Homebrew PCBs

Currently, I am working on homemade CIS with my own auto-reset
circuit. I have completed first version of auto-reset circuit, it
emulates all ink cartridges with single micro. It is based on
MSP430F2130 from TI. It is emulating T60x (601,602,603 and 604) series
cartridges. This version uses internal RAM not flash to hold the ink
counters. I have faced timing problems with internal flash so for the
next version I will add external E2ROM. After completing new version
of auto-reset circuit, I will distribute object code and circuit
diagram to let everybody to do their own CIS system.
Note: I did it for CX4200 series most probably it will work for CX3810
and CX4800

Cheers,
Volkan

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com 
> [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Volkan
> Envoyé : juin 13 2006 13:07
> À : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : [Homebrew_PCBs] Epson Direct Inkjet with Homemade CIS 
> and autoreset
> 
> 
> Currently, I am working on homemade CIS with my own 
> auto-reset circuit. .... After completing new 
> version of auto-reset circuit, I will distribute object code 
> and circuit diagram to let everybody to do their own CIS system.
> Note: I did it for CX4200 series most probably it will work 
> for CX3810 and CX4800
> 
> Cheers,
> Volkan


Volkan, that would be just too cool.  If I can understand what you do, I
wouldn't mind making a PIC-based system.

Robert
:)

Robert,
 No problem I can explain it but it is really so time critical because of that I have used 16 mips micro. In my first test, which was based on MSP430F123 (8 mips device), I did all tricks that I know but could not get a reliable working one.
 
 Volkan


> .... If I can understand what you do, I 

>wouldn't mind making a PIC-based system.

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com 
> [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Volkan Sahin
> Envoyé : juin 13 2006 16:35
> À : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : Re: RE : [Homebrew_PCBs] Epson Direct Inkjet with 
> Homemade CIS and autoreset
> 
> 
>    Robert,
>  No problem I can explain it but it is really so time 
> critical because of that I have used 16 mips micro. In my 
> first test, which was based on MSP430F123 (8 mips device), I 
> did all tricks that I know but could not get a reliable working one.
>  
>  Volkan


Volkan, what's a 16 mips mcu?  :D   Is this a measurement of the processor
speed or is this communication related?

I use PIC 16F mcus at 20MHz and 18F mcus at 40 MHz, is that good enough?

Robert
:)

>cis

I'm interested in this as I cant get an economically priced cis
system, I wont need to rechip to start, but its the
tubes/bottles/vacuum/syringes etc, seems a good idea but a bit of a
build, although once running I suppose its all plain sailing from then
on.

Will this selfbuild be able to use the original sponge carts or will
it need spongeless

It is the measurement of processor speed, 16millions instruction per second.  As far as I know in Pic series clock is divided by 4 so 20 MHz means 5mips 40 MHz means 8mips. The problem is you need to respond serial clock which has a period of around 4 micro seconds.  They do not use any known SPI or I2C serial interface.
 Volkan
   
   
  
>-I use PIC 16F mcus at 20MHz and 18F mcus at 40 MHz, is that good enough?

The cartridges that I am using (T60x series) are spongeless and planning to use same ones for CIS. The cost of electronics around ~$5 and may be you need to spend additional $5 for the plastics. 
Volkan

>... Will this selfbuild be able to use the original sponge carts or will 
 it need spongeless

> The cartridges that I am using (T60x series) are spongeless and planning to use same ones for CIS. The cost of electronics around ~$5 and may be you need to spend additional $5 for the plastics.
>  Volkan

Lol wished that was so........

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Easy-Fill-Carts-Epson-Photo-900-1270-1280-1290-1290s_W0QQitemZ6861801833QQcategoryZ14303QQssPageNameZWD2VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

+ another 28$ for post.

That then takes it above the tax/import free $30 mark, so add another
$30, end cost about $90 for 2 empty cartrudges....

That why I asked if I could convert sponge which I can buy on this
island for $4 a piece.

I did find this, which looks promising at $70 but it comes with dye ink.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CIS-CONTINUOUS-INK-SYSTEM-EPSON-1290-1280-1270-900_W0QQitemZ6891449982QQcategoryZ51313QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

> > Someone wrote:
> > I use PIC 16F mcus at 20MHz and 18F mcus
> > at 40 MHz, is that good enough?

> Volkan wrote:
>
> It is the measurement of processor speed,
> 16millions instruction per second.  As far
> as I know in Pic series clock is divided
> by 4 so 20 MHz means 5mips 40 MHz means
> 8mips. The problem is you need to respond
> serial clock which has a period of around
> 4 micro seconds.  They do not use any
> known SPI or I2C serial interface.

Yes - the pics do have a 4 phase clock and
not a lot of pipeline action. So a 40Mhz
pic is only 10 Million instructions per
second.

They do however have an instruction set that
is very suitable for bit-twiddling and
software seriel ports.  They where originaly
designed to be a I/O coprocesor for other
CPUs so you can imagine they have good
instrcutions for that.

The "efficient for bit twiddling" instruction
set does NOT make up for the lack of "mips"
in most cases though.  So a 40Mhz pic might
have better bit twiddling performance than
other 10 MIPS CPUs but it probably ain't
going to make up for another 60% performance
increase to make it as fast as a 16mips TI-
MPS chip.

Just in the interest of starting a "my MCU
is better than your MCU" holy war - I am
going to mention Atmel AVRs as being a good
choice for 20 mips and an almost completly 
orthogonal instruction set :D

(plus they have more sensible names for op-
codes than TI seem to furnish their chips)

Why don't you try to do it yourself? Check the below web: 
http://eddiem.com/photo/CIS/cis.htm 
There are also some Japanese web links that I have in my office computer, if you are interested I can send them. Personally, I don't understand Japanese but don't worry they have nice pictures that explain everything. 
People are really making a lot of money on this inkjet related issues and for me it is not fair to pay such amount of money for a simple plastics. 
Cheers, 
Volkan 

>Lol wished that was so........ 
  >That then takes it above the tax/import free $30 mark, so add another 
 >$30, end cost about $90 for 2 empty cartrudges.. ..

The guy at ColorBAT go so sick of the noisy few who could not get a
prebuilt CIS to work, he stopped selling them. However, he has
instructional PDFs on his website:
http://www.colorbat.com

The pages load -very- slowly.

The most important thing is ink level, and an air bubble in the damper
(that's what the "cartridge with a hose in it" is called in a CIS). A
cartridge with a flexible thin plastic sheet side may get away without
an air bubble, but it's better with it.

Here, I'm never going to make money on this da** thing, there are too
many cut-rate bulk ink systems out there. No one wants to pay for
reliability, they'd rather replace a $50 system every year:
http://www.polyphoto.com/tutorials/bulkinksystem/

Steve Greenfield

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Lez <lez.briddon@...> wrote:

>
> >cis
> 
> I'm interested in this as I cant get an economically priced cis
> system, I wont need to rechip to start, but its the
> tubes/bottles/vacuum/syringes etc, seems a good idea but a bit of a
> build, although once running I suppose its all plain sailing from then
> on.
> 
> Will this selfbuild be able to use the original sponge carts or will
> it need spongeless
>

Do you know if it is posible to make a spongeless cart from a spongy one?
I don't really need a CIS, but i need something i can refill easily inside  
the printer.

ST

On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 20:35:12 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@yahoo.com> wrote:

> The guy at ColorBAT go so sick of the noisy few who could not get a
> prebuilt CIS to work, he stopped selling them. However, he has
> instructional PDFs on his website:
> http://www.colorbat.com
> The pages load -very- slowly.
> The most important thing is ink level, and an air bubble in the damper
> (that's what the "cartridge with a hose in it" is called in a CIS). A
> cartridge with a flexible thin plastic sheet side may get away without
> an air bubble, but it's better with it.
> Here, I'm never going to make money on this da** thing, there are too
> many cut-rate bulk ink systems out there. No one wants to pay for
> reliability, they'd rather replace a $50 system every year:
> http://www.polyphoto.com/tutorials/bulkinksystem/
> Steve Greenfield

Y'know, I have a contact in China and can get the autoreset chips for
a few dollars each, not $15 or $30 each. The problem is I would need
to order quantity.

They reset at 5% and only go to 95%, that way the printer doesn't run
an unecessary cleaning as it would if the chip reset to 100%.

I'm not sure most Epson printers will work if the chips don't count
down during printing. The autoresets work by turning the printer off
and on again.

Steve Greenfield

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Volkan Sahin <vsahin@...> wrote:
>
>   It is the measurement of processor speed, 16millions instruction
per second.  As far as I know in Pic series clock is divided by 4 so
20 MHz means 5mips 40 MHz means 8mips. The problem is you need to
respond serial clock which has a period of around 4 micro seconds. 
They do not use any known SPI or I2C serial interface.
>  Volkan
>    
>    
>   
> >-I use PIC 16F mcus at 20MHz and 18F mcus at 40 MHz, is that good
enough?
>

On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 20:57:52 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@...> wrote:

> I'm not sure most Epson printers will work if the chips don't count
> down during printing. The autoresets work by turning the printer off
> and on again.
> Steve Greenfield


Actually, most printers only read the chips at start and write at power  
down. This is why the (swedish?) method of powering the printer up with a  
good chip and powering it down with a bad one works to reset the bad one.
During printing the data may be read/written also, but i don't know about  
that. I certainly pulled the chips with the printer on and it didn't mind.  
Only switch off before you insert them or it will empty them again.

This is just such unnecessary crap, having to deal with nonsensical chips  
that are empty all the time.


ST

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com 
> [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Stefan Trethan
> Envoyé : juin 14 2006 15:17
> À : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Epson Direct Inkjet with 
> Homemade CIS and autoreset
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, most printers only read the chips at start and 
> write at power  
> down. This is why the (swedish?) method of powering the 
> printer up with a  
> good chip and powering it down with a bad one works to reset 
> the bad one. ...
> 
> 
> ST


Ya know, you might be on to something here,  I had not heard of this
particular technique.  I have 2 sets of cartidges; one empty and one brand
new.  I start up with the new, switch and reset the old ones back, great
idea!

The swapping of chips would be a pain though.  Maybe a dual circuit with
both chipsets, switch from one to the other manually.

Robert
:)

On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 23:37:53 +0200, Robert Hedan  
<robert.hedan@videotron.ca> wrote:

>
> The swapping of chips would be a pain though.  Maybe a dual circuit with
> both chipsets, switch from one to the other manually.
> Robert
> :)


That would actually be easy, while the (swedish?) method is usually  
executed with a unmodified printer and two sets of carts you could do the  
same as i did and pull all the chips of the carts, solder them together in  
parallel like they are in the printer, and swap the whole stack.

I reset the whole stack with the reset software for the PC (volkan linked  
to the page), because i don't have full chips.

I find it much more reasonable to remove the chips from the carts and have  
them at a separate location. One really doesn't want to pull the cart to  
reset the chip if it isn't needed. They should do that from the start.....

ST

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com 
> [mailto:Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Stefan Trethan
> Envoyé : juin 14 2006 18:48
> À : Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Epson Direct Inkjet with 
> Homemade CIS and autoreset
> 
> 
> 
> That would actually be easy, while the (swedish?) method is usually  
> executed with a unmodified printer and two sets of carts you 
> could do the  
> same as i did and pull all the chips of the carts, solder 
> them together in  
> parallel like they are in the printer, and swap the whole stack.
...
> 
> ST


I was thinking of something requiring less intervention.  Having both sets
of cartridges on the circuit and switching between each set using
electronics.

But now that I think about it, that might not be a good idea.  Volkan
mentionned speed was the essence here, switching devices might complicate
things.  Maybe just having 2 interchangeable stacks might be the better way
to go after all.

Robert
:)

I think method won't work with new version printers; new printers assign a number to the cartridge and save both this number and ink counter to cartridge chip and the internal battery backuped memory. At the start of every printing and power on/off it checks this number if it is not the same, it starts ink charging cycle which means waste of ink. They also sense removal of cartridge but this is easy to disable by shorting 2 shunted pins of the cartridge to the ground.
  Those of you who interested to make their own CIS also check the below Japanese web
 http://www.geocities.jp/hirai_kjp/printer.html
 Cheers
 Volkan
  

>...(swedish?) method of powering the  printer up with a  good chip and powering it down with a bad one works to reset 
> the bad one. ...

