Datacolor User to User Support Group.

Hi,

I just purchased a Spyder3 Print SR for use with a couple of printers. I'm having trouble with my A4 photo printer, a Canon MG6150, in the printer driver settings as I can't find a setting to 'disable colour management' to print out the test patches, etc. I'm running Mac OSX 10.7 (Lion) with all the latest updates and the latest Canon drivers.

There seem to be two colour management options 'Colorsync' which appears to apply icc profiles, and Canon Color Management (I have no idea what this one does). There is not a checkbox I can see to turn either off, it's one of the other.

In a different set of settings, there is the Color Options tab. In here there are settings to alter colour balance, saturation, brightness, etc. and options like 'standard' or 'vivid photo'. I've left them all set to 0 and 'Standard'. I don't know if you select 'Canon Color Management in the other box whether the settings then come down to this other section and I can try different settings here.

What is the best driver setting for this please?

Best,
James

Hi,

I just purchased a Spyder3 Print SR for use with a couple of printers. I'm having trouble with my A4 photo printer, a Canon MG6150, in the printer driver settings as I can't find a setting to 'disable colour management' to print out the test patches, etc. I'm running Mac OSX 10.7 (Lion) with all the latest updates and the latest Canon drivers.

There seem to be two colour management options 'Colorsync' which appears to apply icc profiles, and Canon Color Management (I have no idea what this one does). There is not a checkbox I can see to turn either off, it's one of the other.

In a different set of settings, there is the Color Options tab. In here there are settings to alter colour balance, saturation, brightness, etc. and options like 'standard' or 'vivid photo'. I've left them all set to 0 and 'Standard'. I don't know if you select 'Canon Color Management in the other box whether the settings then come down to this other section and I can try different settings here.

What is the best driver setting for this please?

Best,
James

-- 
John Gruffydd
Mold
Wales UK

I do not have a Mac so what I am suggesting may not be appropriate.  I would select the Colorsyn option and see if it offers an option to turn either Colorsync itself off (Colorsync is the Mac’s system wide color management subsystem) or within Colorsync an option to turn the color management process of the printer driver off.  I have a feeling that the Canon Color Management option is a proprietary set of color adjustments and correction controls and a set of color presets rather than an icc color profile directed color management process.

From: John 
Sent: December 03, 2011 5:36 PM
To: datacolor_group@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: Re: [datacolor_group] Canon MG6150 Print Driver Settings under Mac 10.7

  
On 02/12/2011 13:51, James W wrote: 

    
  Hi,

  I just purchased a Spyder3 Print SR for use with a couple of printers. I'm having trouble with my A4 photo printer, a Canon MG6150, in the printer driver settings as I can't find a setting to 'disable colour management' to print out the test patches, etc. I'm running Mac OSX 10.7 (Lion) with all the latest updates and the latest Canon drivers.

  There seem to be two colour management options 'Colorsync' which appears to apply icc profiles, and Canon Color Management (I have no idea what this one does). There is not a checkbox I can see to turn either off, it's one of the other.

  In a different set of settings, there is the Color Options tab. In here there are settings to alter colour balance, saturation, brightness, etc. and options like 'standard' or 'vivid photo'. I've left them all set to 0 and 'Standard'. I don't know if you select 'Canon Color Management in the other box whether the settings then come down to this other section and I can try different settings here.

  What is the best driver setting for this please?

  Best,
  James


A long shot maybe, but for a Canon iP4500 under Windows it can be found as follows (may be different for Mac):

Open the printer preferences dialog box

Select Main

Set Color/Intensity to Manual

Click the Set button

Look in the Color Correction box at the top. Mine gives choices of:

Driver Matching
ICM (Windows Color Management)
None

Any help?

Regards


-- 
John Gruffydd
Mold
Wales UK

Hi guys,

Thanks for the suggestions, unfortunately neither is the case in the Mac driver, although I saw the option for 'no Color correction' on my friend's PC when we tried it. There is no option to disable under ColorSync either.

Managed to speak to Canon tech support after I posted who said what I was going re: canon Color management and then leaving everything zeroed was correct, although I'm not sure - why not have an 'off' like the Windows driver? Another Color management expert I consulted told me I could try selecting 'generic RGB' under ColorSync, but this produced a nasty, grainy test print so I abandoned that way.

Having used the Spyder3 Print for the first time, it's produced a very weird, awful, unusable profile - looked OK in the soft proof within the Spyder software but absolutely unusable in Photoshop soft proof - highlights all blown out and an odd magenta tinge in Color (even the paper white) and B&W - very considerably worse than the canned profile (in fact the worst profile I've ever seen)! Any tips as to what I might have done wrong?

Cheers,
James

On 4 Dec 2011, at 00:29, "Laurie Solomon" <ls1000@...> wrote:

> I do not have a Mac so what I am suggesting may not be appropriate.  I would select the Colorsyn option and see if it offers an option to turn either Colorsync itself off (Colorsync is the Mac’s system wide color management subsystem) or within Colorsync an option to turn the color management process of the printer driver off.  I have a feeling that the Canon Color Management option is a proprietary set of color adjustments and correction controls and a set of color presets rather than an icc color profile directed color management process.
>  
> From: John
> Sent: December 03, 2011 5:36 PM
> To: datacolor_group@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [datacolor_group] Canon MG6150 Print Driver Settings under Mac 10.7
>  
>  
> On 02/12/2011 13:51, James W wrote:
> 
>>  
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I just purchased a Spyder3 Print SR for use with a couple of printers. I'm having trouble with my A4 photo printer, a Canon MG6150, in the printer driver settings as I can't find a setting to 'disable colour management' to print out the test patches, etc. I'm running Mac OSX 10.7 (Lion) with all the latest updates and the latest Canon drivers.
>> 
>> There seem to be two colour management options 'Colorsync' which appears to apply icc profiles, and Canon Color Management (I have no idea what this one does). There is not a checkbox I can see to turn either off, it's one of the other.
>> 
>> In a different set of settings, there is the Color Options tab. In here there are settings to alter colour balance, saturation, brightness, etc. and options like 'standard' or 'vivid photo'. I've left them all set to 0 and 'Standard'. I don't know if you select 'Canon Color Management in the other box whether the settings then come down to this other section and I can try different settings here.
>> 
>> What is the best driver setting for this please?
>> 
>> Best,
>> James
>> 
> A long shot maybe, but for a Canon iP4500 under Windows it can be found as follows (may be different for Mac):
> 
> Open the printer preferences dialog box
> 
> Select Main
> 
> Set Color/Intensity to Manual
> 
> Click the Set button
> 
> Look in the Color Correction box at the top. Mine gives choices of:
> 
> Driver Matching
> ICM (Windows Color Management)
> None
> 
> Any help?
> 
> Regards
> 
> -- 
> John Gruffydd
> Mold
> Wales UK
>

On Dec 2, 2011, at 8:51 AM, James W wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> I just purchased a Spyder3 Print SR for use with a couple of printers. I'm having trouble with my A4 photo printer, a Canon MG6150, in the printer driver settings as I can't find a setting to 'disable colour management' to print out the test patches, etc. I'm running Mac OSX 10.7 (Lion) with all the latest updates and the latest Canon drivers.
> 
> There seem to be two colour management options 'Colorsync' which appears to apply icc profiles, and Canon Color Management (I have no idea what this one does). There is not a checkbox I can see to turn either off, it's one of the other.
> 
> In a different set of settings, there is the Color Options tab. In here there are settings to alter colour balance, saturation, brightness, etc. and options like 'standard' or 'vivid photo'. I've left them all set to 0 and 'Standard'. I don't know if you select 'Canon Color Management in the other box whether the settings then come down to this other section and I can try different settings here.
> 
> What is the best driver setting for this please?
> 
> Best,
> James
> 

James,

This is how you should print the target:

- The Canon drivers stopped having a "None" setting for color management several
versions ago. The only way to get them to do the right thing "now" is to work
around this.

