Digital BW, The Print

Apparently there wasn't one before, or it's not readily available.

Because this is my first attempt at profiling and I prefer not to work
in isolation, I'd appreciate feedback on this curve. It should provide
superior tonal separation in midtones and deep blacks.

http://www.pmb.net/darkroom/2005/02/curve-for-epson-1280-inkjet-black-only.html

-Pieris
digital darkroom blog: http://www.pmb.net/darkroom

Hello Pieris,

>Apparently there wasn't one before, or it's not readily available.
>
>Because this is my first attempt at profiling and I prefer not to
>work in isolation, I'd appreciate feedback on this curve. It should
>provide superior tonal separation in midtones and deep blacks.

After quite extensive experimenting with BO printing I found that
canned curves aren't necessary for BO, and in fact are largely
ineffective in the sense that a curve worked out for one image is
usually not appropriate for another.  Any fixed curve that is applied
universally to every image will likely be a compromise in some way. 
That's why you don't find any BO curves published anywhere.

The reason for this is that curves/profiles are needed with ink
systems that blend multiple inks because they are controlling the
places where the different inks cut in and out.  Since different
papers react differently to the inks, a different curve is needed for
each ink/paper combination.  

With BO printing only one ink is used so the problem of partitioning
doesn't exist.  The basic workflow is to use a common paper for all
proofing, such as EEM, and work up an image to its best appearance
(using levels, curves, whatever) on that paper, and then save the
image. This image will always look its best on EEM as is, and the
proof then serves as the model for final prints on fine art papers.

For final prints, depending on the paper used, a contrast curve may be
needed to adjust the image to match the proof, because the different
papers have different contrasts, very much like silver gelatin papers.
 This curve will usually be different for each paper, and a curve for
an image on Condor BW, for example, will most likely not be
appropriate for a different image on that paper.  So even these
paper-specific contrast curves can't be applied to every image.  These
curves are usually quick and easy to create, and can be saved either
as an adjustment layer in the image or in a curves file (I use the
former method, even though it adds to file size, because it's more
convenient).

This is one reason why BO printing is so easy - we don't need canned
curves and aren't dependent on someone with a densitometer or other
form of expertise to provide them.  There's more to good BO printing
than just the curves, of course.  A more detailed explanation is found
in a series of articles at the link below.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Clayton,

Sorry to take so long to get back to your post on this topic. Some
unfortunate incidents last week put me out of work for a few days.

I understand what you're saying when you say no one curve can be
applied to any image to make a black-only print. I also recognize that
each image needs the careful attention of the printer's craft to best
represent the aesthetic that the photographer intends. There is no
one-stop solution for this, and the curve I made is certainly not
going to help the printer who is looking for such a panacea.

What I found when I tried BO printing was that the straight printing
method was giving me very, very different looking images from the FS
prints I had been making. They had a very sharp toe and very long,
drawn out midtones and highlights. If I wanted my print to look like
that, it should look like that on-screen.

I do not have a perfect WYSIWYG workflow for FS printing but it's very
good. BO printing with the traditional "just click print" method was
not giving me what I wanted, especially when I'm trying to compare BO
printing to FS printing.

So, for the purpose of (1) WYSIWYG workflow and (2) swapping between
QTR-FS/Roark-FS/BO and trying to get similar results, I made that
curve. I'm not saying I have achieved both of these goals yet, but I
am convinced that profiling curves are necessary to get there.

