QTR-Quadtone RIP

Hi everyone,

I'm in the process of linearizing QTR curves per the Eye-One-
ReadMe.pdf found in the QTR Eye-One folder.

So far I have been able to create a .txt file with a graph from a 
scanned Step-21x4-random.tif printout (on HM PR 188), and then 
creating the graph by dragging the .txt file onto QTR-Linearize-
Data.exe.

However, I'm lost starting at the "Linearize a QuadToneRIP Curve" 
section.  I understand what the goal of the process is, but I how do 
I "...simply create the ink description file, doing the 
partitioning."?  Is this done in the QTR Curve Creator under 
the "Gray Curve" tab or under one of the Toner Curver tabs?  If so, 
are the numbers given in the article for GRAY_SHADOW and 
GRAY_HIGHLIGHT fields the ones I should use (8 & 6 respectively)?

How do I make the quad curve?  Is the Step-21-gray stepwedge created 
from the new quad curve?

I figure these are enough question for the moment, appreaciate any 
help!

Cheers,
Jens

I share Jens's confusion. I am using a Piezography NK7 inkset in an Epson R1800, trying 
to get the best results with Arches Infinity paper. The darkest tones are pretty blocked up 
and I wanted to linearize a profile. I have printed and measured a 21 step-wedge test 
print. I have dropped this into Create_ICC_Profile, but do I simply use this profile when I 
print in order to open up the shadows? Or is there something I need to do to linearize this 
profile before I use it? I've looked for a recent post to give basic instructions and have 
found none, so a reference or any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!


--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "JensGerbitz" <jensgerbitz@...> wrote:

>
> Hi everyone,
> 
> I'm in the process of linearizing QTR curves per the Eye-One-
> ReadMe.pdf found in the QTR Eye-One folder.
> 
> So far I have been able to create a .txt file with a graph from a 
> scanned Step-21x4-random.tif printout (on HM PR 188), and then 
> creating the graph by dragging the .txt file onto QTR-Linearize-
> Data.exe.
> 
> However, I'm lost starting at the "Linearize a QuadToneRIP Curve" 
> section.  I understand what the goal of the process is, but I how do 
> I "...simply create the ink description file, doing the 
> partitioning."?  Is this done in the QTR Curve Creator under 
> the "Gray Curve" tab or under one of the Toner Curver tabs?  If so, 
> are the numbers given in the article for GRAY_SHADOW and 
> GRAY_HIGHLIGHT fields the ones I should use (8 & 6 respectively)?
> 
> How do I make the quad curve?  Is the Step-21-gray stepwedge created 
> from the new quad curve?
> 
> I figure these are enough question for the moment, appreaciate any 
> help!
> 
> Cheers,
> Jens
>

Scott,

First, read a test print (21 step grayscale) printed with you 
UNlinearized file, and save it as a text file.  When you drag this 
text file with the 21 step readings to Create-ICC, a new text file 
should be created and it will open up on your screen (at least it 
does on Windows).  At the bottom, it should show you a line with all 
21 steps sorted in ascending or descending order.  Highlight this 
entire line with your mouse and copy it (Control-C on the PC).  Then 
go to the linearization tab in the Curve Creation module of QTR and 
click the paste button.  These sorted numbers should be pasted into 
the linearization window.  Then save the profile.  You just 
linearized your file if you did everything correctly.

Lou

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "scott.romans" <scott.romans@...> 
wrote:
>
> I share Jens's confusion. I am using a Piezography NK7 inkset in an 
Epson R1800, trying 
> to get the best results with Arches Infinity paper. The darkest 
tones are pretty blocked up 
> and I wanted to linearize a profile. I have printed and measured a 
21 step-wedge test 
> print. I have dropped this into Create_ICC_Profile, but do I simply 
use this profile when I 
> print in order to open up the shadows? Or is there something I need 
to do to linearize this 
> profile before I use it? I've looked for a recent post to give 
basic instructions and have 
> found none, so a reference or any help would be greatly 
appreciated! Thanks!
> 
> 
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "JensGerbitz" <jensgerbitz@> 
wrote:
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> > 
> > I'm in the process of linearizing QTR curves per the Eye-One-
> > ReadMe.pdf found in the QTR Eye-One folder.
> > 
> > So far I have been able to create a .txt file with a graph from a 
> > scanned Step-21x4-random.tif printout (on HM PR 188), and then 
> > creating the graph by dragging the .txt file onto QTR-Linearize-
> > Data.exe.
> > 
> > However, I'm lost starting at the "Linearize a QuadToneRIP Curve" 
> > section.  I understand what the goal of the process is, but I how 
do 
> > I "...simply create the ink description file, doing the 
> > partitioning."?  Is this done in the QTR Curve Creator under 
> > the "Gray Curve" tab or under one of the Toner Curver tabs?  If 
so, 
> > are the numbers given in the article for GRAY_SHADOW and 
> > GRAY_HIGHLIGHT fields the ones I should use (8 & 6 respectively)?
> > 
> > How do I make the quad curve?  Is the Step-21-gray stepwedge 
created 
> > from the new quad curve?
> > 
> > I figure these are enough question for the moment, appreaciate 
any 

> > help!
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > Jens
> >
>

yes, you simply do what you've suggested. The profile and the linearization proces are two 
different things entirely. So just select your new profile in Photoshop print dialogue.
I have to say, unless Infinity has change a lot in the last 2 years there are many papers 
that will take ink much better than it, for much less cost. It bled or mottled badly, or had 
odd reflective qualities in the blacks
Is there even a Cone "profile" for it?
Tyler

