QTR-Quadtone RIP

I would like to re-commission a 220 printer that I have to use MIS
UTR2 inks in a CIS but be able to use either the MK or PK inks by
creating the appropriate curve in QTR.(ie. making the  PK "not used"
when printing a matte print or vice versa for glossy printing) The
hitch is that the UTR2 ink set is an ink set with either a PK or an MK
black and 5 other degrees of black (grey). In my scheme one of the 5
grey inks would have to be replaced by the additional black ink. The
question is one: is this practicable and two: which of the 5 grey inks
can be sacrificed?

Any thoughts?

Thanks for your time

I have just purchased two sets of UTBO-R8 Set 3 inks for my R1800. Dropped
them in the GLOP, PK and MK positions as indicated on the label and neither
of the MK carts are not recognized by the printer. Am I doing something
wrong :(
 
Thanks in advance
 
Mike


 
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "wlh_1" <will@...> wrote:
>
> I would like to re-commission a 220 printer that I have to use MIS
> UTR2 inks in a CIS but be able to use either the MK or PK inks by
> creating the appropriate curve in QTR.(ie. making the  PK "not used"
> when printing a matte print or vice versa for glossy printing) The
> hitch is that the UTR2 ink set is an ink set with either a PK or an MK
> black and 5 other degrees of black (grey). In my scheme one of the 5
> grey inks would have to be replaced by the additional black ink. The
> question is one: is this practicable and two: which of the 5 grey inks
> can be sacrificed?
> 


You'll notice in the ink descriptions at 
http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/R220_R2_Readme.pdf
that the light inks (LM, Y, and LC) are all the same density.  So, it seems to me that the logical place for the PK would be in the Y position.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

I recommend you call MIS.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Kirwan" <mkirwan@...> wrote:

>
> I have just purchased two sets of UTBO-R8 Set 3 inks for my R1800. Dropped
> them in the GLOP, PK and MK positions as indicated on the label and neither
> of the MK carts are not recognized by the printer. Am I doing something
> wrong :(
>  
> Thanks in advance
>  
> Mike
> 
> 
>  
> <http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=14834347/grpspId=1705019182/msgI
> d=7651/stime=1236114404/nc1=3848627/nc2=4507179/nc3=4025304> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark" <paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "wlh_1" <will@> wrote:
> >
> > I would like to re-commission a 220 printer that I have to use MIS
> > UTR2 inks in a CIS but be able to use either the MK or PK inks by
> > creating the appropriate curve in QTR.(ie. making the  PK "not used"
> > when printing a matte print or vice versa for glossy printing) The
> > hitch is that the UTR2 ink set is an ink set with either a PK or an MK
> > black and 5 other degrees of black (grey). In my scheme one of the 5
> > grey inks would have to be replaced by the additional black ink. The
> > question is one: is this practicable and two: which of the 5 grey inks
> > can be sacrificed?
> > 
> 
> 
> You'll notice in the ink descriptions at 
> http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/R220_R2_Readme.pdf
> that the light inks (LM, Y, and LC) are all the same density.  So, it seems to me that the logical place for the PK would be in the Y position.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>
Why are the lite inks LC and LM the same density, and likewise why are the L and C inks the same density? Does it have to do with using this inkset with the sliders on the Epson Driver?

If so then wouldn't it be possible to use the warm ink in the LC position and the neutral in the LM position and likewise warm and neutral inks in the L and C positions and then mixing them as needed in QTR?

Any thoughts on this?

Thanks for your time.

> > You'll notice in the ink descriptions at 
> > http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/R220_R2_Readme.pdf
> > that the light inks (LM, Y, and LC) are all the same density. ...

> Why are the lite inks LC and LM the same density, and likewise 
> why are the L and C inks the same density? 

The R2 inkset was the hextone version of the EZ inkset -- minimalist.  One
could have 3 bottles and keep the machine running.

> Does it have to do with using this inkset with the sliders
> on the Epson Driver?

I actually never thought the Epson driver sliders were very good.  QTR's are
way better.  But, easy Photoshop curves could be made and be on layers in
and do about the same thing.

> If so then wouldn't it be possible to use the warm ink in the 
> LC position and the neutral in the LM position and likewise 
> warm and neutral inks in the L and C positions and then mixing 
> them as needed in QTR?

Exactly.  Set up a warm and cold/neutral channel and mix as desired.  But,
QTR sliders and PS curves layers are much preferred over Epson driver
sliders.  Driver sliders may be OK for small changes, but the ramp gets too
distorted with significant driver slider moves.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> > > You'll notice in the ink descriptions at 
> > > http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/R220_R2_Readme.pdf
> > > that the light inks (LM, Y, and LC) are all the same density. ...
> 
> > Why are the lite inks LC and LM the same density, and likewise 
> > why are the L and C inks the same density? 
> 
> The R2 inkset was the hextone version of the EZ inkset -- minimalist.  One
> could have 3 bottles and keep the machine running.
> 
> > Does it have to do with using this inkset with the sliders
> > on the Epson Driver?
> 
> I actually never thought the Epson driver sliders were very good.  QTR's are
> way better.  But, easy Photoshop curves could be made and be on layers in
> and do about the same thing.
> 
> > If so then wouldn't it be possible to use the warm ink in the 
> > LC position and the neutral in the LM position and likewise 
> > warm and neutral inks in the L and C positions and then mixing 
> > them as needed in QTR?
> 
> Exactly.  Set up a warm and cold/neutral channel and mix as desired.  But,
> QTR sliders and PS curves layers are much preferred over Epson driver
> sliders.  Driver sliders may be OK for small changes, but the ramp gets too
> distorted with significant driver slider moves.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>
Actually I never thought to use the Epson sliders but rather to use QTR to control the black and two greys. 

In my configuration I would use a neutral MK (for matte prints) and neutral PK in the yellow position (for photo prints)and warm and neutral greys. The neutral greys for an entirely neutral print and the warm greys for a warmer feel mixed as appropriate with the neutral greys

Sound OK?

Thanks for your time.

> > ... Set up a warm and cold/neutral channel and mix as desired...
> > QTR sliders ...
> 

> In my configuration I would use a neutral MK (for matte prints) 
> and neutral PK in the yellow position (for photo prints)

Agreed.

> warm and neutral greys. The neutral greys for an entirely neutral 
> print and the warm greys for a warmer feel mixed as appropriate 
> with the neutral greys

That's the formula I think is real close to ideal, and, in fact, close to
where my 220 is headed next. 

If you're into glossy printing with Glop, you could interchange blacks and
have Glop in the Y position as an alternative to the PKN.  In another
alternative that is being set up by a B&W Print forum member, sepia is going
into the Y position (or a 1280 -- they're all close to the same).

MIS R2 can be set up that way.  Frankly, standard Eboni-Lk-LLK for the warm
& MK, with a neutral gray set makes a nice combo (R2 or a UT14 derivative --
or the HP PK and greys I've been experimenting with for the high end or
where ink separation may be a problem).  With the HP greys (they spell it
with an "e") one can use either OEM LK and LLK, or mix them down from the HP
PK with my standard C6 base.  When one dilutes the HP greys this way, they
are cheaper than even third party bulk inks, and they may be the most stable
neutral gray inks -- very high tech stuff.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com