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CIF through-hole rivets

CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-09 by Philip Pemberton

Hi guys,

Has anyone had a play with these yet?
http://uk.farnell.com/cif/bg9-s/rivets-%C3%B8-0-8mm-qty-100/dp/1783593
http://uk.farnell.com/cif/bg10-s/rivets-%C3%B8-1-1mm-qty-100/dp/1783594
http://uk.farnell.com/cif/bg9/metalization-kit-0-8mm/dp/4208742

They make them in 0.8 and 1.1mm sizes (drill size 1.3 or 1.6mm 
respectively), and they cost about £8 (from RS) for a bag of a hundred 
rivets. I wonder if they'd be of much use for high density work; even 
with 2.54mm pitch DIPs you'd have trouble running a track between two 
adjacent rivets.

The insertion tool appears to be a modified automatic centre punch; RS 
have it listed under P/N "BG11" (same as on CIF's website), but Farnell 
only list the rivets (BG9.S and BG10.S) and the BG9 "metallization kit", 
which isn't listed on CIF's website. Is the BG9 a cheaper version of the 
insertion tool, or just a bag of rivets, or something else entirely?

At £8.44 +VAT I'm tempted to put one on my next order (I need some thin 
carbide drills and 512K RAM chips anyway) but was just curious if any 
listmembers had used these.

Thanks,
-- 
Phil.
ygroups@philpem.me.uk
http://www.philpem.me.uk/

Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-10 by sailingto

Phil, I have used rivets very similar to those in the .8mm size. The tool I have is a Panapress with the punches - they work nice indeed. High density would be a problem.  My use is normally for via from one side of board to other and my boards are NOT dense.

They are "spec'd" to hold without soldering, but I press the rivets, then put a dab of solder on both sides to be sure they make a good solid connection.  I like them better than using a piece of wire for a via.

They "could" be set without the press and special tool, but the special tool is nice.

Ken H>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Philip Pemberton <ygroups@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Hi guys,
> 
> Has anyone had a play with these yet?
> http://uk.farnell.com/cif/bg9-s/rivets-%C3%B8-0-8mm-qty-100/dp/1783593
> http://uk.farnell.com/cif/bg10-s/rivets-%C3%B8-1-1mm-qty-100/dp/1783594
> http://uk.farnell.com/cif/bg9/metalization-kit-0-8mm/dp/4208742

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-10 by Philip Pemberton

sailingto wrote:
> Phil, I have used rivets very similar to those in the .8mm size. The
> tool I have is a Panapress with the punches - they work nice indeed.
> High density would be a problem.  My use is normally for via from one
> side of board to other and my boards are NOT dense.

I take it you mean something more like this?

http://www.megauk.com/through_hole_rivets.php

The drill sizes seem a little more reasonable (0.8mm rivet needs 1.0mm 
hole, and there's a 0.4->0.6mm rivet for finer pitch work), as do the 
prices (about £25 for a pack of a thousand rivets, about 1/10th of the 
price of the CIF parts). Problem is the tooling is much more 
expensive... £250 for the press, then £91 for each die set (one required 
for each size). Ugh.

Think I'll stick with wire-wrap wire, the 0.5mm drill bit and a needle 
file for now...

-- 
Phil.
ygroups@...
http://www.philpem.me.uk/

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by Donald H Locker

You wouldn't _have_ to upset the rivet.  Insert rivet, solder head side, invert board, solder tails, pick up rivets whose heads weren't soldered, repeat.  I do know that you wouldn't get the stability that the double head would give you doing this, but it might be OK for low volume, non-critical boards.  For volume or critical, THP is the only way to go.

I was surprised at the size of the head of those 0.4mm rivets.  I wouldn't have thought that much head was necessary or desirable.  But I don't know anything about this process.

Donald.
----- "Philip Pemberton" <ygroups@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> sailingto wrote:
> > Phil, I have used rivets very similar to those in the .8mm size.
> The
> > tool I have is a Panapress with the punches - they work nice
> indeed.
> > High density would be a problem.  My use is normally for via from
> one
> > side of board to other and my boards are NOT dense.
> 
> I take it you mean something more like this?
> 
> http://www.megauk.com/through_hole_rivets.php
> 
> The drill sizes seem a little more reasonable (0.8mm rivet needs 1.0mm
> 
> hole, and there's a 0.4->0.6mm rivet for finer pitch work), as do the
> 
> prices (about £25 for a pack of a thousand rivets, about 1/10th of the
> 
> price of the CIF parts). Problem is the tooling is much more 
> expensive... £250 for the press, then £91 for each die set (one
> required 
> for each size). Ugh.
> 
> Think I'll stick with wire-wrap wire, the 0.5mm drill bit and a needle
> 
> file for now...
> 
> -- 
> Phil.
> ygroups@...
> http://www.philpem.me.uk/
>

Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by sailingto

Yep, the press is "something" like that, operates on the same principle. The other side "must" be upset to some extend other wise when you solder from other side the rivet would fall out same as a wire inserted thru hole.  The rivet needs to be upset sufficient to hold in place while soldering. 

Does that make sense?

ken H>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Donald H Locker <dhlocker@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> You wouldn't _have_ to upset the rivet.  Insert rivet, solder head side, invert board, solder tails, pick up rivets whose heads weren't soldered, repeat.  I do know that you wouldn't get the stability that the double head would give you doing this, but it might be OK for low volume, non-critical boards.  For volume or critical, THP is the only way to go.
> 
> I was surprised at the size of the head of those 0.4mm rivets.  I wouldn't have thought that much head was necessary or desirable.  But I don't know anything about this process.
> 
> Donald.
> ----- "Philip Pemberton" <ygroups@...> wrote:
> 
> > sailingto wrote:
> > > Phil, I have used rivets very similar to those in the .8mm size.
> > The
> > > tool I have is a Panapress with the punches - they work nice
> > indeed.
> > > High density would be a problem.  My use is normally for via from
> > one
> > > side of board to other and my boards are NOT dense.
> > 
> > I take it you mean something more like this?
> > 
> > http://www.megauk.com/through_hole_rivets.php
> > 
> > The drill sizes seem a little more reasonable (0.8mm rivet needs 1.0mm
> > 
> > hole, and there's a 0.4->0.6mm rivet for finer pitch work), as do the
> > 
> > prices (about £25 for a pack of a thousand rivets, about 1/10th of the
> > 
> > price of the CIF parts). Problem is the tooling is much more 
> > expensive... £250 for the press, then £91 for each die set (one
> > required 
> > for each size). Ugh.
> > 
> > Think I'll stick with wire-wrap wire, the 0.5mm drill bit and a needle
> > 
> > file for now...
> > 
> > -- 
> > Phil.
> > ygroups@...
> > http://www.philpem.me.uk/
> >
>

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by Donald H Locker

I understand the principle.  If the pre-headed side is soldered, though, then the other side can be soldered without the rivet falling out, right?  Unless you and I are just in violent agreement, and saying the same thing with different words that neither understand.

Donald.

----- "sailingto" <sailingtoo@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Yep, the press is "something" like that, operates on the same
> principle. The other side "must" be upset to some extend other wise
> when you solder from other side the rivet would fall out same as a
> wire inserted thru hole.  The rivet needs to be upset sufficient to
> hold in place while soldering. 
> 
> Does that make sense?
> 
> ken H>
> 
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Donald H Locker <dhlocker@...>
> wrote:
> >
> > You wouldn't _have_ to upset the rivet.  Insert rivet, solder head
> side, invert board, solder tails, pick up rivets whose heads weren't
> soldered, repeat.  I do know that you wouldn't get the stability that
> the double head would give you doing this, but it might be OK for low
> volume, non-critical boards.  For volume or critical, THP is the only
> way to go.
> > 
> > I was surprised at the size of the head of those 0.4mm rivets.  I
> wouldn't have thought that much head was necessary or desirable.  But
> I don't know anything about this process.
> > 
> > Donald.
> > ----- "Philip Pemberton" <ygroups@...> wrote:
> > 
> > > sailingto wrote:
> > > > Phil, I have used rivets very similar to those in the .8mm
> size.
> > > The
> > > > tool I have is a Panapress with the punches - they work nice
> > > indeed.
> > > > High density would be a problem.  My use is normally for via
> from
> > > one
> > > > side of board to other and my boards are NOT dense.
> > > 
> > > I take it you mean something more like this?
> > > 
> > > http://www.megauk.com/through_hole_rivets.php
> > > 
> > > The drill sizes seem a little more reasonable (0.8mm rivet needs
> 1.0mm
> > > 
> > > hole, and there's a 0.4->0.6mm rivet for finer pitch work), as do
> the
> > > 
> > > prices (about £25 for a pack of a thousand rivets, about 1/10th
> of the
> > > 
> > > price of the CIF parts). Problem is the tooling is much more 
> > > expensive... £250 for the press, then £91 for each die set (one
> > > required 
> > > for each size). Ugh.
> > > 
> > > Think I'll stick with wire-wrap wire, the 0.5mm drill bit and a
> needle
> > > 
> > > file for now...
> > > 
> > > -- 
> > > Phil.
> > > ygroups@...
> > > http://www.philpem.me.uk/
> > >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
> 
> Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and
> Photos:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBsYahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
>

Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by sailingto

Donald, I would NEVER get in a "violent" dis-agreement OR agreement with anyone.  What has been my experience is the first side solders nicely, then when you flip the board over to solder the other side, the solder on the first side tends to melt causing a problem with wire falling out.  

That's why the rivets work so well for me - the head holds the rivet from first side, then the "upset" portion holds the rivet on the other side.  Then both sides can be soldered without anything trying to fall out. 

Am I the only person who has a problem with using a wire for a via?  I've done it by bending both sides so they hold to board, but it doesn't work neatly as slick as the rivets.

if someone has the secret to how to hold the wire in while soldering on both sides - please share.  OR maybe it's not a secret and I'm the only person who doesn't know?  BTW, I have "sewn" wire thru all the vias to hold in place while soldering and that does work pretty good, but once they are clipped off and any rework has to be done, I have problems with solder melting.

Ken H>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Donald H Locker <dhlocker@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> I understand the principle.  If the pre-headed side is soldered, though, then the other side can be soldered without the rivet falling out, right?  Unless you and I are just in violent agreement, and saying the same thing with different words that neither understand.
> 
> Donald.

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by Harvey White

On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 04:02:56 -0000, you wrote:

>Donald, I would NEVER get in a "violent" dis-agreement OR agreement with anyone.  What has been my experience is the first side solders nicely, then when you flip the board over to solder the other side, the solder on the first side tends to melt causing a problem with wire falling out.  

absolutely
>
>That's why the rivets work so well for me - the head holds the rivet from first side, then the "upset" portion holds the rivet on the other side.  Then both sides can be soldered without anything trying to fall out. 
>

Except that the rivets I have are gigantic (but low cost), work fine
for big work, lousy for compact designs.  0.051 hole with needed gap
about 0.030 around the rivet.  Works fine for big stuff. #26 wire for
the small stuff.

>Am I the only person who has a problem with using a wire for a via?  I've done it by bending both sides so they hold to board, but it doesn't work neatly as slick as the rivets.

Stitch the wire
>
>if someone has the secret to how to hold the wire in while soldering on both sides - please share.  OR maybe it's not a secret and I'm the only person who doesn't know?  BTW, I have "sewn" wire thru all the vias to hold in place while soldering and that does work pretty good, but once they are clipped off and any rework has to be done, I have problems with solder melting.
>
Yep, it will melt.  That's why you don't rework them, or if you do,
stitch the wire though again and solder both sides.  Known problem.

Harvey
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>Ken H>
>
>--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Donald H Locker <dhlocker@...> wrote:
>>
>> I understand the principle.  If the pre-headed side is soldered, though, then the other side can be soldered without the rivet falling out, right?  Unless you and I are just in violent agreement, and saying the same thing with different words that neither understand.
>> 
>> Donald.
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and Photos:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBsYahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by Philip Pemberton

sailingto wrote:
> if someone has the secret to how to hold the wire in while soldering
> on both sides - please share.

3M Kapton (polyimide) high-temperature tape, silicone adhesive type. No 
PCB lab should be without it :)
Good to about 300 Celsius (so vaguely usable as a temporary 
coarse-position solder mask), and peelable with little or no residue (if 
you get the 3M stuff).

It's fairly hard to find on the open market (IIRC 3M class it as 
"business-to-business sale only"), but DealExtreme stock it, and there 
are lots of folks selling it on ebay.

-- 
Phil.
ygroups@...
http://www.philpem.me.uk/

Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by sailingto

I found it on ebay - just might have to order a roll. I expect there would be several uses for a high temp tape like that.

Isn't that "DealsExtreme.com" an interesting place?

Ken

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Philip Pemberton <ygroups@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> sailingto wrote:
> > if someone has the secret to how to hold the wire in while soldering
> > on both sides - please share.
> 
> 3M Kapton (polyimide) high-temperature tape, silicone adhesive type. No 
> PCB lab should be without it :)
> Good to about 300 Celsius (so vaguely usable as a temporary 
> coarse-position solder mask), and peelable with little or no residue (if 
> you get the 3M stuff).
> 
> It's fairly hard to find on the open market (IIRC 3M class it as 
> "business-to-business sale only"), but DealExtreme stock it, and there 
> are lots of folks selling it on ebay.
> 
> -- 
> Phil.
> ygroups@...
> http://www.philpem.me.uk/
>

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-11 by Philip Pemberton

sailingto wrote:
> I found it on ebay - just might have to order a roll. I expect there would be several uses for a high temp tape like that.
> 
> Isn't that "DealsExtreme.com" an interesting place?

(1st point: It's DealExtreme, not DealsExtreme)

Too right. They also sell some neat component storage boxes -- they're 
sold for beads and small arts/crafts items, but they're great for 
electronic components:
   http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.4580

These are a bit bigger and almost perfect for axial through-hole parts 
(e.g. quarter-watt resistors):
   http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.4727

Both types can be snapped together and broken apart to make more-or-less 
any size or shape of box you want. There's a little recessed bit on the 
lid that'll take a sticky label, and the lids are sprung (you press a 
little pin and the lid opens).

FWIW: you can get four of the small boxes into one bay of a Raaco A32 
storage box. Those have 32 bays each, meaning you can store a total of 
128 different SMD parts in one A32 storage box. I've got one for SMD 
resistors, another for ceramic and MLCC capacitors, and yet another for 
"miscellaneous SMD" (inductors and such).

On top of that, I've got a couple of A46 Assorters for assembled boards 
and modules, some A45 Assorters for through-hole parts, and a bunch of 
Maplin SF05 "Large Configurable Component Box" boxes for my Dannell 
Electronics quarter-watt resistor kit (you can get an E12 decade in each 
box).

It's a bit of a menagerie, but it works for me. Just need to sort out 
some form of stock control / inventory tracking system so I know where 
everything is...

-- 
Phil.
ygroups@...
http://www.philpem.me.uk/

Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-12 by sailingto

You are correct - I should watch my typing better.  My mind gets faster than my fingers sometimes.

Those are neat boxes - I saw those on ebay and almost ordered some, but DealExtreme is less expensive - that the price they have some some of the DVMs with 2.7" digits - http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.29234 for only $14 shipped?  May not be expensive, but I'll bet it works just fine.

Those boxes would be good for projects - sort all the SMD parts of each size to each box....  Yes, I think that would be good.  I spend a good bit of time trying to sort those tiny SMD parts especially when it gets to the 0805 and 0604 parts.  I remember when the 1206 parts were small!

Kne h>

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Philip Pemberton <ygroups@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> sailingto wrote:
> > I found it on ebay - just might have to order a roll. I expect there would be several uses for a high temp tape like that.
> > 
> > Isn't that "DealsExtreme.com" an interesting place?
> 
> (1st point: It's DealExtreme, not DealsExtreme)

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-12 by Philip Pemberton

sailingto wrote:
> You are correct - I should watch my typing better.  My mind gets
> faster than my fingers sometimes.

Too true -- and the risks of a mistyped URL are all the higher these 
days... (I remember the days where mistyping a URL got you an error 
message :-/ )

> Those are neat boxes - I saw those on ebay and almost ordered some,
> but DealExtreme is less expensive - that the price they have some
> some of the DVMs with 2.7" digits -
> http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.29234 for only $14 shipped?
> May not be expensive, but I'll bet it works just fine.

To be honest, I wouldn't trust a cheap DMM -- I've had really bad luck 
with the "pound shop special" (= dollar store special) DMMs; they tend 
not to be particularly accurate.

Then there was the memorable occasion when one of mine lost the ability 
to detect voltage -- continuity beeper worked fine, so I thought the 
meter was fine. Taking 240V from the side of your hand to your 
wristwatch really does tend to wake you up quite quickly...

You can get used Fluke meters for pennies on the dollar these days; a 
Fluke 25 or 27 in reasonably good nick should only set you back £50 at 
the absolute most, plus maybe £10 for a set of Pomona DMM probes (which, 
curiously enough, are compatible with most of the Fluke accessories). A 
meter like that will last you the rest of your life, unless you do 
something stupid with it. My 25 is about the size of a housebrick and 
weighs about the same too...

If you want a nice, low cost bench DMM though, the Solartron 7150 and 
7150plus are quite nice (as long as you replace the mains filter 
assembly before powering on -- the X-Class capacitors tend to fail 
spectacularly after a few years). Expect to pay about £40 for one that 
needs a new PFM, or £80 for one that's been properly refurbished and 
includes the leather case and a good set of probes. Stewart of Reading 
have a couple of new/unused 7150Plus-es for £150...

Last but not least are the HP bench DMMs -- 3478As (5.5-digit) are going 
for about £100 these days; its big brother the 34401A (6.5-digit) tends 
to sell for about £300-400 used or ~£700 used.

"Verily, thou hath but little value, but the loss of a fine test meter 
causeth much woe and despair back at the shop" :)

> Those boxes would be good for projects - sort all the SMD parts of
> each size to each box....  Yes, I think that would be good.  I spend
> a good bit of time trying to sort those tiny SMD parts especially
> when it gets to the 0805 and 0604 parts.  I remember when the 1206
> parts were small!

I usually don't go below 0805, but I've got some 0604 parts for a few 
LVDS experiments. I want to get my grubby mitts on some RGB LED arrays 
and make a nice, big "any colour you like" display panel. Unfortunately 
the student budget says "no", so it'll be a nice, big "any colour you 
like as long as it's a shade of red, green or amber" panel (for the 
price of one 64-LED 8x8 RGB panel, you can get ten 64-LED 8x8 Red/Green 
panels -- and that's buying at the 1-off price for both).

It'll also be interesting to see what LVDS looks like on my 200MHz 
digital storage scope. I'm guessing "pretty poor at anything above 
40Mbit/sec".

-- 
Phil.
ygroups@...
http://www.philpem.me.uk/

Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-12 by Ben L

I can understand what you are saying Ken and agree with what you are saying.  Unless the Thruhole is tight enough to hold things in place while soldering the other side.  If you get the part hot enough on one side to melt solder it will be hot enough on the other side to melt solder too.

Ben

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "sailingto" <sailingtoo@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Donald, I would NEVER get in a "violent" dis-agreement OR agreement with anyone.  What has been my experience is the first side solders nicely, then when you flip the board over to solder the other side, the solder on the first side tends to melt causing a problem with wire falling out.  
> 
> That's why the rivets work so well for me - the head holds the rivet from first side, then the "upset" portion holds the rivet on the other side.  Then both sides can be soldered without anything trying to fall out. 
> 
> Am I the only person who has a problem with using a wire for a via?  I've done it by bending both sides so they hold to board, but it doesn't work neatly as slick as the rivets.
> 
> if someone has the secret to how to hold the wire in while soldering on both sides - please share.  OR maybe it's not a secret and I'm the only person who doesn't know?  BTW, I have "sewn" wire thru all the vias to hold in place while soldering and that does work pretty good, but once they are clipped off and any rework has to be done, I have problems with solder melting.
> 
> Ken H>
> 
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@...m, Donald H Locker <dhlocker@> wrote:
> >
> > I understand the principle.  If the pre-headed side is soldered, though, then the other side can be soldered without the rivet falling out, right?  Unless you and I are just in violent agreement, and saying the same thing with different words that neither understand.
> > 
> > Donald.
>

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: CIF through-hole rivets

2010-03-12 by Donald H Locker

Back when I actually did some of these things, I just placed the board in intimate contact with a flat metal (aluminum worked perfectly) surface.  Metal plate kept the rivets in and the heat away.  That's been way too long ago.

Upsetting the rivet is the best solution, I agree.  I just didn't have any money back then.  Come to mention it, I don't really have any now, either.

Donald.

----- "Ben L" <bhleavi@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> I can understand what you are saying Ken and agree with what you are
> saying.  Unless the Thruhole is tight enough to hold things in place
> while soldering the other side.  If you get the part hot enough on one
> side to melt solder it will be hot enough on the other side to melt
> solder too.
> 
> Ben
> 
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "sailingto" <sailingtoo@...>
> wrote:
> >
> > Donald, I would NEVER get in a "violent" dis-agreement OR agreement
> with anyone.  What has been my experience is the first side solders
> nicely, then when you flip the board over to solder the other side,
> the solder on the first side tends to melt causing a problem with wire
> falling out.  
> > 
> > That's why the rivets work so well for me - the head holds the rivet
> from first side, then the "upset" portion holds the rivet on the other
> side.  Then both sides can be soldered without anything trying to fall
> out. 
> > 
> > Am I the only person who has a problem with using a wire for a via? 
> I've done it by bending both sides so they hold to board, but it
> doesn't work neatly as slick as the rivets.
> > 
> > if someone has the secret to how to hold the wire in while soldering
> on both sides - please share.  OR maybe it's not a secret and I'm the
> only person who doesn't know?  BTW, I have "sewn" wire thru all the
> vias to hold in place while soldering and that does work pretty good,
> but once they are clipped off and any rework has to be done, I have
> problems with solder melting.
> > 
> > Ken H>
> > 
> > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Donald H Locker <dhlocker@>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > I understand the principle.  If the pre-headed side is soldered,
> though, then the other side can be soldered without the rivet falling
> out, right?  Unless you and I are just in violent agreement, and
> saying the same thing with different words that neither understand.
> > > 
> > > Donald.
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
> 
> Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and
> Photos:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBsYahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
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Move to quarantaine

This moves the raw source file on disk only. The archive index is not changed automatically, so you still need to run a manual refresh afterward.