Digital BW, The Print

Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have an "etched" look
with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has been the
culmination and development of a number of traditional and digital
techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it is, for the
very first time I will tell all! ;-)

The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, nor are they
the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then here it
is.....;-)

Truth No. 1

Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no arguments....period.

Truth No. 2

Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate of testing,
but you need to know what your materials will do.

Truth No. 3

Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a religion and
I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it is. Process
your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the grain
proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where there is
less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver. And, most
importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will exhibit
strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas of tonal
change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. Especially so with
low light situations, soft light, and fog!

You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!

Truth No. 4

No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new fangled Imacon
is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell them you want
absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no gamma
adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 bit files.
Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of the drum
scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That is, scan at
300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The reason for this
is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the grain. If
you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust the aperture
and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will be the most
georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.

This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to CCD
scanners.

Truth No. 5

Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you can in 16
bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections and
adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16 bit file
as needed.

Truth No. 6

Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying Epson Archival
(Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers are 100%
Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right blacks,
lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.

Truth No. 7

Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, and in my
town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so fast, that
in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!

Mike



----- Original Message -----
From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP


>
> >>>>>Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.<<<<<<
>
>
> That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
> quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one of
> those exibition prints.
>
> Bruce McElhaney
> McElhaney Portrait Studio
> Livonia, MI
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
> > In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> > butchhul@a... writes:
> >
> >
> > > George,
> > >
> > > I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. Just
> > > finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I finished
> this
> > > past weekend.
> > Butch,
> > Thanks for responding to my query.
> > I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and are
> happy with it.
> > Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a sign of
> lack of usage
> > rather than dissatisfaction.
> > Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your exhibition
> leads to
> > many other successes.
> > (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine source
> > of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
> > I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he offered
> his
> > knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously offered
> to send a
> > sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
> > They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope some of the
> best
> > things that come around come back to  Mike.
> > This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that I can
> someday
> > contribute to it in a positive way.
> > ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
> > Sounds like an amazing feat!
> > Thanks again,
> > George J Kunze
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Hi Mike,

Thank you...

Have a look at DiXactol on this site: http://www.barrythornton.com I don't
remember the exact details, but it has the benefits of staining devs like
Pyro with rather balanced dev times such that you can develop different film
speeds and makes in one tank. Of course, there are exceptions! (No fast
film) I don't remember the technicalities of the design of the dev, but I'm
sure it's on the site.

On the scanning side... are you simply saying "if your negative size allows
it, scan at a lower resolution than 'maximum optical' to avoid scanning
grain"

Thanks,
Nij

> Truth No. 3
>
> Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a
> religion and
> I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it is. Process
> your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the grain
> proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where there is
> less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver. And, most
> importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will exhibit
> strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas of tonal
> change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints.
> Especially so with
> low light situations, soft light, and fog!
>
> You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!

>
> Truth No. 4
>
> No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new fangled Imacon
> is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell
> them you want
> absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no gamma
> adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 bit files.
> Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of the drum
> scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That
> is, scan at
> 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The
> reason for this
> is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the grain. If
> you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust
> the aperture
> and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will
> be the most
> georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
>
> This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to CCD
> scanners.

Truth Number 8:

Don't bother printing it unless it is a Kravit-perfect image!

Tom O'Connell

TomOC@...
www.thomasoconnell.com


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Michael Kravit" 
<michael.kravit@w...> wrote:
> Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have an "etched" 
look
> with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has 
been the
> culmination and development of a number of traditional and digital
> techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it 
is, for the
> very first time I will tell all! ;-)
> 
> The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, nor 
are they
> the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then here 
it
> is.....;-)
> 
> Truth No. 1
> 
> Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no 
arguments....period.
> 
> Truth No. 2
> 
> Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate of 
testing,
> but you need to know what your materials will do.
> 
> Truth No. 3
> 
> Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a 
religion and
> I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it is. 
Process
> your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the 
grain
> proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where 
there is
> less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver. 
And, most
> importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will 
exhibit
> strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas of 
tonal
> change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. Especially 
so with
> low light situations, soft light, and fog!
> 
> You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
> 
> Truth No. 4
> 
> No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new fangled 
Imacon
> is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell them 
you want
> absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no 
gamma
> adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 bit 
files.
> Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of the 
drum
> scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That is, 
scan at
> 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The reason 
for this
> is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the 
grain. If
> you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust the 
aperture
> and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will be 
the most
> georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
> 
> This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to CCD
> scanners.
> 
> Truth No. 5
> 
> Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you can 
in 16
> bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections and
> adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16 
bit file
> as needed.
> 
> Truth No. 6
> 
> Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying Epson 
Archival
> (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers are 
100%
> Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right 
blacks,
> lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
> 
> Truth No. 7
> 
> Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, and 
in my
> town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so 
fast, that
> in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@t...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
> 
> 
> >
> > >>>>>Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.<<<<<<
> >
> >
> > That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
> > quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one of
> > those exibition prints.
> >
> > Bruce McElhaney
> > McElhaney Portrait Studio
> > Livonia, MI
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
> > > In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> > > butchhul@a... writes:
> > >
> > >
> > > > George,
> > > >
> > > > I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. Just
> > > > finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I finished
> > this
> > > > past weekend.
> > > Butch,
> > > Thanks for responding to my query.
> > > I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and are
> > happy with it.
> > > Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a sign of
> > lack of usage
> > > rather than dissatisfaction.
> > > Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your exhibition
> > leads to
> > > many other successes.
> > > (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine 
source
> > > of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
> > > I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he 
offered
> > his
> > > knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously 
offered
> > to send a
> > > sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
> > > They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope some of 
the
> > best
> > > things that come around come back to  Mike.
> > > This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that I can
> > someday
> > > contribute to it in a positive way.
> > > ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> > > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
> > > Sounds like an amazing feat!
> > > Thanks again,
> > > George J Kunze
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
Polls and
> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to keep
> them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
or "flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
various
> resources on the homepage.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >

On 4/4/02 9:18 PM, "tomoc" <tomoc@...> wrote:

> Truth Number 8:
> 
> Don't bother printing it unless it is a Kravit-perfect image!
> 
Well that would certainly save money...but my printer would clog from lack
of use!  I've been seeing a lot of Kravit images lately...and they look
really good...even as jpg's...Michael's been hanging out in the swamp...and
has drum scanned show and tell.

