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RE: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

RE: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-03 by Alessandro Pardi

I never had a chance to play with the Nikon, but remember that scanning s/w
is an important factor. There's no comparison, either, between the Canon
with its own FilmGet software and the same Canon with Vuescan... (the latter
being miles ahead).
 
Alessandro Pardi
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: André Vallejo [mailto:avs@...]
Sent: lunedì 3 febbraio 2003 15:21
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Canon scanner


I've used a Canon 4000 for a while to test,and reults are much less then
satisfying.No comparison with the Nikon 4000 I've finally bought...


Message: 25
   Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 23:29:53 -0500
   From: "Stuart Phillips" <stuart.phillips@...>
Subject: Re: ImagePrint Sale

Does anyone have expeience with the Canon  FS2720U film scanner? How does it
work?

Thanks in advance?


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-05 by jimenez12fr <miguel.jimenez@oecd.org>

I can't make the Canon scanner work properly either, without given me 
quite a lot of grain. I am using Vuescan, getting Raw RGB scans and 
selecting the best channel and converting into greyscale, but the 
result is still grainy scans, no matter how I manipulate it with 
curves and levels. Funny enough, with the Canon software I'm getting 
better results, but that probably means I'm not good enough at 
manipulating images with photoshop.

I have a question on this, is anyone using gaussian blur to avoid 
grain? Up to now this is the only solution I have for grain, although 
it softens very slightly the image. Is there any other PS tool or 
plugin for eliminating grain that works well? I'd like to hear about 
experiences of other people with BW grain. 

Maybe the Canon scanner is just too sharp for grainy images (I think 
I've read about this on photo.net), perhaps my unit is special. 
Thanks 



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro Pardi 
<alessandro.pardi@i...> wrote:
> I never had a chance to play with the Nikon, but remember that 
scanning s/w
> is an important factor. There's no comparison, either, between the 
Canon
> with its own FilmGet software and the same Canon with Vuescan... 
(the latter
> being miles ahead).
>  
> Alessandro Pardi
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: André Vallejo [mailto:avs@p...]
> Sent: lunedì 3 febbraio 2003 15:21
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] Canon scanner
> 
> 
> I've used a Canon 4000 for a while to test,and reults are much less 
then
> satisfying.No comparison with the Nikon 4000 I've finally bought...
> 
> 
> Message: 25
>    Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 23:29:53 -0500
>    From: "Stuart Phillips" <stuart.phillips@r...>
> Subject: Re: ImagePrint Sale
> 
> Does anyone have expeience with the Canon  FS2720U film scanner? 
How does it
> work?
> 
> Thanks in advance?
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
Polls and
> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint> 
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you 
wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting 
this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages 
to keep
> them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> &amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
various
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> resources on the homepage. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-05 by rikeller <rikeller@yahoo.com>

See discussion of Neat Image software at the bottom of Norman Koren's 
excellent discussion of sharpness and film grain here: 
http://www.normankoren.com/Tutorials/MTF8.html

Or go to Neat Image directly at: http://www.neatimage.com/

I am in no way affiliated with Neat Image. I just found out about the 
software a few days ago, downloaded the demo version, and purchased 
the Pro version (supports 48/16 bits) within hours after seeing the 
stunning results. Works great for reducing both film grain and 
scanner noise on my Nikon 4000ED scans. It also has a great 
sharpening routine. Possibly the best software purchase I have ever 
made at $60.

See this site for a comparison of competing noise/grain reduction 
products (Neat Image came out on top overall): 
http://www.michaelalmond.com/Articles/noise1.htm

