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Thread
2003-08-09 by jmoore172002
I searched the archive and I could not track down answers to these two print coating related questions: 1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not coating with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival properties of Piezography carbon prints? 2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and drymount press?
2003-08-10 by Paul Roark
jeffmoore17@... wrote: >1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not coating >with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival >properties of Piezography carbon prints? I've fade-tested coated v. non-coated prints. I assume the MIS and Piezo inks are about the same. In general, the coated blacks faded a bit faster, although I think that could well be due to the higher dmax raising the temperature (by absorbing more light). The black ink in the test was the MIS VM-K (probably the same as PiezoBW K). The 50% patches were generally the same in terms of their fade rates. There was one other situation that seemed to accelerate the coated print fading. I tested one group under very high humidity conditions. (The test light, etc. were right over a tray of water.) The coated print did fade faster. The uncoated prints faded at essentially the same rate as the low-humidity tests. I speculate that the difference could be that the hot light artificially dries the un-coated prints, whereas the coating traps the water around the pigments. In general, we've always been led to believe that high humidity accelerates fading, but this has never shown up in my tests except for the coated prints. One of the criticisms of accelerated testing is that it artificially dries the inks, with the result that the fade rate is reduced. So, I have 2 test results that seem to favor un-coated prints. I'm very suspicious that both are more artifacts of the testing than predictors of faster fading for PUR-coated prints. >2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing >period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and >drymount press? Yes, I've used Seal Colormount at 180 degrees f. Be sure to use fresh release paper and wait the full 7-day curing period. Also, with trimming the prints, a rotary trimmer might be a good idea. I've noticed a bit of edge roughness when trimming with a straight razor knife. As an aside, one of the PUR experts told me that heat accelerates the cross-linking and curing. Heating the PUR soon after application might actually make for stronger coating -- bringing the strength/extent of cross-lining of the single-solution, water-borne products close to the industrial products. (The adhesion of a water-borne PUR will not, however, match the solvent-based products.) This heating information suggests that the use of a hair-drier might not only speed the drying and curing, but also result in a stronger coating. Paul http://www.PaulRoark.com
2003-08-10 by Robert Morrison
I haven't tested the hydrocote coated prints, but when I was testing a variety of of different acrylic based coatings with piezo inks I found that under dry south window testing the coating improved the fade by up to 100%...so this is the opposite of Paul's results with the Hydrocote. Honestly I'm still a bit skeptical of the aliphatic polyurethanes being as good for paper coating as the acrylics...but this is not based on actual comparative testing...just my knowledge of the respective chemistries. Robert
On Saturday, August 9, 2003, at 06:35 PM, Paul Roark wrote: > jeffmoore17@... wrote: > >> 1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not coating >> with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival >> properties of Piezography carbon prints? > > I've fade-tested coated v. non-coated prints. I assume the MIS and > Piezo > inks are about the same. In general, the coated blacks faded a bit > faster, > although I think that could well be due to the higher dmax raising the > temperature (by absorbing more light). The black ink in the test was > the > MIS VM-K (probably the same as PiezoBW K). The 50% patches were > generally > the same in terms of their fade rates. > > There was one other situation that seemed to accelerate the coated > print > fading. I tested one group under very high humidity conditions. (The > test > light, etc. were right over a tray of water.) The coated print did > fade > faster. The uncoated prints faded at essentially the same rate as the > low-humidity tests. I speculate that the difference could be that the > hot > light artificially dries the un-coated prints, whereas the coating > traps the > water around the pigments. > > In general, we've always been led to believe that high humidity > accelerates > fading, but this has never shown up in my tests except for the coated > prints. One of the criticisms of accelerated testing is that it > artificially dries the inks, with the result that the fade rate is > reduced. > > So, I have 2 test results that seem to favor un-coated prints. I'm > very > suspicious that both are more artifacts of the testing than predictors > of > faster fading for PUR-coated prints. > >> 2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing >> period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and >> drymount press? > > Yes, I've used Seal Colormount at 180 degrees f. Be sure to use fresh > release paper and wait the full 7-day curing period. Also, with > trimming > the prints, a rotary trimmer might be a good idea. I've noticed a bit > of > edge roughness when trimming with a straight razor knife. > > As an aside, one of the PUR experts told me that heat accelerates the > cross-linking and curing. Heating the PUR soon after application might > actually make for stronger coating -- bringing the strength/extent of > cross-lining of the single-solution, water-borne products close to the > industrial products. (The adhesion of a water-borne PUR will not, > however, > match the solvent-based products.) This heating information suggests > that > the use of a hair-drier might not only speed the drying and curing, > but also > result in a stronger coating. > > Paul > http://www.PaulRoark.com > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls > and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting > this same page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - Include your full name with your message. > - Include the address of your website, if you have one. > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to > keep them short. > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject > header. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames > - Complete your Yahoo profile. > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the > various resources on the homepage. > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > >
2003-08-10 by garethlock4472
Found this link yesterday of anyone if anyone is interested http://www.livick.com/method/inkjet/pg1.htm Not into coating myself but thought you lot might like a read Gareth --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Robert Morrison <rmorrison@p...> wrote: > I haven't tested the hydrocote coated prints, but when I was testing a > variety of of different acrylic based coatings with piezo inks I found > that under dry south window testing the coating improved the fade by up > to 100%...so this is the opposite of Paul's results with the Hydrocote. > Honestly I'm still a bit skeptical of the aliphatic polyurethanes > being as good for paper coating as the acrylics...but this is not based > on actual comparative testing...just my knowledge of the respective > chemistries. > > Robert > > > On Saturday, August 9, 2003, at 06:35 PM, Paul Roark wrote: > > > jeffmoore17@c... wrote: > > > >> 1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not coating > >> with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival > >> properties of Piezography carbon prints? > > > > I've fade-tested coated v. non-coated prints. I assume the MIS and > > Piezo > > inks are about the same. In general, the coated blacks faded a bit > > faster, > > although I think that could well be due to the higher dmax raising the > > temperature (by absorbing more light). The black ink in the test was > > the > > MIS VM-K (probably the same as PiezoBW K). The 50% patches were > > generally > > the same in terms of their fade rates. > > > > There was one other situation that seemed to accelerate the coated > > print > > fading. I tested one group under very high humidity conditions. (The > > test > > light, etc. were right over a tray of water.) The coated print did > > fade > > faster. The uncoated prints faded at essentially the same rate as the > > low-humidity tests. I speculate that the difference could be that the > > hot > > light artificially dries the un-coated prints, whereas the coating > > traps the > > water around the pigments. > > > > In general, we've always been led to believe that high humidity > > accelerates > > fading, but this has never shown up in my tests except for the coated > > prints. One of the criticisms of accelerated testing is that it > > artificially dries the inks, with the result that the fade rate is > > reduced. > > > > So, I have 2 test results that seem to favor un-coated prints. I'm > > very > > suspicious that both are more artifacts of the testing than predictors > > of > > faster fading for PUR-coated prints. > > > >> 2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing > >> period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and > >> drymount press? > > > > Yes, I've used Seal Colormount at 180 degrees f. Be sure to use fresh > > release paper and wait the full 7-day curing period. Also, with > > trimming > > the prints, a rotary trimmer might be a good idea. I've noticed a bit > > of > > edge roughness when trimming with a straight razor knife. > > > > As an aside, one of the PUR experts told me that heat accelerates the > > cross-linking and curing. Heating the PUR soon after application might > > actually make for stronger coating -- bringing the strength/extent of > > cross-lining of the single-solution, water-borne products close to the > > industrial products. (The adhesion of a water-borne PUR will not, > > however, > > match the solvent-based products.) This heating information suggests > > that > > the use of a hair-drier might not only speed the drying and curing, > > but also > > result in a stronger coating. > > > > Paul > > http://www.PaulRoark.com > > > > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls > > and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at: > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish > > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting > > this same page. > > > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > > - Include your full name with your message. > > - Include the address of your website, if you have one. > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to > > keep them short. > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject > > header. > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile. > > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the > > various resources on the homepage. > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > >
2003-08-10 by Steven Schaefer
Is the Clear Shield, Livick uses the Minwax floor product? And has any one used this on there prints? Steve garethlock4472 wrote:
> > Found this link yesterday of anyone if anyone is interested > > http://www.livick.com/method/inkjet/pg1.htm > > Not into coating myself but thought you lot might like a read > > Gareth > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Robert Morrison > <rmorrison@p...> wrote: > > I haven't tested the hydrocote coated prints, but when I was > testing a > > variety of of different acrylic based coatings with piezo inks I > found > > that under dry south window testing the coating improved the fade > by up > > to 100%...so this is the opposite of Paul's results with the > Hydrocote. > > Honestly I'm still a bit skeptical of the aliphatic polyurethanes > > being as good for paper coating as the acrylics...but this is not > based > > on actual comparative testing...just my knowledge of the respective > > chemistries. > > > > Robert > > > > > > On Saturday, August 9, 2003, at 06:35 PM, Paul Roark wrote: > > > > > jeffmoore17@c... wrote: > > > > > >> 1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not > coating > > >> with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival > > >> properties of Piezography carbon prints? > > > > > > I've fade-tested coated v. non-coated prints. I assume the MIS > and > > > Piezo > > > inks are about the same. In general, the coated blacks faded a > bit > > > faster, > > > although I think that could well be due to the higher dmax > raising the > > > temperature (by absorbing more light). The black ink in the test > was > > > the > > > MIS VM-K (probably the same as PiezoBW K). The 50% patches were > > > generally > > > the same in terms of their fade rates. > > > > > > There was one other situation that seemed to accelerate the > coated > > > print > > > fading. I tested one group under very high humidity conditions. > (The > > > test > > > light, etc. were right over a tray of water.) The coated print > did > > > fade > > > faster. The uncoated prints faded at essentially the same rate > as the > > > low-humidity tests. I speculate that the difference could be > that the > > > hot > > > light artificially dries the un-coated prints, whereas the > coating > > > traps the > > > water around the pigments. > > > > > > In general, we've always been led to believe that high humidity > > > accelerates > > > fading, but this has never shown up in my tests except for the > coated > > > prints. One of the criticisms of accelerated testing is that it > > > artificially dries the inks, with the result that the fade rate > is > > > reduced. > > > > > > So, I have 2 test results that seem to favor un-coated prints. > I'm > > > very > > > suspicious that both are more artifacts of the testing than > predictors > > > of > > > faster fading for PUR-coated prints. > > > > > >> 2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing > > >> period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and > > >> drymount press? > > > > > > Yes, I've used Seal Colormount at 180 degrees f. Be sure to use > fresh > > > release paper and wait the full 7-day curing period. Also, with > > > trimming > > > the prints, a rotary trimmer might be a good idea. I've noticed > a bit > > > of > > > edge roughness when trimming with a straight razor knife. > > > > > > As an aside, one of the PUR experts told me that heat accelerates > the > > > cross-linking and curing. Heating the PUR soon after application > might > > > actually make for stronger coating -- bringing the > strength/extent of > > > cross-lining of the single-solution, water-borne products close > to the > > > industrial products. (The adhesion of a water-borne PUR will > not, > > > however, > > > match the solvent-based products.) This heating information > suggests > > > that > > > the use of a hair-drier might not only speed the drying and > curing, > > > but also > > > result in a stronger coating. > > > > > > Paul > > > http://www.PaulRoark.com > > > > > > > > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, > Polls > > > and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is > at: > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > > > > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you > wish > > > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by > visiting > > > this same page. > > > > > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > > > - Include your full name with your message. > > > - Include the address of your website, if you have one. > > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier > messages to > > > keep them short. > > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject > > > header. > > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or > flames > > > - Complete your Yahoo profile. > > > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the > > > various resources on the homepage. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > [click here] > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls > and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting > this same page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - Include your full name with your message. > - Include the address of your website, if you have one. > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to > keep them short. > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject > header. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames > - Complete your Yahoo profile. > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the > various resources on the homepage. > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
2003-08-10 by Paul Roark
