Emu XL-7 & MP-7 User's Group

inspired by the "what modes do you use" thread: what are you favorite 
features and how do you use them?

i'll start...

* mute-hold - great for maintaining the same parts while changing 
patterns. of course this requires that different patterns use the same (or 
similar) parts per track.

* cords. i've been doing stuff with the cords that i have a hard time 
believing. think one step out of the box and what seems like a ROMpler 
turns into a "real" synth. now take another step ;) demo-videos soon...?

* i wish there was an "undo" feature, but there isn't. so i always copy 
tracks and make edits (eg quantize) on the copy. this way i can revert to 
the original if things don't work out.


-- 
         ...atom

  ________________________
  http://atom.smasher.org/
  762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
  -------------------------------------------------

 	"Microsoft shouldn't be broken up. It should be shut down."
 		-- Bruce Schneier, 15 May 2000

I like to use repeat for drum fills and rolls do it first on 8th then 16th then 32nd and intersperse it layered on the same snare or hat drum sound
I like to use knob and pitch automation to make patterns weird
I like to use pan automation
I just have the sequencer record knob turns.
I like using MIDI reroute to route stuff to external modules.
I like using quantize with weird shuffle like 65% on ethnic drums for shuffley tribal rythms while keeping a non shuffley rhythm quantized in another track to switch back and fourth to change it up.

I make arpeggiated spacey hip hop.

Things I want to learn how to do:
Cords... I know there's juicy stuff in here.
Route arpeggiator controls to knob and touch strip for automagic scaled solos
Chaining patterns like scenes in Another Sequencer
How program change works and sysex works to make control of other modules easier
How eloader works
multisetups
tuning tables

On Fri, 4 Feb 2011, Matt wrote:

> Things I want to learn how to do: Cords... I know there's juicy stuff in 
> here.
=============

start by googling for tutorials on modular synthesizers.

challenge: make some different types of patches (eg strings, pads, 
percussion, leads) using only single-cycle samples (eg sine, square, 
triangle, sawtooth) and cords.


> multisetups
===============

so far i've thought of two (untested) uses for multi-setups that i might 
have a use for...

  1) different multi-setups can have different assignments for the trigger 
buttons.
  2) for convenience while writing, turn on "channel re-assign". for power 
while playing turn it off and use a PC1600x to send CCs on multiple 
channels at the same time. the channel re-assign setting is stored with a 
multi-setup.


-- 
         ...atom

  ________________________
  http://atom.smasher.org/
  762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
  -------------------------------------------------

 	"Aerial bombardment is never proportionate, measured or
 	 targeted. It evolves a logic of its own, an escalation
 	 of horror similar to that unleashed by the terrorist.
 	 Like all distant and indiscriminate violence, it breeds
 	 a violent response. It is the dumbest weapon of war."
 		-- Simon Jenkins
 		They Opted to Bomb - It Had Better Work

I like all the features of OS2, 'specially:

-Grid record knob input - particularly great for hihats.
-First note record, explode tracks - for direct multichannel midi recording.
-Scale/shift note start times - for bring e.g. snares forward or back. Can get interesting. Also like the swing. Bummer there's no undo, and the truncation is annoying at best.

Not forgetting X-mix, replace record, the quick erase feature and mute hold.

Took a while to get my head around multisetups. Using the same multi for different purposes is fraught with problems. It helps me to assign one multi to a group of 8 patterns as the basis for a composition. Switching multi can be done automatically at the start of a new pattern.  From the Tips document:

>>Recalling Multisetups From Within a Pattern or Song.

>>In pattern edit go to Event and enter program change data and Bank 
>>select change data. For Multisetups : MSB=80, LSB=00 and then the 
>>Program change = the Multisetup number. 

>>You have to make sure that program change is enabled for that 
>>particular midi channel and you have to set the Track Destination 
>>"Both".

>>- HonkeyHindu

As you point out, the pattern quick triggers are saved with a multisetup. If yout think about it, using the tip above you could, say, assign the first 8 buttons to patterns within the same composition (i.e using the same multi) and the second row of buttons to jump to other compositions with their own multis. Massive potential. Must explore this more.

Cords have been a PITA to get to grips with, even with Proteum. I'm Ok now with the standard cords, but the clock / modulation processors are largely unexplored. Video tuts would be welcome! Could possible do one myself.