Hope this helps,
Rik


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
<miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> I can't make the Canon scanner work properly either, without given 
me 
> quite a lot of grain. I am using Vuescan, getting Raw RGB scans and 
> selecting the best channel and converting into greyscale, but the 
> result is still grainy scans, no matter how I manipulate it with 
> curves and levels. Funny enough, with the Canon software I'm 
getting 
> better results, but that probably means I'm not good enough at 
> manipulating images with photoshop.
> 
> I have a question on this, is anyone using gaussian blur to avoid 
> grain? Up to now this is the only solution I have for grain, 
although 
> it softens very slightly the image. Is there any other PS tool or 
> plugin for eliminating grain that works well? I'd like to hear 
about 
> experiences of other people with BW grain. 
> 
> Maybe the Canon scanner is just too sharp for grainy images (I 
think 
> I've read about this on photo.net), perhaps my unit is special. 
> Thanks 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro 
Pardi 
> <alessandro.pardi@i...> wrote:
> > I never had a chance to play with the Nikon, but remember that 
> scanning s/w
> > is an important factor. There's no comparison, either, between 
the 
> Canon
> > with its own FilmGet software and the same Canon with Vuescan... 
> (the latter
> > being miles ahead).
> >  
> > Alessandro Pardi
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: André Vallejo [mailto:avs@p...]
> > Sent: lunedì 3 febbraio 2003 15:21
> > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [Digital BW] Canon scanner
> > 
> > 
> > I've used a Canon 4000 for a while to test,and reults are much 
less 
> then
> > satisfying.No comparison with the Nikon 4000 I've finally 
bought...
> > 
> > 
> > Message: 25
> >    Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 23:29:53 -0500
> >    From: "Stuart Phillips" <stuart.phillips@r...>
> > Subject: Re: ImagePrint Sale
> > 
> > Does anyone have expeience with the Canon  FS2720U film scanner? 
> How does it
> > work?
> > 
> > Thanks in advance?
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
> Polls and
> > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint> 
> > 
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you 
> wish to
> > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting 
> this same
> > page.
> > 
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages 
> to keep
> > them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
> header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > &amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
> various
> > resources on the homepage. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of 
Service
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-05 by sceptre12345 <am1000@videotron.ca>

Jimenez,

Which Canon scanner model are you talking about? 

Also, which film are you scanning in RGB mode in Viewscan, then 
converting to greyscale ? Also, which scanning resolution are you 
using and what print size are you trying to acheive ?

Andre


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
<miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> I can't make the Canon scanner work properly either, without given 
me 
> quite a lot of grain. I am using Vuescan, getting Raw RGB scans and 
> selecting the best channel and converting into greyscale, but the 
> result is still grainy scans, no matter how I manipulate it with 
> curves and levels. Funny enough, with the Canon software I'm 
getting 
> better results, but that probably means I'm not good enough at 
> manipulating images with photoshop.
> 
> I have a question on this, is anyone using gaussian blur to avoid 
> grain? Up to now this is the only solution I have for grain, 
although 
> it softens very slightly the image. Is there any other PS tool or 
> plugin for eliminating grain that works well? I'd like to hear 
about 
> experiences of other people with BW grain. 
> 
> Maybe the Canon scanner is just too sharp for grainy images (I 
think 
> I've read about this on photo.net), perhaps my unit is special. 
> Thanks 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro 
Pardi 
> <alessandro.pardi@i...> wrote:
> > I never had a chance to play with the Nikon, but remember that 
> scanning s/w
> > is an important factor. There's no comparison, either, between 
the 
> Canon
> > with its own FilmGet software and the same Canon with Vuescan... 
> (the latter
> > being miles ahead).
> >  
> > Alessandro Pardi
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: André Vallejo [mailto:avs@p...]
> > Sent: lunedì 3 febbraio 2003 15:21
> > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [Digital BW] Canon scanner
> > 
> > 
> > I've used a Canon 4000 for a while to test,and reults are much 
less 
> then
> > satisfying.No comparison with the Nikon 4000 I've finally 
bought...
> > 
> > 
> > Message: 25
> >    Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 23:29:53 -0500
> >    From: "Stuart Phillips" <stuart.phillips@r...>
> > Subject: Re: ImagePrint Sale
> > 
> > Does anyone have expeience with the Canon  FS2720U film scanner? 
> How does it
> > work?
> > 
> > Thanks in advance?
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
> Polls and
> > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint> 
> > 
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you 
> wish to
> > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting 
> this same
> > page.
> > 
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages 
> to keep
> > them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
> header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > &amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
> various
> > resources on the homepage. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of 
Service
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-05 by Veniamin Kostitsin II

