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2009-07-11 by bermudaben2006
This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? Thanks, Ben
2009-07-11 by jammie
it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered
----- Original Message ----- From: bermudaben2006 To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? Thanks, Ben ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-11 by esynthesist
In fact EMXP never allows samplerates higher than 41667 Hz for Emax-1. I wanted to be sure that the banks would be compatible with all Emax-1 samplers. The maximum samplerate at which Emax-1 can sample is 41667 Hz (Emax-II even only 39 kHz) As far as I know the option to change the samplerate to 44100 Hz on Emax (in the Digital Effects section) was only added for SE versions. I only have an SE and Plus version (which both support playback at 44100 Hz), so I couldn't test if non-SE versions are also able to playback samples at 44100 Hz. If someone can confirm that ALL emax-1 samplers support playback at 44.1 kHz, I might change EMXP. If not all Emax samplers are compatible, I could still add the 44100 Hz option in EMXP "on user's risk" :-) But... does anyone hear the difference between 41.7 and 44.1 kHz samples on the Emax ?? ///E-Synthesist --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@...> wrote:
> > it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered > ----- Original Message ----- > From: bermudaben2006 > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM > Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: > > Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? > > Thanks, > Ben > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
2009-07-12 by bermudaben2006
Well, if you could take samples with Emax at both 42 and 44 KHz you probably wouldn't hear any difference. But converting 44.1 Khz samples is another thing, because any samle rate conversion results in a degradation of quality. I did some testing yesterday with drum samples that I either played back and sampled at 42 Khz or converted from 44 Khz to 42 Khz using EMXP, and the difference was quite radical! For example, the 909 bass drum sample I converted was quite distorted (the original is normalized at -0.3 dB). On the other hand, when I sampled it manually it sounded really good. Also, converting hi hat samples with EMXP added a lot of low frequencies that are not present in the original. Again, manually sampling them gave better results. Do you know if the .wav files I want to convert with EMXP should have some headroom for better results? --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@...> wrote:
> > In fact EMXP never allows samplerates higher than 41667 Hz for Emax-1. > I wanted to be sure that the banks would be compatible with all Emax-1 samplers. > > The maximum samplerate at which Emax-1 can sample is 41667 Hz (Emax-II even only 39 kHz) > As far as I know the option to change the samplerate to 44100 Hz on Emax (in the Digital Effects section) was only added for SE versions. I only have an SE and Plus version (which both support playback at 44100 Hz), so I couldn't test if non-SE versions are also able to playback samples at 44100 Hz. > > If someone can confirm that ALL emax-1 samplers support playback at 44.1 kHz, I might change EMXP. If not all Emax samplers are compatible, I could still add the 44100 Hz option in EMXP "on user's risk" :-) > But... does anyone hear the difference between 41.7 and 44.1 kHz samples on the Emax ?? > > ///E-Synthesist > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: bermudaben2006 > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM > > Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: > > > > Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? > > > > Thanks, > > Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >
2009-07-12 by jammie
drum samples sound better at lower sample rates any way as they dont contain the whole frequency spectrum thats why hiphop producers prefer the 12bit sample sound and the emax is converted to 12bit so you get 4bits of data diference that means more stepping but it adds to the quality hence why people still buy the sp1200 which is an emax engine
----- Original Message ----- From: bermudaben2006 To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 10:04 AM Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP Well, if you could take samples with Emax at both 42 and 44 KHz you probably wouldn't hear any difference. But converting 44.1 Khz samples is another thing, because any samle rate conversion results in a degradation of quality. I did some testing yesterday with drum samples that I either played back and sampled at 42 Khz or converted from 44 Khz to 42 Khz using EMXP, and the difference was quite radical! For example, the 909 bass drum sample I converted was quite distorted (the original is normalized at -0.3 dB). On the other hand, when I sampled it manually it sounded really good. Also, converting hi hat samples with EMXP added a lot of low frequencies that are not present in the original. Again, manually sampling them gave better results. Do you know if the .wav files I want to convert with EMXP should have some headroom for better results? --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@...