QTR-Quadtone RIP

Just want to see if anyone else here that uses MIS carbon inks on an 
R1800 has suffered the same cartridge failure that I have. I've 
contacted them of course but in the mean time . . .
I just started using them a short while back and cannot be more 
pleased with the results. Yesterday I had to swap out my first MIS 
cartridge, the MK black cartridge. A soon as I placed it in and reset 
the printer the ink-out light came on and the printer utility told me 
that it was an incompatible cartridge. I tried it with a second 
cartridge with the same results. When I placed the cleaner cartridge 
for that slot in the printer accepted it just fine. Has any one here 
had similar problems? Can the cartridges be mislabeled?

Best Regards,
Ola Olsson
-- 
Cheers,
Ola Olsson

/*******************************************
/** oeolsson@... -- http://www.enosis.net
/** "There is a time for laughing
/**  and there is a time not for laughing.
/**  This is not one of them."
/*******************************************

DId it say "incompatible" or "not genuine Epson"?

If it is the later message just clic OK and it'll be fine. You won't
get this message until your next reset.

Denis

 A soon as I placed it in and reset 

> the printer the ink-out light came on and the printer utility told me 
> that it was an incompatible cartridge. I tried it with a second 
> cartridge with the same results. When I placed the cleaner cartridge 
> for that slot in the printer accepted it just fine. Has any one here 
> had similar problems? Can the cartridges be mislabeled?
> 
> Best Regards,
> Ola Olsson

At 4:48 PM +0000 4/26/08, the_des_bois wrote:
>DId it say "incompatible" or "not genuine Epson"?
>
>If it is the later message just clic OK and it'll be fine. You won't
>get this message until your next reset.

Yes but the ink-out light is on and it will not print. It will not 
use the cartridge. It treats the cartridge as if it were empty.

Ola
-- 
Cheers,
Ola Olsson

/*******************************************
/** oeolsson@... -- http://www.enosis.net
/** "There is a time for laughing
/**  and there is a time not for laughing.
/**  This is not one of them."
/*******************************************

Dear Ola,

I am a Novice on QTR.

As a student on the FOTOACADEMY in Holland I have to print almost all  
my work black and whites on Fine art paper (baryth);- I use Hahnemule  
Rag Brite 310 (HM 310) mostly. For all students getting true good BW  
is a time consuming and painstaking proces.

Required is a true natural real Black and White (BW), no sepia, cool  
or warm. With the standard setings of QTR I do reach good prints with  
60% cool and 40% warm for all the settings. Pofiles used for the the  
combination  HM and  MK ink;- advanced setting not touched.
I still lack some detail in the deep black. I donnot own a  
spectormeter in order to mesuusre execat inklimits and to addapt the  
profiles for my 4800 in combination with HM 310 paper.

We are very cirtical about detail as well in the high lites, grey tone  
and shadow.

I own a 4800 Stylus pro from Epson in combination with a MAC Pro on  
Leopard.  With the Epson drivers the only acceptabel result I  got so  
far was on Epson velvet fine art paper with the the ICC profile for  
that paper;-  profile name: Pro 4800 VFAP. Good detail in shadow

With the 4800 printer, QTR works best with handfeed sheets;- often the  
sheetfeeeder takes several A4 pages before QTR starts printing. This  
problem does not occur with the Epson native drivers. With A2 paper  
QTR gets confused and repport all the time wrong paper.

Ink and paper expenses are considarable in testing. So I was not glad  
to hear that MIS ink gave you problems. Because I consider to buy them  
too.

I wish you succes and patience in dicovering the right workflow;-  
please inform me if you solve he problems with ink.




