Yamaha DTXpress/DTXplorer/DTXtreme

>
> Doug,
> 
> It's not bi-amped, which doesn't help.  It is probably clipping the bass.  You may be able to minimise it by turning the line volume down and the master volume up, or vice versa - give it a try.  But if it sounds ok, I wouldn't worry too much.  
> 
> It is possible that you could blow up the tweeter, but if that is the case I would have thought you would be cringing at the distortion.  My PA clips on bass kicks sometimes (15" bi-amped with 200W on the bass, 100W on the treble) and it sounds fine and never blown up.  I think if you want some serious volume you need to spend serious money to get some decent power.  My drum teacher uses a couple of 1000W PAs on his electronic drum kit.
> 
> Keith.
>

>
> Doug,
> 
> Two things you could do to reduce the bass:
> 
> 1. make sure there is no bass boost on the DTXpress - utility menu EQ Lo=0
> 
> 2. put an equaliser between the DTXpress and the amp.  I have a cheap & nasty Behringer 9 channel one - it works OK but is a horrible plastic thing (unlike the Xenyx mixer I have which is well built).
> 
> I don't think you have an equaliser on the amp, otherwise you could use that.
> 
> It is a while since I looked into clipping, but assuming things haven't changed much, the problem with clipping is that a nice low frequency sine wave gets the top chopped off.  This creates lots of high frequency harmonics which sound awful and blow up your tweeters.  With a bi-amped design that is less of a problem because the bass distortion cannot get to the tweeter.
> 
> If the clipping is not a sharp cut off, but "soft clipping" the waveform is more rounded, not as noticeable audibly and not as likely to blow anything up.
> 
> You may get some overheating of the amplifier or loudspeaker, although I would expect most amps to have a thermal trip in them.
> 
> So, if your DTXpress equaliser is already at zero, you could buy a separate one to reduce the bass a bit (or even reduce the kick volume in the kit setup) or play and keep your fingers crossed while saving up for that 1000W PA.  
> 
> Keith.
>

From: niceguycolumbus1
Subject: [DTXpress] Re: help:clipping on powered speakers
To: DTXpress@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, March 12, 2009, 12:37 PM

Keith thanks for all your help. I feel quite inept at this. I rarely ever post to forums asking for help — a combination of common sense and "reading the manual" typically gets me to the right result.

However, this thing has me stumped. I just want to plug and play. ?!?!?!?!

There is actually a 5 band EQ on the speaker. Dropping the base does not seem to do anything significant. Plus, I get clipping on all drum hits, it's just more obvious with the bass. So, I don't think an EQ will be the solution.

The bottom line here is that if I drop all input signals low enough or drop the master volume enough to reduce clipping, I am not putting out much sound. It kind of defeats the purpose of buying the speakers in the first place. My goal was a simple ability to have a live monitor alternative to headphones, plus the ability to gig a bit with it.

I'm not looking to blow out the walls, so 1000w is beyond what I had in mind in terms of power and $$.

--- In DTXpress@yahoogroup s.com, "Keith" wrote:
>
> Doug,
>
> Two things you could do to reduce the bass:
>
> 1. make sure there is no bass boost on the DTXpress - utility menu EQ Lo=0
>
> 2. put an equaliser between the DTXpress and the amp. I have a cheap & nasty Behringer 9 channel one - it works OK but is a horrible plastic thing (unlike the Xenyx mixer I have which is well built).
>
> I don't think you have an equaliser on the amp, otherwise you could use that.
>
> It is a while since I looked into clipping, but assuming things haven't changed much, the problem with clipping is that a nice low frequency sine wave gets the top chopped off. This creates lots of high frequency harmonics which sound awful and blow up your tweeters. With a bi-amped design that is less of a problem because the bass distortion cannot get to the tweeter.
>
> If the clipping is not a sharp cut off, but "soft clipping" the waveform is more rounded, not as noticeable audibly and not as likely to blow anything up.
>
>; You may get some overheating of the amplifier or loudspeaker, although I would expect most amps to have a thermal trip in them.
>
> So, if your DTXpress equaliser is already at zero, you could buy a separate one to reduce the bass a bit (or even reduce the kick volume in the kit setup) or play and keep your fingers crossed while saving up for that 1000W PA.
>
> Keith.
>