- In the Color Matching section of the OSX print dialog: choose ColorSync, and
then choose sRGB as the profile using the popup underneath that. Then in the printer
settings section, choose your paper type and output quality/resolution etc. but
don't change anything else that's related to color.

- Print the target that way and measure it; then use the File:Open Data command
in Spyder3Print to open the folder that contains your measurement files. Find the
one that you've created, from this newly printed target, and email a copy of it
to me at dmiller@... so that I can take a quick look at it for you. (But
if you do these things correctly, then you should be able to build a good profile
from this target print and you should be able to print properly through it).


David Miller
Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
Datacolor

Hi David,

Much appreciated, the tech support at Canon was woefully inadequate on this - the option is there in the Windows driver, so why no parity on the Mac? Seems odd of Canon since a good deal of design/photo professionals like Macs and the Canon MG series is currently the only A4 sized printer with grey inks, as far as I'm aware (and the output looks pretty good).

OK will do that over the next day or so, as I like to leave the targets to dry overnight. I can print them from a friend's PC laptop if it'll give me a better target with 'none' selected in colour management, though? Or is the sRGB exactly the same for that purpose?

Cheers,

James

On 4 Dec 2011, at 03:23, David Miller <dm2363@...> wrote:

> 
> On Dec 2, 2011, at 8:51 AM, James W wrote:
> 
> > Hi,
> > 
> > I just purchased a Spyder3 Print SR for use with a couple of printers. I'm having trouble with my A4 photo printer, a Canon MG6150, in the printer driver settings as I can't find a setting to 'disable colour management' to print out the test patches, etc. I'm running Mac OSX 10.7 (Lion) with all the latest updates and the latest Canon drivers.
> > 
> > There seem to be two colour management options 'Colorsync' which appears to apply icc profiles, and Canon Color Management (I have no idea what this one does). There is not a checkbox I can see to turn either off, it's one of the other.
> > 
> > In a different set of settings, there is the Color Options tab. In here there are settings to alter colour balance, saturation, brightness, etc. and options like 'standard' or 'vivid photo'. I've left them all set to 0 and 'Standard'. I don't know if you select 'Canon Color Management in the other box whether the settings then come down to this other section and I can try different settings here.
> > 
> > What is the best driver setting for this please?
> > 
> > Best,
> > James
> > 
> 
> James,
> 
> This is how you should print the target:
> 
> - The Canon drivers stopped having a "None" setting for color management several
> versions ago. The only way to get them to do the right thing "now" is to work
> around this.
> 
> - In the Color Matching section of the OSX print dialog: choose ColorSync, and
> then choose sRGB as the profile using the popup underneath that. Then in the printer
> settings section, choose your paper type and output quality/resolution etc. but
> don't change anything else that's related to color.
> 
> - Print the target that way and measure it; then use the File:Open Data command
> in Spyder3Print to open the folder that contains your measurement files. Find the
> one that you've created, from this newly printed target, and email a copy of it
> to me at dmiller@datacolor.com so that I can take a quick look at it for you. (But
> if you do these things correctly, then you should be able to build a good profile
> from this target print and you should be able to print properly through it).
> 
> David Miller
> Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
> Datacolor
> 
>

On Dec 4, 2011, at 11:52 AM, james_whitehouse1@... wrote:

> 
> Hi David,
> 
> Much appreciated, the tech support at Canon was woefully inadequate on this - the option is there in the Windows driver, so why no parity on the Mac? Seems odd of Canon since a good deal of design/photo professionals like Macs and the Canon MG series is currently the only A4 sized printer with grey inks, as far as I'm aware (and the output looks pretty good).
> 

No idea why; only that this has been an issue with Canon drivers for OSX ever since Leopard
came out. The last time that there was a working "None" control in Canon drivers was for Tiger.

