From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Bill Brandom
Sent: Monday, 20 January 2014 4:13 PM
To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [disklavier] external tone generator
Hi Geoff,
For a high velocity note, the delay will be as short as 32 milliseconds. For
a low velocity note, delay will be up about 225 milliseconds.
Bill
On Sun, Jan 19, 2014 at 2:54 PM, Geoff Ward <gward1211@...> wrote:
Hello
Another instance where real time play is desirable is where the midi file
has on-screen lyrics, such as a karaoke file. I have many of these and the
lyrics don't progress in time with the melody if the 500ms delay is
operative.
I therefore have a question: how noticeable is the sloppy timing of soft vs.
loud notes and rapidly repeating notes? Is it only a problem for intense
classical music and not really a problem for less demanding popular music?
Kind regards
Geoff
_____
From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of George Frederick Litterst
Sent: Monday, 20 January 2014 5:16 AM
To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [disklavier] external tone generator
Good afternoon, everyone.
Sam, I think that the variety of scenarios that have been discussed have
confused things. So, I'll lay out the information in a different way:
(1) Playback from internal memory or floppy disk
The MIDI Out port automatically works. All data is sent out the MIDI out
port EXCEPT for the data that is played by the piano itself. The MIDI data
that is sent to the MIDI Out port will be in sync with the playback of the
piano itself.
If you want to send out ALL recorded data during playback (including the
data that is intended to be played by the piano), you have to turn on the
feature called Piano Part Ensemble Out.
(2) MIDI Out vs. MIDI Thru
You have two choices for the MIDI Out port: Keyboard Out and Delay Out.
If you choose Keyboard Out, the data that you generate by playing the piano
yourself in real time is sent out the MIDI Out port without delay. I believe
that I am correct in saying that on a Mark II, MIDI data that arrives at the
MIDI In port is not sent to the MIDI Out port in this scenario. However,
MIDI data that causes the keys to move will be sent to the MIDI Out port.
If you choose Delay Out, the MIDI Out port because a MIDI Thru port. In this
scenario, the data that you generate by playing the piano yourself in real
time is not sent out the MIDI Out port. Instead, whatever comes in the MIDI
In port is passed through to the MIDI Out port. I am reasonably certain that
if MIDI In is set to Real Time, there is no delay when the data is passed to
the MIDI Out port. If MIDI In is set to the 500ms delay, that same delay is
applied to the MIDI Out port.
(3) MIDI In: Real Time vs. 500ms Delay
It is very rare, with a Mark II, that you would want to set MIDI In to Real
Time. If you do, playback by the piano becomes sloppy as the timing of each
note is related to velocity of each note. Loud notes will be heard sooner
than soft notes and rapidly repeated notes will not speak well. All notes
will have some amount of delay.
In the case of a Mark IIXG or later Disklavier with an internal tone
generator, there are times when you might want to set MIDI In to Real Time.
Generally this is the case when you are going to play the piano yourself and
are working with interactive MIDI software that only sends data to the
Disklavier's internal tone generator. In that scenario, you might want the
internal tone generator to respond without delay.
Regards,
PianoBench
On Jan 19, 2014, at 12:12 PM, Skanter123 wrote:
There is one problem, however, with your last scenario ("If i want to play
virtual piano in Computer from silent DKL...): When you change MIDI Out from
Delay Out to Keyboard Out, the MIDI Out port no longer functions as a MIDI
Thru port.
Pianobench, i was thinking that I would just have to change that one setting
when I wanted to play virtual piano from silent piano, and toggle it when I
go from that mode to multi-channel playback mode. Does that make sense?
Sam
www.keyboardcollective.com <http://www.keyboardcollective.com/>
(212) <tel:%28212%29%20684-3304> 684-3304
On Jan 19, 2014, at 9:30 AM, George Frederick Litterst <PianoBench@...>
wrote:
Good morning, everyone.
Sam, assuming that you are not going to upgrade your Disklavier with a
DKC-850 and enjoy the benefits of an integrated tone generator, your diagram
is the way to go.
There is one problem, however, with your last scenario ("If i want to play
virtual piano in Computer from silent DKL...): When you change MIDI Out from
Delay Out to Keyboard Out, the MIDI Out port no longer functions as a MIDI
Thru port.
Regards,
PianoBench
On Jan 19, 2014, at 12:42 AM, Skanter123 wrote:
<image.png>
Does this look right? (Excuse lousy diagram)
Computer MIDI OUT to DKL IN
DKL OUT /THRU to MU50 IN
MU50 THRU to Computer IN
Play multi-channel MIDI file from computer, plays disklavier live then sends
other channels to MU50 with delay so all syncs up.
If i want to play virtual piano in Computer from silent DKL just change DSK
setting from DLY OUT to KBD OUT, and keep MU50 powered on.
Sam
www.keyboardcollective.com <http://www.keyboardcollective.com/>
(212) <tel:%28212%29%20684-3304> 684-3304
On Jan 18, 2014, at 10:46 PM, PianoBench@... wrote:
Good evening, everyone.
Sam, this procedure does work with the Mark II. This Disklavier does not
have a MIDI Thru port. Instead, the MIDI Output port functions as either a
MIDI Output for or a MIDI Thru part. In the latter case, a 500ms delay is
applied.
To use the MIDI Out port of a Mark II as a MIDI Thru port with a 500ms
delay, change the MIDI Out setting from Keyboard Out to Delay Out.
Regards,
PianoBench
On Jan 17, 2014, at 3:07 AM, Skanter123 <skanter123@...> wrote:
Send your MIDI data to your MPX100II MIDI In port. Connect the MU50 to the
MPX100II MIDI Out.
Hmmm...not sure that would work. I think i'd need a MIDI THRU on the DKL?
Sam
www.keyboardcollective.com <http://www.keyboardcollective.com/>
(212) 684-3304 <tel:%28212%29%20684-3304>
On Jan 17, 2014, at 2:57 AM, Bill Brandom <bill.brandom03@...> wrote:
Send your MIDI data to your MPX100II MIDI In port. Connect the MU50 to the
MPX100II MIDI Out.
This way the 500ms delay is incorporated in both the Disklavier and the
MU50.
Bill
Sent from my iPhone.
On Jan 16, 2014, at 11:46 AM, Sam Kanter <skanter123@...> wrote:
Hope I'm not wearing out my welcome with so many questions from a new user,
but here's another.
The MPX100II came with a MU50 XG external tone generator (and powered
speaker) probably because this model was released before this was b uilt-in
to the Mk II XG disklaviers.
I assume one can use MIDI thru to connect both DK and external module, but
what about the 500ms delay of the dk when receiving MIDI data, preventing
everything from syncing up? There are latency settings in some advanced
sequencers I have, but I was hoping there would be a simpler way to play
back multi-channel MIDI files...
Has anyone else tried this?
Thanks in advance...
Sam Kanter
www.keyboardcollective.com <http://www.keyboardcollective.com/>
(212) <tel:%28212%29%20684-3304> 684-3304