>
> For this purpose a compressor is the right tool for the job. It will allow you too have much higher overall volume before clipping. Properly set-up it will remove the extreme peaks inherent in the electric kit. Google on tips to set it up. Behringer makes very usuable compressors for the money. Hope ive helped! 
> 
> --- On Thu, 3/12/09, niceguycolumbus1 <niceguycolumbus1@...> wrote:
> From: niceguycolumbus1 <niceguycolumbus1@...>
> Subject: [DTXpress] Re: help:clipping on powered speakers
> To: DTXpress@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, March 12, 2009, 12:37 PM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>     
>             Keith thanks for all your help. I feel quite inept at this. I rarely ever post to forums asking for help â€"  a combination of common sense and "reading the manual" typically gets me to the right result. 
> 
> 
> 
> However, this thing has me stumped.  I just want to plug and play. ?!?!?!?!
> 
> 
> 
> There is actually a 5 band EQ on the speaker. Dropping the base does not seem to do anything significant. Plus, I get clipping on all drum hits, it's just more obvious with the bass. So, I don't think an EQ will be the solution.
> 
> 
> 
> The bottom line here is that if I drop all input signals low enough or drop the master volume enough to reduce clipping, I am not putting out much sound. It kind of defeats the purpose of buying the speakers in the first place. My goal was a simple ability to have a live monitor alternative to headphones, plus the ability to gig a bit with it. 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not looking to blow out the walls, so 1000w is beyond what I had in mind in terms of power and $$.
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroup s.com, "Keith" <keith@> wrote:
> 
> >
> 
> > Doug,
> 
> > 
> 
> > Two things you could do to reduce the bass:
> 
> > 
> 
> > 1. make sure there is no bass boost on the DTXpress - utility menu EQ Lo=0
> 
> > 
> 
> > 2. put an equaliser between the DTXpress and the amp.  I have a cheap & nasty Behringer 9 channel one - it works OK but is a horrible plastic thing (unlike the Xenyx mixer I have which is well built).
> 
> > 
> 
> > I don't think you have an equaliser on the amp, otherwise you could use that.
> 
> > 
> 
> > It is a while since I looked into clipping, but assuming things haven't changed much, the problem with clipping is that a nice low frequency sine wave gets the top chopped off.  This creates lots of high frequency harmonics which sound awful and blow up your tweeters.  With a bi-amped design that is less of a problem because the bass distortion cannot get to the tweeter.
> 
> > 
> 
> > If the clipping is not a sharp cut off, but "soft clipping" the waveform is more rounded, not as noticeable audibly and not as likely to blow anything up.
> 
> > 
> 
> > You may get some overheating of the amplifier or loudspeaker, although I would expect most amps to have a thermal trip in them.
> 
> > 
> 
> > So, if your DTXpress equaliser is already at zero, you could buy a separate one to reduce the bass a bit (or even reduce the kick volume in the kit setup) or play and keep your fingers crossed while saving up for that 1000W PA.  
> 
> > 
> 
> > Keith.
> 
> >
>

>
> this sounds like a solution.
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, dustin howard <racetruck420@> wrote:
> >
> > For this purpose a compressor is the right tool for the job. It will allow you too have much higher overall volume before clipping. Properly set-up it will remove the extreme peaks inherent in the electric kit. Google on tips to set it up. Behringer makes very usuable compressors for the money. Hope ive helped! 
> > 
> > --- On Thu, 3/12/09, niceguycolumbus1 <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> > From: niceguycolumbus1 <niceguycolumbus1@>
> > Subject: [DTXpress] Re: help:clipping on powered speakers
> > To: DTXpress@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Thursday, March 12, 2009, 12:37 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >     
> >             Keith thanks for all your help. I feel quite inept at this. I rarely ever post to forums asking for help â€"  a combination of common sense and "reading the manual" typically gets me to the right result. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > However, this thing has me stumped.  I just want to plug and play. ?!?!?!?!
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > There is actually a 5 band EQ on the speaker. Dropping the base does not seem to do anything significant. Plus, I get clipping on all drum hits, it's just more obvious with the bass. So, I don't think an EQ will be the solution.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > The bottom line here is that if I drop all input signals low enough or drop the master volume enough to reduce clipping, I am not putting out much sound. It kind of defeats the purpose of buying the speakers in the first place. My goal was a simple ability to have a live monitor alternative to headphones, plus the ability to gig a bit with it. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I'm not looking to blow out the walls, so 1000w is beyond what I had in mind in terms of power and $$.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DTXpress@yahoogroup s.com, "Keith" <keith@> wrote:
> > 
> > >
> > 
> > > Doug,
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Two things you could do to reduce the bass:
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > 1. make sure there is no bass boost on the DTXpress - utility menu EQ Lo=0
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > 2. put an equaliser between the DTXpress and the amp.  I have a cheap & nasty Behringer 9 channel one - it works OK but is a horrible plastic thing (unlike the Xenyx mixer I have which is well built).
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I don't think you have an equaliser on the amp, otherwise you could use that.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > It is a while since I looked into clipping, but assuming things haven't changed much, the problem with clipping is that a nice low frequency sine wave gets the top chopped off.  This creates lots of high frequency harmonics which sound awful and blow up your tweeters.  With a bi-amped design that is less of a problem because the bass distortion cannot get to the tweeter.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > If the clipping is not a sharp cut off, but "soft clipping" the waveform is more rounded, not as noticeable audibly and not as likely to blow anything up.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > You may get some overheating of the amplifier or loudspeaker, although I would expect most amps to have a thermal trip in them.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > So, if your DTXpress equaliser is already at zero, you could buy a separate one to reduce the bass a bit (or even reduce the kick volume in the kit setup) or play and keep your fingers crossed while saving up for that 1000W PA.  
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Keith.
> > 
> > >
> >
>