--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Atom Smasher <atom@...> wrote:

>
> inspired by the "what modes do you use" thread: what are you favorite 
> features and how do you use them?
> 
> i'll start...
> 
> * mute-hold - great for maintaining the same parts while changing 
> patterns. of course this requires that different patterns use the same (or 
> similar) parts per track.
> 
> * cords. i've been doing stuff with the cords that i have a hard time 
> believing. think one step out of the box and what seems like a ROMpler 
> turns into a "real" synth. now take another step ;) demo-videos soon...?
> 
> * i wish there was an "undo" feature, but there isn't. so i always copy 
> tracks and make edits (eg quantize) on the copy. this way i can revert to 
> the original if things don't work out.
> 
> 
> -- 
>          ...atom
> 
>   ________________________
>   http://atom.smasher.org/
>   762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
>   -------------------------------------------------
> 
>  	"Microsoft shouldn't be broken up. It should be shut down."
>  		-- Bruce Schneier, 15 May 2000
>

On Fri, 4 Feb 2011, stimresp wrote:

> Switching multi can be done automatically at the start of a new pattern. 
> From the Tips document:
>
>>> Recalling Multisetups From Within a Pattern or Song.
>
>>> In pattern edit go to Event and enter program change data and Bank 
>>> select change data. For Multisetups : MSB=80, LSB=00 and then the 
>>> Program change = the Multisetup number.
>
>>> You have to make sure that program change is enabled for that 
>>> particular midi channel and you have to set the Track Destination 
>>> "Both".
>
>>> - HonkeyHindu
=========================

similar to programming a pattern to recall a multi, i've been wondering 
about this but haven't had a chance to experiment... can a pattern be 
programmed to call up a new pattern? let's say i've got pattern 1 running 
in a loop; then i switch to pattern 2 for a fill; can pattern 2 initiate 
pattern 3 to start, before pattern 2 loops? of course the alternative is 
to manually select pattern 3 before pattern 2 starts looping, but the 
option to automate this might be nice.

now that i'm thinking about it... i guess an alternative way to do this 
might be the "loop section"... using the example above, patterns 2 & 3 are 
combined into a single pattern; the first part of the pattern has the 
fill, then the 2nd part of the pattern loops. hhmmm.... can the "loop 
section" settings be saved with a pattern? if so, will a section of the 
pattern before the loop-start play before it starts looping the section? 
even if the loop-section has to be enabled manually (assuming the 
start/stop settings are saved) this could still conserve pattern memory... 
if it works...


-- 
         ...atom

  ________________________
  http://atom.smasher.org/
  762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
  -------------------------------------------------

 	"Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever.
 	 You might dodge successfully for a while, even for years, but
 	 sooner or later they were bound to get you."
 		-- George Orwell, "1984"

Nice ideas.

Page 91 of the manual:

Program Change Edit:
Program change numbers from 0-127, and on any bank number, can be
inserted, deleted or edited in this screen. If you do not select bank numbers(off), the program change will be sent to the currently selected bank.

In order to send programchanges to external  devices, the Track must be assigned to an "external" channel.

elsewhere:
Important Note: Program change messages are NOT transmitted externally
if the destination is set to Both.


So it's possible to place an event <anywhere> in a pattern that trigger midi events such as change multisetup AND program/bank changes on internal presets and external synths. Kind of like a master preset for an entire rig....mmmm, gotta test this.

I can't see a way to switch/queue patterns this way though, or to auto-enable section loop. Would be nice, though I think without the ability to jump between loop sections it would be way too laborious.  

Manually, maybe the Restart Pattern Fire Key which will RTZ or punch-in to a queued pattern, in combination with the shift key method for temporary loop regions? More control perhaps, but you'd need to be on your toes! It's probably easier to just combine a bit of everything with direct pattern access, which not only changes pattern, but the associated midi events, as above.

Cheers,
j

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Atom Smasher <atom@...> wrote:

