QTR-Quadtone RIP

I'm fairly new to using QT RIP, and I've had a hard time understanding 
many of the settings and parameters, such as the different dither 
algorithm settings when printing, and linearization, and the density 
and limit settings in curve creations, to name a few. 

I've read the material available from the QT web site and also asked 
many questions on this forum (but unfortunately, most of the responses 
I don't quite get). 

So, is there any way to learn more about this process and what all 
these setting mean, such as some good books or reference materials on 
the subject?  

I'm not that dense (I think) and obviously you all are getting it, so I 
think there should be some way to learn about this. 

Best (but still slightly confused), David.

In a message dated 8/9/2007 10:57:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
dkfreed@... writes:

 
 
 
I'm fairly new to using QT RIP, and I've had a hard time understanding  
many of the settings and parameters, such as the different dither  
algorithm settings when printing, and linearization, and the density  
and limit settings in curve creations, to name a few. 

I've read  the material available from the QT web site and also asked 
many questions  on this forum (but unfortunately, most of the responses 
I don't quite  get). 

So, is there any way to learn more about this process and what  all 
these setting mean, such as some good books or reference materials on  
the subject? 

I'm not that dense (I think) and obviously you all  are getting it, so I 
think there should be some way to learn about this.  

Best (but still slightly confused), David.  






Ditto, David!
 
Someone needs to write a "QT-RIP for Dummies" to help out us newbies and  
beginners who don't know/understand the semantics, much less all the  technical 
stuff, so we can learn how to use the program better and  properly.
 
It shouldn't be that tough to do IMHO.
 
John E



************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at 
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I am in the same boat as David.  I am fairly new using QuadtoneRip, 
and have less of an interest in the science and creating custom 
curves, with a large desire to make really good B&W prints.  A 
really good, clear, and simple book would be very helpful.  I just 
want to make good high quality prints and not deal with the 
technical stuff, or at least, as little as I can get away with.  
Thanks for any help and or suggestions.  Michael G.

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "David" <dkfreed@...> wrote:
>
> I'm fairly new to using QT RIP, and I've had a hard time 
understanding 
> many of the settings and parameters, such as the different dither 
> algorithm settings when printing, and linearization, and the 
density 
> and limit settings in curve creations, to name a few. 
> 
> I've read the material available from the QT web site and also 
asked 
> many questions on this forum (but unfortunately, most of the 
responses 
> I don't quite get). 
> 
> So, is there any way to learn more about this process and what all 
> these setting mean, such as some good books or reference materials 
on 
> the subject?  
> 
> I'm not that dense (I think) and obviously you all are getting it, 
so I 

> think there should be some way to learn about this. 
> 
> Best (but still slightly confused), David.
>

I'm also new to QTR and would like to use it create high quality black and
white prints without unwanted color casts.  For me, the best way to learn
the program is to just use it.  I started by picking one of my favorite b&w
photos and started printing it using different curves and blends.  It's
quite interesting to see how different the image looks with slight
variations.  Now I'm doing the same process with other images and finding
that different photos need different combinations to look their best.  I
think that the only way to learn the software well enough to take full
advantage of it is through lots of experimentation.  It costs some money for
the ink and paper, but that's money well spent.

 

I have decided the software is a keeper and registered it with Roy.   

 

Stan

  _____  

From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Michael
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 12:53 PM
To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: using a RIP -- best way to learn/understand the
process?

 

I am in the same boat as David. I am fairly new using QuadtoneRip, 
and have less of an interest in the science and creating custom 
curves, with a large desire to make really good B&W prints. A 
really good, clear, and simple book would be very helpful. I just 
want to make good high quality prints and not deal with the 
technical stuff, or at least, as little as I can get away with. 
Thanks for any help and or suggestions. Michael G.

--- In QuadtoneRIP@ <mailto:QuadtoneRIP%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com,
"David" <dkfreed@...> wrote:
>
> I'm fairly new to using QT RIP, and I've had a hard time 
understanding 
> many of the settings and parameters, such as the different dither 
> algorithm settings when printing, and linearization, and the 
density 
> and limit settings in curve creations, to name a few. 
> 
> I've read the material available from the QT web site and also 
asked 
> many questions on this forum (but unfortunately, most of the 
responses 
> I don't quite get). 
> 
> So, is there any way to learn more about this process and what all 
> these setting mean, such as some good books or reference materials 
on 
> the subject? 
> 
> I'm not that dense (I think) and obviously you all are getting it, 
so I 
> think there should be some way to learn about this. 
> 
> Best (but still slightly confused), David.
>

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The best way is to just try things.  Change 1 variable at a time and 
see what happens.  Rather than just reading the tutorials, try doing 
things step by step following the tutorial.  Then when you have 
problems, you can come back here with more specific questions that 
will be easier for us to answer.

