same frustration as me and decided to stick with a 
> regular mouse or has anyone had the same frustration and ultimately 
> got the hang of it and became efficient with it?
> 
> Lousy drawers want to know. I still have another week or so to take 
> it back to Fry's.
> 
> Thanks, Tim
> 
> http://timtimmermans.com
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> 
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>

> I read the thread about the Wacom tablets and went out and bougjt the
> 6x8. So far I hate it. I can't draw to save my soul and I find I have
> much more control with my optical mouse. The pad seems too big for
> one thing. It seems to take the dimensions of my monitor screen and
> reduce it to 6x8 so that the curser goes from end to end.
>
> If I get the smaller one will it do the same at the smaller
> dimension? I think if I had a smaller area to deal with I might be
> more effective. I don't plan on doing any free drawing, just
> photographic editing and such.
>
> Does anyone think I'd be better off with the smaller unit? Has anyone
> else had this same frustration as me and decided to stick with a
> regular mouse or has anyone had the same frustration and ultimately
> got the hang of it and became efficient with it?

Most people like yourself (and me) will feel more comfortable with the 4x5
tablet, mainly because the range of wrist motion required to use the 4x5
tablet is very similar to that of using a mouse.

Tim - I just got the smaller Graphire2. I can tell I'm going to like
it, but it will take some getting used to. For one thing, I believe I
will need to put my keyboard on a pull-out tray so I can put the
tablet right in front of me as I would a pad of paper. Using it as I
have my mouse (to the right of the keyboard) causes my hand to cramp
and feels very unnatural.

Also, I have to educate myself on how to use the pen with Photoshop -
I've only used it a little but it seems like the brushes/tools don't
behave quite the same way.

I can't draw either, but I'm sure I'll be able to draw badly with a
pen better than with a mouse! And to Jerry's point, I think it will
ultimately be fabulous for photo retouching/restoration which is my
primary interest.

So I say to myself: patience, practice, patience, practice.
And if you haven't loaded the Painter Classic that came with it, you
should do so...it is so much fun to play with and shows the potential
of the pen.

Most folks recommend the size you have but my budget only allowed the
small one which I think will be just fine for now.
Sorry so long-winded....
Linda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Timmermans" <treath@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 6:15 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Wacom redux
(snip)
> Does anyone think I'd be better off with the smaller unit? Has
anyone
> else had this same frustration as me and decided to stick with a
> regular mouse or has anyone had the same frustration and ultimately
> got the hang of it and became efficient with it?
>
> Lousy drawers want to know. I still have another week or so to take
> it back to Fry's.
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
> http://timtimmermans.com
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups
Sponsor ---------------------~-->
> Shop for Over 100,000 Posters & Prints @ Art.com with Custom
Framing!
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/qDdA9C/P5AFAA/_ZuFAA/ucIolB/TM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
-~->
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls
and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish
to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages
to keep them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject
header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
&amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the
various resources on the homepage.
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

>
>
>

I have had two Wacoms, an ArtPad & an Intuous II, both 4x5. I can't imagine
using anything larger; in fact, if they offered a model 3-1/2 x 4 in size I
would go for that one.

As far as your general frustration using it, it took me a while to
transition from the relative moves of the mouse to the absolute coordinates
of the tablet. Now I use the tablet exclusively as my pointing device.

When you do get used to using it Tim, you will find it a fantastic tool for
photo editing.  -bk

----- Original Message -----

From: "Tim Timmermans" <treath@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 4:15 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Wacom redux


> I read the thread about the Wacom tablets and went out and bougjt the
> 6x8. So far I hate it. I can't draw to save my soul and I find I have
> much more control with my optical mouse. The pad seems too big for
> one thing. It seems to take the dimensions of my monitor screen and
> reduce it to 6x8 so that the curser goes from end to end.
>
> If I get the smaller one will it do the same at the smaller
> dimension? I think if I had a smaller area to deal with I might be
> more effective. I don't plan on doing any free drawing, just
> photographic editing and such.
>
> Does anyone think I'd be better off with the smaller unit? Has anyone
> else had this same frustration as me and decided to stick with a
> regular mouse or has anyone had the same frustration and ultimately
> got the hang of it and became efficient with it?
>
> Lousy drawers want to know. I still have another week or so to take
> it back to Fry's.
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
> http://timtimmermans.com

Tim;
If you look at all the options in the driver you will find that you 
can change the behavior of the tablet drastically: you can make it 
function like a mouse, i.e. relative movements, or you can 'remap' 
the drawing area so your monitor is represented by a smaller area on 
the tablet. I suppose you could also just take it back and get the 
4x5, in which case I suggest you get the Intuos not the Graphyre. 
I'm of the opinion you have the best size also, and once you get 
used to it, you'll love it. Try using it with quick mask mode to 
refine a detailed selection area-you'll appreciate it immediately!