> wrote: > > In fact EMXP never allows samplerates higher than 41667 Hz for Emax-1. > I wanted to be sure that the banks would be compatible with all Emax-1 samplers. > > The maximum samplerate at which Emax-1 can sample is 41667 Hz (Emax-II even only 39 kHz) > As far as I know the option to change the samplerate to 44100 Hz on Emax (in the Digital Effects section) was only added for SE versions. I only have an SE and Plus version (which both support playback at 44100 Hz), so I couldn't test if non-SE versions are also able to playback samples at 44100 Hz. > > If someone can confirm that ALL emax-1 samplers support playback at 44.1 kHz, I might change EMXP. If not all Emax samplers are compatible, I could still add the 44100 Hz option in EMXP "on user's risk" :-) > But... does anyone hear the difference between 41.7 and 44.1 kHz samples on the Emax ?? > > ///E-Synthesist > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: bermudaben2006 > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM > > Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: > > > > Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? > > > > Thanks, > > Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.11/2232 - Release Date: 07/11/09 17:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-12 by esynthesist
I did some tests myself today. The lower quality of the Emax samples is not caused by the lower samplerate, but by the 12-to-8 bit compression algorithm. If you would convert the samplerate of a 44100Hz WAV to 41667Hz first with some audio tool, and then load this WAV into an Emax-1 bank with EMXP, the same "lower quality" would be audible. I also loaded some 44100 Hz WAVs into an EMAX-II bank with EMXP, making sure it converts them to 41667 Hz. Result: the sound is top quality on the Emax-II with both samplerates. So the samplerate converter in EMXP is definitely not causing the difference. Of course you could ask me now the enhance the 12-to-8 bit compression algorithm in EMXP :-) But when I designed this algorithm a few years ago, I already noticed these quality issues on both the Emax and the Emulator II, especially with drum sounds (I used TR808 samples). So I did some additional tests at that time: I checked the compression/decompression algorithms in SoundDesigner and they suffered from the same problem. I also saved some "good" 16 bit banks on the Emax-II as "compressed 8 bit" Emax-I banks and loaded those on the Emax-I: the same distortion problems appeared. So I concluded that my algorithm was as good (as bad ?) as the ones used by Emu and Digidesign, and I left them as they were. The hardware compression on Emax-I during sampling is much better indeed. I guess there must be an explanation, but I'm not a hardware specialist. ///E-Synthesist --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@...> wrote:
> > drum samples sound better at lower sample rates any way as they dont contain the whole frequency spectrum > > thats why hiphop producers prefer the 12bit sample sound and the emax is converted to 12bit so you get 4bits of data diference that means more stepping but it adds to the quality hence why people still buy the sp1200 which is an emax engine > ----- Original Message ----- > From: bermudaben2006 > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 10:04 AM > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > Well, if you could take samples with Emax at both 42 and 44 KHz you probably wouldn't hear any difference. But converting 44.1 Khz samples is another thing, because any samle rate conversion results in a degradation of quality. > > I did some testing yesterday with drum samples that I either played back and sampled at 42 Khz or converted from 44 Khz to 42 Khz using EMXP, and the difference was quite radical! For example, the 909 bass drum sample I converted was quite distorted (the original is normalized at -0.3 dB). On the other hand, when I sampled it manually it sounded really good. Also, converting hi hat samples with EMXP added a lot of low frequencies that are not present in the original. Again, manually sampling them gave better results. > > Do you know if the .wav files I want to convert with EMXP should have some headroom for better results? > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@> wrote: > > > > In fact EMXP never allows samplerates higher than 41667 Hz for Emax-1. > > I wanted to be sure that the banks would be compatible with all Emax-1 samplers. > > > > The maximum samplerate at which Emax-1 can sample is 41667 Hz (Emax-II even only 39 kHz) > > As far as I know the option to change the samplerate to 44100 Hz on Emax (in the Digital Effects section) was only added for SE versions. I only have an SE and Plus version (which both support playback at 44100 Hz), so I couldn't test if non-SE versions are also able to playback samples at 44100 Hz. > > > > If someone can confirm that ALL emax-1 samplers support playback at 44.1 kHz, I might change EMXP. If not all Emax samplers are compatible, I could still add the 44100 Hz option in EMXP "on user's risk" :-) > > But... does anyone hear the difference between 41.7 and 44.1 kHz samples on the Emax ?? > > > > ///E-Synthesist > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > > > it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: bermudaben2006 > > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM > > > Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: > > > > > > Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.11/2232 - Release Date: 07/11/09 17:56:00 > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
2009-07-13 by Rei
The answer is very simple... Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the samplerate. EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with antialiasing/EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then.