Gareth, >Found this link yesterday of anyone if anyone is interested >http://www.livick.com/method/inkjet/pg1.htm Note that the test strips that show a positive effect from coating with UV blocking sprays were in direct sun. Sun has a lot of UV in it. Glass filters out the shorter and most damaging UV. Acrylic filters out even more. So, comparison of tests conducted in direct sun will show much more effect from the UV filtering sprays than will inside or fluorescent light tests. For outside display, there seems little question that UV coatings are a very good idea. For inside display, I think there will be little difference between coated and non-coated prints with respect to fading. In my fluorescent light testing I see little of no effect from most coatings. I found that by the time I had the amount of UV coating that Golden (perhaps the best supplier of acrylic coatings) recommended, the yellowing was noticeable. This might not be the case with all of these, but I decided, given the lack of significant protective effects that I saw, that I'd be better off just avoiding the UV absorbing additives. Golden's technical person also noted that the solvent-based UV coatings are much more effective than the water-borne UV coatings. Paul http://www.PaulRoark.com __________________________________________________ --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Robert Morrison <rmorrison@p...> wrote: > I haven't tested the hydrocote coated prints, but when I was testing a > variety of of different acrylic based coatings with piezo inks I found > that under dry south window testing the coating improved the fade by up > to 100%...so this is the opposite of Paul's results with the Hydrocote. > Honestly I'm still a bit skeptical of the aliphatic polyurethanes > being as good for paper coating as the acrylics...but this is not based > on actual comparative testing...just my knowledge of the respective > chemistries. > > Robert > > > On Saturday, August 9, 2003, at 06:35 PM, Paul Roark wrote: > > > jeffmoore17@c... wrote: > > > >> 1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not coating > >> with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival > >> properties of Piezography carbon prints? > > > > I've fade-tested coated v. non-coated prints. I assume the MIS and > > Piezo > > inks are about the same. In general, the coated blacks faded a bit > > faster, > > although I think that could well be due to the higher dmax raising the > > temperature (by absorbing more light). The black ink in the test was > > the > > MIS VM-K (probably the same as PiezoBW K). The 50% patches were > > generally > > the same in terms of their fade rates. > > > > There was one other situation that seemed to accelerate the coated > > print > > fading. I tested one group under very high humidity conditions. (The > > test > > light, etc. were right over a tray of water.) The coated print did > > fade > > faster. The uncoated prints faded at essentially the same rate as the > > low-humidity tests. I speculate that the difference could be that the > > hot > > light artificially dries the un-coated prints, whereas the coating > > traps the > > water around the pigments. > > > > In general, we've always been led to believe that high humidity > > accelerates > > fading, but this has never shown up in my tests except for the coated > > prints. One of the criticisms of accelerated testing is that it > > artificially dries the inks, with the result that the fade rate is > > reduced. > > > > So, I have 2 test results that seem to favor un-coated prints. I'm > > very > > suspicious that both are more artifacts of the testing than predictors > > of > > faster fading for PUR-coated prints. > > > >> 2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing > >> period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and > >> drymount press? > > > > Yes, I've used Seal Colormount at 180 degrees f. Be sure to use fresh > > release paper and wait the full 7-day curing period. Also, with > > trimming > > the prints, a rotary trimmer might be a good idea. I've noticed a bit > > of > > edge roughness when trimming with a straight razor knife. > > > > As an aside, one of the PUR experts told me that heat accelerates the > > cross-linking and curing. Heating the PUR soon after application might > > actually make for stronger coating -- bringing the strength/extent of > > cross-lining of the single-solution, water-borne products close to the > > industrial products. (The adhesion of a water-borne PUR will not, > > however, > > match the solvent-based products.) This heating information suggests > > that > > the use of a hair-drier might not only speed the drying and curing, > > but also > > result in a stronger coating. > > > > Paul > > http://www.PaulRoark.com > > > > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls > > and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at: > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish > > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting > > this same page. > > > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > > - Include your full name with your message. > > - Include the address of your website, if you have one. > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to > > keep them short. > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject > > header. > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames > > - Complete your Yahoo profile. > > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the > > various resources on the homepage. > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page. Please follow these basic guidelines: - Include your full name with your message. - Include the address of your website, if you have one. - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them short. - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header. - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames - Complete your Yahoo profile. - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various resources on the homepage. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
2003-08-10 by Robert Morrison
No, but it is a polyacrylic with added light stabilizer made specifically for coating signs. http://www.clearstarcorp.com/clearshield.asp It has a UV absorber in it...but I seriously doubt that's what making it work well...its simply the polyacrylic protecting the pigments from air. I've used the clearshield before. I find the Hydrocote easier to work with, but with slight diluting it could be a good solution for rod coating. I think it could also be sprayed, likewise with diluting. I used the semi-gloss product, but my guess is that a mix of the matte and semi-gloss would probably get us to the gloss level that we are looking for. The Clearshield is less toxic than the Hydrocote because of the co-solvents that they use. Robert
