Digital BW, The Print

HI all

I'm thinking of buying the new version of EyeOne Photo which comes 
with iMatch version 3. I want to be able to:

1) Linearise the 26 step greyscale for an IJC profile.
2) Create soft proofs for B&W as per Roy's method.
3) Create my own ICC colour profiles.
3) Calibrate my monitor. (Already do this with a Spyder)

I have read nothing about how to measure for greyscale linearisation 
except that you can do it. Is this straight forward ?

From what I have read it seems this is an excellent tool. However I 
would appreciate any comments from users. 

The cost in the UK is just under £1000. 

Is it worth it ?

This hobby is getting expensive !!!

Many thanks in advance.

Peter.

Measuring the greyscale patches for IJC is perfectly straightforward. 
You can use the measure tool in ProfileMaker Pro V4 - no dongle 
license required to run it.  This is downloadable from the GM site.  
(The measure tool in V5 cannot be used without the PM V5 license).  I 
have done this myself to generate a linearized custom profile for 
Ilford Smooth Pearl on 2100 that works extremely well.  It took me a 
day, with no previous experience of IJC/OPM.  It's hard to justify 
the cost of an Eye-One Photo, but I have never regretted buying mine 
for a moment.

John 


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
<PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:
> 
> HI all
> 
> I'm thinking of buying the new version of EyeOne Photo which comes 
> with iMatch version 3. I want to be able to:
> 
> 1) Linearise the 26 step greyscale for an IJC profile.
> 2) Create soft proofs for B&W as per Roy's method.
> 3) Create my own ICC colour profiles.
> 3) Calibrate my monitor. (Already do this with a Spyder)
> 
> I have read nothing about how to measure for greyscale 
linearisation 

> except that you can do it. Is this straight forward ?
> 
> From what I have read it seems this is an excellent tool. However I 
> would appreciate any comments from users. 
> 
> The cost in the UK is just under £1000. 
> 
> Is it worth it ?
> 
> This hobby is getting expensive !!!
> 
> Many thanks in advance.
> 
> Peter.

Peter,

I use an Eye One and ProfileMaker 5 for all of the things you 
mention.  Works fine.  PM5 has more options than EyeOne Photo, but 
you should be able to do all you want using it.  In his softproofing 
writeup, Roy has a workaround so you can use custom targets with Eye 
One Match software.  

Lou

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
<PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:
> 
> HI all
> 
> I'm thinking of buying the new version of EyeOne Photo which comes 
> with iMatch version 3. I want to be able to:
> 
> 1) Linearise the 26 step greyscale for an IJC profile.
> 2) Create soft proofs for B&W as per Roy's method.
> 3) Create my own ICC colour profiles.
> 3) Calibrate my monitor. (Already do this with a Spyder)
> 
> I have read nothing about how to measure for greyscale 
linearisation 

> except that you can do it. Is this straight forward ?
> 
> From what I have read it seems this is an excellent tool. However I 
> would appreciate any comments from users. 
> 
> The cost in the UK is just under £1000. 
> 
> Is it worth it ?
> 
> This hobby is getting expensive !!!
> 
> Many thanks in advance.
> 
> Peter.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "John Houghton" 
<j.houghton@n...> wrote:
> 
> Measuring the greyscale patches for IJC is perfectly 
straightforward. 
> You can use the measure tool in ProfileMaker Pro V4 - no dongle 
> license required to run it.  This is downloadable from the GM 
site.  
> (The measure tool in V5 cannot be used without the PM V5 license).  
I 
> have done this myself to generate a linearized custom profile for 
> Ilford Smooth Pearl on 2100 that works extremely well.  It took me 
a 
> day, with no previous experience of IJC/OPM.  It's hard to justify 
> the cost of an Eye-One Photo, but I have never regretted buying 
mine 
> for a moment.