I'm pretty sure the R200/R300 series cartridges are spongeless. But
not so easy to refill OEM cartridges inside the printer, although I'm
checking that out.

Or get a cheap set of 3rd party cartridges.

It's not so hard to refill sponged cartridges. It's actually better
not to remove them from the printer. A bulk ink system really is
-much- easier than refilling.

Steve Greenfield

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan"
<stefan_trethan@...> wrote:
>
> Do you know if it is posible to make a spongeless cart from a spongy
one?
> I don't really need a CIS, but i need something i can refill easily
inside  

> the printer.
> 
> ST
> 
> 
> On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 20:35:12 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@...> wrote:
> 
> > The guy at ColorBAT go so sick of the noisy few who could not get a
> > prebuilt CIS to work, he stopped selling them. However, he has
> > instructional PDFs on his website:
> > http://www.colorbat.com
> > The pages load -very- slowly.
> > The most important thing is ink level, and an air bubble in the damper
> > (that's what the "cartridge with a hose in it" is called in a CIS). A
> > cartridge with a flexible thin plastic sheet side may get away without
> > an air bubble, but it's better with it.
> > Here, I'm never going to make money on this da** thing, there are too
> > many cut-rate bulk ink systems out there. No one wants to pay for
> > reliability, they'd rather replace a $50 system every year:
> > http://www.polyphoto.com/tutorials/bulkinksystem/
> > Steve Greenfield
>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan"
<stefan_trethan@...> wrote:

> Actually, most printers only read the chips at start and write at
power  
> down. This is why the (swedish?) method of powering the printer up
with a  
> good chip and powering it down with a bad one works to reset the bad
one.
> During printing the data may be read/written also, but i don't know
about  
> that. I certainly pulled the chips with the printer on and it didn't
mind.  
> Only switch off before you insert them or it will empty them again.

Those instructions were written quite a while ago, I'd heard they
don't work with newer Epsons. Easy enough for someone to test it.
http://www.inksupply.com/chipreset.cfm

I can get the autoreset chips and empties cheap enough that I just
don't see the point in all this fussing about.

> This is just such unnecessary crap, having to deal with nonsensical
chips  
> that are empty all the time.

Agreed.

Steve Greeenfield

The original website reports that Epson was already using new Firmware
that prevented this in the 1280 back in 2001. Last update in 2001.

http://medlem.spray.se/chipreset/

Steve Greenfield

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Volkan Sahin <vsahin@...> wrote:
>
>   I think method won't work with new version printers; new printers
assign a number to the cartridge and save both this number and ink
counter to cartridge chip and the internal battery backuped memory. At
the start of every printing and power on/off it checks this number if
it is not the same, it starts ink charging cycle which means waste of
ink. They also sense removal of cartridge but this is easy to disable
by shorting 2 shunted pins of the cartridge to the ground.
>   Those of you who interested to make their own CIS also check the
below Japanese web
>  http://www.geocities.jp/hirai_kjp/printer.html
>  Cheers
>  Volkan
>   
> 
> >...(swedish?) method of powering the  printer up with a  good chip
and powering it down with a bad one works to reset 
> > the bad one. ...
>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan" 
<stefan_trethan@...> wrote:
>
> Do you know if it is posible to make a spongeless cart from a spongy 
> one?
> I don't really need a CIS, but i need something i can refill easily 
> inside  
> the printer.
> 
> ST
> 

No. The spongeless carts have the air vent specially designed to keep 
enough negative pressure to keep the ink in the cartridge. The sponge 
is specifically there to prevent leaking. If you took the sponge out, 
all the ink would drain into the printer.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "fenrir_co" <fenrir@...> wrote:
>
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan" 
> <stefan_trethan@> wrote:
> >
> > Do you know if it is posible to make a spongeless cart from a spongy 
> > one?
> > I don't really need a CIS, but i need something i can refill easily 
> > inside  
> > the printer.
> > 
> > ST
> > 
> 
> No. The spongeless carts have the air vent specially designed to keep 
> enough negative pressure to keep the ink in the cartridge. The sponge 
> is specifically there to prevent leaking. If you took the sponge out, 
> all the ink would drain into the printer.

Actually it's the sponge that creates a virtual negative pressure. The
air vent allows air to refill the cartridge to ambient pressure, not
negative.

Dump some water on the table, it runs all over. Pour it into a sponge,
it stays in the sponge. It is at ambient pressure, but it is as if it
were at a slight negative pressure, keeping the ink from draining
right out when the cartridge is not installed. However, once it is in
the printer and properly primed, this virtual negative pressure is
lessened.

Spongeless Epson cartridges have a different arrangement, with valves
only opened by the ink spike. In addition, internal structures
regulate the pressure down to a low, but not negative, value. As
someone else pointed out, surface tension at the nozzles keeps the ink
from running out against this very small pressure.

Steve Greenfield

On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:50:46 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@...> wrote:

> Or get a cheap set of 3rd party cartridges.

Not so easy to get here, cheapest would be importing again, which can get  
expensive.

> It's not so hard to refill sponged cartridges. It's actually better
> not to remove them from the printer. A bulk ink system really is
> -much- easier than refilling.

Well, i tried the method on inksupply.com where you cut open the cart to  
clean the sponge. Only all the ink has drained out of the sponge/cart  
overnight for unknown reason. I'm not actually sure if this is still  
happening or not.

A bulk ink system would be best if you print often, but i think for my low  
volume filling the cart inside the printer would be less effort. It seems  
to me with spongeless carts this is possible.


ST

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Stefan Trethan"
<stefan_trethan@...> wrote:
>
> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:50:46 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@...> wrote:

> > It's not so hard to refill sponged cartridges. It's actually better
> > not to remove them from the printer. A bulk ink system really is
> > -much- easier than refilling.
> 
> Well, i tried the method on inksupply.com where you cut open the
cart to  
> clean the sponge. Only all the ink has drained out of the sponge/cart  
> overnight for unknown reason. I'm not actually sure if this is still  
> happening or not.

Huh. Seems like a crude method. Your reason is to clean all the old
ink out of the cartridge in preparation for filling it with MIS PRO ink.

I found an aspirator at a thrift store. I use it to suck cleaning
solution through, then distilled water, then just a lot of air. That
gets 99.9% of the old ink and left-over water out. Refill with the new
ink. I've made bulk ink systems for myself that way that continue to
work fine.

> A bulk ink system would be best if you print often, but i think for
my low  
> volume filling the cart inside the printer would be less effort. It
seems  
> to me with spongeless carts this is possible.

Having used several CIS's for years, building all but the first myself
(and rebuilding that one), I find refilling too big a pain. But I do
print a lot more.

Steve Greenfield

On Fri, 16 Jun 2006 00:22:08 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@...> wrote:

>
> Huh. Seems like a crude method. Your reason is to clean all the old
> ink out of the cartridge in preparation for filling it with MIS PRO ink.
> I found an aspirator at a thrift store. I use it to suck cleaning
> solution through, then distilled water, then just a lot of air. That
> gets 99.9% of the old ink and left-over water out. Refill with the new
> ink. I've made bulk ink systems for myself that way that continue to
> work fine.


Yes well, i like to take things apart ;-)
For a CIS this would not be good, since it is difficult to re-seal. But  
with the sponge a airleak should not be a problem, but still the whole ink  
drained somehow. I don't understand it and ideally it would just go away  
;-)

One of my fears with the CIS is that i mess it up somehow and a whole lot  
of ink drains out just as it did with the cart. The amount of ink in a  
cart would be plenty for me for many boards anyway.
But i find a set of spongeless carts and reset chips just too expensive  
(30eur at the very least not including shipping). I can reset the chips  
outside the printer without removing the carts (and getting air in), but i  
think this is a 100% reset so not ideal either because it wastes ink. I'd  
have to put a lot of effort in to use an atmel to simulate the chips...

ST

Hi Stefan,
    From my experience with HP spongless and sponged cartridges.  

The early  HP spongless cartridges used to have two little
sacks of air that were stretched over a spring stainless steel hoop. (A 
little like a tiny set of lungs.) The internal volume of the sacks was 
vented to the atmosphere and the pressure of the spring steel hoop would 
try and deflate the air sacks, thus maintain a slight vacuum in the ink 
reservoir.

As soon as a hole was breached in the cartridge to add new ink the 
"lung" would deflate entirely to due to the absents of a vacuum. Any 
attempt to refill the HP cartridge without first inflating the "lung" 
prior to sealing the cartridge with new ink in it resulted in the in 
simply draining out of the print head slowly.

However if the lungs were held inflated whilst the cartridge was being 
sealed, and once sealing of the cartridge was complete, the plug could 
be removed that was blocking the  lungs from expelling their contents to 
the atmosphere. The system once again came in to normal operation with 
the lungs holding a very slight vacuum in the cartridge, thus preventing 
the ink from draining out of the inkjet nozzles.

In fact the cartridge also has a small vent  path in a serpentine 
pattern underneath so if the vacuum became too large,  atmospheric air 
could be drawn up through the serpentine correcting the over-vacuum.


The problem you are describing sounds very much like the correct vacuum 
is not being maintained in the cartridge.  Think of it like a straw full 
of water with your finger over the top.  The vacuum in the top prevent 
the water draining out.


I do not know about epson cartridges however I guess that must have SOME 
form of vent to let air in as the is ink is used. I think the key you 
need to work on is refilling the cartridge and keeping a partial  vacuum 
in the cartridge to hold the ink from simple draining out.


For the HP sponge variety, cutting the cartridge open and taking out the 
sponge was not really all that successful. The sponge is replacing the 
vacuum in the cartridge by means of the surface tension of ink/sponge 
structure interface to hold the ink in the cartridge rather than have it 
all gush out the inkjets at the bottom.  (A bit like being able to 
'siphon' oil out of a oil can with only a fibrous jute rope, or lamp oil 
wicking UP the wick towards the flame)


Cheers,
David








Stefan Trethan wrote:

> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:50:46 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@...> wrote:
>
>   
>> Or get a cheap set of 3rd party cartridges.
>>     
>
> Not so easy to get here, cheapest would be importing again, which can get  
> expensive.
>
>   
>> It's not so hard to refill sponged cartridges. It's actually better
>> not to remove them from the printer. A bulk ink system really is
>> -much- easier than refilling.
>>     
>
> Well, i tried the method on inksupply.com where you cut open the cart to  
> clean the sponge. Only all the ink has drained out of the sponge/cart  
> overnight for unknown reason. I'm not actually sure if this is still  
> happening or not.
>
> A bulk ink system would be best if you print often, but i think for my low  
> volume filling the cart inside the printer would be less effort. It seems  
> to me with spongeless carts this is possible.
>
>
> ST
>
>
>
> Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and Photos:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
> If Files or Photos are running short of space, post them here:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs_Archives/ 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>  
>
>
>
>  
>  ** ACCEPT: CRM114 PASS Markovian Matcher ** 
> CLASSIFY succeeds; success probability: 1.0000  pR: 63.5005
> Best match to file #0 (nonspam.css) prob: 1.0000  pR: 63.5005  
> Total features in input file: 5543
> #0 (nonspam.css): features: 1596240, hits: 197142, prob: 1.00e+00, pR:  63.50 
> #1 (spam.css): features: 748272, hits: 95339, prob: 3.16e-64, pR: -63.50 
>  
> -=-Extra Stuff-=-
>
>   From sentto-4505361-14868-1150397507-yahoo=dcureton.com@... Fri Jun 16 04:51:56 2006
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> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2006 20:26:02 +0200
> Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Epson Direct Inkjet with Homemade CIS and autoreset
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> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:50:46 +0200, Steve <alienrelics@...> wrote:
>
>   
>> Or get a cheap set of 3rd party cartridges.
>>     
>
> Not so easy to get here, cheapest would be importing again, which can get  
> expensive.
>
>   
>> It's not so hard to refill sponged cartridges. It's actually better
>> not to remove them from the printer. A bulk ink system really is
>> -much- easier than refilling.
>>     
>
> Well, i tried the method on inksupply.com where you cut open the cart to  
> clean the sponge. Only all the ink has drained out of the sponge/cart  
> overnight for unknown reason. I'm not actually sure if this is still  
> happening or not.
>
> A bulk ink system would be best if you print often, but i think for my low  
> volume filling the cart inside the printer would be less effort. It seems  
> to me with spongeless carts this is possible.
>
>
> ST
>
>
>
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>
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