On Sunday, August 10, 2003, at 05:13 AM, Steven Schaefer wrote: > Is the Clear Shield, Livick uses the Minwax floor product? > > And has any one used this on there prints? > > Steve > > garethlock4472 wrote: >> >> Found this link yesterday of anyone if anyone is interested >> >> http://www.livick.com/method/inkjet/pg1.htm >> >> Not into coating myself but thought you lot might like a read >> >> Gareth >> >> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Robert Morrison >> <rmorrison@p...> wrote: >>> I haven't tested the hydrocote coated prints, but when I was >> testing a >>> variety of of different acrylic based coatings with piezo inks I >> found >>> that under dry south window testing the coating improved the fade >> by up >>> to 100%...so this is the opposite of Paul's results with the >> Hydrocote. >>> Honestly I'm still a bit skeptical of the aliphatic polyurethanes >>> being as good for paper coating as the acrylics...but this is not >> based >>> on actual comparative testing...just my knowledge of the respective >>> chemistries. >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> >>> On Saturday, August 9, 2003, at 06:35 PM, Paul Roark wrote: >>> >>>> jeffmoore17@c... wrote: >>>> >>>>> 1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not >> coating >>>>> with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival >>>>> properties of Piezography carbon prints? >>>> >>>> I've fade-tested coated v. non-coated prints. I assume the MIS >> and >>>> Piezo >>>> inks are about the same. In general, the coated blacks faded a >> bit >>>> faster, >>>> although I think that could well be due to the higher dmax >> raising the >>>> temperature (by absorbing more light). The black ink in the test >> was >>>> the >>>> MIS VM-K (probably the same as PiezoBW K). The 50% patches were >>>> generally >>>> the same in terms of their fade rates. >>>> >>>> There was one other situation that seemed to accelerate the >> coated >>>> print >>>> fading. I tested one group under very high humidity conditions. >> (The >>>> test >>>> light, etc. were right over a tray of water.) The coated print >> did >>>> fade >>>> faster. The uncoated prints faded at essentially the same rate >> as the >>>> low-humidity tests. I speculate that the difference could be >> that the >>>> hot >>>> light artificially dries the un-coated prints, whereas the >> coating >>>> traps the >>>> water around the pigments. >>>> >>>> In general, we've always been led to believe that high humidity >>>> accelerates >>>> fading, but this has never shown up in my tests except for the >> coated >>>> prints. One of the criticisms of accelerated testing is that it >>>> artificially dries the inks, with the result that the fade rate >> is >>>> reduced. >>>> >>>> So, I have 2 test results that seem to favor un-coated prints. >> I'm >>>> very >>>> suspicious that both are more artifacts of the testing than >> predictors >>>> of >>>> faster fading for PUR-coated prints. >>>> >>>>> 2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing >>>>> period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and >>>>> drymount press? >>>> >>>> Yes, I've used Seal Colormount at 180 degrees f. Be sure to use >> fresh >>>> release paper and wait the full 7-day curing period. Also, with >>>> trimming >>>> the prints, a rotary trimmer might be a good idea. I've noticed >> a bit >>>> of >>>> edge roughness when trimming with a straight razor knife. >>>> >>>> As an aside, one of the PUR experts told me that heat accelerates >> the >>>> cross-linking and curing. Heating the PUR soon after application >> might >>>> actually make for stronger coating -- bringing the >> strength/extent of >>>> cross-lining of the single-solution, water-borne products close >> to the >>>> industrial products. (The adhesion of a water-borne PUR will >> not, >>>> however, >>>> match the solvent-based products.) This heating information >> suggests >>>> that >>>> the use of a hair-drier might not only speed the drying and >> curing, >>>> but also >>>> result in a stronger coating. >>>> >>>> Paul >>>> http://www.PaulRoark.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, >> Polls >>>> and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is >> at: >>>> >>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint >>>> >>>> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you >> wish >>>> to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by >> visiting >>>> this same page. >>>> >>>> Please follow these basic guidelines: >>>> - Include your full name with your message. >>>> - Include the address of your website, if you have one. >>>> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier >> messages to >>>> keep them short. >>>> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject >>>> header. >>>> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or >> flames >>>> - Complete your Yahoo profile. >>>> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the >>>> various resources on the homepage. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to >>>> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ >>>> >>>> >> >> Yahoo! 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2003-08-10 by Robert Morrison
Thanks Gareth, Great link. Its good to see some comparative testing of these products with the Ultrachromes. As Paul mentions in his later post this may only be part of the story, but it is very consistent with the testing that I did several years ago on the original piezo inks. Robert