Robert


> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Michael Kravit"
> <michael.kravit@w...> wrote:
>> Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have an "etched"
> look
>> with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has
> been the
>> culmination and development of a number of traditional and digital
>> techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it
> is, for the
>> very first time I will tell all! ;-)
>> 
>> The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, nor
> are they
>> the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then here
> it
>> is.....;-)
>> 
>> Truth No. 1
>> 
>> Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no
> arguments....period.
>> 
>> Truth No. 2
>> 
>> Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate of
> testing,
>> but you need to know what your materials will do.
>> 
>> Truth No. 3
>> 
>> Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a
> religion and
>> I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it is.
> Process
>> your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the
> grain
>> proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where
> there is
>> less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver.
> And, most
>> importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will
> exhibit
>> strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas of
> tonal
>> change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. Especially
> so with
>> low light situations, soft light, and fog!
>> 
>> You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
>> 
>> Truth No. 4
>> 
>> No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new fangled
> Imacon
>> is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell them
> you want
>> absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no
> gamma
>> adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 bit
> files.
>> Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of the
> drum
>> scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That is,
> scan at
>> 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The reason
> for this
>> is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the
> grain. If
>> you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust the
> aperture
>> and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will be
> the most
>> georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
>> 
>> This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to CCD
>> scanners.
>> 
>> Truth No. 5
>> 
>> Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you can
> in 16
>> bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections and
>> adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16
> bit file
>> as needed.
>> 
>> Truth No. 6
>> 
>> Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying Epson
> Archival
>> (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers are
> 100%
>> Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right
> blacks,
>> lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
>> 
>> Truth No. 7
>> 
>> Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, and
> in my
>> town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so
> fast, that
>> in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@t...>
>> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
>> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>>>>>>> Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
>>> on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.<<<<<<
>>> 
>>> 
>>> That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
>>> quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one of
>>> those exibition prints.
>>> 
>>> Bruce McElhaney
>>> McElhaney Portrait Studio
>>> Livonia, MI
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
>>>> In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>>>> butchhul@a... writes:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> George,
>>>>> 
>>>>> I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. Just
>>>>> finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I finished
>>> this
>>>>> past weekend.
>>>> Butch,
>>>> Thanks for responding to my query.
>>>> I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and are
>>> happy with it.
>>>> Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a sign of
>>> lack of usage
>>>> rather than dissatisfaction.
>>>> Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your exhibition
>>> leads to
>>>> many other successes.
>>>> (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine
> source
>>>> of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
>>>> I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he
> offered
>>> his
>>>> knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously
> offered
>>> to send a
>>>> sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
>>>> They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope some of
> the
>>> best
>>>> things that come around come back to  Mike.
>>>> This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that I can
>>> someday
>>>> contribute to it in a positive way.
>>>> ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
>>>> on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
>>>> Sounds like an amazing feat!
>>>> Thanks again,
>>>> George J Kunze
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks,
> Polls and
>> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>>> 
>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>>> 
>>> Please follow these basic guidelines:
>>> - Include your full name with your message.
>>> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
>>> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier
> messages to keep
>> them short.
>>> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject
> header.
>>> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks
> or "flames."
>>> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
>>> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the
> various
>> resources on the homepage.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>> 
>>> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other
> resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
> resources on the homepage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 

----------------------
Robert Morrison
rmorrison@...

310-397-2704

4131 Bledsoe Ave.
Los Angeles, CA 90066

Fist truth. 
Learn English like if it was your mother language if you want to understand
something in the web about digital print.
Live in a country were you can find all those inks and paper you are talking
about.
Saludos
Aitor


> Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have an "etched" look
> with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has been the
> culmination and development of a number of traditional and digital
> techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it is, for the
> very first time I will tell all! ;-)
> 
> The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, nor are they
> the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then here it
> is.....;-)
> 
> Truth No. 1
> 
> Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no arguments....period.
> 
> Truth No. 2
> 
> Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate of testing,
> but you need to know what your materials will do.
> 
> Truth No. 3
> 
> Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a religion and
> I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it is. Process
> your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the grain
> proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where there is
> less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver. And, most
> importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will exhibit
> strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas of tonal
> change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. Especially so with
> low light situations, soft light, and fog!
> 
> You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
> 
> Truth No. 4
> 
> No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new fangled Imacon
> is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell them you want
> absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no gamma
> adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 bit files.
> Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of the drum
> scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That is, scan at
> 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The reason for this
> is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the grain. If
> you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust the aperture
> and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will be the most
> georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
> 
> This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to CCD
> scanners.
> 
> Truth No. 5
> 
> Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you can in 16
> bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections and
> adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16 bit file
> as needed.
> 
> Truth No. 6
> 
> Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying Epson Archival
> (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers are 100%
> Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right blacks,
> lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
> 
> Truth No. 7
> 
> Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, and in my
> town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so fast, that
> in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
> 
> 
>> >
>>>>>>> > >>>>>Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
>> > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.<<<<<<
>> >
>> >
>> > That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
>> > quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one of
>> > those exibition prints.
>> >
>> > Bruce McElhaney
>> > McElhaney Portrait Studio
>> > Livonia, MI
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
>>> > > In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>>> > > butchhul@a... writes:
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>>> > > > George,
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > > I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. Just
>>>> > > > finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I finished
>> > this
>>>> > > > past weekend.
>>> > > Butch,
>>> > > Thanks for responding to my query.
>>> > > I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and are
>> > happy with it.
>>> > > Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a sign of
>> > lack of usage
>>> > > rather than dissatisfaction.
>>> > > Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your exhibition
>> > leads to
>>> > > many other successes.
>>> > > (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine source
>>> > > of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
>>> > > I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he offered
>> > his
>>> > > knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously offered
>> > to send a
>>> > > sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
>>> > > They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope some of the
>> > best
>>> > > things that come around come back to  Mike.
>>> > > This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that I can
>> > someday
>>> > > contribute to it in a positive way.
>>> > > ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
>>> > > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
>>> > > Sounds like an amazing feat!
>>> > > Thanks again,
>>> > > George J Kunze
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>> >
>> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>> >
>> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
>> > - Include your full name with your message.
>> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
>> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
>> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
>> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
>> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
>> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
> resources on the homepage.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>> >
>> >
> 
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other
> resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
> resources on the homepage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

"Romping in the swamp" has become a recent theme. However this 
weekend will be a "stay at home" weekend. Next week will be the last 
trip down into the Big Cypress until next winter. The mosquitos 
should be in full bloom very shortly.

Mike
 
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Robert Morrison 
<rmorrison@p...> wrote:
> On 4/4/02 9:18 PM, "tomoc" <tomoc@y...> wrote:
> 
> > Truth Number 8:
> > 
> > Don't bother printing it unless it is a Kravit-perfect image!
> > 
> Well that would certainly save money...but my printer would clog 
from lack
> of use!  I've been seeing a lot of Kravit images lately...and they 
look
> really good...even as jpg's...Michael's been hanging out in the 
swamp...and
> has drum scanned show and tell.
> 
> Robert
> 
> 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Michael Kravit"
> > <michael.kravit@w...> wrote:
> >> Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have 
an "etched"
> > look
> >> with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has
> > been the
> >> culmination and development of a number of traditional and 
digital
> >> techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it
> > is, for the
> >> very first time I will tell all! ;-)
> >> 
> >> The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, 
nor
> > are they
> >> the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then 
here
> > it
> >> is.....;-)
> >> 
> >> Truth No. 1
> >> 
> >> Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no
> > arguments....period.
> >> 
> >> Truth No. 2
> >> 
> >> Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate 
of
> > testing,
> >> but you need to know what your materials will do.
> >> 
> >> Truth No. 3
> >> 
> >> Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a
> > religion and
> >> I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it 
is.
> > Process
> >> your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the
> > grain
> >> proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where
> > there is
> >> less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver.
> > And, most
> >> importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will
> > exhibit
> >> strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas 
of
> > tonal
> >> change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. 
Especially
> > so with
> >> low light situations, soft light, and fog!
> >> 
> >> You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
> >> 
> >> Truth No. 4
> >> 
> >> No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new 
fangled
> > Imacon
> >> is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell 
them
> > you want
> >> absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no
> > gamma
> >> adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 
bit
> > files.
> >> Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of 
the
> > drum
> >> scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That 
is,
> > scan at
> >> 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The 
reason
> > for this
> >> is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the
> > grain. If
> >> you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust 
the
> > aperture
> >> and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will 
be
> > the most
> >> georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
> >> 
> >> This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to 
CCD
> >> scanners.
> >> 
> >> Truth No. 5
> >> 
> >> Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you 
can
> > in 16
> >> bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections 
and
> >> adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16
> > bit file
> >> as needed.
> >> 
> >> Truth No. 6
> >> 
> >> Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying 
Epson
> > Archival
> >> (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers 
are
> > 100%
> >> Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right
> > blacks,
> >> lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
> >> 
> >> Truth No. 7
> >> 
> >> Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, 
and
> > in my
> >> town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so
> > fast, that
> >> in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
> >> 
> >> Mike
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@t...>
> >> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> >> Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
> >> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
> >> 
> >> 
> >>> 
> >>>>>>>> Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> >>> on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo 
Matt.<<<<<<
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
> >>> quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one of
> >>> those exibition prints.
> >>> 
> >>> Bruce McElhaney
> >>> McElhaney Portrait Studio
> >>> Livonia, MI
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
> >>>> In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> >>>> butchhul@a... writes:
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>>> George,
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. Just
> >>>>> finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I finished
> >>> this
> >>>>> past weekend.
> >>>> Butch,
> >>>> Thanks for responding to my query.
> >>>> I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and are
> >>> happy with it.
> >>>> Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a sign of
> >>> lack of usage
> >>>> rather than dissatisfaction.
> >>>> Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your 
exhibition
> >>> leads to
> >>>> many other successes.
> >>>> (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine
> > source
> >>>> of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
> >>>> I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he
> > offered
> >>> his
> >>>> knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously
> > offered
> >>> to send a
> >>>> sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
> >>>> They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope some of
> > the
> >>> best
> >>>> things that come around come back to  Mike.
> >>>> This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that I 
can
> >>> someday
> >>>> contribute to it in a positive way.
> >>>> ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> >>>> on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
> >>>> Sounds like an amazing feat!
> >>>> Thanks again,
> >>>> George J Kunze
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks,
> > Polls and
> >> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> >>> 
> >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >>> 
> >>> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> >>> - Include your full name with your message.
> >>> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> >>> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier
> > messages to keep
> >> them short.
> >>> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the 
subject
> > header.
> >>> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks
> > or "flames."
> >>> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> >>> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the
> > various
> >> resources on the homepage.
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >>> 
> >>> 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
Polls and other
> > resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > 
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to keep
> > them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
or "flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
various
> > resources on the homepage.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

> > 
> > 
> 
> ----------------------
> Robert Morrison
> rmorrison@p...
> 
> 310-397-2704
> 
> 4131 Bledsoe Ave.
> Los Angeles, CA 90066

I have heard really good things about DiXactol. 

I have not had the time to check it out and I have about a gallon of 
PMK on the shelf. Considering that I use 15ml of PMK per roll of 
film, the gallon will last quite some time. BTW, the older it gets, 
the better it gets.

I will order some and check it out in the near future.

Mike

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Nij aoth44" <nigel@m...> 
wrote:
> Hi Mike,
> 
> Thank you...
> 
> Have a look at DiXactol on this site: http://www.barrythornton.com 
I don't

Saludos,

That is the truth!

I wish I had listened to my parents and listened better in Spanish 
class. I took Spanish for 3 years in Junior High School and 3 years 
in High School and can only count to 10!

My office is like the United Nations. I have 1 architect from 
Venezuela, 2 from Columbia, 1 from Vietnam, and my office manager is 
fron Puerto Rico. I really wish I had learned other languages.

Mike


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Aitor.p.inclan" 
<aitor.p.inclan@a...> wrote:
> Fist truth. 
> Learn English like if it was your mother language if you want to 
understand
> something in the web about digital print.
> Live in a country were you can find all those inks and paper you 
are talking

> about.
> Saludos
> Aitor

It was...shucks...I had thrown my D1x and my SS4000 out the window...darn...