Op 26 apr 2008, om 17:01 heeft Ola Olsson het volgende geschreven:

> Just want to see if anyone else here that uses MIS carbon inks on an
> R1800 has suffered the same cartridge failure that I have. I've
> contacted them of course but in the mean time . . .
> I just started using them a short while back and cannot be more
> pleased with the results. Yesterday I had to swap out my first MIS
> cartridge, the MK black cartridge. A soon as I placed it in and reset
> the printer the ink-out light came on and the printer utility told me
> that it was an incompatible cartridge. I tried it with a second
> cartridge with the same results. When I placed the cleaner cartridge
> for that slot in the printer accepted it just fine. Has any one here
> had similar problems? Can the cartridges be mislabeled?
>
> Best Regards,
> Ola Olsson
> -- 
> Cheers,
> Ola Olsson
>
> /*******************************************
> /** oeolsson@... -- http://www.enosis.net
> /** "There is a time for laughing
> /** and there is a time not for laughing.
> /** This is not one of them."
> /*******************************************
>
> 

Met vriendelijke groet,

Ir. Walther L. Walraven

Walraven Innovation Management & Photography

T.P. Oosterhoffstraat 1,
9883 PJ  OLDEHOVE
Netherlands


(M) +31 	(0) 653 122 571
(T) +31 	(0) 594 5970 76
(F) +31 	(0) 594 5970 75
(Email) 	walraveninnovation@...

>... For all students getting true good BW
> is a time consuming and painstaking proces.

I suppose it depends on one's expectations, but I no longer think getting
good B&W with an inkjet ought to be difficult at all. 

> Required is a true natural real Black and White (BW), no sepia, cool
> or warm.

I'm wondering, again, what your definition is of "true B&W."  I went heavily
into all sorts of tones with inkjet B&W -- I suppose because I found I
could, and I didn't like the original B&W inkset tones.  Now I'm into my
version of "purist inkjet B&W."  It's called 100% carbon pigments -- no
colors at all.  

See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/R1800.htm 
http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf
http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Ink-Mixing.pdf and
http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/C88-C13-5.pdf


>... I do not own a spectormeter ...

They are very nice items to have, but scanners can do a fair job of some
things.  See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Making_B-W_ICCs.htm

> Ink and paper expenses are considarable ...

They don't need to be.  Getting the best for the least is clearly one of my
goals.

> So I was not glad to hear that MIS ink gave you problems. 

I don't work for MIS or get any royalties on any of the inksets they sell
that I originally designed, but I have worked with them for some time now,
and I use a lot of their materials.  Not all of the materials the third
party sellers like MIS can buy are as good as what Epson is able to obtain.
However, the Eboni MK that is the basis of all the above inksets is
outstanding and one of the least clogging inks from any company I've ever
used, including Epson inks.

The main defects I've seen with MIS products lately relate to chips that are
defective (so I always recommend having some extra chips) and carts that
leak at the outlet because the poppet valves don't seal correctly.  The seal
leaks don't affect printing at first, but they can be a mess when re-filling
the cartridges, and they do affect how easy it is to get good nozzle checks
after refilling them.  So, I just throw away the leaking carts when I find
them and consider it a small price for the very large savings that one can
achieve learning to use third party products.  

And it's not just MIS that suffers from these defects.  The third party
suppliers simply do not have the quality controls that Epson can afford.
But, again, one can learn to deal with the issues rather easily.  

Note that while I enjoy and appreciate saving the money, I'd be using my
current MIS-Eboni-based inksets (with QTR -- either the rip or Create ICC)
even if the MIS inks cost as much as Epson's inks.  My goal is also to make
the best, most stable prints I can.  Of course, some of us are just oriented
to doing things ourselves, pushing the envelope as much as possible, and
taking the road less traveled whenever possible.  It's part of what has
always made B&W photography fun for me.

Good luck with you B&W printing.

Paul   
www.PaulRoark.com

For those of you just starting to use refillable cartridges:

The chips on Epson cartridges can be reset and used on MIS and other  
cartridges, so if you have empty Epson cartridges, keep the chips...   
but be sure to label them!

You can pry them out/off with a small screw driver or pen knife.

The chip has to be used in the correct slot in the printer, but you  
can use any color you like in the cartridge (if you know what you are  
doing).

Myron

Thank You Paul for your elaborate aswer.