Hi John

Thanks for the info. I have downloaded PM4. I have read Roy's readme 
on using measure tool to linearize QTR curves. To use the Measure 
Tool I see that you have to create a ReferenceMT.txt file of the grey 
scale tiff that you want to scan. For QTR Roy supplies these.

Question: How do I create this reference file for IJC 26 step grey 
scale file ?

Peter.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
<PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:
 
> Thanks for the info. I have downloaded PM4. I have read Roy's 
readme 
> on using measure tool to linearize QTR curves. To use the Measure 
> Tool I see that you have to create a ReferenceMT.txt file of the 
grey 
> scale tiff that you want to scan. For QTR Roy supplies these.
> 
> Question: How do I create this reference file for IJC 26 step grey 
> scale file ?
> 
> Peter.

You don't need a reference file.  IJC isn't able to read a 
measurement file so there's no point in producing one.  I simply 
followed the instructions to measure the "L" value of each patch 
using the spot option in the measure tool.  These are then entered 
into the table in the linearization screen.  I was a bit concerned 
that the values I had measured were the opposite way round to the 
density readings in the examples (i.e. high L = low density), but the 
linearization process handles this ok.  It would certainly be nice to 
be able to read in a strip of patches, but no doubt this will come in 
due course.  (Are you there, Paul?)

John

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "John Houghton" 
<j.houghton@n...> wrote:
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
> <PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:
>  
> > Thanks for the info. I have downloaded PM4. I have read Roy's 
> readme 
> > on using measure tool to linearize QTR curves. To use the Measure 
> > Tool I see that you have to create a ReferenceMT.txt file of the 
> grey 
> > scale tiff that you want to scan. For QTR Roy supplies these.
> > 
> > Question: How do I create this reference file for IJC 26 step 
grey 
> > scale file ?
> > 
> > Peter.
> 
> You don't need a reference file.  IJC isn't able to read a 
> measurement file so there's no point in producing one.  I simply 
> followed the instructions to measure the "L" value of each patch 
> using the spot option in the measure tool.  These are then entered 
> into the table in the linearization screen.  I was a bit concerned 
> that the values I had measured were the opposite way round to the 
> density readings in the examples (i.e. high L = low density), but 
the 
> linearization process handles this ok.  It would certainly be nice 
to 
> be able to read in a strip of patches, but no doubt this will come 
in 
> due course.  (Are you there, Paul?)
> 
> John

Many thanks for the reply. I'm a little in the dark about using Eye 
One because I have'nt actually used one yet. I'm just trying to get a 
feel for the tool before I purchase one. I do have IJC and was 
planning on buying a densitometer because it seemed so easy to 
measure the patches and enter the values into IJC. However Eye One 
would do so much more for me and in the longterm be better value. 
Hence the questions regarding using it with IJC. I will have another 
look at the help files in Measure Tool for spot measurements.

Regarding my orignal post I have now worked out how to create the 
reference file. If I have read Roy's readme correctly on QTR/Eye One, 
then this reference file can be read by Measure Tool in strip mode 
and then saved as a text file. IJC can import data as a scan or text 
file. If IJC can read this data text file then I think you have your 
wish. It would save having to enter 26 values every time !! 

What do you think.

Peter.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
<PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:

> Regarding my orignal post I have now worked out how to create the 
> reference file. If I have read Roy's readme correctly on QTR/Eye 
One, 
> then this reference file can be read by Measure Tool in strip mode 
> and then saved as a text file. IJC can import data as a scan or 
text 
> file. If IJC can read this data text file then I think you have 
your 
> wish. It would save having to enter 26 values every time !! 


Peter, Measuring spot values is a simply a matter of placing the 
suplied plastic Eye-1 locating guide in position over the required 
patch and then placing the Eye-1 on the guide and clicking the read 
button.  Likewise, there's also long guide with a slot that is used 
to scan a strip.  Certainly there is no difficulty in using the 
reference files provided by Roy to read a strip.  Whether the 
converted data file from Calc-Density is compatible with IJC is 
unknown.  I haven't found any instructions in the IJC/OPM manual for 
using the "Import linearization Readings" button or a description of 
the file format expected.