> OK will do that over the next day or so, as I like to leave the targets to dry overnight. I can print them from a friend's PC laptop if it'll give me a better target with 'none' selected in colour management, though? Or is the sRGB exactly the same for that purpose?
> 

No, print them from your own computer; there can be differences in how the drivers print,
across platforms, so I wouldn't consider it "safe" to do it that way.


David Miller
Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
Datacolor

Hi David,

Hm, even more odd that it was once considered a worthwhile driver feature but is no longer there- seems like a regression of functionality. I suppose it doesn't really affect people who aren't using devices such as print profilers? I asked the Canon tech guy to pass back this lack of feature to the driver development team, but maybe it would be worthwhile a company such as yourselves approaching them about it?

In any case, I shall print out the patches and send through the files once I've read the patches - thanks for this!

James

On 4 Dec 2011, at 18:01, David Miller <dm2363@optonline.net> wrote:

> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 11:52 AM, james_whitehouse1@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Hi David,
> > 
> > Much appreciated, the tech support at Canon was woefully inadequate on this - the option is there in the Windows driver, so why no parity on the Mac? Seems odd of Canon since a good deal of design/photo professionals like Macs and the Canon MG series is currently the only A4 sized printer with grey inks, as far as I'm aware (and the output looks pretty good).
> > 
> 
> No idea why; only that this has been an issue with Canon drivers for OSX ever since Leopard
> came out. The last time that there was a working "None" control in Canon drivers was for Tiger.
> 
> > OK will do that over the next day or so, as I like to leave the targets to dry overnight. I can print them from a friend's PC laptop if it'll give me a better target with 'none' selected in colour management, though? Or is the sRGB exactly the same for that purpose?
> > 
> 
> No, print them from your own computer; there can be differences in how the drivers print,
> across platforms, so I wouldn't consider it "safe" to do it that way.
> 
> David Miller
> Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
> Datacolor
> 
>

>>Hm, even more odd that it was once considered a worthwhile driver feature but is no longer there- seems like a regression of functionality. I suppose it doesn't really affect people who aren't using devices such as print profilers? I asked the Canon tech guy to pass back this lack of feature to the driver development team, but maybe it would be worthwhile a company such as yourselves approaching them about it?

I've had some frank discussions on the topic with Canon; this is not their fault, they are just doing what Apple tells them they need to do. The changes we need are up to Apple. 

C. D. Tobie
Global Product Technology Mngr.
Imaging Color Solutions
Datacolor.com
CDTobie@...

On Dec 4, 2011, at 3:34 PM, "james_whitehouse1@yahoo.co.uk" <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:

> Hm, even more odd that it was once considered a worthwhile driver feature but is no longer there- seems like a regression of functionality. I suppose it doesn't really affect people who aren't using devices such as print profilers? I asked the Canon tech guy to pass back this lack of feature to the driver development team, but maybe it would be worthwhile a company such as yourselves approaching them about it?

How bizarre - could you explain what Canon said? What's Apple's reasoning, it sounds like you've probably spoken to them about it?

I'm more familiar with moving image applications as I'm in that field professionally, and although I edit on Avid myself I know many colleagues have been utterly perplexed (and angered) by the 'dumbing down' of Final Cut X. This just has an oddly similar feel, unless you explain Apple have a sensible reason behind this. With the added rumours of the demise of the Mac Pro line, they are in danger of losing the serious/pro creative user base, who were their core customers and supported them in their lean years, and becoming just a shiny gadget company, which would be very sad...

James

On 4 Dec 2011, at 22:37, Cdtobie <CDTobie@...> wrote:

> >>Hm, even more odd that it was once considered a worthwhile driver feature but is no longer there- seems like a regression of functionality. I suppose it doesn't really affect people who aren't using devices such as print profilers? I asked the Canon tech guy to pass back this lack of feature to the driver development team, but maybe it would be worthwhile a company such as yourselves approaching them about it?
> 
> I've had some frank discussions on the topic with Canon; this is not their fault, they are just doing what Apple tells them they need to do. The changes we need are up to Apple. 
> 
> C. D. Tobie
> Global Product Technology Mngr.
> Imaging Color Solutions
> Datacolor.com
> CDTobie@datacolor.com
> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 3:34 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:
> 
> > Hm, even more odd that it was once considered a worthwhile driver feature but is no longer there- seems like a regression of functionality. I suppose it doesn't really affect people who aren't using devices such as print profilers? I asked the Canon tech guy to pass back this lack of feature to the driver development team, but maybe it would be worthwhile a company such as yourselves approaching them about it?
>

Do Epson drivers still have the ability to disable colour management under Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 then?


Sent from James iPhone

On 4 Dec 2011, at 22:37, Cdtobie <CDTobie@...> wrote:

> >>Hm, even more odd that it was once considered a worthwhile driver feature but is no longer there- seems like a regression of functionality. I suppose it doesn't really affect people who aren't using devices such as print profilers? I asked the Canon tech guy to pass back this lack of feature to the driver development team, but maybe it would be worthwhile a company such as yourselves approaching them about it?
> 
> I've had some frank discussions on the topic with Canon; this is not their fault, they are just doing what Apple tells them they need to do. The changes we need are up to Apple. 
> 
> C. D. Tobie
> Global Product Technology Mngr.
> Imaging Color Solutions
> Datacolor.com
> CDTobie@datacolor.com
> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 3:34 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:
> 
> > Hm, even more odd that it was once considered a worthwhile driver feature but is no longer there- seems like a regression of functionality. I suppose it doesn't really affect people who aren't using devices such as print profilers? I asked the Canon tech guy to pass back this lack of feature to the driver development team, but maybe it would be worthwhile a company such as yourselves approaching them about it?
>

>>How bizarre - could you explain what Canon said? What's Apple's reasoning, it sounds like you've probably spoken to them about it?

Apple changed their printing path some time ago. The new path has no way to bypass ColorSync, so all prints, including color targets and pre corrected images, get converted. The theory is that in such cases a "null transform" should be used, by setting the source and output profiles to the same profile. The real world situation is that this is unreliable; in any given instance, depending on the version of Photoshop, the version of the printer driver, or the phase of the moon, an undesired transform may occur. What is needed is a call to bypass ColorSync: a No Color Management call in the OS. This has been explained to Apple. They have not seen fit to provide this function. Therefore we are obliged to tell people that the only fully reliable printing solutions are Windows, an old Mac, with an old copy of Photoshop, and old printer drivers, or a third party RIP to bypass the RGB print path on a new Mac. So sad.

C. David Tobie
Global Product Technology Manager
Imaging Color Solutions
Datacolor inc. 
cdtobie@...
www.datacolor.com

On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:24 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@....uk> wrote:

> How bizarre - could you explain what Canon said? What's Apple's reasoning, it sounds like you've probably spoken to them about it?

>>Do Epson drivers still have the ability to disable colour management under Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 then?

All the printer companies have instituted the new print path in newer drivers, but they have done it in varying ways, that may look different in different drivers. And older printers without updated drivers will be yet another different case. 

C. David Tobie
Global Product Technology Manager
Imaging Color Solutions
Datacolor inc. 
cdtobie@datacolor.com
www.datacolor.com

On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:26 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:

> Do Epson drivers still have the ability to disable colour management under Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 then?

Thanks for the detailed info. That is sad indeed...

I'm reluctant to install Windows on my Macs, or go back to PC use and I don't have any older machines to use currently, although in a couple of years i guess I could revert my current Macbook Pro to an older OS, but it really seems kinda lame... What kind of 3rd party rip could I look at for my mac/printers, any idea on good ones?

By the way, should I use sRGB or Generic RGB for the patch printing workaround? If its sRGB, which one as there appear to be several with different numbers, etc., after them?