> I have a question on this, is anyone using gaussian blur to avoid 
> grain? Up to now this is the only solution I have for grain, 
although 
> it softens very slightly the image. Is there any other PS tool or 
> plugin for eliminating grain that works well? I'd like to hear 
about 

hi ... blurring the whole image deteriorates sharpness ... and we do not want that, do we ? :-) 

now and then i use neatimage (http://www.neatimage.com/index.html?c) for noise or grain reduction. careful though ... it is easy to end up "plastic fantastic"

cheers

veniamin kostitsin 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-06 by jimenez12fr <miguel.jimenez@oecd.org>

I'm talking about Canon 4000 FS, and the film is usually Kodak TMY 
developed with TMAX developer at a 1+6 dilution. But I get also 
unsatisfactory results with chromogenic films when they are shot 
indoors with available light (slightly underexposed, which is not 
good for these films, I know).

Thanks for the reference to the grain reduction software, I'll have a 
look as soon as I find the time. I liked the remark about "plastic 
fantastic"... but it is not what I am looking for.


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "sceptre12345 
<am1000@v...>" <am1000@v...> wrote:
> Jimenez,
> 
> Which Canon scanner model are you talking about? 
> 
> Also, which film are you scanning in RGB mode in Viewscan, then 
> converting to greyscale ? Also, which scanning resolution are you 
> using and what print size are you trying to acheive ?
> 
> Andre
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
> <miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> > I can't make the Canon scanner work properly either, without 
given 
> me 
> > quite a lot of grain. I am using Vuescan, getting Raw RGB scans 
and 
> > selecting the best channel and converting into greyscale, but the 
> > result is still grainy scans, no matter how I manipulate it with 
> > curves and levels. Funny enough, with the Canon software I'm 
> getting 
> > better results, but that probably means I'm not good enough at 
> > manipulating images with photoshop.
> > 
> > I have a question on this, is anyone using gaussian blur to avoid 
> > grain? Up to now this is the only solution I have for grain, 
> although 
> > it softens very slightly the image. Is there any other PS tool or 
> > plugin for eliminating grain that works well? I'd like to hear 
> about 
> > experiences of other people with BW grain. 
> > 
> > Maybe the Canon scanner is just too sharp for grainy images (I 
> think 
> > I've read about this on photo.net), perhaps my unit is special. 
> > Thanks 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro 
> Pardi 
> > <alessandro.pardi@i...> wrote:
> > > I never had a chance to play with the Nikon, but remember that 
> > scanning s/w
> > > is an important factor. There's no comparison, either, between 
> the 
> > Canon
> > > with its own FilmGet software and the same Canon with 
Vuescan... 
> > (the latter
> > > being miles ahead).
> > >  
> > > Alessandro Pardi
> > > 
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: André Vallejo [mailto:avs@p...]
> > > Sent: lunedì 3 febbraio 2003 15:21
> > > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [Digital BW] Canon scanner
> > > 
> > > 
> > > I've used a Canon 4000 for a while to test,and reults are much 
> less 
> > then
> > > satisfying.No comparison with the Nikon 4000 I've finally 
> bought...
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Message: 25
> > >    Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 23:29:53 -0500
> > >    From: "Stuart Phillips" <stuart.phillips@r...>
> > > Subject: Re: ImagePrint Sale
> > > 
> > > Does anyone have expeience with the Canon  FS2720U film 
scanner? 
> > How does it
> > > work?
> > > 
> > > Thanks in advance?
> > > 
> > > 
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
> > Polls and
> > > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > > 
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint> 
> > > 
> > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you 
> > wish to
> > > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by 
visiting 
> > this same
> > > page.
> > > 
> > > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > - Include your full name with your message.
> > > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
> messages 
> > to keep
> > > them short.
> > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the 
subject 
> > header.
> > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > > &amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> > > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and 
the 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > various
> > > resources on the homepage. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of 
> Service
> > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-06 by billbresler <wbresler@twmi.rr.com>

