The Logic Off Topic list

The Nazi dream involved rapid occupations, as in France, repeated again and again around the world; the terrorist dream involves the smoking rubble of lower Manhattan, repeated again and again around the world. 

To avoid such a calamity, a vigorous global strategy hardly constitutes an overreaction, and our very survival may depend on it. The barbarians threatening Rome proved too numerous and persistent to eliminate, partially because ancient military technology limited the ability of even the world's dominant power to strike enemies who lurked beyond the gates of Empire. 

By contrast, the barbarian bands arrayed against us remain small in number, and our ability to project deadly force against them knows few physical bounds. Their only advantage involves the deadly dedication they bring to their evil project. 

As former Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says: 'The terrorists today have the will to destroy us, but they don't have the power. We DO have the power to eradicate them!!

Then...there's the three dollar bill assumption:

"This is my message to the Haters: "Black, Red, Yellow, or White, we don't
have to fight, we can Unite,"  you can hear the song we wrote (once you join
the site, which is free and you don't get spammed..."

spoken like a true Hip Hopper that would rather rap the night away rather than stand up to people and organizations that are intent on wiping out Western Civilization. Slumber on, insignificant "peacenicks". The Lucifer trigger-lock is well-oiled.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> From: "Mike Cover" <vista500@...>
> 
> Then...there's the three dollar bill assumption:
> 
> "This is my message to the Haters: "Black, Red, Yellow, or White, we don't
> have to fight, we can Unite,"  you can hear the song we wrote (once you join
> the site, which is free and you don't get spammed..."
> 
> spoken like a true Hip Hopper that would rather rap the night away rather than
> stand up to people and organizations that are intent on wiping out Western
> Civilization. Slumber on, insignificant "peacenicks". The Lucifer trigger-lock
> is well-oiled.

You know, Mike, you're one of those people that Frank Zappa was thinking
about when he wrote "Dumb All Over (a little Ugly on the Side)".  Get a copy
and listen to it.

dumb, misinformed, ignorant, shell-shocked, bitter, abused, confused, or none
of the above, whatever.  he makes as strong a statement as the most well-versed
on this list could possibly elucidate in concept, and i am glad he is here.  he
serves as juxtaposition.  this list is as the world we live in, full of hope and
dejection, love and fear, joy and anger.  we are an unusual species, to say the
least, capable of so much energy, whether it be full of love or fear.  in the
end, this is what i have picked up from these times, along with the addition that
now that energy must manifest.  if bin laden, or for that matter, mr. cover,
makes you apprehensious, be the opposite.  let that be the opposition.
    we have all argued too long.  as it has always been, there is a greater
balance.  if there are now individuals whose place in the world is to manifest
the highest form of fear (terror-ist), then it must also be time for those among
us to manifest the highest form of love and truth.  these are tumultuous times,
but be not afraid.  i thank all of you for having addressed your truths as you
saw them, regardless of the means.  these times and ongoing discussions have made
me remember things about us all, and i have tempered my truths accordingly.  have
the courage to follow your convictions, and have faith that all is as it must be.
remain in awe; these are both awesome and awful times.  blessed peace to you all.

be well,
    /adri@no:

----- Original Message -----
From: "marc lindahl" <marc@...>
To: <logic-ot@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, September 28, 2001 12:29 AM
Subject: Re: [L-OT] My Private letter to Conscientious Objectors...


>
>
> > From: "Mike Cover" <vista500@...>
> >
> > Then...there's the three dollar bill assumption:
> >
> > "This is my message to the Haters: "Black, Red, Yellow, or White, we don't
> > have to fight, we can Unite,"  you can hear the song we wrote (once you join
> > the site, which is free and you don't get spammed..."
> >
> > spoken like a true Hip Hopper that would rather rap the night away rather
than
> > stand up to people and organizations that are intent on wiping out Western
> > Civilization. Slumber on, insignificant "peacenicks". The Lucifer
trigger-lock

> > is well-oiled.
>
> You know, Mike, you're one of those people that Frank Zappa was thinking
> about when he wrote "Dumb All Over (a little Ugly on the Side)".  Get a copy
> and listen to it.
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

> From: "adri@no:" <onlyadriano@...>
> 
> dumb, misinformed, ignorant, shell-shocked, bitter, abused, confused, or none
> of the above, whatever.

Listen to the damn song, don't just read the title!

This is kind of a rude message, isn't it? I don't know the Zappa song, and 
I'm no big fan of Zappa. But it doesn't sound too flattering. You know, there 
are two opposite urges in humans, to make peace, and to make war. You see 
that in Israel with the Peace Now movement and the Likud. You saw it in the 
US during the Vietnam war when students were protesting at every campus, and 
the older generation was supporting the war. While peace is nice and 
wonderful, there are times when violence is necessary. If people didn't fight 
back, Europe would be speaking German, Asia Japanese, or Korea would be 
communist. Most people on this list are creative people and usually sensitive 
and liberal which are good traits. However, there is a certain element of 
brute force, that needs to protect our societies so that we can have the 
freedom to spend our lives pursuing art and music. In harsh times of war and 
famine or other emergency, the arts are the first thing to go out the window. 
So before you condemn all war and violence, remember that its the threat of 
violence that brings peace. The weak are preyed upon, and only the strong 
remain independent.

>> spoken like a true Hip Hopper that would rather rap the night away rather
>than
>> stand up to people and organizations that are intent on wiping out Western
>> Civilization. Slumber on, insignificant "peacenicks". The Lucifer 
trigger-lock

>> is well-oiled.
>
>You know, Mike, you're one of those people that Frank Zappa was thinking
>about when he wrote "Dumb All Over (a little Ugly on the Side)".  Get a
>copy
>and listen to it.

> From: GAmoore@...
> 
> This is kind of a rude message, isn't it? I don't know the Zappa song, and
> I'm no big fan of Zappa. But it doesn't sound too flattering.

See, that's the thing.  You don't know the song, you didn't go listen to it,
yet you make a value judgement anyhow.  Stop, rewind, and go listen to the
song.  Don't just read the lyrics, listen to the song.  Only then, make a
comment.

Sorry, but I hate Zappa and don't own anything he did - except that 
Talking Heads Psycho Chicken remake or whatever. However, the title of 
the song seems to suggest your message. If I say go listen to the song 
"Go Your Screw Yourself" do you really need to listen to it to get the 
probably intent of the message to be conveyed? May I suggest you just 
make your comment in plain English rather than turning it into a research 
exercise. Then we can know whether we agree with you or disagree. There 
are no shortage of people ready to speak their mind frankly on this list, 
you don't need to be shy about it.

>> This is kind of a rude message, isn't it? I don't know the Zappa song, and
>> I'm no big fan of Zappa. But it doesn't sound too flattering.
>
>See, that's the thing.  You don't know the song, you didn't go listen to it,
>yet you make a value judgement anyhow.  Stop, rewind, and go listen to the
>song.  Don't just read the lyrics, listen to the song.  Only then, make a
>comment.