:-(

Robert

On 4/5/02 7:21 AM, "mkravit" <michael.kravit@...> wrote:

> "Romping in the swamp" has become a recent theme. However this
> weekend will be a "stay at home" weekend. Next week will be the last
> trip down into the Big Cypress until next winter. The mosquitos
> should be in full bloom very shortly.
> 
> Mike
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Robert Morrison
> <rmorrison@p...> wrote:
>> On 4/4/02 9:18 PM, "tomoc" <tomoc@y...> wrote:
>> 
>>> Truth Number 8:
>>> 
>>> Don't bother printing it unless it is a Kravit-perfect image!
>>> 
>> Well that would certainly save money...but my printer would clog
> from lack
>> of use!  I've been seeing a lot of Kravit images lately...and they
> look
>> really good...even as jpg's...Michael's been hanging out in the
> swamp...and
>> has drum scanned show and tell.
>> 
>> Robert
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Michael Kravit"
>>> <michael.kravit@w...> wrote:
>>>> Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have
> an "etched"
>>> look
>>>> with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has
>>> been the
>>>> culmination and development of a number of traditional and
> digital
>>>> techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it
>>> is, for the
>>>> very first time I will tell all! ;-)
>>>> 
>>>> The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion,
> nor
>>> are they
>>>> the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then
> here
>>> it
>>>> is.....;-)
>>>> 
>>>> Truth No. 1
>>>> 
>>>> Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no
>>> arguments....period.
>>>> 
>>>> Truth No. 2
>>>> 
>>>> Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate
> of
>>> testing,
>>>> but you need to know what your materials will do.
>>>> 
>>>> Truth No. 3
>>>> 
>>>> Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a
>>> religion and
>>>> I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it
> is.
>>> Process
>>>> your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the
>>> grain
>>>> proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where
>>> there is
>>>> less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver.
>>> And, most
>>>> importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will
>>> exhibit
>>>> strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas
> of
>>> tonal
>>>> change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints.
> Especially
>>> so with
>>>> low light situations, soft light, and fog!
>>>> 
>>>> You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
>>>> 
>>>> Truth No. 4
>>>> 
>>>> No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new
> fangled
>>> Imacon
>>>> is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell
> them
>>> you want
>>>> absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no
>>> gamma
>>>> adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48
> bit
>>> files.
>>>> Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of
> the
>>> drum
>>>> scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That
> is,
>>> scan at
>>>> 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The
> reason
>>> for this
>>>> is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the
>>> grain. If
>>>> you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust
> the
>>> aperture
>>>> and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will
> be
>>> the most
>>>> georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
>>>> 
>>>> This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to
> CCD
>>>> scanners.
>>>> 
>>>> Truth No. 5
>>>> 
>>>> Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you
> can
>>> in 16
>>>> bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections
> and
>>>> adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16
>>> bit file
>>>> as needed.
>>>> 
>>>> Truth No. 6
>>>> 
>>>> Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying
> Epson
>>> Archival
>>>> (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers
> are
>>> 100%
>>>> Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right
>>> blacks,
>>>> lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
>>>> 
>>>> Truth No. 7
>>>> 
>>>> Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom,
> and
>>> in my
>>>> town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so
>>> fast, that
>>>> in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@t...>
>>>> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
>>>> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
>>>>> on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo
> Matt.<<<<<<
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
>>>>> quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one of
>>>>> those exibition prints.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Bruce McElhaney
>>>>> McElhaney Portrait Studio
>>>>> Livonia, MI
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
>>>>>> In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>>>>>> butchhul@a... writes:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> George,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. Just
>>>>>>> finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I finished
>>>>> this
>>>>>>> past weekend.
>>>>>> Butch,
>>>>>> Thanks for responding to my query.
>>>>>> I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and are
>>>>> happy with it.
>>>>>> Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a sign of
>>>>> lack of usage
>>>>>> rather than dissatisfaction.
>>>>>> Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your
> exhibition
>>>>> leads to
>>>>>> many other successes.
>>>>>> (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine
>>> source
>>>>>> of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
>>>>>> I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he
>>> offered
>>>>> his
>>>>>> knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously
>>> offered
>>>>> to send a
>>>>>> sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
>>>>>> They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope some of
>>> the
>>>>> best
>>>>>> things that come around come back to  Mike.
>>>>>> This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that I
> can
>>>>> someday
>>>>>> contribute to it in a positive way.
>>>>>> ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
>>>>>> on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
>>>>>> Sounds like an amazing feat!
>>>>>> Thanks again,
>>>>>> George J Kunze
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks,
>>> Polls and
>>>> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>>>>> 
>>>>> Please follow these basic guidelines:
>>>>> - Include your full name with your message.
>>>>> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
>>>>> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier
>>> messages to keep
>>>> them short.
>>>>> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the
> subject
>>> header.
>>>>> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks
>>> or "flames."
>>>>> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
>>>>> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the
>>> various
>>>> resources on the homepage.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
>>> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks,
> Polls and other
>>> resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>>> 
>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>>> 
>>> Please follow these basic guidelines:
>>> - Include your full name with your message.
>>> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
>>> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier
> messages to keep
>>> them short.
>>> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject
> header.
>>> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks
> or "flames."
>>> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
>>> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the
> various
>>> resources on the homepage.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> ----------------------
>> Robert Morrison
>> rmorrison@p...
>> 
>> 310-397-2704
>> 
>> 4131 Bledsoe Ave.
>> Los Angeles, CA 90066
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other
> resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
> resources on the homepage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 

----------------------
Robert Morrison
rmorrison@...

310-397-2704

4131 Bledsoe Ave.
Los Angeles, CA 90066

Post scriptum to the inlays about English and best methods!!
Satir???

I'm an amateur - heavy one.....
I have friends living on photographing....
We talk to each other......

WE agree on that the best photoes was not of the best qulity
ones, are NOT made by the best cameras or papers and etc etc etc....

1/ The photoes has of good composition
2/ The amateur/pro used his material with his scill
   and know how about "that film" "that paper" "his longed
   earned experimenting with it etc etc.
3/ He didn't necesserely had that 2000$ tripoid with him/her
   at that very moment
4/ The chemical used was regular!
5/ His heart was in it.....
6/ He was there - or he, better knew - to be THERE!
7/ He often had his thumb in the middle of his hand - but he knew
   that!
8/ The grain was VISIBLE . ...HUUUH....what a pitty....
9/ My comment - the grain DID ENHANCE the "picture"
10/ Their eqipment was not "the best".
11/ Some of them got prices her in Sweden for "best that..." and
    best of "this" etc.
12/ They are still using lenses and cameras that some of us would't
    touch  - but they know their limits!!!
13/ Some of them went - as "classics" here in Sweden.
14/ Their "souping" had shocked You.
15/ They wouldn't touch a colorfilm...
16/ Some of them are poor......but happy... giving a d--n...
    but very respected....
17/ They are both amateurs and pros!
etc etc...

To You starting "picturing" - give a "d--n"!!

AND they don't know a world of English more from that coming from 
their TV-sets looking at Humphrey Bogart films like "Casablanca"
 
Telling them about Epson - Quad - Computers - they don't listen - 
they apologize and go for the darkroom to get some pease!

I use quad and expensive things - they don't know the 
word "drumscan" - however THEY still manage.

I love my friends - this is a contribute to my fellows - It's me being
crazy - I love new things - but has never gotten the reputation my
fellows have - using old fasion methods.

So - I keep strugling - with this new things...
However my friends and fellows say they love my "pictures" even after
40 years.......even if they say "how did you manage that light" -
Photoshop of cause -- "Whats that??"

WE are getting old.....

I don't know if quality is "drumscan" that and that and this - 
I think it's one word "PRESENST TENSE FORM" and "BEING THERE" and 
BEING YOURSELF" - giving a damn about things just knowing the limits
of what we have as equipment.

They are crazy????

Is Sweden 75 years back of everything conserning Photo?

I don't think so!

How shall I help them going the "Piezo" - And thev "QUAD" way....

This is said - as a thought - to the previous inlays in this thread.
Yes I agree we ought to learn pure English at first - and then sent 
to hospital for using old cameras and darkrooms ----

They could have a "Macdonalds Hamburger" in front of their two screen 
computers making "Quads".

How can I help them?

Please - just ironics about my friends - I'll try to show them
a Hahnemülle paper this evening and my setup...

Huuh...

I don't think they will be interested......

I fully agree with the inlays here ... but...

Bo Wrangborg
Sweden

/Hasselblad, Minolta Dual Scan Multi PRO, Three 1290(80)
the whole house full of B/W negatives - a corner for my friends
and a still burning interest for the "picture".
And of cause I almost forgot - four children, a wife and a big Dog!
The Dog do understand me! He sleeps under the computer!/





 




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Aitor.p.inclan" 
<aitor.p.inclan@a...> wrote:
> Fist truth. 
> Learn English like if it was your mother language if you want to 
understand
> something in the web about digital print.
> Live in a country were you can find all those inks and paper you 
are talking
> about.
> Saludos
> Aitor
> 
> 
> > Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have 
an "etched" look
> > with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has 
been the
> > culmination and development of a number of traditional and digital
> > techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it 
is, for the
> > very first time I will tell all! ;-)
> > 
> > The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, 
nor are they
> > the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then 
here it
> > is.....;-)
> > 
> > Truth No. 1
> > 
> > Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no 
arguments....period.
> > 
> > Truth No. 2
> > 
> > Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate 
of testing,
> > but you need to know what your materials will do.
> > 
> > Truth No. 3
> > 
> > Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a 
religion and
> > I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it 
is. Process
> > your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the 
grain
> > proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where 
there is
> > less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver. 
And, most
> > importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will 
exhibit
> > strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas 
of tonal
> > change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. 
Especially so with
> > low light situations, soft light, and fog!
> > 
> > You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
> > 
> > Truth No. 4
> > 
> > No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new 
fangled Imacon
> > is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell 
them you want
> > absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no 
gamma
> > adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 
bit files.
> > Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of 
the drum
> > scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That 
is, scan at
> > 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The 
reason for this
> > is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the 
grain. If
> > you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust 
the aperture
> > and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will 
be the most
> > georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
> > 
> > This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to 
CCD
> > scanners.
> > 
> > Truth No. 5
> > 
> > Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you 
can in 16
> > bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections 
and
> > adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16 
bit file
> > as needed.
> > 
> > Truth No. 6
> > 
> > Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying 
Epson Archival
> > (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers 
are 100%
> > Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right 
blacks,
> > lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
> > 
> > Truth No. 7
> > 
> > Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, 
and in my
> > town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so 
fast, that
> > in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
> > 
> > Mike
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@t...>
> > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
> > Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
> > 
> > 
> >> >
> >>>>>>> > >>>>>Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> >> > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo 
Matt.<<<<<<
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
> >> > quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one 
of
> >> > those exibition prints.
> >> >
> >> > Bruce McElhaney
> >> > McElhaney Portrait Studio
> >> > Livonia, MI
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... 
wrote:
> >>> > > In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard 
Time,
> >>> > > butchhul@a... writes:
> >>> > >
> >>> > >
> >>>> > > > George,
> >>>> > > >
> >>>> > > > I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. 
Just
> >>>> > > > finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I 
finished
> >> > this
> >>>> > > > past weekend.
> >>> > > Butch,
> >>> > > Thanks for responding to my query.
> >>> > > I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and 
are
> >> > happy with it.
> >>> > > Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a 
sign of
> >> > lack of usage
> >>> > > rather than dissatisfaction.
> >>> > > Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your 
exhibition
> >> > leads to
> >>> > > many other successes.
> >>> > > (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine 
source
> >>> > > of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
> >>> > > I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he 
offered
> >> > his
> >>> > > knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously 
offered
> >> > to send a
> >>> > > sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
> >>> > > They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope 
some of the
> >> > best
> >>> > > things that come around come back to  Mike.
> >>> > > This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that 
I can
> >> > someday
> >>> > > contribute to it in a positive way.
> >>> > > ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> >>> > > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
> >>> > > Sounds like an amazing feat!
> >>> > > Thanks again,
> >>> > > George J Kunze
> >>> > >
> >>> > >
> >>> > >
> >>> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
Polls and
> > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> >> >
> >> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >> >
> >> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> >> > - Include your full name with your message.
> >> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> >> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to keep
> > them short.
> >> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the 
subject header.
> >> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
or "flames."
> >> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> >> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and 
the various
> > resources on the homepage.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >> >
> >> >
> > 
> > 
> > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > ADVERTISEMENT
> > 
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
Polls and other
> > resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > 
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to keep
> > them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
or "flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
various
> > resources on the homepage.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of 
Service

> > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robert,

I am still amazed at the image quality that my D1X produces. I was 
under the impression that the image would fall apart where there was 
a lot of fine complex detail, such as fields of grass, forests, etc. 
But, the more I use this camera, the more amazed I am at the quality 
of the images.

Mike


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Robert Morrison 
<rmorrison@p...> wrote:
> It was...shucks...I had thrown my D1x and my SS4000 out the 
window...darn...

> 
> :-(
> 
> Robert

Bo,

Thank you for the wonderful story. It sounds like your friends are 
happy and content with what they are doing. To tell you the truth, 
the only reason I switched from a wet traditional darkroom to digital 
is because I became sensitized (allergic) to the chemicals I was 
using to produce platinum prints. When I switched, I made the 
decision that I would ONLY switch if I could make prints that 
compared to the quality and expressiveness of platinum.

I have been able to obtain this goal. But, you are 100% correct in 
that a technically perfect print DOES NOT make a great photograph. 
The heart, soul, and talent of the photographer all contribute to the 
image.

Some of the greatest images I have seen were made by friends with a 
Holga and it's plastic lens. 

Show your buddies the Hahnemuhle paper, if they do not like it, well 
that is too bad as it is a lovely paper.

Have a wonderful weeekend in Sweden.

Best Regards
Mike



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "sm7bxd" <sm7bxd@y...> 
wrote:
> Post scriptum to the inlays about English and best methods!!
> Satir???
> 
> I'm an amateur - heavy one.....
> I have friends living on photographing....
> We talk to each other......
> 
> WE agree on that the best photoes was not of the best qulity
> ones, are NOT made by the best cameras or papers and etc etc etc....
> 
> 1/ The photoes has of good composition
> 2/ The amateur/pro used his material with his scill
>    and know how about "that film" "that paper" "his longed
>    earned experimenting with it etc etc.
> 3/ He didn't necesserely had that 2000$ tripoid with him/her
>    at that very moment
> 4/ The chemical used was regular!
> 5/ His heart was in it.....
> 6/ He was there - or he, better knew - to be THERE!
> 7/ He often had his thumb in the middle of his hand - but he knew
>    that!
> 8/ The grain was VISIBLE . ...HUUUH....what a pitty....
> 9/ My comment - the grain DID ENHANCE the "picture"
> 10/ Their eqipment was not "the best".
> 11/ Some of them got prices her in Sweden for "best that..." and
>     best of "this" etc.
> 12/ They are still using lenses and cameras that some of us would't
>     touch  - but they know their limits!!!
> 13/ Some of them went - as "classics" here in Sweden.
> 14/ Their "souping" had shocked You.
> 15/ They wouldn't touch a colorfilm...
> 16/ Some of them are poor......but happy... giving a d--n...
>     but very respected....
> 17/ They are both amateurs and pros!
> etc etc...
> 
> To You starting "picturing" - give a "d--n"!!
> 
> AND they don't know a world of English more from that coming from 
> their TV-sets looking at Humphrey Bogart films like "Casablanca"
>  
> Telling them about Epson - Quad - Computers - they don't listen - 
> they apologize and go for the darkroom to get some pease!
> 
> I use quad and expensive things - they don't know the 
> word "drumscan" - however THEY still manage.
> 
> I love my friends - this is a contribute to my fellows - It's me 
being
> crazy - I love new things - but has never gotten the reputation my
> fellows have - using old fasion methods.
> 
> So - I keep strugling - with this new things...
> However my friends and fellows say they love my "pictures" even 
after
> 40 years.......even if they say "how did you manage that light" -
> Photoshop of cause -- "Whats that??"
> 
> WE are getting old.....
> 
> I don't know if quality is "drumscan" that and that and this - 
> I think it's one word "PRESENST TENSE FORM" and "BEING THERE" and 
> BEING YOURSELF" - giving a damn about things just knowing the limits
> of what we have as equipment.
> 
> They are crazy????
> 
> Is Sweden 75 years back of everything conserning Photo?
> 
> I don't think so!
> 
> How shall I help them going the "Piezo" - And thev "QUAD" way....
> 
> This is said - as a thought - to the previous inlays in this thread.
> Yes I agree we ought to learn pure English at first - and then sent 
> to hospital for using old cameras and darkrooms ----
> 
> They could have a "Macdonalds Hamburger" in front of their two 
screen 
> computers making "Quads".
> 
> How can I help them?
> 
> Please - just ironics about my friends - I'll try to show them
> a Hahnemülle paper this evening and my setup...
> 
> Huuh...
> 
> I don't think they will be interested......
> 
> I fully agree with the inlays here ... but...
> 
> Bo Wrangborg
> Sweden
> 
> /Hasselblad, Minolta Dual Scan Multi PRO, Three 1290(80)
> the whole house full of B/W negatives - a corner for my friends
> and a still burning interest for the "picture".
> And of cause I almost forgot - four children, a wife and a big Dog!
> The Dog do understand me! He sleeps under the computer!/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Aitor.p.inclan" 
> <aitor.p.inclan@a...> wrote:
> > Fist truth. 
> > Learn English like if it was your mother language if you want to 
> understand
> > something in the web about digital print.
> > Live in a country were you can find all those inks and paper you 
> are talking
> > about.
> > Saludos
> > Aitor
> > 
> > 
> > > Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have 
> an "etched" look
> > > with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability 
has 
> been the
> > > culmination and development of a number of traditional and 
digital
> > > techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here 
it 
> is, for the
> > > very first time I will tell all! ;-)
> > > 
> > > The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, 
> nor are they
> > > the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then 
> here it
> > > is.....;-)
> > > 
> > > Truth No. 1
> > > 
> > > Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no 
> arguments....period.
> > > 
> > > Truth No. 2
> > > 
> > > Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate 
> of testing,
> > > but you need to know what your materials will do.
> > > 
> > > Truth No. 3
> > > 
> > > Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a 
> religion and
> > > I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it 
> is. Process
> > > your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the 
> grain
> > > proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas 
where 
> there is
> > > less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver. 
> And, most
> > > importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and 
will 
> exhibit
> > > strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas 
> of tonal
> > > change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. 
> Especially so with
> > > low light situations, soft light, and fog!
> > > 
> > > You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
> > > 
> > > Truth No. 4
> > > 
> > > No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new 
> fangled Imacon
> > > is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell 
> them you want
> > > absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and 
no 
> gamma
> > > adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 
> bit files.
> > > Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of 
> the drum
> > > scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That 
> is, scan at
> > > 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The 
> reason for this
> > > is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the 
> grain. If
> > > you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust 
> the aperture
> > > and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan 
will 
> be the most
> > > georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
> > > 
> > > This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to 
> CCD
> > > scanners.
> > > 
> > > Truth No. 5
> > > 
> > > Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you 
> can in 16
> > > bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make 
selections 
> and
> > > adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 
16 
> bit file
> > > as needed.
> > > 
> > > Truth No. 6
> > > 
> > > Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying 
> Epson Archival
> > > (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers 
> are 100%
> > > Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right 
> blacks,
> > > lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
> > > 
> > > Truth No. 7
> > > 
> > > Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, 
> and in my
> > > town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing 
so 
> fast, that
> > > in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
> > > 
> > > Mike
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@t...>
> > > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
> > > Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
> > > 
> > > 
> > >> >
> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> > >> > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo 
> Matt.<<<<<<
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind 
of
> > >> > quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see 
one 
> of
> > >> > those exibition prints.
> > >> >
> > >> > Bruce McElhaney
> > >> > McElhaney Portrait Studio
> > >> > Livonia, MI
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... 
> wrote:
> > >>> > > In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard 
> Time,
> > >>> > > butchhul@a... writes:
> > >>> > >
> > >>> > >
> > >>>> > > > George,
> > >>>> > > >
> > >>>> > > > I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS 
inks. 
> Just
> > >>>> > > > finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I 
> finished
> > >> > this
> > >>>> > > > past weekend.
> > >>> > > Butch,
> > >>> > > Thanks for responding to my query.
> > >>> > > I am glad to hear from others who are using the system 
and 
> are
> > >> > happy with it.
> > >>> > > Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a 
> sign of
> > >> > lack of usage
> > >>> > > rather than dissatisfaction.
> > >>> > > Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your 
> exhibition
> > >> > leads to
> > >>> > > many other successes.
> > >>> > > (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a 
fine 
> source
> > >>> > > of information for any traveling down this particular 
road.)
> > >>> > > I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he 
> offered
> > >> > his
> > >>> > > knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously 
> offered
> > >> > to send a
> > >>> > > sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
> > >>> > > They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope 
> some of the
> > >> > best
> > >>> > > things that come around come back to  Mike.
> > >>> > > This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope 
that 
> I can
> > >> > someday
> > >>> > > contribute to it in a positive way.
> > >>> > > ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> > >>> > > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo 
Matt.)
> > >>> > > Sounds like an amazing feat!
> > >>> > > Thanks again,
> > >>> > > George J Kunze
> > >>> > >
> > >>> > >
> > >>> > >
> > >>> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, 
Bookmarks, 
> Polls and
> > > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > >> >
> > >> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > >> >
> > >> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > >> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > >> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > >> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
> messages to keep
> > > them short.
> > >> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the 
> subject header.
> > >> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
> or "flames."
> > >> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > >> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and 
> the various
> > > resources on the homepage.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > > ADVERTISEMENT
> > > 
> > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
> Polls and other
> > > resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > > 
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > > 
> > > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > - Include your full name with your message.
> > > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
> messages to keep
> > > them short.
> > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the 
subject 
> header.
> > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
> or "flames."
> > > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and 
the 

> various
> > > resources on the homepage.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of 
> Service
> > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mike, 

Do you have a web page or images on the web?

Helene


> 
> 
> "Romping in the swamp" has become a recent theme. However this 
> weekend will be a "stay at home" weekend. Next week will be the last 
> trip down into the Big Cypress until next winter. The mosquitos 
> should be in full bloom very shortly.
> 
> Mike
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Robert Morrison 
> <rmorrison@p...> wrote:
> > On 4/4/02 9:18 PM, "tomoc" <tomoc@y...> wrote:
> > 
> > > Truth Number 8:
> > > 
> > > Don't bother printing it unless it is a Kravit-perfect image!
> > > 
> > Well that would certainly save money...but my printer would clog 
> from lack
> > of use!  I've been seeing a lot of Kravit images lately...and they 
> look
> > really good...even as jpg's...Michael's been hanging out in the 
> swamp...and
> > has drum scanned show and tell.
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying 
>Epson Archival (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The
>better papers  are 100% Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you
>obtain deep dense right blacks, lovely midtones and brilliant
>highlights.

All my prints have been on Epson Archival Matte; and the only other paper that I have tried is Somerset Velvet Enhanced, which I did not like because it made the already warm tones of Piezo inks even warmer and had a surface texture that I would not like for most prints. Which cotton rag paper do you recommend and how is its tone neautarlity compared to EAM?
 
--Mitch

Verdad, pero tiene tiempo ahora!
t

> From: "mkravit" <michael.kravit@...>
> Reply-To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Fri, 05 Apr 2002 15:29:48 -0000
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] The 7 Truths of Digital Printing!
> 
> Saludos,
> 
> That is the truth!
> 
> I wish I had listened to my parents and listened better in Spanish
> class. I took Spanish for 3 years in Junior High School and 3 years
> in High School and can only count to 10!
> 
> My office is like the United Nations. I have 1 architect from
> Venezuela, 2 from Columbia, 1 from Vietnam, and my office manager is
> fron Puerto Rico. I really wish I had learned other languages.
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Aitor.p.inclan"
> <aitor.p.inclan@a...> wrote:
>> Fist truth. 
>> Learn English like if it was your mother language if you want to
> understand
>> something in the web about digital print.
>> Live in a country were you can find all those inks and paper you
> are talking
>> about.
>> Saludos
>> Aitor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other
> resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
> resources on the homepage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
>

I believe you are being quite unfair to this sincerely held set of values
which I would claim could be likened, if you will, to the seven pillars of
Piezo Wisdom.


----- Original Message -----
From: "tomoc" <tomoc@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 6:18 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: The 7 Truths of Digital Printing!


> Truth Number 8:
>
> Don't bother printing it unless it is a Kravit-perfect image!
>
> Tom O'Connell
>
> TomOC@...
> www.thomasoconnell.com
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Michael Kravit"
> <michael.kravit@w...> wrote:
> > Many people ask me how is it that my inkjet prints have an "etched"
> look
> > with rich deep blacks and brilliant highlights.  This ability has
> been the
> > culmination and development of a number of traditional and digital
> > techniques that I have come to use over the years. Well, here it
> is, for the
> > very first time I will tell all! ;-)
> >
> > The following truths are true. They are not open to discussion, nor
> are they
> > the only workflow available. But!, if you want the truth, then here
> it
> > is.....;-)
> >
> > Truth No. 1
> >
> > Use great optics! No buts about it, no discussions no
> arguments....period.
> >
> > Truth No. 2
> >
> > Shoot your film and learn the Zone system. I am not an advocate of
> testing,
> > but you need to know what your materials will do.
> >
> > Truth No. 3
> >
> > Process your negatives in a staining Pyro developer. This is a
> religion and
> > I fully understand that. BUT, you wanted the truth, so here it is.
> Process
> > your negatives in PMK Pyro. The stain acts fills in between the
> grain
> > proportionately, That is, more stain builds up in the areas where
> there is
> > less silver and less stain in areas where there is more silver.
> And, most
> > importantly the negatives will have very high accutance and will
> exhibit
> > strong edge effects. You will see a fine black line along areas of
> tonal
> > change. The negatives will glow and so will your prints. Especially
> so with
> > low light situations, soft light, and fog!
> >
> > You may not agree, but hey the truth hurts!
> >
> > Truth No. 4
> >
> > No matter how good your service bureau tells you their new fangled
> Imacon
> > is, insist on a drum scan. Insist on a flat scan, that is tell them
> you want
> > absolutely NO ADJUSTMENTS. No USM, no contrast adjustments and no
> gamma
> > adjustments. Ask them to scan your PMK Pyro negatives as RGB 48 bit
> files.
> > Have them scan using a native optical resolution resolution of the
> drum
> > scanners that is the smallest resolution that you can use. That is,
> scan at
> > 300dpi at the image size rather than at 4000dpi at 1:1. The reason
> for this
> > is simple, at the lower dpi settings the drum will not scan the
> grain. If
> > you scan at the higher resolutions the drum scanner will adjust the
> aperture
> > and will scan right down into the grain and your Tri-X scan will be
> the most
> > georgeous example of TX grain you have ever seen.
> >
> > This applies to drum scanners omly and may not be applicable to CCD
> > scanners.
> >
> > Truth No. 5
> >
> > Do as many of the tonal, contrast, and gamma adjustments as you can
> in 16
> > bit mode. Use duplicate copies of your images to make selections and
> > adjustment layers. Then you can copy these selections into the 16
> bit file
> > as needed.
> >
> > Truth No. 6
> >
> > Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying Epson
> Archival
> > (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The better papers are
> 100%
> > Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you obtain deep dense right
> blacks,
> > lovely midtones and brilliant highlights.
> >
> > Truth No. 7
> >
> > Whatever I say here works for me in my studio, in my darkroom, and
> in my
> > town. It may not work for you in yours. Technology is changing so
> fast, that
> > in 15 minutes everything that I just told you make be untrue!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "btmcelhaney" <kmcelhaney@t...>
> > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 11:25 PM
> > Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Piezo Pro 24 RIP
> >
> >
> > >
> > > >>>>>Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> > > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.<<<<<<
> > >
> > >
> > > That sounds nearly impossible to do while retaining any kind of
> > > quality! What's the secret? I would certainly like to see one of
> > > those exibition prints.
> > >
> > > Bruce McElhaney
> > > McElhaney Portrait Studio
> > > Livonia, MI
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
> > > > In a message dated 4/2/2002 10:34:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> > > > butchhul@a... writes:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > George,
> > > > >
> > > > > I am also using a 7000 with the IP4 RIP and MIS-FS inks. Just
> > > > > finished framing and hanging a show of prints that I finished
> > > this
> > > > > past weekend.
> > > > Butch,
> > > > Thanks for responding to my query.
> > > > I am glad to hear from others who are using the system and are
> > > happy with it.
> > > > Not too many people chimed in, which I am guessing is a sign of
> > > lack of usage
> > > > rather than dissatisfaction.
> > > > Congratulations on your apparent success. I hope your exhibition
> > > leads to
> > > > many other successes.
> > > > (Must also say, Mike Kravit is both a gentleman and a fine
> source
> > > > of information for any traveling down this particular road.)
> > > > I must agree with you 110% on this point. Not only has he
> offered
> > > his
> > > > knowlege, experience and expertise, but he has generously
> offered
> > > to send a
> > > > sample print so I can put an eyeball on the picture!
> > > > They say that what goes around, comes around, so I hope some of
> the
> > > best
> > > > things that come around come back to  Mike.
> > > > This list is a pleasure to participate in, and I hope that I can
> > > someday
> > > > contribute to it in a positive way.
> > > > ( Images from 35mm Tri-X, scanned at 2800 dpi
> > > > on Minolta Multi, printed 18x27 on 24x36 Legion Photo Matt.)
> > > > Sounds like an amazing feat!
> > > > Thanks again,
> > > > George J Kunze
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks,
> Polls and
> > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > >
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > >
> > > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > - Include your full name with your message.
> > > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier
> messages to keep
> > them short.
> > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject
> header.
> > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks
> or "flames."
> > > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the
> various
> > resources on the homepage.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >
> > >
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Helene,

www.kravit.net

Mike

----- Original Message -----
From: <grdglass@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 1:22 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: The 7 Truths of Digital Printing!


> Mike,
>
> Do you have a web page or images on the web?
>
> Helene
>
>
> >
> >
> > "Romping in the swamp" has become a recent theme. However this
> > weekend will be a "stay at home" weekend. Next week will be the last
> > trip down into the Big Cypress until next winter. The mosquitos
> > should be in full bloom very shortly.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Robert Morrison
> > <rmorrison@p...> wrote:
> > > On 4/4/02 9:18 PM, "tomoc" <tomoc@y...> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Truth Number 8:
> > > >
> > > > Don't bother printing it unless it is a Kravit-perfect image!
> > > >
> > > Well that would certainly save money...but my printer would clog
> > from lack
> > > of use!  I've been seeing a lot of Kravit images lately...and they
> > look
> > > really good...even as jpg's...Michael's been hanging out in the
> > swamp...and
> > > has drum scanned show and tell.
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

The Hahnemuhle, BrightCube, Legion, Hawk Mountain, and Crane papers are all
very good.

Mike

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mitch Alland" <malland@...>
To: <digitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 4:28 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: The 7 Truths of Digital Printing!


> >Buy the best paper you can. Saving $0.50 per sheet and buying
> >Epson Archival (Enhanced) Matte is silly and short sighted. The
> >better papers  are 100% Cotton Rag, acid free and will help you
> >obtain deep dense right blacks, lovely midtones and brilliant
> >highlights.
>
> All my prints have been on Epson Archival Matte; and the only other paper
that I have tried is Somerset Velvet Enhanced, which I did not like because
it made the already warm tones of Piezo inks even warmer and had a surface
texture that I would not like for most prints. Which cotton rag paper do you
recommend and how is its tone neautarlity compared to EAM?
>
> --Mitch