Regard,
-Pieris

digital darkroom blog: http://www.pmb.net/darkroom

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones"
<cj@c...> wrote:
> 
> Hello Pieris,
> 
> >Apparently there wasn't one before, or it's not readily available.
> >
> >Because this is my first attempt at profiling and I prefer not to
> >work in isolation, I'd appreciate feedback on this curve. It should
> >provide superior tonal separation in midtones and deep blacks.
> 
> After quite extensive experimenting with BO printing I found that
> canned curves aren't necessary for BO, and in fact are largely
> ineffective in the sense that a curve worked out for one image is
> usually not appropriate for another.  Any fixed curve that is
applied
> universally to every image will likely be a compromise in some way. 
> That's why you don't find any BO curves published anywhere.
> 
> The reason for this is that curves/profiles are needed with ink
> systems that blend multiple inks because they are controlling the
> places where the different inks cut in and out.  Since different
> papers react differently to the inks, a different curve is needed
for
> each ink/paper combination.  
> 
> With BO printing only one ink is used so the problem of partitioning
> doesn't exist.  The basic workflow is to use a common paper for all
> proofing, such as EEM, and work up an image to its best appearance
> (using levels, curves, whatever) on that paper, and then save the
> image. This image will always look its best on EEM as is, and the
> proof then serves as the model for final prints on fine art papers.
> 
> For final prints, depending on the paper used, a contrast curve may
be
> needed to adjust the image to match the proof, because the different
> papers have different contrasts, very much like silver gelatin
papers.
>  This curve will usually be different for each paper, and a curve
for
> an image on Condor BW, for example, will most likely not be
> appropriate for a different image on that paper.  So even these
> paper-specific contrast curves can't be applied to every image. 
These
> curves are usually quick and easy to create, and can be saved either
> as an adjustment layer in the image or in a curves file (I use the
> former method, even though it adds to file size, because it's more
> convenient).
> 
> This is one reason why BO printing is so easy - we don't need canned
> curves and aren't dependent on someone with a densitometer or other
> form of expertise to provide them.  There's more to good BO printing
> than just the curves, of course.  A more detailed explanation is
found

> in a series of articles at the link below.
> 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at    
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Hi Pieris.

Like you, I found it easier to profile the papers I,m using with BO
printing by means of curves. It's not just that each paper takes the
ink differently but that the ink itself was compressing shadow details
as you intimated. I used the same 21 step table as is used with the
quad/hextone inks to develope curves. All it serves to do is to be
sure that what I decide a particular tone should be during image
workup is what ends up on the final print. That doesn't help me much
if my "vision" ends up being not so great on any given image but then
what would. It does let me work to a standard where I feel comfortable.
I don't know if the curves would translate to others or not but I
would think so as long as ink,printer,paper etc were the same.
There are many ways to the same end.

Best.
Duane.
 




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Pieris
Berreitter" <pieris@y...> wrote:

> 
> Clayton,
> 
> Sorry to take so long to get back to your post on this topic. Some
> unfortunate incidents last week put me out of work for a few days.
> 
> I understand what you're saying when you say no one curve can be
> applied to any image to make a black-only print. I also recognize that
> each image needs the careful attention of the printer's craft to best
> represent the aesthetic that the photographer intends. There is no
> one-stop solution for this, and the curve I made is certainly not
> going to help the printer who is looking for such a panacea.
> 
> What I found when I tried BO printing was that the straight printing
> method was giving me very, very different looking images from the FS
> prints I had been making. They had a very sharp toe and very long,
> drawn out midtones and highlights. If I wanted my print to look like
> that, it should look like that on-screen.
> 
> I do not have a perfect WYSIWYG workflow for FS printing but it's very
> good. BO printing with the traditional "just click print" method was
> not giving me what I wanted, especially when I'm trying to compare BO
> printing to FS printing.
> 
> So, for the purpose of (1) WYSIWYG workflow and (2) swapping between
> QTR-FS/Roark-FS/BO and trying to get similar results, I made that
> curve. I'm not saying I have achieved both of these goals yet, but I
> am convinced that profiling curves are necessary to get there.
> 
> Regard,
> -Pieris
> 
> digital darkroom blog: http://www.pmb.net/darkroom

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dlruckus" 
<dlruckus@y...> wrote:
> 

> All it serves to do is to be sure that what I decide a particular
> tone should be during image workup is what ends up on the final
> print.

I think what you have said here sums it up nicely. Not a bad idea I 
think. Another plus to profiling is that if you ever move to another 
printer/ink system, it will be easier to make similar prints once the 
new system is profiled.

-Pieris
digital darkroom blog: http://www.pmb.net/darkroom