Digital BW, The Print

Hi,
does anybody has tried (experimented) the best combination with 
Ilford Smooth Pearl and media type in QTR with UT2 inks on an EPSON 
890?

Hi! I¹m a new guy here this is my first post and I just read my first emails
I got his morning.
My name is Mark Rabiner and I¹m just introducing myself.
I¹ve got 40 years of darkroom experience and I¹m not about to phase that
out.
But have not made a darkroom print in over a year. Nor ran any film.
Previously I kind of specialized in black and white now sometimes I shoot
the c41 monochrome stuff but kind of like Fuji NPZ. More information.
And other color neg. films as of late. Some 160 in the studio when I don¹t
shoot with my D100.
When I do shoot film it¹s Hasselblad or Leica M. sometimes Nikon as I¹ve
revamped that system with the d100 and all.
I¹ll get back to the darkroom sooner or later I¹m kind of focusing on
digital now trying to get it down.
I print with an Epson 2200 and am looking at a 4000.
Which is not in the room I¹m looking ay buying one.
I AM looking at a 1200 which is taking up too much room in this room I guess
I¹ts not system X I don¹t remember.
Maybe I should put it in the back yard.
I¹m a photographer you could click on my site if want to check out where my
head is at a little bit.
I do generalized commercial, fashion and fine art. And portrait.  And
toaster ovens.  
And wood chips. This is Oregon.
Promo I guess I may have done the most of. Since 1975. Model portfolios for
one. Actors, Dancers, Stock brokers.
I¹m really not selling anything there so I hope it¹s not considered spam to
have it on my name thing at the end where it always is.
Or Velveeta.

Do you guys and gals show each other your prints?
Not possible I guess. On the internet that is.
Uploading is another (much easier) art form.
People in effect ³print to disk, or monitor² I wonder if you guys talk about
that stuff.

Next thing you know everyone will be showing each other their portfolios on
that Epson viewer hard disk thing with the 2 inch screen.
It will be the greatest equalizer since the Colt 45.
The big present for next holiday season we¹ll see if I¹m right.

I do have a biz size portfolio I¹ve printed on Enhanced Matte.
That¹s 2x3.5².
It¹s nice to have shots with you.
Beats out a third lens.
Well that¹s me a little bit.
Happy to be here.

That zone system PDF acrobat thing in my darkroom page I¹ve put lots of
hours into yesterday totally revising it.
So if it looks interesting so far it will look read far better in a few
days.
I also have a few other tidbits, charts and so on I impulsively make for
myself and I upload it here for other darkroom and photo geeks like myself.
Angles of view, which needs some real updating with cropped formats and all.
My ten tray darkroom workflow. (so I don¹t forget when I finally get down
there again)
They all are in need of some rethinking but there they are for now.
Everything's free. Feel free to print them out of course.  Say YOU did it!
:)
Any input as to suggestions and mistakes is wildly appreciated (are?).

http://rabinergroup.com/Catagorypages/Darkroom.html

Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mark,

Welcome to the group.

>... 40 years of darkroom experience and I¹m 
>not about to phase that out.

That's what I thought also.  Now my darkroom is the ink mixing room.  (I do
still develop my B&W film there.)  Once you get hooked on the power of
digital and find that the direct inkjet outputs really can be excellent,
you'll probably not be using the enlarger much.


Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Hi Mark,

Welcome to the group and to the world of fine digital B&W print making. Are you the same Rabiner that I used to read years ago on the LUG?

I think that once you get a workflow in place that works for you, you probably won't be using those enlargers anymore. I haven't touched my Beseler 45MX or Leitz V35 for over 5 years. I can produce much better, IMO, prints in the digital lightroom than I could with silver papers in the darkroom. And, I spent the 10-15 years prior to moving to digital contact printing 8x10.

Good luck, and welcome to the "club!"

Alan Huntley


Alan Huntley

> 
> From: Mark Rabiner <mark@...>
> Date: 2005/02/28 Mon AM 11:23:26 EST
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Digital BW] New guy Alert!
> 
> 
> 
> Hi! I\ufffdm a new guy here this is my first post and I just read my first emails
> I got his morning.
> My name is Mark Rabiner and I\ufffdm just introducing myself.
> I\ufffdve got 40 years of darkroom experience and I\ufffdm not about to phase that
> out.

Mark, welcome.  
 
Like some of the rest of us, you've already phased out the wet print process and don't want to admit it.  Kinda' like losing an old friend.
 
Tom Baker

Alan.Huntley@... wrote:

Hi Mark,

Welcome to the group and to the world of fine digital B&W print making. Are you the same Rabiner that I used to read years ago on the LUG?

I think that once you get a workflow in place that works for you, you probably won't be using those enlargers anymore. I haven't touched my Beseler 45MX or Leitz V35 for over 5 years. I can produce much better, IMO, prints in the digital lightroom than I could with silver papers in the darkroom. And, I spent the 10-15 years prior to moving to digital contact printing 8x10.

Good luck, and welcome to the "club!"

Alan Huntley


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Welcome Mark,

Enjoyed your "bio" - sound like you'll be a nice addition to the group!

Christer
			Christer, AKA Christer Rosewell

			  http://www.ChristerArt.com
		


On Feb 28, 2005, at 12:46 PM, 
DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com wrote:

>    From: Mark Rabiner <mark@...>
> Subject: New guy Alert!
>
>
> Hi! I¹m a new guy here this is my first post and I just read my first 
> emails
> I got his morning.
> My name is Mark Rabiner and I¹m just introducing myself.
>



> http://rabinergroup.com/Catagorypages/Darkroom.html
>
> Mark Rabiner
> Photography
> Portland Oregon

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

At 8:23 AM -0800 2/28/05, Mark Rabiner wrote:
>[snip] Do you guys and gals show each other your prints? [snip]

Yes, Mark, in addition to what's posted on web sites, thanks to Tom 
O'Connell there is a monthly (I believe) "print exchange" in which 
the first 15 (?) to sign up in response to a posted announcement send 
Tom 14 (?) documented letter-sized prints of an image and a 
self-addressed box in which to receive the exhanged prints.  When I 
was participating in the exchange, I always got an interesting 
variety of paper-and-inkset combinations as well as images. So you 
might want to keep an eye out for Tom's posted announcements.
--
Sam

> Once you get hooked on the power of
> digital and find that the direct inkjet outputs really can be excellent,
> you'll probably not be using the enlarger much.
> 
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
> 
> 
I'm hoping in another 9 months perhaps I¹ll go full circle and phase in the
darkroom again, Paul. For more of a mix.
Perhaps I¹ll output some Photoshop tweaks to 4x5 film black and white neg.
and print that!
Or output it to 8x10 and go outside on a sunny day and platinum print that.
Not done that yet but I think it¹s having a comeback perhaps for that
reason. No more need to have to shoot 8x10 negs.

And I¹ve never done large format much. I feel a wave of that stuff coming
on.
All I¹ve got is the 210 lens. I may start cranking out 4x4 negs. and flat
bedding them.
I just got a 4870 I bet my output would far exceed what you¹d get with a
40,000 film capture back or camera. If there is such a thing for that much.

I wonder how cheap a scanner you¹d need to scan sheet film and outdo
everybody else shooting DSLR's?

My guess would be 99 bucks! :) And that may be true.



Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 2/28/05 9:59 AM, "Tom Baker" <tbaker1328@...> typed:

> Mark, welcome.  
>  
> Like some of the rest of us, you've already phased out the wet print process
> and don't want to admit it.  Kinda' like losing an old friend.
>  
> Tom Baker
> 
> Alan.Huntley@... wrote:
> 
> Hi Mark,
> 
Well it¹s still all down there. I've not got eBay-itus with my darkroom
gear. No way.
You have to understand that I have made many many fiber 20x24¹s, 16x20¹s.
Thousands of 11x14¹s since I¹ve been 13 years old. (made 8x10¹s then and
there was no RC) I may get into teaching and I have a book in mind.


Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> 
> 
> Yes, Mark, in addition to what's posted on web sites, thanks to Tom
> O'Connell there is a monthly (I believe) "print exchange" in which
> the first 15 (?) to sign up in response to a posted announcement send
> Tom 14 (?) documented letter-sized prints of an image and a
> self-addressed box in which to receive the exhanged prints.  When I
> was participating in the exchange, I always got an interesting
> variety of paper-and-inkset combinations as well as images. So you
> might want to keep an eye out for Tom's posted announcements.
> --
> Sam
> 
> 
Wow that¹s cool I¹ll join in on that if I can!

The proof is in the pudding is what I say!

Lots of people I¹ve met in the past talk big but their output when you
finally see it when you come to their town looks like newspaper 80 line
screen halftones!  This exchange program would prevent that!


Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mark wrote, in part:

>...
>Perhaps I¹ll output some Photoshop tweaks to 4x5 film black and white neg.
>and print that!

I used imagesetter, LVT, and Fujix Pictography (OHT) internegatives.  I
liked the 8x10 400 ppi Pictography internegs the best.  They held up quite
well at 16 x 20, were cheap, and had virtually no artifacts.  Finding a good
service bureau, however, is a requirement.

Enjoy the journey.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Well, all that sounds familiar.  I did get certified to teach this stuff at one point.  eBay won't get you much.  I gave my entire darkroom, which was quite extensive, to the local high school.  I still do the b&w film for scanning.  But, I've never looked back at the wet print process.
 
Platinum is nice stuff.  But, you can come damn close with the digital prints.
 
Tom Baker

Mark Rabiner <mark@...> wrote:

On 2/28/05 9:59 AM, "Tom Baker" typed:

> Mark, welcome. 
> 
> Like some of the rest of us, you've already phased out the wet print process
> and don't want to admit it. Kinda' like losing an old friend.
> 
> Tom Baker
> 
> Alan.Huntley@... wrote:
> 
> Hi Mark,
> 
Well it�s still all down there. I've not got eBay-itus with my darkroom
gear. No way.
You have to understand that I have made many many fiber 20x24�s, 16x20�s.
Thousands of 11x14�s since I�ve been 13 years old. (made 8x10�s then and
there was no RC) I may get into teaching and I have a book in mind.


Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

You're in for a real treat when you see the prints of some on this forum.
 
Tom Baker

Mark Rabiner <mark@...> wrote:

> 
> 
> Yes, Mark, in addition to what's posted on web sites, thanks to Tom
> O'Connell there is a monthly (I believe) "print exchange" in which
> the first 15 (?) to sign up in response to a posted announcement send
> Tom 14 (?) documented letter-sized prints of an image and a
> self-addressed box in which to receive the exhanged prints. When I
> was participating in the exchange, I always got an interesting
> variety of paper-and-inkset combinations as well as images. So you
> might want to keep an eye out for Tom's posted announcements.
> --
> Sam
> 
> 
Wow that�s cool I�ll join in on that if I can!

The proof is in the pudding is what I say!

Lots of people I�ve met in the past talk big but their output when you
finally see it when you come to their town looks like newspaper 80 line
screen halftones! This exchange program would prevent that!


Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as they are often being updated.

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If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
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- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See �Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines� in the Files section:
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BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE �OWNER� AND �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE �OWNER� AND �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mark

I See That You are in Portland Oregon On March 17 - 20, 2005 Shades of Paper
/ INNOVA Fine Art will be exhibiting at the 42nd SPE National Conference in
Portland Oregon at the Hilton Portland & Executive Tower. I will have some
exceptional prints with me and I would be happy to share the Info.. So
Please feel Free To Look me Up and if anybody else is going please email me
and let me know I would enjoy meeting some of you !

Best

Jim Doyle

J. Doyle Enterprises LLC.
114 Old Orchard Rd.
Cherry Hill, NJ 08003
856-424-8660
http://www.shadesofpaper.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Baker [mailto:tbaker1328@...]
Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 11:02 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New guy Alert!


You're in for a real treat when you see the prints of some on this forum.

Tom Baker

Mark Rabiner <mark@...> wrote:

>
>
> Yes, Mark, in addition to what's posted on web sites, thanks to Tom
> O'Connell there is a monthly (I believe) "print exchange" in which
> the first 15 (?) to sign up in response to a posted announcement send
> Tom 14 (?) documented letter-sized prints of an image and a
> self-addressed box in which to receive the exhanged prints. When I
> was participating in the exchange, I always got an interesting
> variety of paper-and-inkset combinations as well as images. So you
> might want to keep an eye out for Tom's posted announcements.
> --
> Sam
>
>
Wow that\ufffds cool I\ufffdll join in on that if I can!

The proof is in the pudding is what I say!

Lots of people I\ufffdve met in the past talk big but their output when you
finally see it when you come to their town looks like newspaper 80 line
screen halftones! This exchange program would prevent that!


Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
they are often being updated.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
membership without notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
the membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and
Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/

BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU
FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY
DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE
POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY
TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR
ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY
THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.

Yahoo! Groups Links









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
they are often being updated.

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If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
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them short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
membership without notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
the membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and
Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section:
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BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU
FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY
DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE
POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY
TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR
ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY
THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.

Yahoo! Groups Links







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> 
> 
> I used imagesetter, LVT, and Fujix Pictography (OHT) internegatives.  I
> liked the 8x10 400 ppi Pictography internegs the best.  They held up quite
> well at 16 x 20, were cheap, and had virtually no artifacts.  Finding a good
> service bureau, however, is a requirement.
> 
> Enjoy the journey.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
> 
> 
If you guys are into that kind of stuff I¹m going to really be happy about
being here. That¹s my new frontier.

Another way I¹d like to combine my digital work and darkroom work is to get
a scanner which can scan an image off an 11x14 print which is my darkroom
default. 
That way after spending all night in the darkroom I can have something to
show for all that sweat when I come upstairs to my office with my digital
stuff in it. I¹ve had good luck scanning prints some may find that heresy
over scanning from an original need but I¹m not sure.
Often its what you don¹t think! :)

Here¹s a scan I made off an 8x10 darkroom print. (not that someone would
scan from an inkjet does that happen!!!?!)
http://rabinergroup.com/ImagePages/CouponWall630.html

Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 2/28/05 8:08 PM, "Jim Doyle" <jdoyle1713@...> typed:

> Mark
> 
> I See That You are in Portland Oregon On March 17 - 20, 2005 Shades of Paper
> / INNOVA Fine Art will be exhibiting at the 42nd SPE National Conference in
> Portland Oregon at the Hilton Portland & Executive Tower. I will have some
> exceptional prints with me and I would be happy to share the Info.. So
> Please feel Free To Look me Up and if anybody else is going please email me
> and let me know I would enjoy meeting some of you !
> 
> Best
> 
> Jim Doyle
> 

I¹ll be there! I¹ll wear a red carnation on my lapel!


Wow! Four feet of stuff to clip off!


Mark Rabiner
Photography
Portland Oregon
http://rabinergroup.com/





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]