Digital BW, The Print

I use an R220 with the MIS UT-R2 neutral ink set primarily on Innova 
315 Smooth Cotton and Dourian Art (Photorag clone) papers.  I've 
found myself using black only more and more simply because I like 
the warmer tone for some of my images.  I am interested in the UT-3D 
inkset, but not ready to commit to it until more profiles are made, 
and not sure Clayton's driver control method is a step forward from 
the ICC approach I use now.

I saw Paul Roark recommends using a warm yellow cart to slightly 
warm up the neutral set, but this doesn't make a whole lot of 
difference in my experience.  I'd like to split the difference 
between the neutral and warm set.  If I bought a warm yellow bottle 
and used it in say the LM and Y places, would that get me close to 
halfway to the warm inkset?  Any recommendations as to what might 
look good while minimizine strange shifts in toning from cool to 
warm?  I thought I'd ask before blindly experimenting.

Also, I've given up trying to get the Epson semi-matte to work on 
the R220.  If anyone wants 200 4x6 sheets or so for proofing, it's 
yours for $20 + shipping, or best offer.

Thanks!
Roger

Roger,

>I use an R220 with the MIS UT-R2 neutral ink set primarily on Innova 
>315 Smooth Cotton and Dourian Art (Photorag clone) papers. I've 
>found myself using black only more and more simply because I like 
>the warmer tone for some of my images.

As you note below, you could use some R2-W carts to warm up the image and
keep the smoothness.

> I am interested in the UT-3D 
>inkset, but not ready to commit to it until more profiles are made,

The 3D inkset in a 220 prints essentially neutral on EEM with no curves,
Color Controls=0, and Gamma 2.2.  Even with no ICC, it has a good ramp, with
a bit more separation in the deep shadows than when an ICC is used in
working space gray gamma 2.2.

The easiest way to make the inkset warmer is to have the file in RGB, open a
curves dialog box, move the green curve (M ink, which is the main cool
toner) up 20 in the center and the red curve (C ink, which is the carbon)
down 20 at the center.  The print then is very close to a 220 Eboni BO
print, but with much more smoothness and more separation in the deep
shadows.  These curves could be embedded in an ICC if you have that program.

The point is that the 3D inkset prints well with no controls, just like the
R2.  Very simple curves with offsetting moves are an effective way to alter
the tones with little effect on the shape of the ramp.

>  not sure Clayton's driver control method is a step forward from 
> the ICC approach I use now.

They can distort the ramp easily if overdone.  For mild control, they have
merit.  I have not had time to experiment much with them and the 3D inkset,
but they would also work some in that context.

I prefer curves embedded in ICCs.

>I saw Paul Roark recommends using a warm yellow cart to slightly 
>warm up the neutral set, but this doesn't make a whole lot of 
>difference in my experience. 

I like the warm in the yellow spot because it has most of its effect in the
shadow areas, where some cotton papers print too cold for me.

>I'd like to split the difference between the neutral and warm set. 
> If I bought a warm yellow bottle 
>and used it in say the LM and Y places, would that get me close to 
>halfway to the warm inkset?

It would get you about half way at the 50% point. You'll still have 2
neutral-cool dark inks in the C & M.  You might want a warm one there too.

Hope this helps.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Roger, 

I think you can probably get closer than you think to the BO tone
without doing much driver color manipulation but working with the same
mix of carts Clayton is recommending in his article.  I've been
experimenting over the last week or so and have come very close
without degrading the ramp.  That is not to say that the "ICC
approach" doesn't offer more control as Paul explains in his response,
only that in the interim you can probably acheive what you are after
without much work.

Brian
http://www.brianchapmanphotography.com

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Roger"
<rsmith02@...> wrote:

>
> I use an R220 with the MIS UT-R2 neutral ink set primarily on Innova 
> 315 Smooth Cotton and Dourian Art (Photorag clone) papers.  I've 
> found myself using black only more and more simply because I like 
> the warmer tone for some of my images.  I am interested in the UT-3D 
> inkset, but not ready to commit to it until more profiles are made, 
> and not sure Clayton's driver control method is a step forward from 
> the ICC approach I use now.
> 
> I saw Paul Roark recommends using a warm yellow cart to slightly 
> warm up the neutral set, but this doesn't make a whole lot of 
> difference in my experience.  I'd like to split the difference 
> between the neutral and warm set.  If I bought a warm yellow bottle 
> and used it in say the LM and Y places, would that get me close to 
> halfway to the warm inkset?  Any recommendations as to what might 
> look good while minimizine strange shifts in toning from cool to 
> warm?  I thought I'd ask before blindly experimenting.
> 
> Also, I've given up trying to get the Epson semi-matte to work on 
> the R220.  If anyone wants 200 4x6 sheets or so for proofing, it's 
> yours for $20 + shipping, or best offer.
> 
> Thanks!
> Roger
>

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@...> wrote:

> As you note below, you could use some R2-W carts to warm up the 
image and
> keep the smoothness.
> 
> I like the warm in the yellow spot because it has most of its 
effect in the
> shadow areas, where some cotton papers print too cold for me.
> 
> >I'd like to split the difference between the neutral and warm 
set. 
> > If I bought a warm yellow bottle 
> >and used it in say the LM and Y places, would that get me close 
to 
> >halfway to the warm inkset?
> 
> It would get you about half way at the 50% point. You'll still 
have 2
> neutral-cool dark inks in the C & M.  You might want a warm one 
there too.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>
Thanks a lot, Paul.  I ordered a warm yellow and magenta cart and 
will see if this warms up the prints to my liking.  I've found that 
on glossy papers, the neutral set looks great.  Unfortunately, I 
don't really like the glossy papers (too open shadow areas for one 
thing) and am much happier with the mattes where the neutral looks 
bluish to my eyes.  The Eboni on Innova Smooth Cotton 315 is 
beautiful- I hope you get a chance to make UT-3D profiles for this 
paper at some point, and maybe even a UT-R2 silver rag profile.  I'd 
do it if I had a flatbed...

Roger,

> ... I've found that 
>on glossy papers, the neutral set looks great. 

That was the target for the "neutral" (actually neutral-cool depending on
the paper).  The glossy papers needed that shade.

>... much happier with the mattes where the neutral looks 
>bluish to my eyes.

That's where I also add the warm inks as needed.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> Roger,
> 
> > ... I've found that 
> >on glossy papers, the neutral set looks great. 
> 
> That was the target for the "neutral" (actually neutral-cool 
depending on
> the paper).  The glossy papers needed that shade.
> 
> >... much happier with the mattes where the neutral looks 
> >bluish to my eyes. 

> That's where I also add the warm inks as needed.
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com

Thanks Paul, I'm glad I'm not seeing things.  I put a warm ink in 
yellow, light cyan and magenta and now the set looks great on matte 
paper.  A touch warmer than neutral and cooler than Eboni and way 
smoother than black only (which still looks better for some images).
I appreciate the guidance.