Best wishes,

James

On 5 Dec 2011, at 01:06, Cdtobie <CDTobie@...> wrote:

> >>How bizarre - could you explain what Canon said? What's Apple's reasoning, it sounds like you've probably spoken to them about it?
> 
> Apple changed their printing path some time ago. The new path has no way to bypass ColorSync, so all prints, including color targets and pre corrected images, get converted. The theory is that in such cases a "null transform" should be used, by setting the source and output profiles to the same profile. The real world situation is that this is unreliable; in any given instance, depending on the version of Photoshop, the version of the printer driver, or the phase of the moon, an undesired transform may occur. What is needed is a call to bypass ColorSync: a No Color Management call in the OS. This has been explained to Apple. They have not seen fit to provide this function. Therefore we are obliged to tell people that the only fully reliable printing solutions are Windows, an old Mac, with an old copy of Photoshop, and old printer drivers, or a third party RIP to bypass the RGB print path on a new Mac. So sad.
> 
> C. David Tobie
> Global Product Technology Manager
> Imaging Color Solutions
> Datacolor inc. 
> cdtobie@...
> www.datacolor.com
> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:24 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:
> 
> > How bizarre - could you explain what Canon said? What's Apple's reasoning, it sounds like you've probably spoken to them about it?
>

What a fine mess :(

On 5 Dec 2011, at 01:09, Cdtobie <CDTobie@...> wrote:

> >>Do Epson drivers still have the ability to disable colour management under Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 then?
> 
> All the printer companies have instituted the new print path in newer drivers, but they have done it in varying ways, that may look different in different drivers. And older printers without updated drivers will be yet another different case. 
> 
> C. David Tobie
> Global Product Technology Manager
> Imaging Color Solutions
> Datacolor inc. 
> cdtobie@...
> www.datacolor.com
> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:26 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:
> 
> > Do Epson drivers still have the ability to disable colour management under Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 then?
>

I might try PrintFab, as it looks like it might allow this kind of thing on a Mac and looks pretty full featured. Any thoughts on whether it'll do this kind of thing properly?

On 5 Dec 2011, at 01:06, Cdtobie <CDTobie@aol.com> wrote:

> >>How bizarre - could you explain what Canon said? What's Apple's reasoning, it sounds like you've probably spoken to them about it?
> 
> Apple changed their printing path some time ago. The new path has no way to bypass ColorSync, so all prints, including color targets and pre corrected images, get converted. The theory is that in such cases a "null transform" should be used, by setting the source and output profiles to the same profile. The real world situation is that this is unreliable; in any given instance, depending on the version of Photoshop, the version of the printer driver, or the phase of the moon, an undesired transform may occur. What is needed is a call to bypass ColorSync: a No Color Management call in the OS. This has been explained to Apple. They have not seen fit to provide this function. Therefore we are obliged to tell people that the only fully reliable printing solutions are Windows, an old Mac, with an old copy of Photoshop, and old printer drivers, or a third party RIP to bypass the RGB print path on a new Mac. So sad.
> 
> C. David Tobie
> Global Product Technology Manager
> Imaging Color Solutions
> Datacolor inc. 
> cdtobie@...
> www.datacolor.com
> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:24 PM, "james_whitehouse1@yahoo.co.uk" <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:
> 
> > How bizarre - could you explain what Canon said? What's Apple's reasoning, it sounds like you've probably spoken to them about it?
>

>>I might try PrintFab, as it looks like it might allow this kind of thing on a Mac and looks pretty full featured. Any thoughts on whether it'll do this kind of thing properly?

It appears to be a true RIP, so it will bypass the RGB print path, and avoid  the issue at hand. Whether it applies profiles well, turns CM off for target printing, or can work with RGB output profiles I cannot say not having tested it. 

C. David Tobie
Global Product Technology Manager
Imaging Color Solutions
Datacolor inc. 
cdtobie@datacolor.com
www.datacolor.com

On Dec 4, 2011, at 8:39 PM, "james_whitehouse1@yahoo.co.uk" <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:

> I might try PrintFab, as it looks like it might allow this kind of thing on a Mac and looks pretty full featured. Any thoughts on whether it'll do this kind of thing properly?