>
> Hi Folks!
> 
> I'm late to the party on this question and I can't seem to find the original post.
> 
> Anyway, a "compressor" is not the way to go.  Get yourself a Behringer B2092A Studio Subwoofer.. Nice box, 360 watts with a built in crossover that I use to send the highs to a couple of Behringer MS-40's on "ear level" stands.
> 
> This configuration sends the LOW notes and the HIGH notes to the proper powered speakers that were meant to deal with said notes and it still has a couple of R/L output lines to send to the "house" PA.
> 
> Hope this helps!
> 
> Out
> Mick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "niceguycolumbus1" <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> >
> > this sounds like a solution.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, dustin howard <racetruck420@> wrote:
> > >
> > > For this purpose a compressor is the right tool for the job. It will allow you too have much higher overall volume before clipping. Properly set-up it will remove the extreme peaks inherent in the electric kit. Google on tips to set it up. Behringer makes very usuable compressors for the money. Hope ive helped! 
> > > 
> > > --- On Thu, 3/12/09, niceguycolumbus1 <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> > > From: niceguycolumbus1 <niceguycolumbus1@>
> > > Subject: [DTXpress] Re: help:clipping on powered speakers
> > > To: DTXpress@yahoogroups.com
> > > Date: Thursday, March 12, 2009, 12:37 PM
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > >     
> > >             Keith thanks for all your help. I feel quite inept at this. I rarely ever post to forums asking for help â€"  a combination of common sense and "reading the manual" typically gets me to the right result. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > However, this thing has me stumped.  I just want to plug and play. ?!?!?!?!
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > There is actually a 5 band EQ on the speaker. Dropping the base does not seem to do anything significant. Plus, I get clipping on all drum hits, it's just more obvious with the bass. So, I don't think an EQ will be the solution.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > The bottom line here is that if I drop all input signals low enough or drop the master volume enough to reduce clipping, I am not putting out much sound. It kind of defeats the purpose of buying the speakers in the first place. My goal was a simple ability to have a live monitor alternative to headphones, plus the ability to gig a bit with it. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > I'm not looking to blow out the walls, so 1000w is beyond what I had in mind in terms of power and $$.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In DTXpress@yahoogroup s.com, "Keith" <keith@> wrote:
> > > 
> > > >
> > > 
> > > > Doug,
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > Two things you could do to reduce the bass:
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > 1. make sure there is no bass boost on the DTXpress - utility menu EQ Lo=0
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > 2. put an equaliser between the DTXpress and the amp.  I have a cheap & nasty Behringer 9 channel one - it works OK but is a horrible plastic thing (unlike the Xenyx mixer I have which is well built).
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > I don't think you have an equaliser on the amp, otherwise you could use that.
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > It is a while since I looked into clipping, but assuming things haven't changed much, the problem with clipping is that a nice low frequency sine wave gets the top chopped off.  This creates lots of high frequency harmonics which sound awful and blow up your tweeters.  With a bi-amped design that is less of a problem because the bass distortion cannot get to the tweeter.
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > If the clipping is not a sharp cut off, but "soft clipping" the waveform is more rounded, not as noticeable audibly and not as likely to blow anything up.
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > You may get some overheating of the amplifier or loudspeaker, although I would expect most amps to have a thermal trip in them.
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > So, if your DTXpress equaliser is already at zero, you could buy a separate one to reduce the bass a bit (or even reduce the kick volume in the kit setup) or play and keep your fingers crossed while saving up for that 1000W PA.  
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > > Keith.
> > > 
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

