Elektron Musical Instruments

all i was saying was that it's not difficult to write music w/out a keyboard 
as input.
i have made song using only the piano roll bar to enter note data....
**It's difficult to produce electronic music of any quality if you can't
play a keyboard... WELL**
.... so the poll up, i said 'yes' because of course you use a keyboard at 
some time in your studio, i just think it's a little condensinding to say 
that you have to be able to play a keyboard (which implies play a keyboard 
well) to play/create/produce 'quality' music.  sorta like the whole 'you're 
not a musician if you sequence your music' arguments i get into all my old 
friends from metal bands.

ne?

-0behn desu0-

be4n_anikean@...

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--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "Behn Humphrey" 
<be4n_anikean@h...> wrote:
> .... so the poll up, i said 'yes' because of course you use a 
> keyboard at  some time in your studio, i just think it's a little 
> condensinding to say that you have to be able to play a keyboard 
> (which implies play a keyboard well) to

  Okay, I'd like to end this thread....

  I'm sorry if I sounded like I was implying that people need to play 
well or whatever, that wasn't my goal.  I certainly can't play well 
at all.  I am currently studying "Happy Birthday" and trying to play 
it consistently without messing up.

  By "play," I meant "use".  Even my friends who use alternate input 
devices (e.g. Yamaha WX-7) still use keyboards.  I consider them, 
therefore, "keyboard players".  But I just asked one of them, and he 
said he doesn't consider himself a keyboard player.

  So I take back my definition.

  Anyway, back to Elektron business :)

> sorta like the whole 'you're 
> not a musician if you sequence your music' arguments
> i get into all my old 
> friends from metal bands.

What I have found interesting about these recent
threads is not just who, how, and with what skill
people use or do not use keyboards, but the variety of
approaches (often implied) that we all take to capture
our music.

The music is the end.  To be drawn into arguement as
to the means used - traditional (keyboard, guitar,
percussion, brass, violin, etc) or non-traditional
(drum machines, sequencers, samplers, etc.) or both -
is pointless.  To denigrate an artist\ufffds choice as to
the media used to achieve his art is a long string of
bad words we can all fill in for ourselves and does
nothing to change the outcome or initial opinion.  

Whether a \ufffdsong\ufffd is produced by banging on oil cans
and brake drums (as originated those beautiful
Trinidad steel drums), a combination of strings in a
wooden frame whose production is itself a piece of
art, or mouse clicks in software to drive electrical
circuits is immaterial.  What comes out stands on its
own merits as Music, appealing to each of us in
varying degree.

For the record I \ufffduse\ufffd keyboards, but I\ufffdm not a
keyboard player.  This lack of skill with keyboards
influences both my technical ability to produce and
the type of music I attempt when I do compose.  As
does my complete inability to \ufffdplay\ufffd guitar or
traditional drums \ufffd surprise \ufffd which is why you find
neither of these instruments in my compositions.  This
does not mean I don\ufffdt enjoy music using these
instruments nor that I couldn\ufffdt employ them in my own
work.  But not \ufffdknowing\ufffd them or having a way to
produce them equivalently in a composition with the
nuance of a human player means that I don\ufffdt attempt to
use them as a human player would or pursue those
styles of musical expression where such techniques
contribute.  This thereby reduces the potential for
the \ufffdkind\ufffd of music I create \ufffd which is under no
circumstance to be confused with the \ufffdquality\ufffd of
musical expression as Music.

I find the keyboard, regardless of skill to deliver
the end result, an easy and intuitive tool to
investigate patterns and sounds of potential.  That\ufffds
me, I don\ufffdt expect that to be everybody.  But I am
equally prone to start from my sequencer and drive my
sound modules that way to find a start that evokes a
vision.  There is no logic to an approach I\ufffdve been
able to identify for myself, although I\ufffdve found that
my compositions that have more of a melodic nature in
the end are usually those whose musical theme was
begun from the kernel of a keyboard experiment and
those where rhythm and beat dominate are those from a
sequencer (most particularly my MD).  This does not
mean that I don\ufffdt use melody with rhythm and vice
versa, I do/can/might/not, just that the starting
inspiration and dominate theme for me seems to follow
this influence.