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "scott.romans" <scott.romans@...> wrote:
>
> I share Jens's confusion. I am using a Piezography NK7 inkset in an Epson R1800, trying 
> to get the best results with Arches Infinity paper. The darkest tones are pretty blocked 
up 
> and I wanted to linearize a profile. I have printed and measured a 21 step-wedge test 
> print. I have dropped this into Create_ICC_Profile, but do I simply use this profile when I 
> print in order to open up the shadows? Or is there something I need to do to linearize 
this 

> profile before I use it? I've looked for a recent post to give basic instructions and have 
> found none, so a reference or any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!
> 
> 
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "JensGerbitz" <jensgerbitz@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> > 
> > I'm in the process of linearizing QTR curves per the Eye-One-
> > ReadMe.pdf found in the QTR Eye-One folder.
> > 
> > So far I have been able to create a .txt file with a graph from a 
> > scanned Step-21x4-random.tif printout (on HM PR 188), and then 
> > creating the graph by dragging the .txt file onto QTR-Linearize-
> > Data.exe.
> > 
> > However, I'm lost starting at the "Linearize a QuadToneRIP Curve" 
> > section.  I understand what the goal of the process is, but I how do 
> > I "...simply create the ink description file, doing the 
> > partitioning."?  Is this done in the QTR Curve Creator under 
> > the "Gray Curve" tab or under one of the Toner Curver tabs?  If so, 
> > are the numbers given in the article for GRAY_SHADOW and 
> > GRAY_HIGHLIGHT fields the ones I should use (8 & 6 respectively)?
> > 
> > How do I make the quad curve?  Is the Step-21-gray stepwedge created 
> > from the new quad curve?
> > 
> > I figure these are enough question for the moment, appreaciate any 
> > help!
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > Jens
> >
>

Lou,I cant´t figure it out...
The linearization window has sixty boxes. The file generated by qtr is
like the one below.What bottom line do you refer to??? What shall I
paste in those 60 boxes? And btw, when I try to install the qtr
generated profile, Windows says it's in an invalid format...


QTR-Create-ICC version 2.5.2.0

File: C:\Arquivos de
programas\Datacolor\Spyder3Print\Data\Export\EAM_UBlack_2-out.txt
Step    Dens    Lab    A    B   
0.00    0.114    90.31    -1.43    -1.30    -                       b
    |                       L     +
5.00    0.160    86.58    -1.21    -1.24    -                        b
   |                    L        +
10.00    0.203    83.27    -0.44    -1.37    -                       b
  a |                  L          +
15.00    0.240    80.51    0.29    -1.93    -                     b  
    |a                L           +
20.00    0.285    77.24    1.24    -1.98    -                     b  
    |   a           L             +
25.00    0.313    75.24    1.43    -2.32    -                   b    
    |    a         L              +
30.00    0.358    72.10    2.00    -2.44    -                   b    
    |       a    L                +
35.00    0.409    68.73    2.40    -2.65    -                  b     
    |        a L                  +
40.00    0.447    66.30    2.72    -2.98    -                 b      
    |        La                   +
45.00    0.495    63.33    3.17    -3.01    -                b       
    |      L    a                 +
50.00    0.561    59.39    3.65    -3.34    -               b        
    |    L        a               +
55.00    0.625    55.80    4.09    -3.65    -              b         
    |  L            a             +
60.00    0.695    52.07    4.52    -3.88    -             b          
    |L                a           +
65.00    0.781    47.72    4.96    -4.37    -           b            
  L |                  a          +
70.00    0.868    43.57    5.24    -4.51    -          b             
L   |                   a         +
75.00    0.969    39.12    5.26    -4.65    -          b           L 
    |                    a        +
80.00    1.089    34.29    3.91    -4.08    -            b      L    
    |              a              +
85.00    1.264    27.96    1.63    -2.76    -               L b      
    |     a                       +
90.00    1.452    22.07    0.14    -1.65    -            L         b 
    a                             +
95.00    1.568    18.81    -0.14    -0.91    -          L            
 b  a|                             +
100.00    1.656    16.54    0.72    -0.32    -        L              
   b | a                           +

Created ICC file C:\Arquivos de
programas\Datacolor\Spyder3Print\Data\Export\EAM_UBlack_2.icc




Posted by: "Louis Dina" lou@...   ldina
Fri Dec 7, 2007 7:51 pm (PST)
Scott,

First, read a test print (21 step grayscale) printed with you
UNlinearized file, and save it as a text file. When you drag this
text file with the 21 step readings to Create-ICC, a new text file
should be created and it will open up on your screen (at least it
does on Windows). At the bottom, it should show you a line with all
21 steps sorted in ascending or descending order. Highlight this
entire line with your mouse and copy it (Control-C on the PC). Then
go to the linearization tab in the Curve Creation module of QTR and
click the paste button. These sorted numbers should be pasted into
the linearization window. Then save the profile. You just
linearized your file if you did everything correctly.