>
> On Fri, 4 Feb 2011, stimresp wrote:
> 
> > Switching multi can be done automatically at the start of a new pattern. 
> > From the Tips document:
> >
> >>> Recalling Multisetups From Within a Pattern or Song.
> >
> >>> In pattern edit go to Event and enter program change data and Bank 
> >>> select change data. For Multisetups : MSB=80, LSB=00 and then the 
> >>> Program change = the Multisetup number.
> >
> >>> You have to make sure that program change is enabled for that 
> >>> particular midi channel and you have to set the Track Destination 
> >>> "Both".
> >
> >>> - HonkeyHindu
> =========================
> 
> similar to programming a pattern to recall a multi, i've been wondering 
> about this but haven't had a chance to experiment... can a pattern be 
> programmed to call up a new pattern? let's say i've got pattern 1 running 
> in a loop; then i switch to pattern 2 for a fill; can pattern 2 initiate 
> pattern 3 to start, before pattern 2 loops? of course the alternative is 
> to manually select pattern 3 before pattern 2 starts looping, but the 
> option to automate this might be nice.
> 
> now that i'm thinking about it... i guess an alternative way to do this 
> might be the "loop section"... using the example above, patterns 2 & 3 are 
> combined into a single pattern; the first part of the pattern has the 
> fill, then the 2nd part of the pattern loops. hhmmm.... can the "loop 
> section" settings be saved with a pattern? if so, will a section of the 
> pattern before the loop-start play before it starts looping the section? 
> even if the loop-section has to be enabled manually (assuming the 
> start/stop settings are saved) this could still conserve pattern memory... 
> if it works...
> 
> 
> -- 
>          ...atom
> 
>   ________________________
>   http://atom.smasher.org/
>   762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
>   -------------------------------------------------
> 
>  	"Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever.
>  	 You might dodge successfully for a while, even for years, but
>  	 sooner or later they were bound to get you."
>  		-- George Orwell, "1984"
>

On Sat, 5 Feb 2011, Atom Smasher wrote:

> now that i'm thinking about it... i guess an alternative way to do this 
> might be the "loop section"... using the example above, patterns 2 & 3 
> are combined into a single pattern; the first part of the pattern has 
> the fill, then the 2nd part of the pattern loops. hhmmm.... can the 
> "loop section" settings be saved with a pattern? if so, will a section 
> of the pattern before the loop-start play before it starts looping the 
> section? even if the loop-section has to be enabled manually (assuming 
> the start/stop settings are saved) this could still conserve pattern 
> memory... if it works...
==================

aacckk!!! as i suspected... "Loop Section is a temporary loop which is not 
saved with the pattern or multisetup. Loop Section defaults to 'off' upon 
pattern change.

i guess it can still be used if you're quick enough to assign loop points 
and start the loop, but it can't be saved with a pattern :(


-- 
         ...atom

  ________________________
  http://atom.smasher.org/
  762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
  -------------------------------------------------

 	"We must understand words mean things to different people.
 	 There's got to be a better way to communicate with ourselves."
 		-- George "dubya" Bush, 5 May 2006
 		http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/05/20060507-2.html

I was asking about this last week how to chain patterns like scenes in other daw.
You guys seem to be almost on it.

Don't be so disheartened :)

The loop points are loads of fun - esp. by using the shift-key method. It just takes a bit of practice....

Example: set-up an 5-bar pattern with a basic beat for 4 bars, and a fill on the 5th . Start the pattern and quickly select the loop start point - (Hold TAP and hit SELECT) - just get in the habit/timing of doing this at the start of the bar. When reaching the loop end (start of bar 4) Hold TAP and hit EDIT, the quickly and while still holding TAP, hit STOP. So you are now looping, but by continuing to hold TAP you can move the start and end points while the loop is still running. You can even extend the loop, by first turning it off, select the new loop end and quickly reactivate. Notice all the time you are holding TAP and pressing 1 of only 3 buttons. So, practice messing around within the first 4, bars, and whenever you want the fill on bar 5, just turn off the loop. Then reactivate when the pattern re-starts.

To go further you could construct a longer pattern, with various fills and breakdown, chorus, bridge, etc along the way, and use the the above method to switch in-and out of looped regions. Haven't tried this, but might workable as long as you paying attention and have a fixed song structure. Flexibility is lost because you can't move the loop start point backwards (but you can always RTZ...).
Anyway, lots of fun and interaction with the CS. Combine it with direct pattern access and automation tracks - not to mention XMix - and there's plenty going on. 

Oh yeah - I've been testing the changing multis with new patterns via direct access. For me there's always a noticeable pause - sometimes musical - but mostly annoying, even if the is only one instrument track playing. Still, in the background, pretty handy (as is Direct pattern access)



--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Atom Smasher <atom@...> wrote:

>
> On Sat, 5 Feb 2011, Atom Smasher wrote:
> 
> > now that i'm thinking about it... i guess an alternative way to do this 
> > might be the "loop section"... using the example above, patterns 2 & 3 
> > are combined into a single pattern; the first part of the pattern has 
> > the fill, then the 2nd part of the pattern loops. hhmmm.... can the 
> > "loop section" settings be saved with a pattern? if so, will a section 
> > of the pattern before the loop-start play before it starts looping the 
> > section? even if the loop-section has to be enabled manually (assuming 
> > the start/stop settings are saved) this could still conserve pattern 
> > memory... if it works...
> ==================
> 
> aacckk!!! as i suspected... "Loop Section is a temporary loop which is not 
> saved with the pattern or multisetup. Loop Section defaults to 'off' upon 
> pattern change.
> 
> i guess it can still be used if you're quick enough to assign loop points 
> and start the loop, but it can't be saved with a pattern :(
> 
> 
> -- 
>          ...atom
> 
>   ________________________
>   http://atom.smasher.org/
>   762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
>   -------------------------------------------------
> 
>  	"We must understand words mean things to different people.
>  	 There's got to be a better way to communicate with ourselves."
>  		-- George "dubya" Bush, 5 May 2006
>  		http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/05/20060507-2.html
>

Oh yeah - I've been testing the changing multis with new patterns via direct access. For me there's always a noticeable pause - sometimes musical - but mostly annoying, even if the is only one instrument track playing. Still, in the background, pretty handy (as is Direct pattern access)

I think it's due to the processor load when loading a new multisetup???

I haven't tested this with external synths yet, but I imagine it depends on the processing power of the devce being triggered, no? 

Then I went back to the manual. On Page 53 - Event Timing:

Songs and patterns both contain pre-sequence setup information that is
loaded just before a song or sequence plays. This pre-sequence information is not reloaded when a pattern loops. Reloading this setup information each time a pattern looped would cause data clogging and possible timing errors in the sequence.
• The first two ticks (0 & 1) are reserved for pre-sequence setup information.Tick 0 is reserved for the internal pre-sequence setup information.
Tick 1 is used to place your own pre-sequence setup information so
that it won't loop and cause timing errors.


Does anyone know how to access/alter this pre-sequence setup info on 'pre-' Tick 1? See the accompanying diagram - it's a little confusing....

Also it says:
When a track is set to "ext" (external transmit only), you will be allowed to see the tick 0 spot for EVENTS. This allows you to remove any presequence setup data (which is stored at Tick 0) left over from when the track may have been internal or both.

.......maybe this facilitates a faster program change transmission?

Cheers,
J
--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Abatemarco <dan@...> wrote:

>
> >
> > Oh yeah - I've been testing the changing multis with new patterns via
> > direct access. For me there's always a noticeable pause - sometimes musical
> > - but mostly annoying, even if the is only one instrument track playing.
> > Still, in the background, pretty handy (as is Direct pattern access)
> 
> 
> A noticeable dropout in the audio, or a pause where the sequencer misses
> time? If you were just using the sequencer to trigger external gear, would
> you notice it? I love Direct Pattern Access, but I'd like a way to get more
> than 16 patterns, and it would be cool to create a few different multi
> setups as different "banks" of patterns for Direct Pattern Access.
> 
> --Dan
>

This is a great topic! Lotsa good ideas here!

As for my contribution, I have been getting into realtime improvs and recently have been exploring arps. The 4x4 knobs are tremendous in volume mode for starting up arps, fading them in and out, mixing them, etc. Since I am using a usb/midi keyboard, I reply on those faders/knobs to control CCs, though at times I just set the 4x4 knobs to quick edit mode and play the knobs there. It is quite handy to toggle among the 4x4 knob modes.

Obviously, 32 potential arps are very nice to have--even if you don't use all of them at the same time!!

Patchcords are superb!!!!
Lately, I have been making use of LFOs, esp routed to pan and filter settings. I have created some cool patches using LFO patterns routed to pitch. The random value generators are also cool routed to pan and filter settings for spacialization and variety.

During a recent improv, I made use of factory arps and bts as well as a whole bunch of custom arps--some specific patterns, some random patterns.

http://electro-music.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=321754&highlight=#321754

Randomize preset is also a great feature, so long as you customize the results.

Anyhow, these are some of the features I have been exploring recently.

Steve

My favorite features are the sounds themselves, but you knew that.


My favorite tricky thing I've come up with is also pretty basic and I've mentioned it before, but here goes.

I've created two copies of drum kit patches and given them arpeggios.  One is quarter notes, the other is third-ed eighths.  Both are latched arpeggios.  (Never had a use for that option before, as it seemed to just result in find-the-stuck-note panics.)

And I've created a pattern with your basic rock organ patch on channel 1, and the above kit patches on channels 11,12 and 13.  One is the quarter noted one, and the other is the thirded eighths.