I would go insane without music.  I think that
everyone that is on this list falls into that grouping
of humans for whom Music \ufffddoes it\ufffd \ufffd the way painting
or mathematics is sometimes for others.  I think that
each of us have varying levels of skill with
instrumental technique and composition that influence
our ability to create; I know I do.  Thinking as I
write this I would have to say that primary among
those handful of reasons why I love electronic music
(any kind) is that it opens wider avenues and
techniques to me with which I can participate in my
passion for music by creating, where before I\ufffdd felt
my physical skill with an instrument limited just how
far and what tonal themes I could attempt myself \ufffd
regardless of what I heard in my head.  I could care
less what you call the end result or how it\ufffds done; my
MD along with my computer, and keyboards, hardware and
software modules, processors, samplers, sequencers\ufffd
all combine to give me the exquisite pleasure of
creating what I could not do with my corporate self. 
And when I\ufffdm done I\ufffdm equally as likely to CD some
wicked blues and listen to that guitar scream.


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Well met.

On Thursday, August 21, 2003, at 02:11 am, Eric Jacobsen wrote:

>> sorta like the whole 'you're
>> not a musician if you sequence your music' arguments
>> i get into all my old
>> friends from metal bands.
>
> What I have found interesting about these recent
> threads is not just who, how, and with what skill
> people use or do not use keyboards, but the variety of
> approaches (often implied) that we all take to capture
> our music.
>
> The music is the end.  To be drawn into arguement as
> to the means used - traditional (keyboard, guitar,
> percussion, brass, violin, etc) or non-traditional
> (drum machines, sequencers, samplers, etc.) or both -
> is pointless.  To denigrate an artist’s choice as to
> the media used to achieve his art is a long string of
> bad words we can all fill in for ourselves and does
> nothing to change the outcome or initial opinion.
>
> Whether a “song” is produced by banging on oil cans
> and brake drums (as originated those beautiful
> Trinidad steel drums), a combination of strings in a
> wooden frame whose production is itself a piece of
> art, or mouse clicks in software to drive electrical
> circuits is immaterial.  What comes out stands on its
> own merits as Music, appealing to each of us in
> varying degree.
>
> For the record I “use” keyboards, but I’m not a
> keyboard player.  This lack of skill with keyboards
> influences both my technical ability to produce and
> the type of music I attempt when I do compose.  As
> does my complete inability to “play” guitar or
> traditional drums – surprise – which is why you find
> neither of these instruments in my compositions.  This
> does not mean I don’t enjoy music using these
> instruments nor that I couldn’t employ them in my own
> work.  But not “knowing” them or having a way to
> produce them equivalently in a composition with the
> nuance of a human player means that I don’t attempt to
> use them as a human player would or pursue those
> styles of musical expression where such techniques
> contribute.  This thereby reduces the potential for
> the “kind” of music I create – which is under no
> circumstance to be confused with the “quality” of
> musical expression as Music.
>
> I find the keyboard, regardless of skill to deliver
> the end result, an easy and intuitive tool to
> investigate patterns and sounds of potential.  That’s
> me, I don’t expect that to be everybody.  But I am
> equally prone to start from my sequencer and drive my
> sound modules that way to find a start that evokes a
> vision.  There is no logic to an approach I’ve been
> able to identify for myself, although I’ve found that
> my compositions that have more of a melodic nature in
> the end are usually those whose musical theme was
> begun from the kernel of a keyboard experiment and
> those where rhythm and beat dominate are those from a
> sequencer (most particularly my MD).  This does not
> mean that I don’t use melody with rhythm and vice
> versa, I do/can/might/not, just that the starting
> inspiration and dominate theme for me seems to follow
> this influence.
>
> I would go insane without music.  I think that
> everyone that is on this list falls into that grouping
> of humans for whom Music “does it” – the way painting
> or mathematics is sometimes for others.  I think that
> each of us have varying levels of skill with
> instrumental technique and composition that influence
> our ability to create; I know I do.  Thinking as I
> write this I would have to say that primary among
> those handful of reasons why I love electronic music
> (any kind) is that it opens wider avenues and
> techniques to me with which I can participate in my
> passion for music by creating, where before I’d felt
> my physical skill with an instrument limited just how
> far and what tonal themes I could attempt myself –
> regardless of what I heard in my head.  I could care
> less what you call the end result or how it’s done; my
> MD along with my computer, and keyboards, hardware and
> software modules, processors, samplers, sequencers

> all combine to give me the exquisite pleasure of
> creating what I could not do with my corporate self.
> And when I’m done I’m equally as likely to CD some
> wicked blues and listen to that guitar scream.
>
>
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"  The music is the end.  To be drawn into arguement as to the means used - 
traditional (keyboard, guitar, percussion, brass, violin, etc) or 
non-traditional (drum machines, sequencers, samplers, etc.) or both - is 
pointless.  "

um... lol... isn't that kind of discussion sorta the point of lists like 
this?

-0behn desu0-
be4n_anikean@...

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