Digital BW, The Print

Well, as I said. If you read the various documents regarding intellectual
copyright on Yahoo, you don't have the right to do what you are doing. You
will be making money from the folk who post to the list - as I said in my
last post - would you use someone's photos without permission? Have you
asked Yahoo if you can use their archive? If you check their site they
specifically ask to be informed of material posted to Yahoo appearing on
other sites.

Julian
----- Original Message -----
From: "greg_pop" <greg@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 8:29 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: binbooks


> Julian,
>
> I didn't quite see it that way. I feel that I am providing a new
> service which organises and presents in a nicer way information
> that is already available to everybody. I even think that it
> could be a usefull resource for this group as when the same
> questions arise you can point to the old discussions on the
> same subject.
>
> As for the 'for profit' topic, If I can't hope to make money one day,
> there is no way I can keep doing the work required in updating the
> Photo Binbook. But I have not yet earned a cent from this :-(.
>
> Again, I did not mean to offend anyone or to 'steal' anything. I'll
> definitely remove your postings as you requested, Julian, as well
> as those of anyone who requests it.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Gregory
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Julian Thomas"
> <julianthomas@t...> wrote:
> > Just for info...
> > I've had a couple of very polite email exchanges with Gregory
> > of Binbooks. Binbooks is a for profit site. I've asked him to
> > remove my emails from his site. Although he has fully credited
> > all the emails, I'm not happy with Binbooks attempting to make
> > money out of the knowledge and skills that folk
> > on the list have spent a long time and money developing.
> >
> > Julian
> > -----------------------------------
> > Julian Thomas
> > Bruc 168-6-1
> > 08037 Barcelona
> >
> > Website at www.foundobjectsgallery.com
> >
> > current exhibition: www.thesight.com
> >
> > Gallery at http://www.mwords.co.uk/galleryGuests.htm#
> >
> > Streetphotography at
> > http://www.borderless-photos.de/jthomas/jthomas-01.html
> >
> > tfno 679676321
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
"flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

> I didn't quite see it that way. I feel that I am providing a new
> service which organises and presents in a nicer way information
> that is already available to everybody. I even think that it
> could be a usefull resource for this group as when the same
> questions arise you can point to the old discussions on the
> same subject.

How you "see" doesn't matter. Even if the information is available to
"everybody" (meaning Yahoo group subsribers), the information is NOT YOURS
to make available. Whether or not you present the information in a different
manner is totally irrelevant, and certainly does not justify copyright
infrigement on your part.

> As for the 'for profit' topic, If I can't hope to make money one day,
> there is no way I can keep doing the work required in updating the
> Photo Binbook. But I have not yet earned a cent from this :-(.

Nor should you if you're using stolen information. Even if your site was
non-profit, what you're doing is still wrong. You're treading a thin legal
and ethical line, and you'll live to regret it if Yahoo should every take
legal action against you.

> Again, I did not mean to offend anyone or to 'steal' anything.

If you are sincere about it, then you should immediately remove all postings
stolen from this group, and include only the messages of those who opt in.
Canada recently passed a law making negative-option marketing illegal, other
countries may already have exisiting similar laws.

>> Again, I did not mean to offend anyone or to 'steal' anything.
> 
> If you are sincere about it, then you should immediately remove all postings
> stolen from this group, and include only the messages of those who opt in.
> Canada recently passed a law making negative-option marketing illegal, other
> countries may already have exisiting similar laws.

They sure did, interesting comparison Moreno.

Carolyn

I agree with Julian. Yahoo owns this content and an agreement would need to 
be reached with them before using it. It costs Yahoo money to run this 
forum (computers, disk space, software, network lines, support personnel, 
on and on). What Yahoo gets in return is an avenue to shows us ads (if we 
access the forum via a Web browser), a targeted e-mail list for potential 
direct advertising, and a general (hopefully) positive experience with 
Yahoo that would cause us to choose Yahoo for other services and information.

By replicating forums posts and threads somewhere else, you have diminished 
or completely removed the aforementioned benefits Yahoo gains from 
providing this forum at no cost to the participants. In my opinion, if you 
don't contact Yahoo and obtain authorization to replicate this content, you 
will likely face legal action in the future. Such action may be potentially 
costly to you.

Jeff Greer

At 08:46 PM 05/15/2002 +0200, you wrote:

>Well, as I said. If you read the various documents regarding intellectual
>copyright on Yahoo, you don't have the right to do what you are doing. You
>will be making money from the folk who post to the list - as I said in my
>last post - would you use someone's photos without permission? Have you
>asked Yahoo if you can use their archive? If you check their site they
>specifically ask to be informed of material posted to Yahoo appearing on
>other sites.
>
>Julian
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "greg_pop" <greg@...>
>To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 8:29 PM
>Subject: [Digital BW] Re: binbooks
>
>
> > Julian,
> >
> > I didn't quite see it that way. I feel that I am providing a new
> > service which organises and presents in a nicer way information
> > that is already available to everybody. I even think that it
> > could be a usefull resource for this group as when the same
> > questions arise you can point to the old discussions on the
> > same subject.
> >
> > As for the 'for profit' topic, If I can't hope to make money one day,
> > there is no way I can keep doing the work required in updating the
> > Photo Binbook. But I have not yet earned a cent from this :-(.
> >
> > Again, I did not mean to offend anyone or to 'steal' anything. I'll
> > definitely remove your postings as you requested, Julian, as well
> > as those of anyone who requests it.
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Gregory
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Julian Thomas"
> > <julianthomas@t...> wrote:
> > > Just for info...
> > > I've had a couple of very polite email exchanges with Gregory
> > > of Binbooks. Binbooks is a for profit site. I've asked him to
> > > remove my emails from his site. Although he has fully credited
> > > all the emails, I'm not happy with Binbooks attempting to make
> > > money out of the knowledge and skills that folk
> > > on the list have spent a long time and money developing.
> > >
> > > Julian
> > > -----------------------------------
> > > Julian Thomas
> > > Bruc 168-6-1
> > > 08037 Barcelona
> > >
> > > Website at www.foundobjectsgallery.com
> > >
> > > current exhibition: www.thesight.com
> > >
> > > Gallery at http://www.mwords.co.uk/galleryGuests.htm#
> > >
> > > Streetphotography at
> > > http://www.borderless-photos.de/jthomas/jthomas-01.html
> > >
> > > tfno 679676321
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
>other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
>them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
>"flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
>resources on the homepage.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and 
>other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
>Please follow these basic guidelines:
>- Include your full name with your message.
>- Include the address of your website, if you have one.
>- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep 
>them short.
>- As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
>- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or 
>"flames."
>- Complete your Yahoo profile.
>- Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various 
>resources on the homepage.
>
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

After Yahoo reset all our privacy settings so we were signed up for spam 
without our permission and then signed us giving they permission to 
monitor our internet use again without our permission, I'm not sure they 
are going to do much sword rattling toward anyone. They are going to be 
quite busy answering questions from (at least) the FL attorney general 
over their violation of  consumer protection law. They are on pretty 
shaky ground on this issue.

Truman

J Greer wrote:

> I agree with Julian. Yahoo owns this content and an agreement would 
> need to
> be reached with them before using it. It costs Yahoo money to run this
> forum (computers, disk space, software, network lines, support personnel,
> on and on). What Yahoo gets in return is an avenue to shows us ads (if we
> access the forum via a Web browser), a targeted e-mail list for potential
> direct advertising, and a general (hopefully) positive experience with
> Yahoo that would cause us to choose Yahoo for other services and 
> information.
>
> By replicating forums posts and threads somewhere else, you have 
> diminished
> or completely removed the aforementioned benefits Yahoo gains from
> providing this forum at no cost to the participants. In my opinion, if 
> you
> don't contact Yahoo and obtain authorization to replicate this 
> content, you
> will likely face legal action in the future. Such action may be 
> potentially
> costly to you.
>
> Jeff Greer