To start, try uisng a paper / ink combination that is already 
profiled.  I have found that existing profiles are usually pretty 
good and you can get by without relinearizing, etc. Different dithers 
make small changes so don't worry to much about them to start with. 
Just make prints and play with the curve blendings to begin to enjoy 
the possibilities.  Then as you find things that aren't quite right 
or you want to use papers that aren't profiled, you can start 
learning about additional features.

Peter

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "David" <dkfreed@...> wrote:
>
> I'm fairly new to using QT RIP, and I've had a hard time 
understanding 
> many of the settings and parameters, such as the different dither 
> algorithm settings when printing, and linearization, and the 
density 
> and limit settings in curve creations, to name a few. 
> 
> I've read the material available from the QT web site and also 
asked 
> many questions on this forum (but unfortunately, most of the 
responses 
> I don't quite get). 
> 
> So, is there any way to learn more about this process and what all 
> these setting mean, such as some good books or reference materials 
on 
> the subject?  
> 
> I'm not that dense (I think) and obviously you all are getting it, 
so I 

> think there should be some way to learn about this. 
> 
> Best (but still slightly confused), David.
>

Peter, I am new. Where are these tutorials. Are there a few key threads that will help me learn 
about this, thanks, stephen

You say:   Rather than just reading the tutorials, try doing 
> things step by step following the tutorial.

In a message dated 8/10/2007 12:22:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
zonepeter@... writes:

The  best way is to just try things. Change 1 variable at a time and 
see what  happens. Rather than just reading the tutorials, try doing 
things step by  step following the tutorial. 
*What* "tutorial"? I didn't get one with my copy of QTRIP. 
 
The only downloadable tutorial at Roy's site is for  Macintosh users, which 
is retty useless for Win XP Pro users since the PC  version of QT-RIP is 
completely different from the Mac version (the  latter runs thru Photoshop; the 
former is a standalone).  Nevertheless, that Mac tutorial is outdated anyway (v 
2.3) 
 
Where's the tutorial for those of us who use PCs running Win  XP Pro? 
 
The lone tutorial (on curve creation) in the User's Guide is inadequate  for 
newbies since it presupposes technical knowledge and  experience with the 
program to begin with.

Then  when you have 
problems, you can come back here with more specific  questions that 
will be easier for us to answer.

To start, try uisng  a paper / ink combination that is already 
profiled. I have found that  existing profiles are usually pretty 
good and you can get by without  relinearizing, etc. Different dithers 
make small changes so don't worry to  much about them to start with. 
Just make prints and play with the curve  blendings to begin to enjoy 
the possibilities. Then as you find things  that aren't quite right 
or you want to use papers that aren't profiled,  you can start 
learning about additional  features.

Peter



Nonsense (with all due respect):  That is no way to learn to *any*  program 
*quickly and efficiently,* least of all any way to learn its  more technical 
features (e.g., how to "linearize"). If Adobe gave the  public the same "advice" 
instead of providing instructions and  tutorials with Photoshop, we'd all be 
using Paintshop Pro instead. 
 
John E




************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at 
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Gee folks, it is only a $50 shareware program. The guy can only do so  
much, I would hope he is spending his time making the program better  
then writing "how to". Maybe he should raise the price to $1000-$2000  
like other RIPS so he can hire a tutorial writer? :)
Mark

On Aug 10, 2007, at 9:25 AM, sloopjohne@... wrote:

> *What* "tutorial"? I didn't get one with my copy of QTRIP.
>
> The only downloadable tutorial at Roy's site is for  Macintosh  
> users, which
> is retty useless for Win XP Pro users since the PC  version of QT- 
> RIP is
> completely different from the Mac version (the  latter runs thru  
> Photoshop; the
> former is a standalone).  Nevertheless, that Mac tutorial is  
> outdated anyway (v
> 2.3)
>
> Where's the tutorial for those of us who use PCs running Win  XP Pro?