2009-07-13 by Chip
another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample input using a decent preamp. --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "Rei" <vjrei@...> wrote:
> > The answer is very simple... > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the samplerate. > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with antialiasing/EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. >
2009-07-13 by bermudaben2006
I did some more testing with EMXP... The answer to my problem with distortion really has to do with headroom, not with the conversion algorithm or with Emax's 12bit sound! If you convert a sample that is normalized to 0 dB with EMXP it will be distorted after the conversion. If you want to be sure there is no distortion you need to normalize the files to -4 dB before converting them to Emax format. If anybody is interested in the results, I have some audio files and pictures demonstrating this with a 909 kick drum. Even so, there will still be a difference between a converted .wav file and a sample taken manually with Emax. This is only natural. Which one sounds better really depends on the sample and your taste. --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@...> wrote:
> > I did some tests myself today. > > The lower quality of the Emax samples is not caused by the lower samplerate, but by the 12-to-8 bit compression algorithm. > If you would convert the samplerate of a 44100Hz WAV to 41667Hz first with some audio tool, and then load this WAV into an Emax-1 bank with EMXP, the same "lower quality" would be audible. > I also loaded some 44100 Hz WAVs into an EMAX-II bank with EMXP, making sure it converts them to 41667 Hz. Result: the sound is top quality on the Emax-II with both samplerates. So the samplerate converter in EMXP is definitely not causing the difference. > > Of course you could ask me now the enhance the 12-to-8 bit compression algorithm in EMXP :-) > > But when I designed this algorithm a few years ago, I already noticed these quality issues on both the Emax and the Emulator II, especially with drum sounds (I used TR808 samples). > So I did some additional tests at that time: I checked the compression/decompression algorithms in SoundDesigner and they suffered from the same problem. > I also saved some "good" 16 bit banks on the Emax-II as "compressed 8 bit" Emax-I banks and loaded those on the Emax-I: the same distortion problems appeared. > So I concluded that my algorithm was as good (as bad ?) as the ones used by Emu and Digidesign, and I left them as they were. > > The hardware compression on Emax-I during sampling is much better indeed. I guess there must be an explanation, but I'm not a hardware specialist. > > ///E-Synthesist > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > drum samples sound better at lower sample rates any way as they dont contain the whole frequency spectrum > > > > thats why hiphop producers prefer the 12bit sample sound and the emax is converted to 12bit so you get 4bits of data diference that means more stepping but it adds to the quality hence why people still buy the sp1200 which is an emax engine > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: bermudaben2006 > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 10:04 AM > > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, if you could take samples with Emax at both 42 and 44 KHz you probably wouldn't hear any difference. But converting 44.1 Khz samples is another thing, because any samle rate conversion results in a degradation of quality. > > > > I did some testing yesterday with drum samples that I either played back and sampled at 42 Khz or converted from 44 Khz to 42 Khz using EMXP, and the difference was quite radical! For example, the 909 bass drum sample I converted was quite distorted (the original is normalized at -0.3 dB). On the other hand, when I sampled it manually it sounded really good. Also, converting hi hat samples with EMXP added a lot of low frequencies that are not present in the original. Again, manually sampling them gave better results. > > > > Do you know if the .wav files I want to convert with EMXP should have some headroom for better results? > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@> wrote: > > > > > > In fact EMXP never allows samplerates higher than 41667 Hz for Emax-1. > > > I wanted to be sure that the banks would be compatible with all Emax-1 samplers. > > > > > > The maximum samplerate at which Emax-1 can sample is 41667 Hz (Emax-II even only 39 kHz) > > > As far as I know the option to change the samplerate to 44100 Hz on Emax (in the Digital Effects section) was only added for SE versions. I only have an SE and Plus version (which both support playback at 44100 Hz), so I couldn't test if non-SE versions are also able to playback samples at 44100 Hz. > > > > > > If someone can confirm that ALL emax-1 samplers support playback at 44.1 kHz, I might change EMXP. If not all Emax samplers are compatible, I could still add the 44100 Hz option in EMXP "on user's risk" :-) > > > But... does anyone hear the difference between 41.7 and 44.1 kHz samples on the Emax ?? > > > > > > ///E-Synthesist > > > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > > > > > it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: bermudaben2006 > > > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM > > > > Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: > > > > > > > > Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.11/2232 - Release Date: 07/11/09 17:56:00 > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >
2009-07-13 by jammie
the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old samplers
----- Original Message ----- From: Chip To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample input using a decent preamp. --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "Rei" <vjrei@...> wrote: > > The answer is very simple... > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the samplerate. > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with antialiasing/EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by Brooks Mosher
so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the machine. to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the Emax default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed out data of 512 ram)? thanks Brooks On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@...>wrote: > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > samplers > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Chip > To: emax@yahoogroups.com <emax%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample > input using a decent preamp. > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com <emax%40yahoogroups.com>, "Rei" <vjrei@...> > wrote: > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > samplerate. > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > antialiasing/EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by jammie
in sample dump you have to dump 1 sample at a time it takes the sample 16 bits and transmits it at 12 bits i find the 27khz sample rate to be good for drum sounds thats what i sample them at in my sp1200 and my eps/eps16+ they get a good grainy sound which adds to that old hiphop sound thats what gives the snares that that rasp a snare sample will take about 4 seconds to dump to a sample location
----- Original Message ----- From: Brooks Mosher To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 5:55 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the machine. to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the Emax default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed out data of 512 ram)? thanks Brooks On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@...>wrote: > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > samplers > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Chip > To: emax@yahoogroups.com <emax%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample > input using a decent preamp. > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com <emax%40yahoogroups.com>, "Rei" <vjrei@...> > wrote: > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > samplerate. > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > antialiasing/EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by Elk Latham
Sample dumps over the RS422 port is my preferred method. ________________________________
From: jammie <jammie.emma@...> To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:02:15 AM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP in sample dump you have to dump 1 sample at a time it takes the sample 16 bits and transmits it at 12 bits i find the 27khz sample rate to be good for drum sounds thats what i sample them at in my sp1200 and my eps/eps16+ they get a good grainy sound which adds to that old hiphop sound thats what gives the snares that that rasp a snare sample will take about 4 seconds to dump to a sample location ----- Original Message ----- From: Brooks Mosher To: emax@yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 5:55 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the machine. to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the Emax default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed out data of 512 ram)? thanks Brooks On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk>wrote: > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > samplers > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Chip > To: emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample > input using a decent preamp. > > --- In emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com>, "Rei" <vjrei@...> > wrote: > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > samplerate. > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > antialiasing/ EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by jammie
thats only good if you have the old mac setup not good for pc and i like to make up my own samples and not use other peoples sd2 bank files
----- Original Message ----- From: Elk Latham To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 6:27 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP Sample dumps over the RS422 port is my preferred method. ________________________________ From: jammie <jammie.emma@...> To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:02:15 AM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP in sample dump you have to dump 1 sample at a time it takes the sample 16 bits and transmits it at 12 bits i find the 27khz sample rate to be good for drum sounds thats what i sample them at in my sp1200 and my eps/eps16+ they get a good grainy sound which adds to that old hiphop sound thats what gives the snares that that rasp a snare sample will take about 4 seconds to dump to a sample location ----- Original Message ----- From: Brooks Mosher To: emax@yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 5:55 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the machine. to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the Emax default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed out data of 512 ram)? thanks Brooks On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk>wrote: > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > samplers > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Chip > To: emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample > input using a decent preamp. > > --- In emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com>, "Rei" <vjrei@...> > wrote: > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > samplerate. > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > antialiasing/ EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by Elk Latham
Your right about not being good for PC users. If you’re an Alchemy user on a mac you’re not limited to using sd2 files. I make all my samples as well.. ________________________________