Steve K
> 
> When you do get used to using it Tim, you will find it a fantastic 
tool for
> photo editing.  -bk
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tim Timmermans" <treath@a...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 4:15 PM
> Subject: [Digital BW] Wacom redux
> 
> 
> > I read the thread about the Wacom tablets and went out and 
bougjt the
> > 6x8. So far I hate it. I can't draw to save my soul and I find I 
have
> > much more control with my optical mouse. The pad seems too big 
for
> > one thing. It seems to take the dimensions of my monitor screen 
and
> > reduce it to 6x8 so that the curser goes from end to end.
> >
> > If I get the smaller one will it do the same at the smaller
> > dimension? I think if I had a smaller area to deal with I might 
be
> > more effective. I don't plan on doing any free drawing, just
> > photographic editing and such.
> >
> > Does anyone think I'd be better off with the smaller unit? Has 
anyone
> > else had this same frustration as me and decided to stick with a
> > regular mouse or has anyone had the same frustration and 
ultimately
> > got the hang of it and became efficient with it?
> >
> > Lousy drawers want to know. I still have another week or so to 
take

> > it back to Fry's.
> >
> > Thanks, Tim
> >
> > http://timtimmermans.com

Greetings Tim,
"Keep the Faith Baby", the tablet will become the best thing you ever used with Photoshop.
I use a Graphire2. I found that when I first used it, I had the setup set so sensitive that I couldn't  possibly handle it. I went a back several times and reset it until it seemed more a tuned to my manual dexterity. 

Have A Happy Day,
Phillip Buzard
Virginia Beach, Virginia, USA
philbuzard@...
Film! I don't need no stinkin' film!


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I've had the "original" Graphire on Windoze USB for 2 years..My mouse has
been "gathering dust" ever since..Spend some time with your Wacom..I
guarantee you won't go back to your mouse for most photo-editing
manipulations..

Just my $2.00 worth..("inflation" you know!)

Eddie Wiseman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phillip Buzard" <philbuzard@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 1:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Wacom redux


>
> Greetings Tim,
> "Keep the Faith Baby", the tablet will become the best thing you ever used
with Photoshop.
> I use a Graphire2. I found that when I first used it, I had the setup set
so sensitive that I couldn't  possibly handle it. I went a back several
times and reset it until it seemed more a tuned to my manual dexterity.
>
> Have A Happy Day,
> Phillip Buzard
> Virginia Beach, Virginia, USA
> philbuzard@...
> Film! I don't need no stinkin' film!
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
&amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

I got a graphire a year or so ago, and use it plenty for photoshop
business - and the usefulness of the touch sensitivity is great and really
has to be used to be appreciated. I do have a problem with the control
aspect of it though, and I pinned it down to the slipperyness of the pen
point on the pad - for me it is too slick, there isn't much feedback from
the tip, and I find I slide all over it when I'm trying to do something
slowly, or finely detailed. So I've stuck a sheet of paper over the pad and
its much much better, because the tip doesn't necessarily slide when I apply
more pressure, I can draw a hard, thick line without it becoming scribbly.
This probably has a lot to do with individual sketch style too mind, I'm
pretty loose and iterative with pencils, whereas some people tend to be more
controlled. I'd like an angle sensing system, to vary the width of the line
(pressure to control the darkness), but the ones that offer such a feature
are too expensive for my application.

I do find it tricky to use the pen for things other than sketching business,
partially because the double click is tricky, partially because of the extra
concentration it takes to use. Mice are easier to use in conjunction with
keyboards.

I'd recommend a graphire for any work that favours a naturalistic sketchy
style of working over a precise, but my sister, who has bad rsi in her
wrists and hands finds it unusable - possibly a matter of finding the best
way to use it.


sandy noble @ www.euphy.co.uk

Jerry (and anyone else who has an opinion)-

I recenty traded the old wacom serial port in for the new graphire 
one (4x5) with the USB connection...and I hate the pen compared to 
the old one.

What pen do you use? The one I have has the click switch too high up 
on the pen barrel and it's quite a bit thicker than the old one I was 
used to...I use a laptop with a pointing stick (toshiba and IBM) and 
I find myself drifting away from the wacom because of the pen...I've 
never used a mouse and I'm actually thinking of using the wacom mouse 
on the pad (you all probably get a laugh about that).

Is there a perfect pen?

Tom O'Connell



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Jerry Olson 
<jerryolson@r...> wrote:
> If you don't have to draw anything, you'd probably be happier with 
a 
> mouse, but if you
> do anything in photoshop like retouching, NOTHING beats the wacom 
> tablet.  You have
> the best size, in my opinion.
> 
> Jerry
> 
> 
> 
> Tim Timmermans wrote:
> > I read the thread about the Wacom tablets and went out and bougjt 
the 
> > 6x8. So far I hate it. I can't draw to save my soul and I find I 
have 
> > much more control with my optical mouse. The pad seems too big 
for 
> > one thing. It seems to take the dimensions of my monitor screen 
and 
> > reduce it to 6x8 so that the curser goes from end to end.
> > 
> > If I get the smaller one will it do the same at the smaller 
> > dimension? I think if I had a smaller area to deal with I might 
be 
> > more effective. I don't plan on doing any free drawing, just 
> > photographic editing and such.
> > 
> > Does anyone think I'd be better off with the smaller unit? Has 
anyone 
> > else had this same frustration as me and decided to stick with a 
> > regular mouse or has anyone had the same frustration and 
ultimately 
> > got the hang of it and became efficient with it?
> > 
> > Lousy drawers want to know. I still have another week or so to 
take 
> > it back to Fry's.
> > 
> > Thanks, Tim
> > 
> > http://timtimmermans.com
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
Polls and other resources as they are often being updated. The page 
is at:
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > 
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you 
wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by 
visiting this same page.
> > 
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to keep them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or 
&amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
various resources on the homepage. 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 

> > 
> > 
> >

Tom, You don't want the Graphire tablet. Get the Intuos Tablet. Twice
the resolution, and the pen is very nice.  However, I wish they didn't
have any buttons on the pen itself, as they always seem to get pushed
when you don't want them to.

Jerry