I have nearly 8 years experience scanning negs using Nikon scanners. 
Getting a good scan from a traditional B&W film is difficult. My 
results with Tri-X, TMY and TMZ are mixed at best. One thing is 
certain. If your scanner has "digital ice" software or something 
similar you will get grain and blown-out highlights. Disabling the 
ice software helps. Best results are from chromogenic films, color or 
B&W. A weak fill flash ( 1 stop under overall exposure )will help 
your available light chromogenics. My best results in available light 
come from Fujicolor 800 pushed to 1600 or 3200. It converts well to 
grayscale in Photoshop. A friend who uses an older Polaroid scanner 
claims he gets good results because the light source is broader or 
diffused rather than a point source. 
I just joined the group and jumped right in. Please excuse me if this 
has been covered previously. Like I always tell my students, I'm 
always ready to offer advice, whether you've asked for it or not!
Bill Bresler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
<miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> I'm talking about Canon 4000 FS, and the film is usually Kodak TMY 
> developed with TMAX developer at a 1+6 dilution. But I get also 
> unsatisfactory results with chromogenic films when they are shot 
> indoors with available light (slightly underexposed, which is not 
> good for these films, I know).
> 
> Thanks for the reference to the grain reduction software, I'll have 
a 
> look as soon as I find the time. I liked the remark about "plastic 
> fantastic"... but it is not what I am looking for.
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "sceptre12345 
> <am1000@v...>" <am1000@v...> wrote:
> > Jimenez,
> > 
> > Which Canon scanner model are you talking about? 
> > 
> > Also, which film are you scanning in RGB mode in Viewscan, then 
> > converting to greyscale ? Also, which scanning resolution are you 
> > using and what print size are you trying to acheive ?
> > 
> > Andre
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
> > <miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> > > I can't make the Canon scanner work properly either, without 
> given 
> > me 
> > > quite a lot of grain. I am using Vuescan, getting Raw RGB scans 
> and 
> > > selecting the best channel and converting into greyscale, but 
the 
> > > result is still grainy scans, no matter how I manipulate it 
with 
> > > curves and levels. Funny enough, with the Canon software I'm 
> > getting 
> > > better results, but that probably means I'm not good enough at 
> > > manipulating images with photoshop.
> > > 
> > > I have a question on this, is anyone using gaussian blur to 
avoid 
> > > grain? Up to now this is the only solution I have for grain, 
> > although 
> > > it softens very slightly the image. Is there any other PS tool 
or 
> > > plugin for eliminating grain that works well? I'd like to hear 
> > about 
> > > experiences of other people with BW grain. 
> > > 
> > > Maybe the Canon scanner is just too sharp for grainy images (I 
> > think 
> > > I've read about this on photo.net), perhaps my unit is special. 
> > > Thanks 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro 
> > Pardi 
> > > <alessandro.pardi@i...> wrote:
> > > > I never had a chance to play with the Nikon, but remember 
that 
> > > scanning s/w
> > > > is an important factor. There's no comparison, either, 
between 
> > the 
> > > Canon
> > > > with its own FilmGet software and the same Canon with 
> Vuescan... 
> > > (the latter
> > > > being miles ahead).
> > > >  
> > > > Alessandro Pardi
> > > > 
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: André Vallejo [mailto:avs@p...]
> > > > Sent: lunedì 3 febbraio 2003 15:21
> > > > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Subject: [Digital BW] Canon scanner
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > I've used a Canon 4000 for a while to test,and reults are 
much 
> > less 
> > > then
> > > > satisfying.No comparison with the Nikon 4000 I've finally 
> > bought...
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Message: 25
> > > >    Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 23:29:53 -0500
> > > >    From: "Stuart Phillips" <stuart.phillips@r...>
> > > > Subject: Re: ImagePrint Sale
> > > > 
> > > > Does anyone have expeience with the Canon  FS2720U film 
> scanner? 
> > > How does it
> > > > work?
> > > > 
> > > > Thanks in advance?
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, 
Bookmarks, 
> > > Polls and
> > > > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is 
at:
> > > > 
> > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint> 
> > > > 
> > > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or 
you 
> > > wish to
> > > > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by 
> visiting 
> > > this same
> > > > page.
> > > > 
> > > > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > > - Include your full name with your message.
> > > > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
> > messages 
> > > to keep
> > > > them short.
> > > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the 
> subject 
> > > header.
> > > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
or
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > > > &amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> > > > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > > > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and 
> the 
> > > various
> > > > resources on the homepage. 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of 
> > Service
> > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-06 by sceptre12345 <am1000@videotron.ca>