>
> 
> Hi Doug
>  
> I was just reading this again this morning and realized you may be discribing a damaged amplifier! when a portion of the amp(eg 1 transistor out of two or 4) is not working it can do what you are discribing... 
> 
> try hooking up your dtx output to some other amp(less power or the same) and compare the output of the two. you may have to bite the bullet and buy a different setup to amplify the output,... or get that one repaired.
> 
> one of my 400 watt powered amps is quieter than the other(i figure it is damaged)(I run stereo and they are both yamaha's), which forces me to crank it at the mixer and it usually clips before we get it to a decent level I know it needs repair or replacement, which I will do in the near future. when I save enough!
> Tom
> 
> 
>       __________________________________________________________________
> Connect with friends from any web browser - no download required. Try the new Yahoo! Canada Messenger for the Web BETA at http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/webmessengerpromo.php
>

>
> A guy at Guitar Center told me that he thinks it is (input?) sensitivity mismatch between my kit and the speaker.
> 
> This is all way too much for a guy who just wants to unplug the headphones and share his music once in a while. And since at the moment, I have more money than time and patience, I am biting the bullet and buying a piano amp.
> 
> I appreciate everyone's help here. This has always been a great forum.
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, Tom Watson <palomineo@> wrote:
> >
> > 
> > Hi Doug
> >  
> > I was just reading this again this morning and realized you may be discribing a damaged amplifier! when a portion of the amp(eg 1 transistor out of two or 4) is not working it can do what you are discribing... 
> > 
> > try hooking up your dtx output to some other amp(less power or the same) and compare the output of the two. you may have to bite the bullet and buy a different setup to amplify the output,... or get that one repaired.
> > 
> > one of my 400 watt powered amps is quieter than the other(i figure it is damaged)(I run stereo and they are both yamaha's), which forces me to crank it at the mixer and it usually clips before we get it to a decent level I know it needs repair or replacement, which I will do in the near future. when I save enough!
> > Tom
> > 
> > 
> >       __________________________________________________________________
> > Connect with friends from any web browser - no download required. Try the new Yahoo! Canada Messenger for the Web BETA at http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/webmessengerpromo.php
> >
>

>
> Like the other guy said - it could be your amp or it could be the speaker.  Speakers on the way out sound like "clipping".  Sometimes if you push the speaker cone in and release it a couple of times you can here ugly noises, that means - new speaker or a re-cone job at least.
> 
> As the other guy recommended, try another amp or borrow a guitar (bass if possible) and try that through the questionable amp!
> 
> BTW - the Behringer rig I mentioned in a previous post would run about $700 with cables and stands.  Make sure you factor that against the price of the piano amp you are thinking of buying.  Plus, with the rig I mentioned you retain the stereo imaging.
> 
> Later
> Mick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "niceguycolumbus1" <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> >
> > A guy at Guitar Center told me that he thinks it is (input?) sensitivity mismatch between my kit and the speaker.
> > 
> > This is all way too much for a guy who just wants to unplug the headphones and share his music once in a while. And since at the moment, I have more money than time and patience, I am biting the bullet and buying a piano amp.
> > 
> > I appreciate everyone's help here. This has always been a great forum.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, Tom Watson <palomineo@> wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > > Hi Doug
> > >  
> > > I was just reading this again this morning and realized you may be discribing a damaged amplifier! when a portion of the amp(eg 1 transistor out of two or 4) is not working it can do what you are discribing... 
> > > 
> > > try hooking up your dtx output to some other amp(less power or the same) and compare the output of the two. you may have to bite the bullet and buy a different setup to amplify the output,... or get that one repaired.
> > > 
> > > one of my 400 watt powered amps is quieter than the other(i figure it is damaged)(I run stereo and they are both yamaha's), which forces me to crank it at the mixer and it usually clips before we get it to a decent level I know it needs repair or replacement, which I will do in the near future. when I save enough!
> > > Tom
> > > 
> > > 
> > >       __________________________________________________________________
> > > Connect with friends from any web browser - no download required. Try the new Yahoo! Canada Messenger for the Web BETA at http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/webmessengerpromo.php
> > >
> >
>

