QTR-Quadtone RIP

Carl,
Something seems missing.. possibly.. not sure.. Maybe I'm missing something here but I honestly don't think so.. My "listening' regarding the posts is that the wax will be used instead of the recommended coating.. If that's the case I don't feel it's appropriate .. If it's to be used on top of the recommended coating then their may be a benefit but I'm not sure I understand it.. 
This discussion regarding using the wax, in all fairness, should not compare to an original oil painting versus an aquais ink canvas giclee. They are incredibly different in both their make up and their process..ARtists for years have applied a good wax to their finished oil paintings they hav ealso used a product like Liquin along the way to enhance teh quality an dgloss levels of the oil paints.. Lets note that today,while controversial, their are two type of inks used for giclee's.. Both Aquias and Solvent.. If this is a conversation about solvent inks then absolutely this wax probably would cause no harm nor have ill effects on the artwork as Solvent inks don't require a receptor layer. If however the Wax is used over an aquias ink set.. well lets go back words for a second so we can go forward..The receptor layer on canvas allows aquias inks to penetrate and hold on the canvas surface.. note that some of the new inks are cheating a little.. Their adding alcohol to the aquias inks as it mixes well with water.. (Canon does this and possibly HP.. I understand Epson does not.) Anyway, once you have applied an aquais ink to the canvas it requires a coating to basically complete the process. It's just the nature of the beast.. I do not think anyone has come up with a canvas that is fully functional uncoated for aquias inks to date.. SO once the canvas is coated with either a water base or solvent base material which is appropriate for the canvas / inkset you then have lift off as in a completed successful process. If one chooses to apply the wax after that process is completed I don't think it would hurt anything but it is not necessary.. 
Ok now moving on.. Wax is a pretty special product.. but no way is it permanent.. I've been using specialty wax product most of my life on everything from fine furniture to exotic show cars .. It's just not permanent.. Plus all the typically softer waxes that are used for wood attract dust... Once you've waxed your giclee assuming it's not coated with say bulldog or whatever you are now committed.. Wax is not friendly to any further top coats applied.. You must remove all the wax if you choose to apply a top coat that you expect to bond to the surface.. So what would removing all the wax from an aquias giclee look like.. I have no clue except to say that I'm not going there..

Constructively.. for those of you that just don't want to deal with the coating issue.. Well you bought the wrong printer.. Go buy a solvent machine.. That may sound pretty harsh but it's not really. If your selling an aquias print that is only waxed your really not selling what the industry says you need to do.. Maybe down the road they'll have this all worked out with new coating and inks.. But they sure don't today.. Their are lots of folks that are involved in inventing new technology and products.. That should not be confused with those that useing products outside the approved processes.. It's not to say we can't try new things and experiment but I specifically take exception to those that say it's ok just becasue they did it and it may "look" ok to them.. "Were's the beef" .. I have a couple of customers that if I tried something like that and got caught at it .. well I'd have to shut down the studio.. Rememebr your only as good as your last job for the most part..
Lastly again.. Call teh folks that make th ewax.. rather then speculate about what it wil lor won't do. See if they will support it on canvas using aquias inks..

jimbo

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Carl Schofield 
  To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 1:09 PM
  Subject: Re: [QuadtoneRIP] renaissance wax and bronzing?


  Renaissance wax has been used on silver gelatin prints and oil 
  paintings by museum conservators for years. It produces a very hard, 
  durable finish that protects the print surface from finger prints, 
  dust, dirt, grease, etc.. It is obviously not sufficient for 
  protection against rough handling and physical abuse that would cause 
  scratching or gouging of the surface. Most people that print on 
  canvas feel obligated (long tradition that carries over from painters) 
  to slap on thick coats of water based acrylic or solvent based 
  varnishes for physical protection. The new water resistant glossy 
  canvas coatings with a thin finish coat of Renaissance wax will 
  withstand light handling well and is all that I need for home display 
  of gallery wrapped canvas prints.

  Carl

  On Sep 12, 2008, at 2:32 PM, magickPal wrote:

  > As an antique conservator (furniture, decorative arts) I would 
  > caution you not to ascribe too much confidence in any wax giving 
  > significant protection to anything. This includes "Renaissance Wax" 
  > which is, in reality, not much different than any of other the 
  > proprietary waxes that are on the market, even though it seems, 
  > unexplainably to me, to have been chosen by the public to contain 
  > qualities, that are unavailable in the others. Waxes throughout 
  > history have been primarily used for aesthetic reasons, and in my 
  > experience have a rather minimal use as a protectant. I wonder if 
  > there is any real data on its effect on paper. I have never heard of 
  > a paper conservator using it and doubt it has been. What the 
  > materials that are defined as "canvas" I have no knowledge of. Any 
  > graphics conservators out there?
  >
  > David Pal
  >
  >
  > ----- Original Message -----
  > From: Carl Schofield
  > To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
  > Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 10:37 AM
  > Subject: Re: [QuadtoneRIP] renaissance wax and bronzing?
  >
  >
  > I'm currently testing Renaissance wax on water resistant glossy
  > canvas. Seems to work very well giving a nice soft sheen and good for
  > protecting from dirt, grime, water, etc. It did eliminate slight
  > gloss differential on some of my canvas prints. I have no bronzing
  > problems.
  >
  > Carl
  >
  > On Sep 12, 2008, at 1:27 PM, djon43 wrote:
  >
  >> Has anybody got experience with Renaissance wax?
  >>
  >> It surely protective and dealers claim it'll "reduce" bronzing...what
  >> does "reduce" mean? Is it highly worthwhile for that purpose?
  >>
  >> I'd rather apply wax and rub it (did that with Johnson's paste on
  >> darkroom prints in the 70s) than spray because I don't want to deal
  >> with dust and fumes (want to do it indoors).



   

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