I have to ask why are you scanning TMY in RGB mode when there is a 
specific TMY profile in Viewscan with a CI of .40 to .80

I have scanned TMY in 120 size with Viewscan on an Epson 1640 with 
very good result and with no grain. I scanned in 16 bits b&w mode 
using the TMY profile and ajusting for the CI.

Then using the right sharpening method, result were quite good.
Andre

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
<miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> I'm talking about Canon 4000 FS, and the film is usually Kodak TMY 
> developed with TMAX developer at a 1+6 dilution. But I get also 
> unsatisfactory results with chromogenic films when they are shot 
> indoors with available light (slightly underexposed, which is not 
> good for these films, I know).
> 
> Thanks for the reference to the grain reduction software, I'll have 
a 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> look as soon as I find the time. I liked the remark about "plastic 
> fantastic"... but it is not what I am looking for.
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "sceptre12345 
> <am1000@v...>" <am1000@v...> wrote:
> > Jimenez,
> > 
> > Which Canon scanner model are you talking about? 
> > 
> > Also, which film are you scanning in RGB mode in Viewscan, then 
> > converting to greyscale ? Also, which scanning resolution are you 
> > using and what print size are you trying to acheive ?
> > 
> > Andre

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-06 by Carolyn Frayn

On Thursday, February 6, 2003, at 06:24  AM, billbresler wrote:
> I have nearly 8 years experience scanning negs using Nikon scanners.
> Getting a good scan from a traditional B&W film is difficult. My
> results with Tri-X, TMY and TMZ are mixed at best. One thing is
> certain. If your scanner has "digital ice" software or something
> similar you will get grain and blown-out highlights. Disabling the
> ice software helps.


Digital ice does not work when scanning black and white film. That's 
why you are experiencing strange artifacts and increased exposure when 
trying to do so. ...
Carolyn

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-06 by jimenez12fr <miguel.jimenez@oecd.org>

Andre,

Initially I used the specific TMY profiles which also gave me the 
same amount of grain. I have been trying to solve this problem for 
some time now, following discussions in photo.net and asking in that 
forum. The advice I got was to use Vuescan, scan in Raw mode (of 
course without ICE which anyway does not work when you choose "B&W 
negative" film) and do all manipulations in PS, because the raw file 
should contain all the information available and PS is a better tool 
to manipulate. Some people said that with this method they never had 
problems, but then I read one of those people recognizing that using 
the Nikon 8000 scanner for MF negatives was not satisfactory because 
it gives harsh grain and he preferred to go back to his previous 
scanner, an Epson 2450. Now, I also have the Epson scanner (which 
shouldn't be very different from your 1640 version) and it doesn't 
give noticeable grain, but for scanning 35mm is a bit soft. I use it 
for 4x5 film and I'm very happy with it, and you and that person in 
photo net use it for MF negatives, for which the 2450 seems to be 
also good.
The fact of too much grain with the 4000 dpi scanners has its part of 
good news (they are very sharp), but of course is not satisfactory 
for final prints. I am not ready to swap the Canon scanner by a 
Polaroid, which seems to accentuate grain by less. I have just had a 
look at Norman Koren's site, and the software suggested by previous 
posts here and recommended there looks promising (less grain 
with "natural" look). We'll see. Thanks for your interest though.

Miguel

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "sceptre12345 
<am1000@v...>" <am1000@v...> wrote:
> I have to ask why are you scanning TMY in RGB mode when there is a 
> specific TMY profile in Viewscan with a CI of .40 to .80
> 
> I have scanned TMY in 120 size with Viewscan on an Epson 1640 with 
> very good result and with no grain. I scanned in 16 bits b&w mode 
> using the TMY profile and ajusting for the CI.
> 
> Then using the right sharpening method, result were quite good.
> Andre
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
> <miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> > I'm talking about Canon 4000 FS, and the film is usually Kodak 
TMY 
> > developed with TMAX developer at a 1+6 dilution. But I get also 
> > unsatisfactory results with chromogenic films when they are shot 
> > indoors with available light (slightly underexposed, which is not 
> > good for these films, I know).
> > 
> > Thanks for the reference to the grain reduction software, I'll 
have 
> a 
> > look as soon as I find the time. I liked the remark 
about "plastic 
> > fantastic"... but it is not what I am looking for.
> > 
> > 
> > --- In 
DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "sceptre12345 
> > <am1000@v...>" <am1000@v...> wrote:
> > > Jimenez,
> > > 
> > > Which Canon scanner model are you talking about? 
> > > 
> > > Also, which film are you scanning in RGB mode in Viewscan, then 
> > > converting to greyscale ? Also, which scanning resolution are 
you 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > > using and what print size are you trying to acheive ?
> > > 
> > > Andre

Re: [Digital BW] Canon scanner

2003-02-06 by sceptre12345 <am1000@videotron.ca>

Miguel,
I agree that the Epson 1640 is about as useless as they come for 
scanning 35mm film except for web use. MF is another story. The Epson 
2450 is sharper and would be good for scans to about 8 times negative 
size.

Do not discount the Polaroid SS4000 yet.

Photographer Chris Cheadle has been using a Polaroid SS4000. In fact 
all the photo on his site were done with that scanner.
http://www.chrischeadle.com/

However he did sell his scanner for $327. on eBay today. He will be 
getting a MF scanner that can also scan 35mm.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?
ViewItem&item=3004691736&category=15223

Here's Johnny Deadman's site where his negs were scanned using a 
Polaroid SS4000 and also an Epson 1640. He does b&w street 
photography 
http://www.pinkheadedbug.com/

It might be worthwhile to contact them for input on the SS4000. The 
newer SS4000 Pro is even better but I hear it's about to be 
discontinued.

Cheers,
Andre




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jimenez12fr 
<miguel.jimenez@o...>" <miguel.jimenez@o...> wrote:
> Andre,
> 
> Initially I used the specific TMY profiles which also gave me the 
> same amount of grain. I have been trying to solve this problem for 
> some time now, following discussions in photo.net and asking in 
that 
> forum. The advice I got was to use Vuescan, scan in Raw mode (of 
> course without ICE which anyway does not work when you choose "B&W 
> negative" film) and do all manipulations in PS, because the raw 
file 
> should contain all the information available and PS is a better 
tool 
> to manipulate. Some people said that with this method they never 
had 
> problems, but then I read one of those people recognizing that 
using 
> the Nikon 8000 scanner for MF negatives was not satisfactory 
because 
> it gives harsh grain and he preferred to go back to his previous 
> scanner, an Epson 2450. Now, I also have the Epson scanner (which 
> shouldn't be very different from your 1640 version) and it doesn't 
> give noticeable grain, but for scanning 35mm is a bit soft. I use 
it 
> for 4x5 film and I'm very happy with it, and you and that person in 
> photo net use it for MF negatives, for which the 2450 seems to be 
> also good.
> The fact of too much grain with the 4000 dpi scanners has its part 
of 
> good news (they are very sharp), but of course is not satisfactory 
> for final prints. I am not ready to swap the Canon scanner by a 
> Polaroid, which seems to accentuate grain by less. I have just had 
a 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> look at Norman Koren's site, and the software suggested by previous 
> posts here and recommended there looks promising (less grain 
> with "natural" look). We'll see. Thanks for your interest though.
> 
> Miguel
> 
>

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