Digital BW, The Print

I'm trying to create new icc profile for ut3d with 2100.
still today I used a old densitometer with the Paul Roark workflow 
(thank you Paul).
Now I have available the new datacolor spyder3print and I have some 
question:
1- is possible to create directly the profile for ut-3d with this 
software? The guide say that I need the 2.0 version.
2 - I will have better result using directly the datacolor software or 
is better to going on with paul workflow?

Thank you

Marco

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "fogmarco" 
<marco.fogarolo@...> wrote:
>
> I'm trying to create new icc profile for ut3d with 2100.
> still today I used a old densitometer with the Paul Roark workflow 
> (thank you Paul).
> Now I have available the new datacolor spyder3print and I have some 
> question:
> 1- is possible to create directly the profile for ut-3d with this 
> software? The guide say that I need the 2.0 version.
> 2 - I will have better result using directly the datacolor software or 
> is better to going on with paul workflow?
> 

Hello Marco,  I've used both methods with an R220, which should be close to the 2200.  
You can get different results with the different methods.  If you are after neutral prints I 
think you will do better with Paul's workflow.  If you build profiles with the SpyderPro 2.0 
you can build profiles that will allow an easy method of split toning with matte papers by 
treating the UT3D as an RGB inkset (albeit with a very limited gamut).

With glossy papers you must use a PK of some sort in the K position and I found it hard to 
maintain the tones at the transitions from deep shadows to blacks, above that point the 
transitions are very nice and smooth,  (I tried using a PK and a PKN).  Using the SpyderPro 
with the glossy papers and a PK(N) will be different as Paul's workflow uses the two dark 
grays to produce the K on glossy.   You cannot use the straight UT3D with the Eboni in 
place with the SpyderPro method on glossies as you will get massive gloss differential and 
flaking of the Eboni.  It might be possible to smooth out the transitions of a PK(N) with a 
Photoshop curve but for neutral prints on glossy I think it is much easier to use Paul's 
method. 

Good luck.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "robert49brake" 
<robert49brake@...> wrote:

As a disclaimer: I have no direct experience with the icc profile/color 
workflow of ut3d+2100. But I have considered it seriously and took a 
lot of advice, amongst others from Datacolor's David Tobie. 

What I learned: in theory the icc/color workflow gives one the 
opportunity to (split)-toning in Photoshop, preview it on screen and 
print it. In practice however, the color gamut one can obtain is very 
limited, apparently difficult to discriminate from neutral. 

As a result I stayed with my 2100 + ut3d + eye-one + QTR workflow. 

To be totally honest: this was because I aready owned an eye-one. If I 
would have a spider, I would consider the icc workflow for different 
reasons: on windows one can't print directly to QTR. In a color 
workflow this is much easier. 

Frankly, the toning possibilities of UT3D (or whatever other inkset) do 
not appeal very much to me anymore. These days, I just print neutral. 
In terms of ease of profiling, UT3D is actually a pretty convenient 
inkset to get a dead neutral (= fractional lab a and lab b values) QTR 
profile. The pre-mixed inks make this rather simple. On the other hand, 
if I would set up my 2100 from scratch I would probably go for the 4k+ 
inkset (standard inks, possibility to get dead neutral prints as well, 
glossy prints and, ok...., toning still possible).

Joost


 
>l
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "fogmarco" 
> <marco.fogarolo@> wrote:
> >
> > I'm trying to create new icc profile for ut3d with 2100.
> > still today I used a old densitometer with the Paul Roark workflow 
> > (thank you Paul).
> > Now I have available the new datacolor spyder3print and I have some 
> > question:
> > 1- is possible to create directly the profile for ut-3d with this 
> > software? The guide say that I need the 2.0 version.
> > 2 - I will have better result using directly the datacolor software 
or 
> > is better to going on with paul workflow?
> >

I have Print Fix Pro with an R220.  I didn't find the ICC workflow all
that useful- if your goal is to dial in dead neutral or slight
variations thereof on different papers it could be helpful, but I
didn't find soft proofing all that accurate for toning and if you go
too far you'll see posterization in your prints. 

I do recommend linearizing with PFP and the QTR create ICC tool and
for mild toning it's easy to use a modified Clayton Jones method- warm
Ms, cool Cs and cool Y and linearize ICCs for a couple of settings
(C+20M-20, C-20, M+20, color controls neutral).  I like the results I
get this way with the UTR2 inkset on the R220.

Roger


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Joost Horsten"
<j.h.j.h@...> wrote:

>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "robert49brake" 
> <robert49brake@> wrote:
> 
> As a disclaimer: I have no direct experience with the icc profile/color 
> workflow of ut3d+2100. But I have considered it seriously and took a 
> lot of advice, amongst others from Datacolor's David Tobie. 
> 
> What I learned: in theory the icc/color workflow gives one the 
> opportunity to (split)-toning in Photoshop, preview it on screen and 
> print it. In practice however, the color gamut one can obtain is very 
> limited, apparently difficult to discriminate from neutral. 
> 
> As a result I stayed with my 2100 + ut3d + eye-one + QTR workflow. 
> 
> To be totally honest: this was because I aready owned an eye-one. If I 
> would have a spider, I would consider the icc workflow for different 
> reasons: on windows one can't print directly to QTR. In a color 
> workflow this is much easier. 
> 
> Frankly, the toning possibilities of UT3D (or whatever other inkset) do 
> not appeal very much to me anymore. These days, I just print neutral. 
> In terms of ease of profiling, UT3D is actually a pretty convenient 
> inkset to get a dead neutral (= fractional lab a and lab b values) QTR 
> profile. The pre-mixed inks make this rather simple. On the other hand, 
> if I would set up my 2100 from scratch I would probably go for the 4k+ 
> inkset (standard inks, possibility to get dead neutral prints as well, 
> glossy prints and, ok...., toning still possible).
> 
> Joost
> 
> 
>  
> >l
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "fogmarco" 
> > <marco.fogarolo@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I'm trying to create new icc profile for ut3d with 2100.
> > > still today I used a old densitometer with the Paul Roark workflow 
> > > (thank you Paul).
> > > Now I have available the new datacolor spyder3print and I have some 
> > > question:
> > > 1- is possible to create directly the profile for ut-3d with this 
> > > software? The guide say that I need the 2.0 version.
> > > 2 - I will have better result using directly the datacolor software 
> or 
> > > is better to going on with paul workflow?
> > >
>