Lou

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Andre Vallejo da Silva" 
<vallejodasilva@...> wrote:
>
> Lou,I cant´t figure it out...
> The linearization window has sixty boxes. The file generated by qtr 
is
> like the one below.What bottom line do you refer to??? What shall I
> paste in those 60 boxes? And btw, when I try to install the qtr
> generated profile, Windows says it's in an invalid format...
> 
> 
> QTR-Create-ICC version 2.5.2.0
> 
> File: C:\Arquivos de
> programas\Datacolor\Spyder3Print\Data\Export\EAM_UBlack_2-out.txt
> Step    Dens    Lab    A    B   
> 0.00    0.114    90.31    -1.43    -1.30    -                       
b
>     |                       L     +
> 5.00    0.160    86.58    -1.21    -1.24    -
                        b
>    |                    L        +
> 10.00    0.203    83.27    -0.44    -1.37    -
                       b
>   a |                  L          +
> 15.00    0.240    80.51    0.29    -1.93    -                     
b  
>     |a                L           +
> 20.00    0.285    77.24    1.24    -1.98    -                     
b  
>     |   a           L             +
> 25.00    0.313    75.24    1.43    -2.32    -                   
b    
>     |    a         L              +
> 30.00    0.358    72.10    2.00    -2.44    -                   
b    
>     |       a    L                +
> 35.00    0.409    68.73    2.40    -2.65    -                  
b     
>     |        a L                  +
> 40.00    0.447    66.30    2.72    -2.98    -                 
b      
>     |        La                   +
> 45.00    0.495    63.33    3.17    -3.01    -                
b       
>     |      L    a                 +
> 50.00    0.561    59.39    3.65    -3.34    -               
b        
>     |    L        a               +
> 55.00    0.625    55.80    4.09    -3.65    -              
b         
>     |  L            a             +
> 60.00    0.695    52.07    4.52    -3.88    -             
b          
>     |L                a           +
> 65.00    0.781    47.72    4.96    -4.37    -           
b            
>   L |                  a          +
> 70.00    0.868    43.57    5.24    -4.51    -          
b             
> L   |                   a         +
> 75.00    0.969    39.12    5.26    -4.65    -          b           
L 
>     |                    a        +
> 80.00    1.089    34.29    3.91    -4.08    -            b      
L    
>     |              a              +
> 85.00    1.264    27.96    1.63    -2.76    -               L 
b      
>     |     a                       +
> 90.00    1.452    22.07    0.14    -1.65    -            L         
b 
>     a                             +
> 95.00    1.568    18.81    -0.14    -0.91    -          
L            
>  b  a|                             +
> 100.00    1.656    16.54    0.72    -0.32    -        
L              

>    b | a                           +
> 
> Created ICC file C:\Arquivos de
> programas\Datacolor\Spyder3Print\Data\Export\EAM_UBlack_2.icc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Posted by: "Louis Dina" lou@...   ldina
> Fri Dec 7, 2007 7:51 pm (PST)
> Scott,
> 
> First, read a test print (21 step grayscale) printed with you
> UNlinearized file, and save it as a text file. When you drag this
> text file with the 21 step readings to Create-ICC, a new text file
> should be created and it will open up on your screen (at least it
> does on Windows). At the bottom, it should show you a line with all
> 21 steps sorted in ascending or descending order. Highlight this
> entire line with your mouse and copy it (Control-C on the PC). Then
> go to the linearization tab in the Curve Creation module of QTR and
> click the paste button. These sorted numbers should be pasted into
> the linearization window. Then save the profile. You just
> linearized your file if you did everything correctly.
> 
> Lou
>

Andre,

I use a 21 step grayscale for linearizing, which gives me 21 L* or 
density readings.  I just copy those from the output file that Create-
ICC generates, then open the Linearization window, and use the paste 
button in QTR, below the boxes.  You don't need to fill all 60.  

There is a line at the bottom of the output file with all the density 
or L* readings in sorted order.  I don't copy the entire output file, 
just that one final line of data.  

Should work.

Lou

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Andre Vallejo da Silva" 
<vallejodasilva@...> wrote:
>
> Lou,I cant´t figure it out...
> The linearization window has sixty boxes. The file generated by qtr 
is
> like the one below.What bottom line do you refer to??? What shall I
> paste in those 60 boxes? And btw, when I try to install the qtr
> generated profile, Windows says it's in an invalid format...
> 
> 
> QTR-Create-ICC version 2.5.2.0
> 
> File: C:\Arquivos de
> programas\Datacolor\Spyder3Print\Data\Export\EAM_UBlack_2-out.txt
> Step    Dens    Lab    A    B   
> 0.00    0.114    90.31    -1.43    -1.30    -                       
b
>     |                       L     +
> 5.00    0.160    86.58    -1.21    -1.24    -
                        b
>    |                    L        +
> 10.00    0.203    83.27    -0.44    -1.37    -
                       b
>   a |                  L          +
> 15.00    0.240    80.51    0.29    -1.93    -                     
b  
>     |a                L           +
> 20.00    0.285    77.24    1.24    -1.98    -                     
b  
>     |   a           L             +
> 25.00    0.313    75.24    1.43    -2.32    -                   
b    
>     |    a         L              +
> 30.00    0.358    72.10    2.00    -2.44    -                   
b    
>     |       a    L                +
> 35.00    0.409    68.73    2.40    -2.65    -                  
b     
>     |        a L                  +
> 40.00    0.447    66.30    2.72    -2.98    -                 
b      
>     |        La                   +
> 45.00    0.495    63.33    3.17    -3.01    -                
b       
>     |      L    a                 +
> 50.00    0.561    59.39    3.65    -3.34    -               
b        
>     |    L        a               +
> 55.00    0.625    55.80    4.09    -3.65    -              
b         
>     |  L            a             +
> 60.00    0.695    52.07    4.52    -3.88    -             
b          
>     |L                a           +
> 65.00    0.781    47.72    4.96    -4.37    -           
b            
>   L |                  a          +
> 70.00    0.868    43.57    5.24    -4.51    -          
b             
> L   |                   a         +
> 75.00    0.969    39.12    5.26    -4.65    -          b           
L 
>     |                    a        +
> 80.00    1.089    34.29    3.91    -4.08    -            b      
L    
>     |              a              +
> 85.00    1.264    27.96    1.63    -2.76    -               L 
b      
>     |     a                       +
> 90.00    1.452    22.07    0.14    -1.65    -            L         
b 
>     a                             +
> 95.00    1.568    18.81    -0.14    -0.91    -          
L            
>  b  a|                             +
> 100.00    1.656    16.54    0.72    -0.32    -        
L              