>
> The speaker SOUNDS great — its the LED clipping indicator that goes off. It could be faulty, but I am thinking I have incompatibility here somewhere.  The piano amp I am looking at is well under $500 and should get me through just about anything I want to do. 
> 
> Again, thanks to all - what a great community. 
> 
> (Now if I could just find the post from the guy that listed his kit as: kick, snare, 4 toms and four cymbals with no extra brain just using one Y splitter and the 9/10 swap, I'll be all set. I have all but the fourth cymbal working.)
> 
> TGIF!!!!
> 
> 
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "micklean1953" <micklean@> wrote:
> >
> > Like the other guy said - it could be your amp or it could be the speaker.  Speakers on the way out sound like "clipping".  Sometimes if you push the speaker cone in and release it a couple of times you can here ugly noises, that means - new speaker or a re-cone job at least.
> > 
> > As the other guy recommended, try another amp or borrow a guitar (bass if possible) and try that through the questionable amp!
> > 
> > BTW - the Behringer rig I mentioned in a previous post would run about $700 with cables and stands.  Make sure you factor that against the price of the piano amp you are thinking of buying.  Plus, with the rig I mentioned you retain the stereo imaging.
> > 
> > Later
> > Mick
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "niceguycolumbus1" <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> > >
> > > A guy at Guitar Center told me that he thinks it is (input?) sensitivity mismatch between my kit and the speaker.
> > > 
> > > This is all way too much for a guy who just wants to unplug the headphones and share his music once in a while. And since at the moment, I have more money than time and patience, I am biting the bullet and buying a piano amp.
> > > 
> > > I appreciate everyone's help here. This has always been a great forum.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, Tom Watson <palomineo@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > > Hi Doug
> > > >  
> > > > I was just reading this again this morning and realized you may be discribing a damaged amplifier! when a portion of the amp(eg 1 transistor out of two or 4) is not working it can do what you are discribing... 
> > > > 
> > > > try hooking up your dtx output to some other amp(less power or the same) and compare the output of the two. you may have to bite the bullet and buy a different setup to amplify the output,... or get that one repaired.
> > > > 
> > > > one of my 400 watt powered amps is quieter than the other(i figure it is damaged)(I run stereo and they are both yamaha's), which forces me to crank it at the mixer and it usually clips before we get it to a decent level I know it needs repair or replacement, which I will do in the near future. when I save enough!
> > > > Tom
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > >       __________________________________________________________________
> > > > Connect with friends from any web browser - no download required. Try the new Yahoo! Canada Messenger for the Web BETA at http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/webmessengerpromo.php
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

>
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "niceguycolumbus1" <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> > (Now if I could just find the post from the guy that listed his kit as: kick, snare, 4 toms and four cymbals with no extra brain just using one Y splitter and the 9/10 swap, I'll be all set. I have all but the fourth cymbal working.)
> > 
> 
> 
> That's what I have on my DTXpress III (assuming you count the hihat as a cymbal).
> 
> Keith.
>

>
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "niceguycolumbus1" <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> > (Now if I could just find the post from the guy that listed his kit as: kick, snare, 4 toms and four cymbals with no extra brain just using one Y splitter and the 9/10 swap, I'll be all set. I have all but the fourth cymbal working.)
> > 
> 
> 
> That's what I have on my DTXpress III (assuming you count the hihat as a cymbal).
> 
> Keith.
>

>
> The only two ways I think you can have 11 pads on the DTXpress are to either put two pads in parallel (they will give the same sound - sometimes used to put a cymbals on each side of the kit) or use my DTXpander.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Keith
> 
> -original message-
> Subject: [DTXpress] Re: help:clipping on powered speakers
> From: "niceguycolumbus1" <niceguycolumbus1@...>
> Date: 14/03/2009 3:39 am
> 
> oh - actually, forgot the HH...  YES - there was a post on here from someone who had all eleven triggers on a list. It was from 2004 or 2005 and I could not find it. 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "Keith" <keith@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "niceguycolumbus1" <niceguycolumbus1@> wrote:
> > > (Now if I could just find the post from the guy that listed his kit as: kick, snare, 4 toms and four cymbals with no extra brain just using one Y splitter and the 9/10 swap, I'll be all set. I have all but the fourth cymbal working.)
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > That's what I have on my DTXpress III (assuming you count the hihat as a cymbal).
> > 
> > Keith.
> >
>