From: jammie <jammie.emma@...> To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 11:56:43 AM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP thats only good if you have the old mac setup not good for pc and i like to make up my own samples and not use other peoples sd2 bank files ----- Original Message ----- From: Elk Latham To: emax@yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 6:27 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP Sample dumps over the RS422 port is my preferred method. ____________ _________ _________ __ From: jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk> To: emax@yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:02:15 AM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP in sample dump you have to dump 1 sample at a time it takes the sample 16 bits and transmits it at 12 bits i find the 27khz sample rate to be good for drum sounds thats what i sample them at in my sp1200 and my eps/eps16+ they get a good grainy sound which adds to that old hiphop sound thats what gives the snares that that rasp a snare sample will take about 4 seconds to dump to a sample location ----- Original Message ----- From: Brooks Mosher To: emax@yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 5:55 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the machine. to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the Emax default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed out data of 512 ram)? thanks Brooks On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk>wrote: > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > samplers > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Chip > To: emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample > input using a decent preamp. > > --- In emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com>, "Rei" <vjrei@...> > wrote: > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > samplerate. > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > antialiasing/ EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by Brooks Mosher
just curious, is RS422 better than MIDI for transferring sample files? On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 2:09 PM, Elk Latham <elk_latham@...>wrote: > > > Your right about not being good for PC users. > If you�re an Alchemy user on a mac you�re not limited to using sd2 files. > I make all my samples as well.. > > > ________________________________ > From: jammie <jammie.emma@...<jammie.emma%40blueyonder.co.uk> > > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com <emax%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 11:56:43 AM > > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > thats only good if you have the old mac setup not good for pc and i like to > make up my own samples and not use other peoples sd2 bank files > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Elk Latham > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 6:27 PM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > Sample dumps over the RS422 port is my preferred method. > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk> > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:02:15 AM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > in sample dump you have to dump 1 sample at a time it takes the sample 16 > bits and transmits it at 12 bits i find the 27khz sample rate to be good for > drum sounds thats what i sample them at in my sp1200 and my eps/eps16+ they > get a good grainy sound which adds to that old hiphop sound thats what gives > the snares that that rasp a snare sample will take about > > 4 seconds to dump to a sample location > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Brooks Mosher > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 5:55 PM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound > quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've > never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the > machine. > > to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the Emax > default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed > out data of 512 ram)? > > thanks > > Brooks > > On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk > >wrote: > > > > > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > > samplers > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Chip > > To: emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com> > > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's > sample > > input using a decent preamp. > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com>, "Rei" <vjrei@ > ...> > > wrote: > > > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like > when > > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > > samplerate. > > > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > > antialiasing/ EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back > then. > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 > 05:56:00 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 > 05:56:00 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by jammie
not better just faster a lot faster but not as fast as scsi but the emax does not respond to smdi any way so rs port is the fastes
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brooks Mosher" <brooksmosher@...> To: <emax@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 8:14 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP just curious, is RS422 better than MIDI for transferring sample files? On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 2:09 PM, Elk Latham <elk_latham@...>wrote: > > > Your right about not being good for PC users. > If you're an Alchemy user on a mac you're not limited to using sd2 files. > I make all my samples as well.. > > > ________________________________ > From: jammie <jammie.emma@...<jammie.emma%40blueyonder.co.uk> > > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com <emax%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 11:56:43 AM > > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > thats only good if you have the old mac setup not good for pc and i like > to > make up my own samples and not use other peoples sd2 bank files > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Elk Latham > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 6:27 PM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > Sample dumps over the RS422 port is my preferred method. > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk> > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:02:15 AM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > in sample dump you have to dump 1 sample at a time it takes the sample 16 > bits and transmits it at 12 bits i find the 27khz sample rate to be good > for > drum sounds thats what i sample them at in my sp1200 and my eps/eps16+ > they > get a good grainy sound which adds to that old hiphop sound thats what > gives > the snares that that rasp a snare sample will take about > > 4 seconds to dump to a sample location > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Brooks Mosher > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 5:55 PM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound > quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've > never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the > machine. > > to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the > Emax > default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed > out data of 512 ram)? > > thanks > > Brooks > > On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk > >wrote: > > > > > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > > samplers > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Chip > > To: emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com> > > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's > sample > > input using a decent preamp. > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com>, "Rei" <vjrei@ > ...> > > wrote: > > > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like > when > > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > > samplerate. > > > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > > antialiasing/ EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back > then. > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 > 05:56:00 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 > 05:56:00 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ Emax and Emax II User's Group Website http://www.silveriafamily.comYahoo! Groups Links -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00
2009-07-13 by Elk Latham
There's also a certain stability to it like SCSI.. ________________________________
From: jammie <jammie.emma@...> To: emax@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 12:18:08 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP not better just faster a lot faster but not as fast as scsi but the emax does not respond to smdi any way so rs port is the fastes ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brooks Mosher" <brooksmosher@ gmail.com> To: <emax@yahoogroups. com> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 8:14 PM Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP just curious, is RS422 better than MIDI for transferring sample files? On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 2:09 PM, Elk Latham <elk_latham@sbcgloba l.net>wrote: > > > Your right about not being good for PC users. > If you're an Alchemy user on a mac you're not limited to using sd2 files. > I make all my samples as well.. > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk<jammie.emma% 40blueyonder. co.uk> > > > To: emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com> > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 11:56:43 AM > > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > thats only good if you have the old mac setup not good for pc and i like > to > make up my own samples and not use other peoples sd2 bank files > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Elk Latham > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 6:27 PM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > Sample dumps over the RS422 port is my preferred method. > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk> > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:02:15 AM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > in sample dump you have to dump 1 sample at a time it takes the sample 16 > bits and transmits it at 12 bits i find the 27khz sample rate to be good > for > drum sounds thats what i sample them at in my sp1200 and my eps/eps16+ > they > get a good grainy sound which adds to that old hiphop sound thats what > gives > the snares that that rasp a snare sample will take about > > 4 seconds to dump to a sample location > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Brooks Mosher > To: emax@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 5:55 PM > Subject: Re: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > so from what i'm reading, EMXP isn't going to give us the best sound > quality? i've never had any distortion problems using it myself, but i've > never done tests to compare using EMXP to manually sampling into the > machine. > > to use midi sample dump, do i need to set the sample rate to match the > Emax > default? how long does a midi sample dump take for a full bank (or maxed > out data of 512 ram)? > > thanks > > Brooks > > On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM, jammie <jammie.emma@ blueyonder. co.uk > >wrote: > > > > > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi > > sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old > > samplers > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Chip > > To: emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com> > > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's > sample > > input using a decent preamp. > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups. com <emax%40yahoogroups .com>, "Rei" <vjrei@ > ...> > > wrote: > > > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like > when > > you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of > > headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you > > import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean > > anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that > > gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the > > samplerate. > > > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with > > antialiasing/ EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they > > really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back > then. > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 > 05:56:00 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 > 05:56:00 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------ --------- --------- ------ Emax and Emax II User's Group Website http://www.silveriafamily.comYahoo! Groups Links ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/13/09 05:56:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-07-13 by esynthesist
This could be true.
The conversion algorithm is quite sensitive to the level of the sound amplitude. When I designed it I thought I had made sure that even the maximum input sound level was supported but maybe I should revisit the code.
Could you send the 0DB and -4DB WAV files to my yahoo account ?
Note that the EMXP algorithm was based on tests I did with the Emax-II converter ("save as 8 bit"). But I have Alchemy now so I will do some additional tests with Alchemy via RS422, because in that case I will be looking at the actual Emu conversion algorithm as it has been built into the Emax-I OS instead of the one in the Emax-II OS. Although I can hardly believe that Emu used a different algorithm in the Emax-II. Mmmm... most probably I have to finetune my algorithm a little bit to make it even more comparable to the Emu one.
///E-Synthesist
--- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "bermudaben2006" <bermudaben2006@...> wrote:> > I did some more testing with EMXP... > > The answer to my problem with distortion really has to do with headroom, not with the conversion algorithm or with Emax's 12bit sound! > > If you convert a sample that is normalized to 0 dB with EMXP it will be distorted after the conversion. If you want to be sure there is no distortion you need to normalize the files to -4 dB before converting them to Emax format. > > If anybody is interested in the results, I have some audio files and pictures demonstrating this with a 909 kick drum. > > Even so, there will still be a difference between a converted .wav file and a sample taken manually with Emax. This is only natural. Which one sounds better really depends on the sample and your taste. > > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@> wrote: > > > > I did some tests myself today. > > > > The lower quality of the Emax samples is not caused by the lower samplerate, but by the 12-to-8 bit compression algorithm. > > If you would convert the samplerate of a 44100Hz WAV to 41667Hz first with some audio tool, and then load this WAV into an Emax-1 bank with EMXP, the same "lower quality" would be audible. > > I also loaded some 44100 Hz WAVs into an EMAX-II bank with EMXP, making sure it converts them to 41667 Hz. Result: the sound is top quality on the Emax-II with both samplerates. So the samplerate converter in EMXP is definitely not causing the difference. > > > > Of course you could ask me now the enhance the 12-to-8 bit compression algorithm in EMXP :-) > > > > But when I designed this algorithm a few years ago, I already noticed these quality issues on both the Emax and the Emulator II, especially with drum sounds (I used TR808 samples). > > So I did some additional tests at that time: I checked the compression/decompression algorithms in SoundDesigner and they suffered from the same problem. > > I also saved some "good" 16 bit banks on the Emax-II as "compressed 8 bit" Emax-I banks and loaded those on the Emax-I: the same distortion problems appeared. > > So I concluded that my algorithm was as good (as bad ?) as the ones used by Emu and Digidesign, and I left them as they were. > > > > The hardware compression on Emax-I during sampling is much better indeed. I guess there must be an explanation, but I'm not a hardware specialist. > > > > ///E-Synthesist > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > > > drum samples sound better at lower sample rates any way as they dont contain the whole frequency spectrum > > > > > > thats why hiphop producers prefer the 12bit sample sound and the emax is converted to 12bit so you get 4bits of data diference that means more stepping but it adds to the quality hence why people still buy the sp1200 which is an emax engine > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: bermudaben2006 > > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 10:04 AM > > > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, if you could take samples with Emax at both 42 and 44 KHz you probably wouldn't hear any difference. But converting 44.1 Khz samples is another thing, because any samle rate conversion results in a degradation of quality. > > > > > > I did some testing yesterday with drum samples that I either played back and sampled at 42 Khz or converted from 44 Khz to 42 Khz using EMXP, and the difference was quite radical! For example, the 909 bass drum sample I converted was quite distorted (the original is normalized at -0.3 dB). On the other hand, when I sampled it manually it sounded really good. Also, converting hi hat samples with EMXP added a lot of low frequencies that are not present in the original. Again, manually sampling them gave better results. > > > > > > Do you know if the .wav files I want to convert with EMXP should have some headroom for better results? > > > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@> wrote: > > > > > > > > In fact EMXP never allows samplerates higher than 41667 Hz for Emax-1. > > > > I wanted to be sure that the banks would be compatible with all Emax-1 samplers. > > > > > > > > The maximum samplerate at which Emax-1 can sample is 41667 Hz (Emax-II even only 39 kHz) > > > > As far as I know the option to change the samplerate to 44100 Hz on Emax (in the Digital Effects section) was only added for SE versions. I only have an SE and Plus version (which both support playback at 44100 Hz), so I couldn't test if non-SE versions are also able to playback samples at 44100 Hz. > > > > > > > > If someone can confirm that ALL emax-1 samplers support playback at 44.1 kHz, I might change EMXP. If not all Emax samplers are compatible, I could still add the 44100 Hz option in EMXP "on user's risk" :-) > > > > But... does anyone hear the difference between 41.7 and 44.1 kHz samples on the Emax ?? > > > > > > > > ///E-Synthesist > > > > > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: bermudaben2006 > > > > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM > > > > > Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: > > > > > > > > > > Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > > > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.11/2232 - Release Date: 07/11/09 17:56:00 > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > >
2009-07-13 by bermudaben2006
Has anyone ever compared the sound quality of EMXP and midi dump? As I said earlier, I think sound quality of files converted with EMXP is perfectly ok if you leave enough headroom before conversion. I have never used Midi dump though. --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@...> wrote:
> > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old samplers > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Chip > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample input using a decent preamp. > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "Rei" <vjrei@> wrote: > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the samplerate. > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with antialiasing/EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
2009-07-15 by esynthesist
I just made some comparisons based on your bass drum WAV files. In a first test I have sent the 0DB and -4DB WAV file via MIDI DUMP to the Emax, using Alchemy on Mac. --> Result: there is no distortion in the samples on Emax, but imho the result doesn't sound at all like the original WAVs. The samples on the Emax have quite a low volume (no real problem) but also some annoying high pitch in them and they sound dull. In a second test I have created an Emax bank with EMXP. --> Result: there is a clear distortion on the 0DB sample, but the -4DB sample sounds very good and is almost identical to the original WAV file (or to the EMAX-II version of this sample). Of course the distortion of the first sample is not OK, so I will check EMXP's conversion algorithm. It's clearly a problem of amplitude level because the distortion is caused by clipping. So I'll have to check the normalization level in my algorithm. Maybe I will include an updated version of this algorithm in the next EMXP v2.07 (aka the "SoundFont2 release") which I hope to launch as a BETA version within the next 2 weeks. ///E-Synthesist --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "bermudaben2006" <bermudaben2006@...> wrote:
> > Has anyone ever compared the sound quality of EMXP and midi dump? As I said earlier, I think sound quality of files converted with EMXP is perfectly ok if you leave enough headroom before conversion. I have never used Midi dump though. > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > the best way to get a good quality sound into the emax is through midi sample dump i use dissidants sample wrench as it works with all the old samplers > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Chip > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:13 AM > > Subject: [emax] Re: Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > another significat factor is the AD 12 bit conversor > > > > sometimes you get better results sampling a sound directly to emax's sample input using a decent preamp. > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "Rei" <vjrei@> wrote: > > > > > > The answer is very simple... > > > > > > Algoritms. Emu software is meant to work with Emu hardware. Is like when you buy an iPod or any other music device, if you use some other kind of headphones the sound is gonna be way different, usually bad. > > > > > > The OS of each Emu sampler is calibrated for its own hardware, if you import an audio file only with the correct sample rate that doesn't mean anything, you are missing the antialiasing filter, that is the one that gives the texture and the quality to the actual sample other than the samplerate. > > > > > > EMXP is only downgrading the sample rate but is not resampli with antialiasing/EQ or compression. That is what gives Emu its sound, they really did an amazing job suking the sounds out of the technology back then. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >
2009-08-13 by esynthesist
Update: I have checked the Emax 8 bit compression algorithm in EMXP and applied some changes - there was indeed something wrong in the algorithm. It should be OK now; I did some tests with your test WAV files and also with some factory Emax-II banks which I translated to Emax-I with EMXP and everything sounds "cristal clear" now. The new compression algorithm is implemented in version 2.06.3 and also in the new beta version 2.07.beta.2 which supports SoundFont2. (available in files section or http://users.skynet.be/emxp) I hope it's OK now. ///E-Synthesist --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "bermudaben2006" <bermudaben2006@...> wrote:
> > Well, if you could take samples with Emax at both 42 and 44 KHz you probably wouldn't hear any difference. But converting 44.1 Khz samples is another thing, because any samle rate conversion results in a degradation of quality. > > I did some testing yesterday with drum samples that I either played back and sampled at 42 Khz or converted from 44 Khz to 42 Khz using EMXP, and the difference was quite radical! For example, the 909 bass drum sample I converted was quite distorted (the original is normalized at -0.3 dB). On the other hand, when I sampled it manually it sounded really good. Also, converting hi hat samples with EMXP added a lot of low frequencies that are not present in the original. Again, manually sampling them gave better results. > > Do you know if the .wav files I want to convert with EMXP should have some headroom for better results? > > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "esynthesist" <esynthesist@> wrote: > > > > In fact EMXP never allows samplerates higher than 41667 Hz for Emax-1. > > I wanted to be sure that the banks would be compatible with all Emax-1 samplers. > > > > The maximum samplerate at which Emax-1 can sample is 41667 Hz (Emax-II even only 39 kHz) > > As far as I know the option to change the samplerate to 44100 Hz on Emax (in the Digital Effects section) was only added for SE versions. I only have an SE and Plus version (which both support playback at 44100 Hz), so I couldn't test if non-SE versions are also able to playback samples at 44100 Hz. > > > > If someone can confirm that ALL emax-1 samplers support playback at 44.1 kHz, I might change EMXP. If not all Emax samplers are compatible, I could still add the 44100 Hz option in EMXP "on user's risk" :-) > > But... does anyone hear the difference between 41.7 and 44.1 kHz samples on the Emax ?? > > > > ///E-Synthesist > > > > --- In emax@yahoogroups.com, "jammie" <jammie.emma@> wrote: > > > > > > it might be that to get all samples to fit in the emaxs memory that a bit of sample rate is lowered > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: bermudaben2006 > > > To: emax@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:46 PM > > > Subject: [emax] Converting wav files to Emax samples using EMXP > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a question for esynthesist or anyone who uses his software: > > > > > > Why does EMXP convert my 44.1 KHz wav files to 41.7 Khz Emax samples, given that Emax supports sample rates of up to 44.1 Khz? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.10/2231 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > >