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Digital BW, The Print

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Thread

ICC/ABW shadow compression figures . . .

ICC/ABW shadow compression figures . . .

2005-10-25 by wwodets

In followup to the discussion on QTR Create ICC and and the shadow 
compression issue I looked at the ABW driver settings.  A selection 
of "Light" (instead of the Neutral-Darker default setting) in ABW 
produced the following numbers.  These are for blacks at 90 to 100.  
The ABW Light is shown first, the default ABW Neutral-Darker second 
in parentheses:

HPR:

90  23.93 (18.42)
92  21.68 (17.69)
94  19.90 (17.21)
96  17.99 (16.94)
98  17.19 (16.69)
100 16.91 (16.80)  

VFA:

90  24.67 (19.38)
92  22.72 (17.60)
94  20.68 (16.41)
96  18.63 (15.48)
98  16.66 (14.47)
100 14.19 (13.83)

Note that on both papers there is a slight reduction in Dmax with the 
light setting.  Both also showed similarly smooth curves above 90, 
but the Light setting curves have a slight, smooth sag through the 
midrange (darker).

I also tried the "Normal" driver setting (between Neutral-Darker and 
Light) which does about what you'd think it would.  The figures are 
between the other two.  It was just enough to undo the HPR reversal 
(96=17.77, 98=17.15, 100=17.05)

What do others think about the ABW driver settings as a basis for 
Create ICC profiling?  My impression is that the Light setting is a 
better starting point (linearization) for profiling.

Thanks,
Walt

Re: [Digital BW] ICC/ABW shadow compression figures . . .

2005-10-25 by Tom Baker

This is a bit disconcerting.  It seems that the Dmax should remain the same for any given paper.  If it doesn't, how can optimal results be achieved with all settings?  And, there is a linerization problem in at least on case.  SInce it's not great, maybe it could be compensated for by a good profile.  But, I wonder if the variable dmax problem can be fixed.
 
Tom Baker

wwodets <odets@...> wrote:
In followup to the discussion on QTR Create ICC and and the shadow 
compression issue I looked at the ABW driver settings.  A selection 
of "Light" (instead of the Neutral-Darker default setting) in ABW 
produced the following numbers.  These are for blacks at 90 to 100.  
The ABW Light is shown first, the default ABW Neutral-Darker second 
in parentheses:

HPR:

90  23.93 (18.42)
92  21.68 (17.69)
94  19.90 (17.21)
96  17.99 (16.94)
98  17.19 (16.69)
100 16.91 (16.80)  

VFA:

90  24.67 (19.38)
92  22.72 (17.60)
94  20.68 (16.41)
96  18.63 (15.48)
98  16.66 (14.47)
100 14.19 (13.83)

Note that on both papers there is a slight reduction in Dmax with the 
light setting.  Both also showed similarly smooth curves above 90, 
but the Light setting curves have a slight, smooth sag through the 
midrange (darker).

I also tried the "Normal" driver setting (between Neutral-Darker and 
Light) which does about what you'd think it would.  The figures are 
between the other two.  It was just enough to undo the HPR reversal 
(96=17.77, 98=17.15, 100=17.05)

What do others think about the ABW driver settings as a basis for 
Create ICC profiling?  My impression is that the Light setting is a 
better starting point (linearization) for profiling.

Thanks,
Walt





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BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.




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---------------------------------




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] ICC/ABW shadow compression figures . . .

2005-10-25 by Tom Baker

This is a bit disconcerting.  It seems that the Dmax should remain the same for any given paper.  If it doesn't, how can optimal results be achieved with all settings?  And, there is a linerization problem in at least on case.  SInce it's not great, maybe it could be compensated for by a good profile.  But, I wonder if the variable dmax problem can be fixed.
 
Tom Baker

wwodets <odets@...> wrote:
In followup to the discussion on QTR Create ICC and and the shadow 
compression issue I looked at the ABW driver settings.  A selection 
of "Light" (instead of the Neutral-Darker default setting) in ABW 
produced the following numbers.  These are for blacks at 90 to 100.  
The ABW Light is shown first, the default ABW Neutral-Darker second 
in parentheses:

HPR:

90  23.93 (18.42)
92  21.68 (17.69)
94  19.90 (17.21)
96  17.99 (16.94)
98  17.19 (16.69)
100 16.91 (16.80)  

VFA:

90  24.67 (19.38)
92  22.72 (17.60)
94  20.68 (16.41)
96  18.63 (15.48)
98  16.66 (14.47)
100 14.19 (13.83)

Note that on both papers there is a slight reduction in Dmax with the 
light setting.  Both also showed similarly smooth curves above 90, 
but the Light setting curves have a slight, smooth sag through the 
midrange (darker).

I also tried the "Normal" driver setting (between Neutral-Darker and 
Light) which does about what you'd think it would.  The figures are 
between the other two.  It was just enough to undo the HPR reversal 
(96=17.77, 98=17.15, 100=17.05)

What do others think about the ABW driver settings as a basis for 
Create ICC profiling?  My impression is that the Light setting is a 
better starting point (linearization) for profiling.

Thanks,
Walt





Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as they are often being updated.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the membership without notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from the membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the Files section:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/

BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.




---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS 


    Visit your group "DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint" on the web.
  
    To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
 DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
  
    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 


---------------------------------




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] ICC/ABW shadow compression figures . . .

2005-10-25 by Tom Baker

This is a bit disconcerting.  It seems that the Dmax should remain the same for any given paper.  If it doesn't, how can optimal results be achieved with all settings?  And, there is a linerization problem in at least on case.  SInce it's not great, maybe it could be compensated for by a good profile.  But, I wonder if the variable dmax problem can be fixed.
 
Tom Baker

wwodets <odets@...> wrote:
In followup to the discussion on QTR Create ICC and and the shadow 
compression issue I looked at the ABW driver settings.  A selection 
of "Light" (instead of the Neutral-Darker default setting) in ABW 
produced the following numbers.  These are for blacks at 90 to 100.  
The ABW Light is shown first, the default ABW Neutral-Darker second 
in parentheses:

HPR:

90  23.93 (18.42)
92  21.68 (17.69)
94  19.90 (17.21)
96  17.99 (16.94)
98  17.19 (16.69)
100 16.91 (16.80)  

VFA:

90  24.67 (19.38)
92  22.72 (17.60)
94  20.68 (16.41)
96  18.63 (15.48)
98  16.66 (14.47)
100 14.19 (13.83)

Note that on both papers there is a slight reduction in Dmax with the 
light setting.  Both also showed similarly smooth curves above 90, 
but the Light setting curves have a slight, smooth sag through the 
midrange (darker).

I also tried the "Normal" driver setting (between Neutral-Darker and 
Light) which does about what you'd think it would.  The figures are 
between the other two.  It was just enough to undo the HPR reversal 
(96=17.77, 98=17.15, 100=17.05)

What do others think about the ABW driver settings as a basis for 
Create ICC profiling?  My impression is that the Light setting is a 
better starting point (linearization) for profiling.

Thanks,
Walt





Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as they are often being updated.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the membership without notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from the membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the Files section:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/

BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.




---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS 


    Visit your group "DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint" on the web.
  
    To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
 DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
  
    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 


---------------------------------




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