Digital BW, The Print

Hello All,

Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  Are they full spectrum as they
claim?

I have fluorescent lights with full spectrum tubes on the ceiling in
my work room, and they're great.  But I need to augment the light
right over my work table where I examine prints.  I would certainly
like to have a full spectrum lamp and the OTT Lights are the only ones
I've seen, but $50 for a clamp-on shelf light is a lot of money.

I just thought I'd check here first.  Is there another brand that's
cheaper?


Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

I have one - the floor lamp with a flexible neck - which I like, 
although I don't know whether it's full spectrum.

I can't remember what it cost, but I remember that I found the best 
price at an arts-and-crafts on-line outlet. I think they're popular 
with quilters and scrapbookers, etc. too. You might be able to 
examine some test sheets and prints under a variety of lights at such 
a store in a mall.
--
Sam

>Hello All,
>
>Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  Are they full spectrum as they
>claim?
>
>I have fluorescent lights with full spectrum tubes on the ceiling in
>my work room, and they're great.  But I need to augment the light
>right over my work table where I examine prints.  I would certainly
>like to have a full spectrum lamp and the OTT Lights are the only ones
>I've seen, but $50 for a clamp-on shelf light is a lot of money.
>
>I just thought I'd check here first.  Is there another brand that's
>cheaper?
>
>
>Regards,
>Clayton

>
> >
> >Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  Are they full spectrum as they
> >claim?
> >
> >I have fluorescent lights with full spectrum tubes on the ceiling in
> >my work room, and they're great.  But I need to augment the light
> >right over my work table where I examine prints.  I would certainly
> >like to have a full spectrum lamp and the OTT Lights are the only ones
> >I've seen, but $50 for a clamp-on shelf light is a lot of money.
> >
> >I just thought I'd check here first.  Is there another brand that's
> >cheaper?
> >
>

There is another brand, Solux (solux.net), which has had good 
recommendations from pro users.  Don't think it's cheaper, though.

James


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

James Irelan wrote:
>>>Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  Are they full spectrum as they
>>>claim?
>>>
>>>I have fluorescent lights with full spectrum tubes on the ceiling in
>>>my work room, and they're great.  But I need to augment the light
>>>right over my work table where I examine prints.  I would certainly
>>>like to have a full spectrum lamp and the OTT Lights are the only ones
>>>I've seen, but $50 for a clamp-on shelf light is a lot of money.
>>>
>>>I just thought I'd check here first.  Is there another brand that's
>>>cheaper?
>>>
>>
> 
> There is another brand, Solux (solux.net), which has had good 
> recommendations from pro users.  Don't think it's cheaper, though.
> 
> James

I'm using a compact fluorescent True-Light 15 W lamp in an 
Artemide Tolomeo Classic table model. EC made it says. The 
ventilation hole in the cap is blocked with adhesive aluminium 
foil from the inside by me so I don't have to look straight into 
the lamp itself. Enough ventilation for a compact fluorescent 
remains.

Ernst

Do we really want to examine prints under a spectrum that almost none of our
print buyers will possess?

On 7/8/04 5:20 AM, "Ernst Dinkla" <E.Dinkla@...> wrote:

> James Irelan wrote:
>>>> >>>Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  Are they full spectrum as they
>>>> >>>claim?



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones" 
<cj@c...> wrote:
> Hello All,
> 
> Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  > 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at    
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Hi, Clayton,

After recommendations on the Piezo list, a few years ago, I bought 
OTT lights from Radio Shack when I visited the DC area from Greece.  
(I found OTT to be a most unhelpful company who wouldn't ship 
overseas, scared I think by the fears of litigation.)

Using MIS FSN inks I found black and white prints had a green cast.  
I contacted a company in the Netherlands if I recall correctly, who 
sold the twirl vision master bulbs - I think that was the name.  I 
bought one of these and this was slightly magenta.  I now use both 
and find the combination, after a bit of faffing around, to be OK.

Next time I cross the pond I may buy the Solux brand mentioned by an 
earlier respondent.

Colin

Hello J,

>Do we really want to examine prints under a spectrum that almost 
>none of our print buyers will possess?

I am not prescient enough to know what kind of lighting my future
print buyers will or won't have.  In my case it is irrelevent because
I print Black Only with Eboni and my prints have no metamerism.  They
can be viewed under any kind of light.

As for whether someone might have it, daylight spectrum lighting is
steadily becoming more popular and widespread, both in business and
the home.  I discovered daylight tubes years ago and found that they
produced much less fatigue in the eyes after a full day in the
workplace.  Back then I had to buy them at a commercial electrical
supply.  Today they are cheaper and can be found at Home Depot and
other stores.  

They produce a bright white light that is very refreshing.  Even "Cool
White" fluorescent tubes are yellowish compared to these.  I have them
in my computer room at home where I spend many hours every day (self
employed, work at home).  They make a huge difference and I would not
use anything else.  They are also in my kitchen/dining area, and
visitors to my home often remark about the wonderful light they
produce.  They cost a few dollars more than other tubes, but are worth
every cent.

So as a general premise I would not accept the statement that almost
no print buyers will have daylight spectrum lighting.  If they are
enlightened people (pun intended, couldn't resist <g>) they will have
it.

My question about OTT lights is from my desire to add a lamp that is
similar to the existing light in the room.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

colingruk wrote:

> Using MIS FSN inks I found black and white prints had a green cast.  
> I contacted a company in the Netherlands if I recall correctly, who 
> sold the twirl vision master bulbs - I think that was the name.  I 
> bought one of these and this was slightly magenta.  I now use both 
> and find the combination, after a bit of faffing around, to be OK.
> 
> Next time I cross the pond I may buy the Solux brand mentioned by an 
> earlier respondent.
> 
> Colin

You got that address in the Netherlands from me at that time. 
That's the True-Lite lamp I'm using.  With Prove-it + the 
SpectroCam I can get the monitor close to the lamp's output.  The 
lamp I have is near 5700 K according to my SpectroCam. Matches 
the Just normlight for slides as well.

http://www.naturalite.nl/

Ernst

Colin,

If you are in the UK there is a supplier of Solux products in Cambridge. I
purchased the 50W 4700k bulbs from them last year. The web site is
www.outsidein.co.uk

Steve Chambers UK

> -----Original Message-----
> From: colingruk [mailto:colin.conway@...] 
> Sent: 08 July 2004 15:33
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: OTT Lights?
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones" 
> <cj@c...> wrote:
> > Hello All,
> > 
> > Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  > Regards, Clayton
> > 
> > 
> > Info on black and white digital printing at    
> > http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
> 
> Hi, Clayton,
> 
> After recommendations on the Piezo list, a few years ago, I 
> bought OTT lights from Radio Shack when I visited the DC area 
> from Greece.  
> (I found OTT to be a most unhelpful company who wouldn't ship 
> overseas, scared I think by the fears of litigation.)
> 
> Using MIS FSN inks I found black and white prints had a green cast.  
> I contacted a company in the Netherlands if I recall 
> correctly, who sold the twirl vision master bulbs - I think 
> that was the name.  I bought one of these and this was 
> slightly magenta.  I now use both and find the combination, 
> after a bit of faffing around, to be OK.
> 
> Next time I cross the pond I may buy the Solux brand 
> mentioned by an earlier respondent.
> 
> Colin
> 
> 
> 
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>

Thanks to everyone for the good tips and info.  I went to the
solux.net web site and they have some graphs showing the spectral
output of several brands, including OTT.

The OTT light is not as close to true daylight as the Solux.  The
report seems to lump it together with other daylight type fluorescent
bulbs as a general class.  If that is true, then the OTT probably is
similar to my current overhead lighting ("Sunshine" tubes by GE,
5000K, 90 CRI), which is far better than standard "Cool White" tubes
which are yellowish in comarison.

A clamp-on OTT is $50 in a local store.  Solux clamp-on models range
from $63 to $87 + shipping.  I wonder if its worth it...

I'll have to think about it for awhile.  Thanks again for the help.


Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

> Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  Are they full spectrum as 
they claim?
> 
Others have mentioned Solux lamps.

http://www.soluxlamps.com/

These are 12 volt MR16 style lamps, usually used in track lighting 
with fixtures that convert 120 vac to 12 vdc (Lowes or Home Depot).  
I have used them both at work (for a graphic artist) and installed 
some for my wife at home (color matching for hand sewn quilts).  In 
both instances, the Solux lamps approximate daylight very well and 
they have several different color ranges, measured in degrees Kelvin.

Long life and relatively inexpensive, they are a good point source of 
light.

Clayton, Panasonic makes a 5000 degree large bulb for about $15 (the last
time I looked the Ott was roughly 5000).  In my studio I have an inspection
easel (just like the wet darkroom) with cool fluorescent, 5000, tungsten and
qtz display, so I can check out the image profile selected in IP in various
spectra.  Just like in the wet darkroom, fluorescent bulbs will tend to
excite optical brighteners, and putting the light source too close will
result in a print "too dark" in normal light, esp when glazed.  I even have
one fluourescent array esp for reading that is 2700 degrees, and nothing
will work with it!

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Clayton Jones [mailto:cj@...] 
> Sent: Wednesday, July 07, 2004 9:12 PM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] OTT Lights?
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> Anyone had experience with OTT Lights?  Are they full 
> spectrum as they claim?
> 
> I have fluorescent lights with full spectrum tubes on the 
> ceiling in my work room, and they're great.  But I need to 
> augment the light right over my work table where I examine 
> prints.  I would certainly like to have a full spectrum lamp 
> and the OTT Lights are the only ones I've seen, but $50 for a 
> clamp-on shelf light is a lot of money.
> 
> I just thought I'd check here first.  Is there another brand 
> that's cheaper?
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at    
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
> --------------------~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for 
> only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/ucIolB/TM
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ------~-> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other 
> resources as they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or 
> you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership 
> preferences by visiting this same page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
> messages to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
> or flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be 
> removed from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of 
> digital B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic 
> posts may be removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group 
> rules and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and 
> decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See "Group 
> Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL 
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE 
> THAT THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT 
> YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, 
> INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY 
> DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF 
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN 
> IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT 
> YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH 
> DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE 
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED 
> ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) 
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, 
> THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO 
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
>

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Steven 
Chambers" <sjcmail@b...> wrote:
> Colin,
> 
> If you are in the UK there is a supplier of Solux products in 
Cambridge. I
> purchased the 50W 4700k bulbs from them last year. The web site is
> www.outsidein.co.uk
> 
> Steve Chambers UK


Steve,

I'm not but I will be tonight but then in France on leave for a 
couple of weeks.

I'll contact them when I return to Greece.

Colin

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Ernst Dinkla 
<E.Dinkla@c...> wrote:
> 
> 
> You got that address in the Netherlands from me at that time. 
> That's the True-Lite lamp I'm using.  With Prove-it + the 
> SpectroCam I can get the monitor close to the lamp's output.  The 
> lamp I have is near 5700 K according to my SpectroCam. Matches 
> the Just normlight for slides as well.
> 
> http://www.naturalite.nl/
> 
> Ernst

Ernst,

I guess I didn't thank you for the tip, for which I now apologise.

The set up of the two lights now works quite well for me but, between 
them they are a bit bright so the image is abouta metre and a half 
away to compensate.

Colin

Colin