Finally, I made a setup on my Axiom 49 controller to go with that pattern.  The Axiom 49 has 49 keys and eight rubber pads (among other things.)  I route the keyboard to the organ patch, and two of the pads each to a 2/4 arped kit and the remaining 4 to the thirded eighth kit.

Now, this may sound simplistic, BUT from a standing start, all those arps aren't synched to anything.  So I can get some very complex patterns going.  And this is fun to just play the keyboard along with.  I change what the keyboard's routed to as I feel like, and sometimes I tweak the drum sounds with QuickEditing.

As a keyboardist, mostly I used the CS as a soundbank with a keyboard 
controller. (The sequencer part was just a bonus for me. :-) )

So my favorite midi setup was OMNI mode.
I used one pattern for one song with 16 optional instruments.
(TAP+channel number button + rechannelize input)
Using OMNI mode I could use both built in effects per instruments,
and the 4x4 knobs section was set to "quick edit" mode.
I used the following ROMs:
- XL7
- Vintage
- Sounds of the ZR (with Perfect Piano)
- Definitive B3

Later on I could buy a Nord Stage so my CS moved to my table
and I could start to discover the sequencer functions.
Still learning it, it is very complex! :)


Andrew

On Tue, 8 Feb 2011, just john wrote:

> My favorite features are the sounds themselves, but you knew that.
>
>
> My favorite tricky thing I've come up with is also pretty basic and I've mentioned it before, but here goes.
>
> I've created two copies of drum kit patches and given them arpeggios.  One is quarter notes, the other is third-ed eighths.  Both are latched arpeggios.  (Never had a use for that option before, as it seemed to just result in find-the-stuck-note panics.)
>
> And I've created a pattern with your basic rock organ patch on channel 1, and the above kit patches on channels 11,12 and 13.  One is the quarter noted one, and the other is the thirded eighths.
>
> Finally, I made a setup on my Axiom 49 controller to go with that pattern.  The Axiom 49 has 49 keys and eight rubber pads (among other things.)  I route the keyboard to the organ patch, and two of the pads each to a 2/4 arped kit and the remaining 4 to the thirded eighth kit.
>
> Now, this may sound simplistic, BUT from a standing start, all those arps aren't synched to anything.  So I can get some very complex patterns going.  And this is fun to just play the keyboard along with.  I change what the keyboard's routed to as I feel like, and sometimes I tweak the drum sounds with QuickEditing.
>
>

Just coming back to this. Although looped sections are not saved with the pattern, they seem to be saved in ram, and are 'transferable' between patterns. i.e. while you have a loop running, you can set the loop points once, switch patterns, and just re-activate loop. The pattern will start at zero, but then will loop at the same points specified in the previous pattern.

So you could come close to what you want with a series of directly-accessible patterns, fills on bar 1 and loop the remainder (maybe a fill at the end), switching between them to trigger fills and back into a loop. 

It takes a little bit of setting-up and practice though. I've just been switching between 3 drum patterns and getting plenty of control by playing with the loops points and punching into new patterns using the RTZ shift key (another nice feature of OS2)

Cheers,
J

--- In xl7@yahoogroups.com, Atom Smasher <atom@...> wrote:

>
> On Sat, 5 Feb 2011, Atom Smasher wrote:
> 
> > now that i'm thinking about it... i guess an alternative way to do this 
> > might be the "loop section"... using the example above, patterns 2 & 3 
> > are combined into a single pattern; the first part of the pattern has 
> > the fill, then the 2nd part of the pattern loops. hhmmm.... can the 
> > "loop section" settings be saved with a pattern? if so, will a section 
> > of the pattern before the loop-start play before it starts looping the 
> > section? even if the loop-section has to be enabled manually (assuming 
> > the start/stop settings are saved) this could still conserve pattern 
> > memory... if it works...
> ==================
> 
> aacckk!!! as i suspected... "Loop Section is a temporary loop which is not 
> saved with the pattern or multisetup. Loop Section defaults to 'off' upon 
> pattern change.
> 
> i guess it can still be used if you're quick enough to assign loop points 
> and start the loop, but it can't be saved with a pattern :(
> 
> 
> -- 
>          ...atom
> 
>   ________________________
>   http://atom.smasher.org/
>   762A 3B98 A3C3 96C9 C6B7 582A B88D 52E4 D9F5 7808
>   -------------------------------------------------
> 
>  	"We must understand words mean things to different people.
>  	 There's got to be a better way to communicate with ourselves."
>  		-- George "dubya" Bush, 5 May 2006
>  		http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/05/20060507-2.html
>