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In a message dated 8/10/2007 10:07:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
mark@... writes:

Gee  folks, it is only a $50 shareware program. The guy can only do so 
much, I  would hope he is spending his time making the program better 
then writing  "how to". Maybe he should raise the price to $1000-$2000 
like other RIPS  so he can hire a tutorial writer? :)
Mark



Good point, Mark. 
 
However, as far as I can tell no one suggested that Roy should be the  one to 
take on the job. 
 
IMO, if some other enterprising third party came out with a  "QuadtoneRIP for 
Dummies" book it would be well worth another $50. :-)
 
John E



************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at 
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

This is really dummy talk

Roy is doing a fantastic job and the support we al get and give is 
enorm

remko


--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, sloopjohne@... wrote:
>
>  
> In a message dated 8/10/2007 10:07:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
> mark@... writes:
> 
> Gee  folks, it is only a $50 shareware program. The guy can only do 
so 
> much, I  would hope he is spending his time making the program 
better 
> then writing  "how to". Maybe he should raise the price to $1000-
$2000 
> like other RIPS  so he can hire a tutorial writer? :)
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
> Good point, Mark. 
>  
> However, as far as I can tell no one suggested that Roy should be 
the  one to 
> take on the job. 
>  
> IMO, if some other enterprising third party came out with 
a  "QuadtoneRIP for 
> Dummies" book it would be well worth another $50. :-)
>  
> John E
> 
> 
> 
> ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-
new AOL at 

> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

In a message dated 8/10/2007 12:27:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
r.p.de.graaff@... writes:


>>This is really dummy talk
How so? Please explain.



>>Roy is doing a fantastic job and the support we al get  and give is 
enorm

remko
Granted. But *what* does that have to do with my idea/suggestion  
--especially taking into account the enormous amount of time it takes to plow  thru the 
archives to find an answer to a particular problem or question, and/or  conduct 
numerous experiments (read: use up lot$$$ of ink & paper) trying  to find a 
solution?
 
John E
 







************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at 
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In a message dated 8/10/2007 11:47:53 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
sloopjohne@... writes:


IMO,  if some other enterprising third party came out with a  "QuadtoneRIP 
for  
Dummies" book it would be well worth another $50. :-)

John  E



You'll have to add on the spectrophotometer and software cost to that  
$50.00. Sometimes it's better to not know too much when all you want to do is  make 
a print. As Tyler once said: "just go print".
 
Richard Massie



************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at 
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Why can't some of you experienced users just help
these people out rather than waste time writing
useless messages.  Share your settings and what you
have learned and no one will need a book!


--- CorrPro96@... wrote:

>  
> In a message dated 8/10/2007 11:47:53 A.M. Eastern
> Daylight Time,  
> sloopjohne@... writes:
> 
> 
> IMO,  if some other enterprising third party came
> out with a  "QuadtoneRIP 
> for  
> Dummies" book it would be well worth another $50.
> :-)
> 
> John  E
> 
> 
> 
> You'll have to add on the spectrophotometer and
> software cost to that  
> $50.00. Sometimes it's better to not know too much
> when all you want to do is  make 
> a print. As Tyler once said: "just go print".
>  
> Richard Massie
> 
> 
> 
> ************************************** Get a sneak
> peek of the all-new AOL at 
> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
> 
> 



       
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http://autos.yahoo.com/carfinder/

Dear all, I started this post and I'm a bit surprised at the tone and
direction of some of the posts. 

I never intended to diss Roy or anyone else associated with creating
this program. Much thanks and kudos to you all, and also to all who
offer advice here. 

That said, I was mainly asking about where to look (references, books,
web sites) to learn more about the process. It seems that many others
are looking for the same thing. 

Some have suggested that digging in and just working and experimenting
with the program is the way to go. Well and good, but I believe having
some resources would certainly be helpful. This is especially true for
me since I'm using this program for an alternative process (creating
transparencies to create etching plates)  

Anyways, best to all, 
David.

David, I am a new member and I share your view. I find it helps me to review someone's 
perspective and also understand the theory and history behind the process. So let's start 
that conversation. 

