The Logic Off Topic list

>
>
>> I have long since, never trusted Norton...But that is old story from
>> the days of lore.
>>
>> Peace,
>> Alexis
>
dubno wrote:
>
> I have used Norton Utilities for about 6 years, and have found it to 
> be an
> invaluable resource.  While I can't speak for OS X, I would never even 
> think
> of running an OS 9 or lower mac without it!
>
>

I've run OS9 without it for some time. There is not much need for any 
of it's components anymore, except disk doctor, and other utilities 
perform better in that department anyway. [disk first aid as a first 
option, and DiskWarrior if you really need some heavy-duty fixing]

Dave Eager

>>> I have long since, never trusted Norton...But that is old story from
>>> the days of lore.
>>>
>>> Peace,
>>> Alexis
>>
> dubno wrote:
>>
>> I have used Norton Utilities for about 6 years, and have found it to
>> be an
>> invaluable resource.  While I can't speak for OS X, I would never even
>> think
>> of running an OS 9 or lower mac without it!

I can speak, since there are a lot of people who were running this 
stuff.  I told them hey, "Instead of bitching about how fucked up OSX 
Jag is, take a look at what you are running, cause I am fine!"  I 
proceeded to tell some people to list what they were running...sure 
enough most were running Norton.  Just because it says on the BOX, made 
for OSX 10.2, does not mean it is reliable.  That goes for any system.  
Now, many years ago, Norton team had to learn an invaluable 
lesson...but I am guessing now, they have learn new ones.  Because 
people are blaming Jag, when they should be blaming all the third party 
crap they run.  Would you like me to tell you a lovely story about 
Norton?

DaveEager wrote:
> I've run OS9 without it for some time. There is not much need for any
> of it's components anymore, except disk doctor, and other utilities
> perform better in that department anyway. [disk first aid as a first
> option, and DiskWarrior if you really need some heavy-duty fixing]

As Dave here points out, I have been running without any software like 
this since MacOS 8.1.  Really, I actually stopped using Norton around 
OS 7.1.  But I stopped relying on utilities like this, I fully stopped 
around 8.1.

Now, I provided for those of you with information from a person who 
wrote actually wrote the Mac Bible...Read the information.  If you 
wanna hose your drive...then by all means, go for it.  But Norton is 
causing issues...not 10.2.

The idea of the community service announcement is to help you.  The 
opinion I left was to confirm my beliefs, yet again.  Sometimes these 
utilities cause more problems, then alleviate them.

 > This may not be your typical tip, but it may be very very useful to a
 > number of OS X users.
 >
 > A number of folks on OS X lists that I am on have traced the cause of
 > their (atypical for OS X) many kernel panics and freezes under OS X to
 > the installation of Norton or Norton System Works. The problems went
 > away when the Norton product was uninstalled.
 >
 > I've also now heard from three different people who say that running
 > Norton Disk Doctor under OS X hosed their disk. And a couple of
 >others have told me that they had similar trouble from running Norton
 >Anti-Virus.

 > So, at this point my recommendation is to uninstall any version of
 > Norton if you are having problems under OS X to see if that helps, and
 > to stay away from Norton if you are looking for a disk utility. 
Consider
 > Disk Warrior instead.
 >
 >
 > Randy B. Singer
 > Co-Author of: The Macintosh Bible (4th, 5th and 6th editions)

Peace,
Alexis

> >>> I have long since, never trusted Norton...But that is old story
> >>> from the days of lore.
> >>> Peace,
> >>> Alexis

I'm with Alexis on this one. In my experience over 10 years of Mac
use, I've seen systems that have been totally f**ked up by the use of
Norton Filesaver, Disk Doctor (especially), Antivirus (tip: just stop
using MS Outlook, and turn CDROM autoplay off), Systemworks, etc, on
more than one occasion. The same goes for Conflict Catcher (gah). 

The utilities I am prepared to vouch for (in OS9):

Apple Drive Setup (for formatting)
Apple Disk First Aid (first port of call)
DiskWarrior 
TechTool Pro

In OSX, I have had no need of anything like that, and I suspect that
3rd-party vendors of such tools who allege OSX-support are simply
dreaming - Unix is a whole new reality for them.

-------------

John Pitcairn

Got midi fader/knob hardware? Try the Fadermapper demo:
http://www.revolver.co.nz/fadermapper/

On Wednesday, October 2, 2002, at 05:00 AM, John Pitcairn wrote:
\
> Norton Filesaver, Disk Doctor (especially), Antivirus (tip: just stop
> using MS Outlook, and turn CDROM autoplay off), Systemworks, etc, on
> more than one occasion. The same goes for Conflict Catcher (gah).

same experience here

I very much like Diskwarrior

Now using plus optimizer for defrag

For extensions - duh... extensions manager.  You can avoid having a ton 
of third party extension if you clean install OS upgrades - drag needed 
extensions into the new system folder. No need for CC or any other 
startup product.

for virus - there is not a lot to worry about - turn off autoplay in QT 
(this may have been fixed. Do NOT use MS internet product - lots of 
holes there. I could be wrong but I don't think that it is even 
possible to remote hack OS9.

That said, I am not sure of the situation in OSX - Apple is pretty much 
on the ball with security updates - checking in with their updater 
periodically does the job.

  Diskwarrior works fine but needs to be booted from OS9. Extension 
problems are obsolete.

On Wednesday, October 2, 2002, at 07:53 PM, mercutio wrote:

> for virus - there is not a lot to worry about - turn off autoplay in QT
> (this may have been fixed. Do NOT use MS internet product - lots of
> holes there. I could be wrong but I don't think that it is even
> possible to remote hack OS9.

I must also add, that any virus you'll probably run into on MacOS  [not 
OSX] is probably a variant on 7dust or the Autostart worm. Both of 
which can be taken care of by a freeware utility called 'agax'

Dave Eager