>    b | a                           +
> 
> Created ICC file C:\Arquivos de
> programas\Datacolor\Spyder3Print\Data\Export\EAM_UBlack_2.icc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Posted by: "Louis Dina" lou@...   ldina
> Fri Dec 7, 2007 7:51 pm (PST)
> Scott,
> 
> First, read a test print (21 step grayscale) printed with you
> UNlinearized file, and save it as a text file. When you drag this
> text file with the 21 step readings to Create-ICC, a new text file
> should be created and it will open up on your screen (at least it
> does on Windows). At the bottom, it should show you a line with all
> 21 steps sorted in ascending or descending order. Highlight this
> entire line with your mouse and copy it (Control-C on the PC). Then
> go to the linearization tab in the Curve Creation module of QTR and
> click the paste button. These sorted numbers should be pasted into
> the linearization window. Then save the profile. You just
> linearized your file if you did everything correctly.
> 
> Lou
>

Lou, Thanks so much for the response. I neglected to mention that I am running all this on 
Mac OS X, so I don't have the QTR GUI with Curve Creation module/Linearization tab. 
Wouldn't that figure! Please let me step back and detail what I do have:

I printed the 21-step wedge w/o any profiling or changes and then spot measured with 
PrintFix Pro device. This generated a text file with a list such as follows:

1	96.76
2	92.53
3	88.14

etc. I saved the list as a text file. The last few values are very bunched up i.e., 20=20.76 
and 21=20.75. When I have printed on the Arches paper, I've had best results using the 
Moab Entrada FANat Curve, but as these numbers indicate, the shadow detail is a bit 
blocked up. I was hoping to get very similar results as are produced with the Moab curve, 
but open up the shadow detail.

So I take the txt file, and I can do two things: when I drop it in the QTR-Create-ICC script 
in the QTR downloaded Eye-One folder, I get back another txt file, this time with step 
values in 5% increments, Density values, and Lab values that match my readings. In 
addition, there is the L curve, and I can see where the L's start to curve downward at step 
95 and 100. In addition, I get an icc profile back.

Alternatively, when I drop my original txt in QTR-Linearize-Data, I get back a similar txt 
file with the same step, density, LAB, and curve data, but this time the last line reads 
"LINEARIZE="96.76 92.53 88.14 ... 20.75". None of the values change from my original 
readings. 

Now that I have these files, I am not sure how to use them to accomplish my goal of 
opening up the last bit of shadows. I had assumed I would ultimately end up with another 
curve to choose from in my QTR printer dialog box that would produce desired results. 
Am I supposed to use the txt file with the Linearize message to create a curve or am I 
supposed to use the icc profile? If so where do I put these files or how do I use them?

I did try running a print with my QTR-ArchesInfinity.icc profile as both the Proof and as 
the Printer Profile (letting Photoshop manage color); in the QTR printer dialog box, I didn't 
select any curve because I don't have any new option to choose from.  This generated a 
very ugly, muddy print--obviously incorrect. 

If anyone could give guidance on how to properly use the icc profile or the linearize txt file 
in a Mac OS X context, I'd be grateful!

Thanks much.

Scott--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Louis Dina" <lou@...> wrote:

>
> Scott,
> 
> First, read a test print (21 step grayscale) printed with you 
> UNlinearized file, and save it as a text file.  When you drag this 
> text file with the 21 step readings to Create-ICC, a new text file 
> should be created and it will open up on your screen (at least it 
> does on Windows).  At the bottom, it should show you a line with all 
> 21 steps sorted in ascending or descending order.  Highlight this 
> entire line with your mouse and copy it (Control-C on the PC).  Then 
> go to the linearization tab in the Curve Creation module of QTR and 
> click the paste button.  These sorted numbers should be pasted into 
> the linearization window.  Then save the profile.  You just 
> linearized your file if you did everything correctly.
> 
> Lou
> 
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "scott.romans" <scott.romans@> 
> wrote:
> >
> > I share Jens's confusion. I am using a Piezography NK7 inkset in an 
> Epson R1800, trying 
> > to get the best results with Arches Infinity paper. The darkest 
> tones are pretty blocked up 
> > and I wanted to linearize a profile. I have printed and measured a 
> 21 step-wedge test 
> > print. I have dropped this into Create_ICC_Profile, but do I simply 
> use this profile when I 
> > print in order to open up the shadows? Or is there something I need 
> to do to linearize this 
> > profile before I use it? I've looked for a recent post to give 
> basic instructions and have 
> > found none, so a reference or any help would be greatly 
> appreciated! Thanks!
> > 
> > 
> > --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "JensGerbitz" <jensgerbitz@> 
> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi everyone,
> > > 
> > > I'm in the process of linearizing QTR curves per the Eye-One-
> > > ReadMe.pdf found in the QTR Eye-One folder.
> > > 
> > > So far I have been able to create a .txt file with a graph from a 
> > > scanned Step-21x4-random.tif printout (on HM PR 188), and then 
> > > creating the graph by dragging the .txt file onto QTR-Linearize-
> > > Data.exe.
> > > 
> > > However, I'm lost starting at the "Linearize a QuadToneRIP Curve" 
> > > section.  I understand what the goal of the process is, but I how 
> do 
> > > I "...simply create the ink description file, doing the 
> > > partitioning."?  Is this done in the QTR Curve Creator under 
> > > the "Gray Curve" tab or under one of the Toner Curver tabs?  If 
> so, 
> > > are the numbers given in the article for GRAY_SHADOW and 
> > > GRAY_HIGHLIGHT fields the ones I should use (8 & 6 respectively)?
> > > 
> > > How do I make the quad curve?  Is the Step-21-gray stepwedge 
> created 
> > > from the new quad curve?
> > > 
> > > I figure these are enough question for the moment, appreaciate 
> any 
> > > help!
> > > 
> > > Cheers,
> > > Jens
> > >
> >
>

Hmmm.....MAC.....I'm out of my element now.  I'm a PC guy and use the 
QTR Gui interface.  Someone else will need to guide you on this.  

Lou

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "scott.romans" <scott.romans@...> 
wrote:
>
> Lou, Thanks so much for the response. I neglected to mention that I 
am running all this on 
> Mac OS X, so I don't have the QTR GUI with Curve Creation 
module/Linearization tab. 
> Wouldn't that figure! Please let me step back and detail what I do 
have:
> 
> I printed the 21-step wedge w/o any profiling or changes and then 
spot measured with 
> PrintFix Pro device. This generated a text file with a list such as 
follows:
> 
> 1	96.76
> 2	92.53
> 3	88.14
> 
> etc. I saved the list as a text file. The last few values are very 
bunched up i.e., 20=20.76 
> and 21=20.75. When I have printed on the Arches paper, I've had 
best results using the 
> Moab Entrada FANat Curve, but as these numbers indicate, the shadow 
detail is a bit 
> blocked up. I was hoping to get very similar results as are 
produced with the Moab curve, 
> but open up the shadow detail.
> 
> So I take the txt file, and I can do two things: when I drop it in 
the QTR-Create-ICC script 
> in the QTR downloaded Eye-One folder, I get back another txt file, 
this time with step 
> values in 5% increments, Density values, and Lab values that match 
my readings. In 
> addition, there is the L curve, and I can see where the L's start 
to curve downward at step 
> 95 and 100. In addition, I get an icc profile back.
> 
> Alternatively, when I drop my original txt in QTR-Linearize-Data, I 
get back a similar txt 
> file with the same step, density, LAB, and curve data, but this 
time the last line reads 
> "LINEARIZE="96.76 92.53 88.14 ... 20.75". None of the values change 
from my original 
> readings. 
> 
> Now that I have these files, I am not sure how to use them to 
accomplish my goal of 
> opening up the last bit of shadows. I had assumed I would 
ultimately end up with another 
> curve to choose from in my QTR printer dialog box that would 
produce desired results. 
> Am I supposed to use the txt file with the Linearize message to 
create a curve or am I 
> supposed to use the icc profile? If so where do I put these files 
or how do I use them?
> 
> I did try running a print with my QTR-ArchesInfinity.icc profile as 
both the Proof and as 
> the Printer Profile (letting Photoshop manage color); in the QTR 
printer dialog box, I didn't 
> select any curve because I don't have any new option to choose 
from.  This generated a 
> very ugly, muddy print--obviously incorrect. 
> 
> If anyone could give guidance on how to properly use the icc 
profile or the linearize txt file 

> in a Mac OS X context, I'd be grateful!
> 
> Thanks much.
> 
> Scott--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Louis Dina" <lou@> wrote:
> >
> > Scott,

Lou, when you linearize a file in the Windows environment, are you ultimately creating a 
new profile and then soft-proofing AND Printing with this profile (ie, selecting print "Proof" 
rather than "Document")? Or when you linearize do you end up with a new curve 
associated with your specific paper that you can select in "curves" field of the QTR 
dialogue box?

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Louis Dina" <lou@...> wrote:

>
> Hmmm.....MAC.....I'm out of my element now.  I'm a PC guy and use the 
> QTR Gui interface.  Someone else will need to guide you on this.  
> 
> Lou
> 
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "scott.romans" <scott.romans@> 
> wrote:
> >
> > Lou, Thanks so much for the response. I neglected to mention that I 
> am running all this on 
> > Mac OS X, so I don't have the QTR GUI with Curve Creation 
> module/Linearization tab. 
> > Wouldn't that figure! Please let me step back and detail what I do 
> have:
> > 
> > I printed the 21-step wedge w/o any profiling or changes and then 
> spot measured with 
> > PrintFix Pro device. This generated a text file with a list such as 
> follows:
> > 
> > 1	96.76
> > 2	92.53
> > 3	88.14
> > 
> > etc. I saved the list as a text file. The last few values are very 
> bunched up i.e., 20=20.76 
> > and 21=20.75. When I have printed on the Arches paper, I've had 
> best results using the 
> > Moab Entrada FANat Curve, but as these numbers indicate, the shadow 
> detail is a bit 
> > blocked up. I was hoping to get very similar results as are 
> produced with the Moab curve, 
> > but open up the shadow detail.
> > 
> > So I take the txt file, and I can do two things: when I drop it in 
> the QTR-Create-ICC script 
> > in the QTR downloaded Eye-One folder, I get back another txt file, 
> this time with step 
> > values in 5% increments, Density values, and Lab values that match 
> my readings. In 
> > addition, there is the L curve, and I can see where the L's start 
> to curve downward at step 
> > 95 and 100. In addition, I get an icc profile back.
> > 
> > Alternatively, when I drop my original txt in QTR-Linearize-Data, I 
> get back a similar txt 
> > file with the same step, density, LAB, and curve data, but this 
> time the last line reads 
> > "LINEARIZE="96.76 92.53 88.14 ... 20.75". None of the values change 
> from my original 
> > readings. 
> > 
> > Now that I have these files, I am not sure how to use them to 
> accomplish my goal of 
> > opening up the last bit of shadows. I had assumed I would 
> ultimately end up with another 
> > curve to choose from in my QTR printer dialog box that would 
> produce desired results. 
> > Am I supposed to use the txt file with the Linearize message to 
> create a curve or am I 
> > supposed to use the icc profile? If so where do I put these files 
> or how do I use them?
> > 
> > I did try running a print with my QTR-ArchesInfinity.icc profile as 
> both the Proof and as 
> > the Printer Profile (letting Photoshop manage color); in the QTR 
> printer dialog box, I didn't 
> > select any curve because I don't have any new option to choose 
> from.  This generated a 
> > very ugly, muddy print--obviously incorrect. 
> > 
> > If anyone could give guidance on how to properly use the icc 
> profile or the linearize txt file 
> > in a Mac OS X context, I'd be grateful!
> > 
> > Thanks much.
> > 
> > Scott--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Louis Dina" <lou@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Scott,
>

This might be a good time to ask the question that has baffled me from
the beginning.  With PhotoShop, and most other cross platform
applications, the experience is quite similar for Mac and PC Users. 
Why then are the PC and Mac editions of QTR so very different.  I ask
this because as a PC only user, I too find myself trying to comprehend
a post only to learn a bit later that it is from a MAC user. 

I will admit here my ignorance.  I am completely without any knowledge
whatever of the MAC environment.

Thanks.

George... 


--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Louis Dina" <lou@...> wrote:

>
> Hmmm.....MAC.....I'm out of my element now.  I'm a PC guy and use the 
> QTR Gui interface.  Someone else will need to guide you on this.  
> 
> Lou
>

Scott,

I'm on a PC and con't help answer the Mac ralated questions.  ON my PC, 
I create a profile in QTR (or start with an existing one and delete the 
linearization data).  I use this UN-linearized profile to print a 21 
step grayscale target, which I read with my spectro.  The density or L* 
is loaded (automatically or manually) and makes adjustments to the 
curve shapes to give me a nice smooth tone ramp.  So, the lin data is 
just smoothing out the bumps to the unlinearized file.  

How you do that on a Mac is beyond me, but the result is the same.  And 
since I am on a PC, I cannot print from Photoshop directly to QTR.  I 
have to boot up QTR and print from the QTRgui interface.  

I do sometimes print the linearized 21 step grayscale again after the 
profile is linearized and complete.  I create an ICC profile from the 
linearized print, which I can then use for soft proofing (both tonality 
and color) in Photoshop, but all printing must be done from QTR in the 
PC environment.  The same profile will be used to print in QTR and if I 
have done it all right, the tonality and color should match my PS soft 
proof.  

Lou

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "scott.romans" <scott.romans@...> 
wrote:
>
> Lou, when you linearize a file in the Windows environment, are you 
ultimately creating a 
> new profile and then soft-proofing AND Printing with this profile 
(ie, selecting print "Proof" 
> rather than "Document")? Or when you linearize do you end up with a 
new curve 
> associated with your specific paper that you can select in "curves" 
field of the QTR 
> dialogue box?

Thanks, Lou.

Anyone out there have thoughts on workflow for linearizing a Piezography inkset on Epson 
R1800 in a Mac environment? In looking back through past posts, some have suggested 
editing Printer/Paper specific .txt files in the Profiles folder and pasting in new 
linearization data, but I note that all the R1800 NK7 files are .quad files and it is not clear 
how to edit these in a similar way. 

Any Mac guidance on what to do with the files to get linearized curves in the QTR printer 
dialogue would be greatly appreciated!!

Thanks.

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Louis Dina" <lou@...> wrote:

>
> Scott,
> 
> I'm on a PC and con't help answer the Mac ralated questions.  ON my PC, 
> I create a profile in QTR (or start with an existing one and delete the 
> linearization data).  I use this UN-linearized profile to print a 21 
> step grayscale target, which I read with my spectro.  The density or L* 
> is loaded (automatically or manually) and makes adjustments to the 
> curve shapes to give me a nice smooth tone ramp.  So, the lin data is 
> just smoothing out the bumps to the unlinearized file.  
> 
> How you do that on a Mac is beyond me, but the result is the same.  And 
> since I am on a PC, I cannot print from Photoshop directly to QTR.  I 
> have to boot up QTR and print from the QTRgui interface.  
> 
> I do sometimes print the linearized 21 step grayscale again after the 
> profile is linearized and complete.  I create an ICC profile from the 
> linearized print, which I can then use for soft proofing (both tonality 
> and color) in Photoshop, but all printing must be done from QTR in the 
> PC environment.  The same profile will be used to print in QTR and if I 
> have done it all right, the tonality and color should match my PS soft 
> proof.  
> 
> Lou
> 
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "scott.romans" <scott.romans@> 
> wrote:
> >
> > Lou, when you linearize a file in the Windows environment, are you 
> ultimately creating a 
> > new profile and then soft-proofing AND Printing with this profile 
> (ie, selecting print "Proof" 
> > rather than "Document")? Or when you linearize do you end up with a 
> new curve 
> > associated with your specific paper that you can select in "curves" 
> field of the QTR 
> > dialogue box?
>

Folks, I'm still having issues with this.  My original post was 
somewhat unclear, hopefully this will clear it up...

Basically, I'm following the directions on curve linearization in the 
Eye-One-ReadMe.pdf contained in the QuadToneRIP\Eye-One folder.

I have an Eye-One Photo LT.  I used Gretag-Macbeth's 
ProfileMaker "MeasureTool" (demo version) to open, and then spot-
measure, the QTR-21x4-random file.

Once that was done, I saved the resulting .txt file and dragged it 
onto the QTR-Linearize-Data.exe program to create a graph with 51 
readings.  The L data graph is nice and straight until it gets to 
about 60.00, so linearization is needed; this is where I get lost.  
The directions for linearizing are detailed in the .pdf as follows:

"The Linearization process is simply creating a correction curve 
using the above data to straighten the L data graph. To use this 
feature, simply create the ink description file, doing the 
partitioning. The GRAY_HIGHLIGHT and GRAY_SHADOW fields can be 
approximated at 4 and 8 respectively. Make the quad curve and print 
out the Step-21-gray stepwedge, and measure as above. The last line 
has the linearization info. Triple-click on it, Copy the whole line 
and Paste it to the bottom of the ink description file. Re-process 
the ink file with Drop-Quad-Profile."

I'm in the dark from "...simply create the ink description file..."

That is:
1) What is meant by "...simply create the ink description file, doing 
the partitioning."?

2) "The GRAY_HIGHLIGHT and GRAY_SHADOW fields can be approximated at 
4 and 8 respectively..."  --> Which tab in QTR's Curve Creator?

3) "Make the quad curve and print out the Step-21-gray stepwedge, and 
measure as above."  --> Which quad curve?  Do I print out the Step-21-
gray stepwedge even though I worked with the larger (51 step) file?

Thanks, appreaciate any input-
Jens

PS-- Using Windows XP Pro

I'll try to explain my workflow 
first there is in the file section of this group some usefull doc
second linearization is for quad curve 
icc profile is mainly   for softproofing

> I have an Eye-One Photo LT.  I used Gretag-Macbeth's 
> ProfileMaker "MeasureTool" (demo version) to open, and then spot-
> measure, the QTR-21x4-random file.

Yes you must use QTR-21x4-random file not the 51 step as in Eye-One-ReadMe.pdf
 
> Once that was done, I saved the resulting .txt file and dragged it 
> onto the QTR-Linearize-Data.exe program to create a graph with 51 
> readings.  The L data graph is nice and straight until it gets to 
> about 60.00, so linearization is needed; this is where I get lost.  
> The directions for linearizing are detailed in the .pdf as follows:
> 
> "The Linearization process is simply creating a correction curve 
> using the above data to straighten the L data graph. To use this 
> feature, simply create the ink description file, doing the 
> partitioning. The GRAY_HIGHLIGHT and GRAY_SHADOW fields can be 
> approximated at 4 and 8 respectively. Make the quad curve and print 
> out the Step-21-gray stepwedge, and measure as above. The last line 
> has the linearization info. Triple-click on it, Copy the whole line 
> and Paste it to the bottom of the ink description file. Re-process 
> the ink file with Drop-Quad-Profile."
> 
> I'm in the dark from "...simply create the ink description file..."
> 
> That is:
> 1) What is meant by "...simply create the ink description file, doing 
> the partitioning."?
> 
> 2) "The GRAY_HIGHLIGHT and GRAY_SHADOW fields can be approximated at 
> 4 and 8 respectively..."  --> Which tab in QTR's Curve Creator?
> 
> 3) "Make the quad curve and print out the Step-21-gray stepwedge, and 
> measure as above."  --> Which quad curve?  Do I print out the Step-21-
> gray stepwedge even though I worked with the larger (51 step) file?
> 
> Thanks, appreaciate any input-
> Jens
> 
> PS-- Using Windows XP Pro
>
I am on Mac
the ink description file is the file you must drop on Drop-Quad-Profile to make a curve 
that you can use in Qtr like :
#
#  quadtone curve descriptor file
#
#
# the printer name
# the curve name
#   no spaces or special characters, except - or _  (dash or underscore)
# Date			15/12/07
# Printer		Epson 2100
# INK			epson matte black
# Paper			epson Archivial Matte Paper
etc.

I describe my workflow

I made a ink description file for my ink, printer, paper starting from a file for similar paper 
printer, I  include the correct ink limit and gray partitioning , GRAY_HIGHLIGHT=6  
GRAY_SHADOW=8, without the end line "LINEARIZE=" 
drop this file on Drop-Quad-Profile
you must have a new curve file .quad in Curve Drop Box
print the 21x4 target  with the setting you intend to use for you work DO NOT use 
calibration mode in the driver 
read with the eye-one the target , only Lab value is important
drop the measure  file on QTR-Linearize-Data 
you have a file with graph and a end line like this 
LINEARIZE="96.5325 92.8775 87.96 83.0275 77.3025 71.92 66.0425 61.4925 57.3125 
53.465 48.925 45.2425 42.305 39.1225 36.415 33.85 29.2375 27.07 22.2925 20.43 
16.685"

copy this line to the end of the ink description file you have used before
drop on Drop-Quad-Profile
you have done the curve , now for printing use this linearized curve 

Print again the 21x4 step target with this new curve read it and drop the measure file on 
QTR-Create-ICC
put the icc profile just created  to the correct folder and use it in PS for softproofing

Hope this help

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Dr. Cristiano Peverada"
<cpeverada@...> wrote:
>
> I'll try to explain my workflow 
> first there is in the file section of this group some usefull doc
> second linearization is for quad curve 
> icc profile is mainly   for softproofing
> 
> > I have an Eye-One Photo LT.  I used Gretag-Macbeth's 
> > ProfileMaker "MeasureTool" (demo version) to open, and then spot-
> > measure, the QTR-21x4-random file.
> 
> Yes you must use QTR-21x4-random file not the 51 step as in
Eye-One-ReadMe.pdf
>  

> > Once that was done, I saved the resulting .txt file and dragged it 
> > onto the QTR-Linearize-Data.exe program to create a graph with 51 
> > readings.  The L data graph is nice and straight until it gets to 
> > about 60.00, so linearization is needed; this is where I get lost.  
> > The directions for linearizing are detailed in the .pdf as follows:
> > 
> > "The Linearization process is simply creating a correction curve 
> > using the above data to straighten the L data graph. To use this 
> > feature, simply create the ink description file, doing the 
> > partitioning. The GRAY_HIGHLIGHT and GRAY_SHADOW fields can be 
> > approximated at 4 and 8 respectively. Make the quad curve and print 
> > out the Step-21-gray stepwedge, and measure as above. The last line 
> > has the linearization info. Triple-click on it, Copy the whole line 
> > and Paste it to the bottom of the ink description file. Re-process 
> > the ink file with Drop-Quad-Profile."
> > 
> > I'm in the dark from "...simply create the ink description file..."
> > 
> > That is:
> > 1) What is meant by "...simply create the ink description file, doing 
> > the partitioning."?
> > 
> > 2) "The GRAY_HIGHLIGHT and GRAY_SHADOW fields can be approximated at 
> > 4 and 8 respectively..."  --> Which tab in QTR's Curve Creator?
> > 
> > 3) "Make the quad curve and print out the Step-21-gray stepwedge, and 
> > measure as above."  --> Which quad curve?  Do I print out the Step-21-
> > gray stepwedge even though I worked with the larger (51 step) file?
> > 
> > Thanks, appreaciate any input-
> > Jens
> > 
> > PS-- Using Windows XP Pro
> >
> I am on Mac
> the ink description file is the file you must drop on
Drop-Quad-Profile to make a curve 
> that you can use in Qtr like :
> #
> #  quadtone curve descriptor file
> #
> #
> # the printer name
> # the curve name
> #   no spaces or special characters, except - or _  (dash or underscore)
> # Date			15/12/07
> # Printer		Epson 2100
> # INK			epson matte black
> # Paper			epson Archivial Matte Paper
> etc.
> 
> I describe my workflow
> 
> I made a ink description file for my ink, printer, paper starting
from a file for similar paper 
> printer, I  include the correct ink limit and gray partitioning ,
GRAY_HIGHLIGHT=6  
> GRAY_SHADOW=8, without the end line "LINEARIZE=" 
> drop this file on Drop-Quad-Profile
> you must have a new curve file .quad in Curve Drop Box
> print the 21x4 target  with the setting you intend to use for you
work DO NOT use 
> calibration mode in the driver 
> read with the eye-one the target , only Lab value is important
> drop the measure  file on QTR-Linearize-Data 
> you have a file with graph and a end line like this 
> LINEARIZE="96.5325 92.8775 87.96 83.0275 77.3025 71.92 66.0425
61.4925 57.3125 
> 53.465 48.925 45.2425 42.305 39.1225 36.415 33.85 29.2375 27.07
22.2925 20.43 
> 16.685"
> 
> copy this line to the end of the ink description file you have used
before
> drop on Drop-Quad-Profile
> you have done the curve , now for printing use this linearized curve 
> 
> Print again the 21x4 step target with this new curve read it and
drop the measure file on 
> QTR-Create-ICC
> put the icc profile just created  to the correct folder and use it
in PS for softproofing
> 
> Hope this help
>

Thank you Dr. Cristiano Peverada, this is the most useful thing I have
found on the list so far. I am new to QTR and trying to figure out how
to do things like calibrate and linearize, and I find the
documentation pretty opaque. Thank you so much for sharing, I would
not have figure this out on my own and I would love to see this
incorporated into the documentation for the software at some point.