John

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "John Houghton" 
<j.houghton@n...> wrote:
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
> <PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:
> 
> > Regarding my orignal post I have now worked out how to create the 
> > reference file. If I have read Roy's readme correctly on QTR/Eye 
> One, 
> > then this reference file can be read by Measure Tool in strip 
mode 
> > and then saved as a text file. IJC can import data as a scan or 
> text 
> > file. If IJC can read this data text file then I think you have 
> your 
> > wish. It would save having to enter 26 values every time !! 
> 
> 
> Peter, Measuring spot values is a simply a matter of placing the 
> suplied plastic Eye-1 locating guide in position over the required 
> patch and then placing the Eye-1 on the guide and clicking the read 
> button.  Likewise, there's also long guide with a slot that is used 
> to scan a strip.  Certainly there is no difficulty in using the 
> reference files provided by Roy to read a strip.  Whether the 
> converted data file from Calc-Density is compatible with IJC is 
> unknown.  I haven't found any instructions in the IJC/OPM manual 
for 
> using the "Import linearization Readings" button or a description 
of 
> the file format expected.
> 
> John

John
The "Import linearization Readings" button is for importing a tab-
delimited text file. There is an example of one in the linearization 
examples folder. It just lists the 26 values.

Peter

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
<PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:

> The "Import linearization Readings" button is for importing a tab-
> delimited text file. There is an example of one in the 
linearization 
> examples folder. It just lists the 26 values.

I don't seem to have such a file in my pre-release version of IJC/OPM 
(Win).  However, I did run the measure tool over a print of Roy's 21 
step image and got a measurement.txt file.  Unfortunately, the Calc-
Density.command file for processing it seems to be a unix or Linux 
shell script so no good on a WinXP system.  In any case, we need the 
26 step data for IJC.  But we are close to having what's required.

John

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "John Houghton" 
<j.houghton@n...> wrote:
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "bwbonkers" 
> <PeterDLevis@a...> wrote:
> 
> > The "Import linearization Readings" button is for importing a tab-
> > delimited text file. There is an example of one in the 
> linearization 
> > examples folder. It just lists the 26 values.
> 
> I don't seem to have such a file in my pre-release version of 
IJC/OPM 
> (Win).  However, I did run the measure tool over a print of Roy's 
21 
> step image and got a measurement.txt file.  Unfortunately, the Calc-
> Density.command file for processing it seems to be a unix or Linux 
> shell script so no good on a WinXP system.  In any case, we need 
the 
> 26 step data for IJC.  But we are close to having what's required.
> 
> John

John

From info I got offline from kind members of this forum, all you need 
is this measurement.txt file. Import this file into a spreadsheet. 
Then select the 26 L values and save as a text file. This file can 
then be imported into IJC. You do not need to use the Calc-Density 
script.

If you need the 26 random greyscale tiff for printing and the Measure 
Tool reference file to go with it, I have both (given to me by 
members of this group), just contact me offline.


Peter

Can someone give me a step-by-step description of how to use the Profile Maker version 
4.x with an Eye-One Photo device to linearize?  The PM software seems to want a hardware 
dongle.

thanks for any help
Ed

Ed

Just ignore the dongle message - you use Measure Tool which does not require
the dongle.  Instructions are listed in a readme in the Eye One folder of
the QTR download.  If you don't have the readme contact me off list and I
will send it to you.

Steve

> From: edrudolpho <erudolph@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 04:17:10 -0000
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: EyeOne Photo for linearization
> 
> 
> 
> Can someone give me a step-by-step description of how to use the Profile Maker
> version 
> 4.x with an Eye-One Photo device to linearize?  The PM software seems to want
> a hardware 
> dongle.
> 
> thanks for any help
> Ed
>