Thanks, I'll ask them and see! Any known good alternatives for Mac?

Sent from James iPhone

On 5 Dec 2011, at 10:34, Cdtobie <CDTobie@...> wrote:

> >>I might try PrintFab, as it looks like it might allow this kind of thing on a Mac and looks pretty full featured. Any thoughts on whether it'll do this kind of thing properly?
> 
> It appears to be a true RIP, so it will bypass the RGB print path, and avoid the issue at hand. Whether it applies profiles well, turns CM off for target printing, or can work with RGB output profiles I cannot say not having tested it. 
> 
> C. David Tobie
> Global Product Technology Manager
> Imaging Color Solutions
> Datacolor inc. 
> cdtobie@...
> www.datacolor.com
> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 8:39 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:
> 
> > I might try PrintFab, as it looks like it might allow this kind of thing on a Mac and looks pretty full featured. Any thoughts on whether it'll do this kind of thing properly?
>

On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:26 PM, james_whitehouse1@... wrote:

> 
> Do Epson drivers still have the ability to disable colour management under Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 then?
> 

Yes, Epson drivers have a properly functioning "off" control for color management, as follows:

- In the Color Matching pane of the OSX print dialog, you choose "Epson Color Controls"

- in the Printer Settings section of the OSX print dialog (where you choose paper type,
ink mode, etc) you choose "Off - No Color Management"

It works perfectly.

David Miller
Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
Datacolor

That bodes well when I buy the R3000 I'm saving for, nice to know! It does suggest that Canon can't simply disclaim all responsibility for removing the feature from the Mac driver, and blame it on Apple, since Epson have obviously worked around it...

Have printed the patches with sRGB setting and will read them and send tomorrow.

James

On 5 Dec 2011, at 15:24, David Miller <dm2363@...> wrote:

> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:26 PM, james_whitehouse1@... wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Do Epson drivers still have the ability to disable colour management under Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 then?
> > 
> 
> Yes, Epson drivers have a properly functioning "off" control for color management, as follows:
> 
> - In the Color Matching pane of the OSX print dialog, you choose "Epson Color Controls"
> 
> - in the Printer Settings section of the OSX print dialog (where you choose paper type,
> ink mode, etc) you choose "Off - No Color Management"
> 
> It works perfectly.
> 
> David Miller
> Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
> Datacolor
> 
>

I asked the PrintFab guys the question, and here's their response, in case it's of use to anyone-

Dear James,

With applications that send "Postscript" like Adobe PhotoShop / Indesign and Quark XPress, PrintFab actually bypasses ColorSync, so the application's RGB / CMYK colors are sent directly to the PrintFab driver.

With applications that use Apple's printing framework (e.g. iPhoto), ColorSync cannot be disabled but is configured to do a "null transform".

Best regards
Florian Zeiler

ZEDOnet GmbH

So, my question following from that is- does the Spyder3 Print SR software fall into the former category or the latter? If it's the latter, would I be better off printing the targets from Photoshop if using PrintFab?

James

On 5 Dec 2011, at 10:34, Cdtobie <CDTobie@...> wrote:

> >>I might try PrintFab, as it looks like it might allow this kind of thing on a Mac and looks pretty full featured. Any thoughts on whether it'll do this kind of thing properly?
> 
> It appears to be a true RIP, so it will bypass the RGB print path, and avoid the issue at hand. Whether it applies profiles well, turns CM off for target printing, or can work with RGB output profiles I cannot say not having tested it. 
> 
> C. David Tobie
> Global Product Technology Manager
> Imaging Color Solutions
> Datacolor inc. 
> cdtobie@...
> www.datacolor.com
> 
> On Dec 4, 2011, at 8:39 PM, "james_whitehouse1@..." <james_whitehouse1@...> wrote:
> 
> > I might try PrintFab, as it looks like it might allow this kind of thing on a Mac and looks pretty full featured. Any thoughts on whether it'll do this kind of thing properly?
>

On Dec 7, 2011, at 8:44 AM, james_whitehouse1@... wrote:

> With applications that send "Postscript" like Adobe PhotoShop / Indesign and Quark XPress, PrintFab actually bypasses ColorSync, so the application's RGB / CMYK colors are sent directly to the PrintFab driver.