Anyway, I am ordering the following books, will let you know what I think of them. They 
are from two good people, thanks, stephen 

"George DeWolfe's Digital Photography Fine Print Workshop"

"Mastering Digital Black and White: A Photographer's Guide to High Quality Black-and-
White Imaging and Printing (Digital Process and Print)"
Amadou Diallo; 


--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "David" <dkfreed@...> wrote:

>
> Dear all, I started this post and I'm a bit surprised at the tone and
> direction of some of the posts. 
> 
> I never intended to diss Roy or anyone else associated with creating
> this program. Much thanks and kudos to you all, and also to all who
> offer advice here. 
> 
> That said, I was mainly asking about where to look (references, books,
> web sites) to learn more about the process. It seems that many others
> are looking for the same thing. 
> 
> Some have suggested that digging in and just working and experimenting
> with the program is the way to go. Well and good, but I believe having
> some resources would certainly be helpful. This is especially true for
> me since I'm using this program for an alternative process (creating
> transparencies to create etching plates)  
> 
> Anyways, best to all, 
> David.
>

David,

For transparencies / digital negatives you could try Ron Reeder's book
(Digital Negatives) and his free PDF about how to use QTR for digital
negatives.  See the links near the top of this page.

This is also linked from Roy's QTR site .
http://www.quadtonerip.com/html/QTRlinks.html

Steve Gledhill

www.virtuallygrey.co.uk <http://www.virtuallygrey.co.uk/> 

 

  _____  

From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of David
Sent: 12 August 2007 04:07
To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: using a RIP -- best way to learn/understand the
process?

 

Dear all, I started this post and I'm a bit surprised at the tone and
direction of some of the posts. 

I never intended to diss Roy or anyone else associated with creating
this program. Much thanks and kudos to you all, and also to all who
offer advice here. 

That said, I was mainly asking about where to look (references, books,
web sites) to learn more about the process. It seems that many others
are looking for the same thing. 

Some have suggested that digging in and just working and experimenting
with the program is the way to go. Well and good, but I believe having
some resources would certainly be helpful. This is especially true for
me since I'm using this program for an alternative process (creating
transparencies to create etching plates) 

Anyways, best to all, 
David 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "David" <dkfreed@...> wrote:
>
> Dear all, I started this post and I'm a bit surprised...

I rarely post here, as I don't use QTR daily, or as my main driver. I do keep up with things 
here, and do use Create ICC often.
I can see all sides of this, QTR can be a bit opaque in the beginning. On the other hand 
there is literally nothing else out there that will do what it does, how it does it. So the price 
is vitually a steal. What that does is make extensive support and documentation by the 
developer unrealistic, and more in the hands of the user base. Somewhat like the open 
source community, generous user interaction is nearly manditory.
So coming here, asking questions, and expecting some help is understandable. People 
should be made welcome in my opinion. There are other forums where all kinds of 
silliness seems more expected than here.
On the other hand, given the price, messing around is definitely the way to learn with all 
the various ways this tool can be used, and all the different setups it can work with.
Also, once beyind the basics, and initial materials selections, the subtle variety of print 
quality one can arrive at, and use for their personal expression, can only be arrived at by a 
lot of creative experimentation.
Would love to help here more, as the other lists feel less focused, but I'm just not using it 
enough to offer suggestions.
I recommend Amadou's book as well, and spending a lot of time in the archives here, and 
being persistant with the questioning.
Tyler

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia <mark@...> wrote:
>
> Gee folks, it is only a $50 shareware program. The guy can only do so  
> much, I would hope he is spending his time making the program better  
> then writing "how to". Maybe he should raise the price to $1000-$2000  
> like other RIPS so he can hire a tutorial writer? :)
> Mark

As a general point, I don't see this as a reason for lack of suitable
documentation. Lots of other $50 programs have good documentation. If
users don't know how to use it, then there will be more requirement
for support resources, which could otherwise be put to better use.

As a professional sw developer myself, there is often a misguided
opinion that documentation is a peripheral item. In fact some users
see it as a macho thing - documentaion is only for sissys! However,
quality software dicatates that errors/missing documentation should be
treated just as seriously as a coding/design error. 

Getting down to specifics, I recently started evaluating QTR (XP), and
although the documenation could be improved, I did find it adequate.
One of the primary functions of a RIP is to give the user greater
control, but as a consequence, this requires a greater understanding
by the user of the problem space. Hence, I don't think that an
"idiots" guide is feasible, as "idiots" don't have sufficient
understanding of b&w digital inkjet printing.