Op 28 apr 2008, om 02:22 heeft Paul Roark het volgende geschreven:

>
>
> >... For all students getting true good BW
> > is a time consuming and painstaking proces.
>
> I suppose it depends on one's expectations, but I no longer think  
> getting
> good B&W with an inkjet ought to be difficult at all.
>
> > Required is a true natural real Black and White (BW), no sepia, cool
> > or warm.
>
> I'm wondering, again, what your definition is of "true B&W." I went  
> heavily
> into all sorts of tones with inkjet B&W -- I suppose because I found I
> could, and I didn't like the original B&W inkset tones. Now I'm into  
> my
> version of "purist inkjet B&W." It's called 100% carbon pigments -- no
> colors at all.
>
> See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/R1800.htm
> http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf
> http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Ink-Mixing.pdf and
> http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/C88-C13-5.pdf
>
> >... I do not own a spectormeter ...
>
> They are very nice items to have, but scanners can do a fair job of  
> some
> things. See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Making_B-W_ICCs.htm
>
> > Ink and paper expenses are considarable ...
>
> They don't need to be. Getting the best for the least is clearly one  
> of my
> goals.
>
> > So I was not glad to hear that MIS ink gave you problems.
>
> I don't work for MIS or get any royalties on any of the inksets they  
> sell
> that I originally designed, but I have worked with them for some  
> time now,
> and I use a lot of their materials. Not all of the materials the third
> party sellers like MIS can buy are as good as what Epson is able to  
> obtain.
> However, the Eboni MK that is the basis of all the above inksets is
> outstanding and one of the least clogging inks from any company I've  
> ever
> used, including Epson inks.
>
> The main defects I've seen with MIS products lately relate to chips  
> that are
> defective (so I always recommend having some extra chips) and carts  
> that
> leak at the outlet because the poppet valves don't seal correctly.  
> The seal
> leaks don't affect printing at first, but they can be a mess when re- 
> filling
> the cartridges, and they do affect how easy it is to get good nozzle  
> checks
> after refilling them. So, I just throw away the leaking carts when I  
> find
> them and consider it a small price for the very large savings that  
> one can
> achieve learning to use third party products.
>
> And it's not just MIS that suffers from these defects. The third party
> suppliers simply do not have the quality controls that Epson can  
> afford.
> But, again, one can learn to deal with the issues rather easily.
>
> Note that while I enjoy and appreciate saving the money, I'd be  
> using my
> current MIS-Eboni-based inksets (with QTR -- either the rip or  
> Create ICC)
> even if the MIS inks cost as much as Epson's inks. My goal is also  
> to make
> the best, most stable prints I can. Of course, some of us are just  
> oriented
> to doing things ourselves, pushing the envelope as much as possible,  
> and
> taking the road less traveled whenever possible. It's part of what has
> always made B&W photography fun for me.
>
> Good luck with you B&W printing.
>
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>
>
> 

Met vriendelijke groet,

Ir. Walther L. Walraven

Walraven Innovation Management & Photography

T.P. Oosterhoffstraat 1,
9883 PJ  OLDEHOVE
Netherlands


(M) +31 	(0) 653 122 571
(T) +31 	(0) 594 5970 76
(F) +31 	(0) 594 5970 75
(Email) 	walraveninnovation@...

At 9:35 PM -0300 4/27/08, Myron Gochnauer wrote:
>The chips on Epson cartridges can be reset and used on MIS and other
>cartridges, so if you have empty Epson cartridges, keep the chips...
>but be sure to label them!
>
>You can pry them out/off with a small screw driver or pen knife.
>
>The chip has to be used in the correct slot in the printer, but you
>can use any color you like in the cartridge (if you know what you are
>doing).

I think you just solved my problem with the MIS cartridges or at 
least explained it. Sounds like MIS mislabeled their cartridges. 
That's why they don't work in their intended slots. Before I try to 
swap chips I would like MIS to acknowledge their mistake and replace 
them.

Best Regards,
Ola