Does not answer the key question of whether RGB output profiles can be used with the RIP.
> 
> With applications that use Apple's printing framework (e.g. iPhoto), ColorSync cannot be disabled but is configured to do a "null transform".

Not a RIP at that point, but a convenient front end for the RGB printing path. The "null transform" noted is the one which we see fail far too frequently due to a large number of variables.

C. David Tobie
Global Product Technology Manager


Datacolor
5 Princess Road
Lawrenceville, NJ 08648, USA
609.924.2189
www.datacolor.com

Phone: 207.685.9248
Mobile: 207.312.0448
Fax: 207.685.4455
Email:  cdtobie@...
Skype: cdtobie

OK, in that case what question would I ask to get a sufficiently useful response from them before I buy PrintFab?

On 7 Dec 2011, at 14:20, C D Tobie <CDTobie@...> wrote:

> 
> On Dec 7, 2011, at 8:44 AM, james_whitehouse1@... wrote:
> 
>> With applications that send "Postscript" like Adobe PhotoShop / Indesign and Quark XPress, PrintFab actually bypasses ColorSync, so the application's RGB / CMYK colors are sent directly to the PrintFab driver.
> 
> Does not answer the key question of whether RGB output profiles can be used with the RIP.
>> 
>> With applications that use Apple's printing framework (e.g. iPhoto), ColorSync cannot be disabled but is configured to do a "null transform".
> 
> Not a RIP at that point, but a convenient front end for the RGB printing path. The "null transform" noted is the one which we see fail far too frequently due to a large number of variables.
> 
> C. David Tobie
> Global Product Technology Manager
> 
> <image003.gif>
> Datacolor
> 5 Princess Road
> Lawrenceville, NJ 08648, USA
> 609.924.2189
> www.datacolor.com
> 
> Phone: 207.685.9248
> Mobile: 207.312.0448
> Fax: 207.685.4455
> Email:  cdtobie@...
> Skype: cdtobie
>

On Dec 7, 2011, at 11:09 AM, james_whitehouse1@... wrote:

> 
> OK, in that case what question would I ask to get a sufficiently useful response from them before I buy PrintFab?
> 

At this point, I'm not sure I understand what buying PrintFab is going to
do for you...?

The target print that you created and sent me a sample of, using the method
I described in the OSX print dialog (use ColorSync, then select the sRGB profile
under that) is fine. Your measurements from that target print are also
perfect, and you can now build a perfect profile for the Canon; using the stock
Canon driver and without having to invest additional money in an external
driver or RIP.

You're now up and running...! :-)


David Miller
Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
Datacolor

Hi David,

Fair point - maybe I'm getting too bogged down in technicalities ;) OK if the chart and readings are spot on I'll continue to work that way, (although, having looked at PrintFab it has some nice features apart from the ones I was discussing). I take it I select the custom ICC in Photoshop when I print?

Best,

James

On 7 Dec 2011, at 16:38, David Miller <dm2363@...> wrote:

> 
> On Dec 7, 2011, at 11:09 AM, james_whitehouse1@... wrote:
> 
>>  
>> 
>> OK, in that case what question would I ask to get a sufficiently useful response from them before I buy PrintFab?
>> 
> 
> At this point, I'm not sure I understand what buying PrintFab is going to
> do for you...?
> 
> The target print that you created and sent me a sample of, using the method
> I described in the OSX print dialog (use ColorSync, then select the sRGB profile
> under that) is fine. Your measurements from that target print are also
> perfect, and you can now build a perfect profile for the Canon; using the stock
> Canon driver and without having to invest additional money in an external
> driver or RIP.
> 
> You're now up and running...! :-)
> 
> 
> David Miller
> Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
> Datacolor
> 
>