For a reasonably knowledgeable user, I think the documentation is good
enough, especially combined with this support resource. 

Steve

David,
If you are doing digital negs, Ron Reeder's tutorial (and the book he 
and Brad Hinkel wrote) should help.  Also check in at The Hybrid 
Photo board if you aren't already there.
It would probably make sense to just make some prints with QTR before 
making the negatives.  Should save some time.  If you have to get 
into curve making and relinearizing, Tom Moore's tutorial should be 
helpful.  It is available at the QTR site.  It all seems obtuse at 
the beginning (I'm still not sure I have it all) but doing is much 
better then reading.  It is the only way for it to start making sense.
Please feel free to check in here when we can help answer questions.  
I have a few old posts saved that may help, but I'm not sure where 
you are in the process and don't want to post things that just add to 
the confusion.
Again, I hope you feel welcome here, and keep us posted on your 
progress, because although I currently am not doing digital negs, it 
is one of the really interesting uses of QTR and I am trying keep up 
with it.  

Peter

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "David" <dkfreed@...> wrote:
>
> Dear all, I started this post and I'm a bit surprised at the tone 
and
> direction of some of the posts. 
> 
> I never intended to diss Roy or anyone else associated with creating
> this program. Much thanks and kudos to you all, and also to all who
> offer advice here. 
> 
> That said, I was mainly asking about where to look (references, 
books,
> web sites) to learn more about the process. It seems that many 
others
> are looking for the same thing. 
> 
> Some have suggested that digging in and just working and 
experimenting
> with the program is the way to go. Well and good, but I believe 
having
> some resources would certainly be helpful. This is especially true 
for

> me since I'm using this program for an alternative process (creating
> transparencies to create etching plates)  
> 
> Anyways, best to all, 
> David.
>

David-

I'm coming into this thread late, as usual. My apologies if this has been mentioned previously:

If your going to use an inkjet to generate negatives (or positives, for that matter) to create etching plates, you might visit Mark Nelson's site: www.precisiondigitalnegatives.com. His eBook, Precision Digital Negatives for Silver & Other Alternative Processes, is excellent. If you haven't already, you may want to investigate Nelson's process before diving into QTR (or another print driver/third party RIP).

There are people doing very interesting, exciting, work with this.


 


Bill Kennedy
K2 Press
Austin, Texas

-----Original Message-----
From: zonepeter <zonepeter@...>
To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, 13 Aug 2007 2:16 pm
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: using a RIP -- best way to learn/understand the process?


















  



    

            
David,

If you are doing digital negs, Ron Reeder's tutorial (and the book he 

and Brad Hinkel wrote) should help.  Also check in at The Hybrid 

Photo board if you aren't already there.

It would probably make sense to just make some prints with QTR before 

making the negatives.  Should save some time.  If you have to get 

into curve making and relinearizing, Tom Moore's tutorial should be 

helpful.  It is available at the QTR site.  It all seems obtuse at 

the beginning (I'm still not sure I have it all) but doing is much 

better then reading.  It is the only way for it to start making sense.

Please feel free to check in here when we can help answer questions.  

I have a few old posts saved that may help, but I'm not sure where 

you are in the process and don't want to post things that just add to 

the confusion.

Again, I hope you feel welcome here, and keep us posted on your 

progress, because although I currently am not doing digital negs, it 

is one of the really interesting uses of QTR and I am trying keep up 

with it.  



Peter



--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "David" <dkfreed@...> wrote:

>

> Dear all, I started this post and I'm a bit surprised at the tone 

and

> direction of some of the posts. 

> 

> I never intended to diss Roy or anyone else associated with creating

> this program. Much thanks and kudos to you all, and also to all who

> offer advice here. 

> 

> That said, I was mainly asking about where to look (references, 

books,

> web sites) to learn more about the process. It seems that many 

others

> are looking for the same thing. 

> 

> Some have suggested that digging in and just working and 

experimenting

> with the program is the way to go. Well and good, but I believe 

having

> some resources would certainly be helpful. This is especially true 

for

> me since I'm using this program for an alternative process (creating

> transparencies to create etching plates)  

> 

> Anyways, best to all, 

> David.

>





    
  

    
    




 


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