On Sunday, August 10, 2003, at 01:19 AM, garethlock4472 wrote: > Found this link yesterday of anyone if anyone is interested > > http://www.livick.com/method/inkjet/pg1.htm > > Not into coating myself but thought you lot might like a read > > Gareth > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Robert Morrison > <rmorrison@p...> wrote: >> I haven't tested the hydrocote coated prints, but when I was > testing a >> variety of of different acrylic based coatings with piezo inks I > found >> that under dry south window testing the coating improved the fade > by up >> to 100%...so this is the opposite of Paul's results with the > Hydrocote. >> Honestly I'm still a bit skeptical of the aliphatic polyurethanes >> being as good for paper coating as the acrylics...but this is not > based >> on actual comparative testing...just my knowledge of the respective >> chemistries. >> >> Robert >> >> >> On Saturday, August 9, 2003, at 06:35 PM, Paul Roark wrote: >> >>> jeffmoore17@c... wrote: >>> >>>> 1) Has anyone done any testing on the issue of whether or not > coating >>>> with a product such as Hydrocote Polyshield affects the archival >>>> properties of Piezography carbon prints? >>> >>> I've fade-tested coated v. non-coated prints. I assume the MIS > and >>> Piezo >>> inks are about the same. In general, the coated blacks faded a > bit >>> faster, >>> although I think that could well be due to the higher dmax > raising the >>> temperature (by absorbing more light). The black ink in the test > was >>> the >>> MIS VM-K (probably the same as PiezoBW K). The 50% patches were >>> generally >>> the same in terms of their fade rates. >>> >>> There was one other situation that seemed to accelerate the > coated >>> print >>> fading. I tested one group under very high humidity conditions. > (The >>> test >>> light, etc. were right over a tray of water.) The coated print > did >>> fade >>> faster. The uncoated prints faded at essentially the same rate > as the >>> low-humidity tests. I speculate that the difference could be > that the >>> hot >>> light artificially dries the un-coated prints, whereas the > coating >>> traps the >>> water around the pigments. >>> >>> In general, we've always been led to believe that high humidity >>> accelerates >>> fading, but this has never shown up in my tests except for the > coated >>> prints. One of the criticisms of accelerated testing is that it >>> artificially dries the inks, with the result that the fade rate > is >>> reduced. >>> >>> So, I have 2 test results that seem to favor un-coated prints. > I'm >>> very >>> suspicious that both are more artifacts of the testing than > predictors >>> of >>> faster fading for PUR-coated prints. >>> >>>> 2) When coating Piezo prints with Hydrocote, after a good curing >>>> period, can these prints be drymounted, i.e., Seal tissue and >>>> drymount press? >>> >>> Yes, I've used Seal Colormount at 180 degrees f. Be sure to use > fresh >>> release paper and wait the full 7-day curing period. Also, with >>> trimming >>> the prints, a rotary trimmer might be a good idea. I've noticed > a bit >>> of >>> edge roughness when trimming with a straight razor knife. >>> >>> As an aside, one of the PUR experts told me that heat accelerates > the >>> cross-linking and curing. Heating the PUR soon after application > might >>> actually make for stronger coating -- bringing the > strength/extent of >>> cross-lining of the single-solution, water-borne products close > to the >>> industrial products. (The adhesion of a water-borne PUR will > not, >>> however, >>> match the solvent-based products.) This heating information > suggests >>> that >>> the use of a hair-drier might not only speed the drying and > curing, >>> but also >>> result in a stronger coating. >>> >>> Paul >>> http://www.PaulRoark.com >>> >>> >>> >>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, > Polls >>> and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is > at: >>> >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint >>> >>> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you > wish >>> to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by > visiting >>> this same page. >>> >>> Please follow these basic guidelines: >>> - Include your full name with your message. >>> - Include the address of your website, if you have one. >>> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier > messages to >>> keep them short. >>> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject >>> header. >>> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or > flames >>> - Complete your Yahoo profile. >>> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the >>> various resources on the homepage. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to >>> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ >>> >>> > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ---------------------~--> > Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for Your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark > Printer at Myinks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US & > Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 > http://us.click.yahoo.com/l.m7sD/LIdGAA/qnsNAA/ucIolB/TM > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > ~-> > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls > and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting > this same page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - Include your full name with your message. > - Include the address of your website, if you have one. > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to > keep them short. > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject > header. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames > - Complete your Yahoo profile. > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the > various resources on the homepage. > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > >