Digital BW, The Print

We long-suffering 1280 cart refillers finally get some relief! The 
new carts are now available to all, and they look terrific.

Steve Karafyllakis

Do you think that they will have glop bottles to fill these carts with? 
I am totally sold on paul's Ut2/glop system. It just works great, the 
prints with kirkland are great. Still looking fro a bigger size that 
works this good with glop/UT2. I want to get semimatte and try it, 
someday.....I bet I've spent quite a bit on carts this year, my wife 
will be pleased with the ez fills!
On Mar 9, 2005, at 9:25 AM, Steven Karafyllakis wrote:

>
>  We long-suffering 1280 cart refillers finally get some relief! The
>  new carts are now available to all, and they look terrific.
>
>  Steve Karafyllakis
>
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other 
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The 1280 EZ carts are available now via phone.  (MIS is at 248-391-2390.)
They'll be put on the web page this weekend.  

At the risk of over stating the case, I was going to cease supporting the
1280 until these came out.  Now I think that printer has lots of life in it
still.  I've even filled a chamber with the wrong ink, cleaned it out, and
re-loaded it with the right ink.  There is still a filter that and other
things that will retain a little ink, but these easy refill, sponge-less
carts seem like a great step forward (so far).

The glop is already available in bottles.  Go to the MIS R800 page.

Premium Semimatte will be out in 17 x 22 soon.  I cut that down for the
smaller papers when I want those sizes.  A Premium Semimatte, sprayed with
PremierArt, dry mounted, and displayed without glass is currently my
favorite B&W.  So far they are surviving people touching them in the
gallery.  I've had to clean some finger prints off, but it was easy and
didn't hurt the surface.

Enjoy.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Douglas Meeuwsen [mailto:lipshurt@...]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 10:28 AM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] 1280 EZ-REFILL CARTS ARE HERE!
> 
> 
> Do you think that they will have glop bottles to fill these carts with?
> I am totally sold on paul's Ut2/glop system. It just works great, the
> prints with kirkland are great. Still looking fro a bigger size that
> works this good with glop/UT2. I want to get semimatte and try it,
> someday.....I bet I've spent quite a bit on carts this year, my wife
> will be pleased with the ez fills!
> On Mar 9, 2005, at 9:25 AM, Steven Karafyllakis wrote:
> 
> >
> >  We long-suffering 1280 cart refillers finally get some relief! The
> >  new carts are now available to all, and they look terrific.
> >
> >  Steve Karafyllakis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> > resources as they are often being updated.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> >  If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish
> > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
> > this same page.
> >
> >  Please follow these basic guidelines:
> >  - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to
> > keep them short.
> >  - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from
> > the membership without notice.
> >  - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital
> > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
> > removed from the membership.
> >  - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group
> > Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the
> > Files section:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> >
> >  BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER”
> > AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> > LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,
> > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,
> > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE
> > LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> > YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES),
> > RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW,
> > THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF
> > YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD
> > PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
> > MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >
> > ADVERTISEMENT
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> > <l.gif>
> >
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> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
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> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
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> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
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> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
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> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
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> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND
> “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
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> 
> 
> 
> 
>

Paul,

I've recently had some problems spraying Epson Premium Semimatte with 
PremierArt PrintShield.  I think it might be partially due to the low 
humidity and low temps around here, but I'm not sure.  Surface coating 
looks reticulated and uneven as if the spray was drying on the surface 
before being absorbed.  I was spraying successive coats across 
horizontally, vertically, and then diagonally in both directions and I 
think this just overloaded the paper.  Usually this procedure works 
fine with Ilford Smooth Pearl, but the semimatte seems to be less 
"absorbent".  Have you had any difficulty getting an even coating on 
semimatte?

Carl

On Mar 9, 2005, at 4:06 PM, Paul Roark wrote:

>
> The 1280 EZ carts are available now via phone.  (MIS is at 
> 248-391-2390.)
> They'll be put on the web page this weekend.
>
> At the risk of over stating the case, I was going to cease supporting 
> the
> 1280 until these came out.  Now I think that printer has lots of life 
> in it
> still.  I've even filled a chamber with the wrong ink, cleaned it out, 
> and
> re-loaded it with the right ink.  There is still a filter that and 
> other
> things that will retain a little ink, but these easy refill, 
> sponge-less
> carts seem like a great step forward (so far).
>
> The glop is already available in bottles.  Go to the MIS R800 page.
>
> Premium Semimatte will be out in 17 x 22 soon.  I cut that down for the
> smaller papers when I want those sizes.  A Premium Semimatte, sprayed 
> with
> PremierArt, dry mounted, and displayed without glass is currently my
> favorite B&W.  So far they are surviving people touching them in the
> gallery.  I've had to clean some finger prints off, but it was easy and
> didn't hurt the surface.
>
> Enjoy.
>
> Paul

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
<paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> The 1280 EZ carts are available now via phone.  (MIS is at
248-391-2390.)
> They'll be put on the web page this weekend.  
> 
> At the risk of over stating the case, I was going to cease
supporting the
> 1280 until these came out.  Now I think that printer has lots of
life in it
> still.  I've even filled a chamber with the wrong ink, cleaned it
out, and
> re-loaded it with the right ink.  There is still a filter that and other
> things that will retain a little ink, but these easy refill, sponge-less
> carts seem like a great step forward (so far).
> 

Paul,

For those of us who haven't filled carts before, can you post (or
point us to) a list of equipment needed and instructions? The MIS site
lists 5 different filling methods and 3 different chip-resetter
procedures. 

Thanks,

Jim Zall

Hello Paul,

When using your warm curve is the light toner (LM) in use at all?
There are no toner between 50-100%.
The "yellow line" has been struggling for weeks 
and I can't get a new damper quick enough.
Have tried "everything" with very good help from a list member.
It's a long story so I stop here.

Hans
-- 
Atelier Pictoform
Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
Hedåsgatan 5
SE-412 53 Göteborg
SWEDEN

+46  (0)31181414
Mobile: 073 974 44 24
(Besök/visit Hedåsgatan 6)

http://www.pictoform.nu

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> The 1280 EZ carts are available now via phone.  (MIS is at 248-391-
2390.)
> They'll be put on the web page this weekend. 

Now this is curious...I posted this annoncement only because I went 
to their website, clicked on 'new products' and voila! there they 
were! And now they are not. OOps! At any rate, I'm sure there will 
be detailed instructions included for first-timers

Steve Karafyllakis

Carl,
 
Are you spraying directly on the image or "fogging" it? Having had a custom frame shop for many years, when we had to use a spray fixative overcoat, we quickly learned that you do not directly spay on the print, but spray horizontal above the image about a foot or two above the print (e.g. create a fog) that then coats the image. Allow to completely dry, then re-fog again. Two fogging coats were usually enough. You may be concerned that you will be using a lot more spray for each print, but the prints should show no effects of the overcoat, which is the bottom line. Also with fogging, you will need more ventalation.
 
Best regards,

Carl Schofield <scho@...> wrote:
Paul,

I've recently had some problems spraying Epson Premium Semimatte with 
PremierArt PrintShield.  I think it might be partially due to the low 
humidity and low temps around here, but I'm not sure.  Surface coating 
looks reticulated and uneven as if the spray was drying on the surface 
before being absorbed.  I was spraying successive coats across 
horizontally, vertically, and then diagonally in both directions and I 
think this just overloaded the paper.  Usually this procedure works 
fine with Ilford Smooth Pearl, but the semimatte seems to be less 
"absorbent".  Have you had any difficulty getting an even coating on 
semimatte?

Carl

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Carl,
 
> I've recently had some problems spraying Epson Premium Semimatte with
> PremierArt PrintShield.  I think it might be partially due to the low
> humidity and low temps around here, but I'm not sure.  Surface coating
> looks reticulated and uneven as if the spray was drying on the surface
> before being absorbed...

That has been a problem with PremierArt Print Shield with others too.  In
very dry conditions the solvent is so volatile that it dries too soon.
Lascaux is less volatile and has not has these problems, but in my
experience it also is not nearly as effective as Print Shield in reducing
bronzing.

You may need to try some other fixatives.  I bought some Sennelier, but
haven't given it a test drive yet.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 

> 
> On Mar 9, 2005, at 4:06 PM, Paul Roark wrote:
> 
> >
> > The 1280 EZ carts are available now via phone.  (MIS is at
> > 248-391-2390.)
> > They'll be put on the web page this weekend.
> >
> > At the risk of over stating the case, I was going to cease supporting
> > the
> > 1280 until these came out.  Now I think that printer has lots of life
> > in it
> > still.  I've even filled a chamber with the wrong ink, cleaned it out,
> > and
> > re-loaded it with the right ink.  There is still a filter that and
> > other
> > things that will retain a little ink, but these easy refill,
> > sponge-less
> > carts seem like a great step forward (so far).
> >
> > The glop is already available in bottles.  Go to the MIS R800 page.
> >
> > Premium Semimatte will be out in 17 x 22 soon.  I cut that down for the
> > smaller papers when I want those sizes.  A Premium Semimatte, sprayed
> > with
> > PremierArt, dry mounted, and displayed without glass is currently my
> > favorite B&W.  So far they are surviving people touching them in the
> > gallery.  I've had to clean some finger prints off, but it was easy and
> > didn't hurt the surface.
> >
> > Enjoy.
> >
> > Paul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files
> section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND
> MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

> 
> For those of us who haven't filled carts before, can you post (or
> point us to) a list of equipment needed and instructions? The MIS site
> lists 5 different filling methods and 3 different chip-resetter
> procedures.
> 

The EZ refill carts have a plug at the top of each chamber.  You just pull
the plug and squirt in 12cc of ink.  So, six 10 cc syringes and 10 needles
are good to have.  I prefer the longer 4" needles.  

One thing to be carefull of is that the holes at the top of the carts are
not partially blocked by the cart label.  The beta carts I received had this
problem.  I took a sharp razor knife and reamed the hole in a way to cut the
label out of the way.  That top hole must seal when the stopper is put back
in.  Be careful not to push the stopper in so far you can't get it out,
however.

Once full, the carts need to be "primed" to get air out of the outlet.  The
same modified bottom-fill adapter will work for all.  I just rinse it off
and go to the next chamber.  I have shortened the MIS bottom fill adapter so
that the snout is 7mm.  What you want is a snout that is long enough to open
the poppet valve, but short enough to have seal in the outlet.  I think the
shortened shouts are better than the other solutions I've seen.  So, one
bottom fill adapter is needed.

Before I prime the carts, I use a razor knife to cut the thin, clear plastic
seal.  I use an "X" cut.  Some have felt that a poorly broken seal can
partially block a printer inlet.

That's about it.  I'd buy the ink in 4 oz. bottles.  The pints are difficult
to use after the ink level drops.

I re-use the syringes many times.  Wash them well.  After they are dry, when
I re-assemble them I spray some silicone lubricant onto a paper towel and
roll the rubber syringe plunger edge on the towel.  (The darkroom vent fan
is handy during this.) The silicone helps keep the syringes working well.
It's not that necessary for the re-filling jobs, but for very accurate
mixing the syringes can get too stiff to be easy to use.

There isn't much to this.  The toughest part may be fumbling around with
those little stoppers.

All the parts are on the MIS accessories page.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Hans,

The UT1 warm curve does not use the toner to any significant degree.  The
green curve has to be dropped to turn on the black ink, but if there were
nothing in the LM jet, you probably would not notice the difference.

(I assume you're going to take the LM damper and put it on the Yellow line.)

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Hans & Chia [mailto:chiahans@...]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 2:14 PM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] To Paul R, UT1 and 7500
> 
> 
> Hello Paul,
> 
> When using your warm curve is the light toner (LM) in use at all?
> There are no toner between 50-100%.
> The "yellow line" has been struggling for weeks
> and I can't get a new damper quick enough.
> Have tried "everything" with very good help from a list member.
> It's a long story so I stop here.
> 
> Hans
> --
> Atelier Pictoform
> Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
> Hedåsgatan 5
> SE-412 53 Göteborg
> SWEDEN
> 
> +46  (0)31181414
> Mobile: 073 974 44 24
> (Besök/visit Hedåsgatan 6)
> 
> http://www.pictoform.nu
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the Files
> section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND
> “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

Thanks for the heads-up, Steve!  Do you happen to have a URL for them?  I 
called MIS tech support this morning (on an unrelated issue) and the lady I 
spoke with told me the EZ refill 1280 carts MIS had tested had been "sent 
back to China for re-design" (!)  I hope she was wrong... I wanna try these 
puppies!

John Broski

 Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 17:25:30 -0000
   From: "Steven Karafyllakis" <steve@...>
Subject: 1280 EZ-REFILL CARTS ARE HERE!


We long-suffering 1280 cart refillers finally get some relief! The
new carts are now available to all, and they look terrific.

Steve Karafyllakis

Hi Douglas,

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Douglas
Stockdale 
<dstockdale@s...> wrote:
> ... Are you spraying directly on the image or "fogging" it? ... you 
> do not directly spay on the print, but spray horizontal above the 
> image about a foot or two above the print (e.g. create a fog) that 
> then coats the image.

Might it be that the purpose of your coating is to create a fine
layer of separation between the print surface and the glazing? If so 
I'm afraid that is not exactly what most inkjet coaters are trying to 
do. I think they want a coating that is not quite like liquid 
lamination but gives additional strength to the otherwise fragile 
inkjet media.

> Carl Schofield <scho@m...> wrote:
> Paul, I've recently had some problems spraying Epson Premium 
> Semimatte with PremierArt PrintShield.  I think it might be 
> partially due to the low humidity and low temps around here, but
> I'm not sure.  Surface coating looks reticulated and uneven as if 
> the spray was drying on the surface before being absorbed ...

Yes, you might be spraying too far from the print surface. It takes 
some practice to get consistent results. Get in closer and move
across a little more slowly but not so slow that you may get streaks. 
Just practice alot and you'll get really good at it.

--nick

Paul,

Yes, I'm going to switch Y and LM dampers, if the 
problem comes back after some printing there must 
be something wrong with the ink.
It's only the Y-line that struggles. After some 
printing the nozzles slowly disappears.

This is a short version of what's done:
Humidity is under control.
The level o CFS/ink bottles are adjusted.
Every joint and o-ring checked.
Y damper cleaned three times.
Capping station adjustment is done.
The CFS-cart is replaced with an Epson original 
cart as there always was a lot of foam in the MIS 
cart.
Switched Y/LM damper place, the problem followed the Y-line.
Switched the Y/LM tubes. Both lines worked. The Y damper was just cleaned.
And "some" cleaning, normal and kk2, and purge file printing.

Best
Hans

>Hans,
>
>The UT1 warm curve does not use the toner to any significant degree.  The
>green curve has to be dropped to turn on the black ink, but if there were
>nothing in the LM jet, you probably would not notice the difference.
>
>(I assume you're going to take the LM damper and put it on the Yellow line.)
>
>Paul
>www.PaulRoark.com
>
>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: Hans & Chia [mailto:chiahans@...]
>>  Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 2:14 PM
>>  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>>  Subject: [Digital BW] To Paul R, UT1 and 7500
>>
>>
>>  Hello Paul,
>>
>>  When using your warm curve is the light toner (LM) in use at all?
>>  There are no toner between 50-100%.
>>  The "yellow line" has been struggling for weeks
>>  and I can't get a new damper quick enough.
>>  Have tried "everything" with very good help from a list member.
>>  It's a long story so I stop here.
>>
>>  Hans
>>  --
>>  Atelier Pictoform
>>  Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
>>  Hedåsgatan 5
>>  SE-412 53 Göteborg
>>  SWEDEN
>>
>>  +46  (0)31181414
>>  Mobile: 073 974 44 24
>>  (Besök/visit Hedåsgatan 6)
>>
>>  http://www.pictoform.nu
>>
>>
>>
>>  Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
>>  they are often being updated.
>>
>>  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>>
>>  If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
>>  unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
>>  page.
>>
>>  Please follow these basic guidelines:
>>  - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
>>  them short.
>>  - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
>>  Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
>>  membership without notice.
>>  - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
>>  printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
>>  the membership.
>>  - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
>>  guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
>>  and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the Files
>>  section:
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>>
>>  BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
>>  YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND
>>  “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
>>  YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
>>  EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
>>  PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
>>  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
>>  ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
>>  OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
>>  UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
>>  STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
>>  YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
>>  PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>>
>>  Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Please visit the Group Homepage to check the 
>Files, and other resources as they are often 
>being updated.
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
>If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily 
>digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit 
>your Membership preferences by visiting this 
>same page.
>
>Please follow these basic guidelines:
>- As threads develop, trim off excess portions 
>of earlier messages to keep them short.
>- Good manners are required at all time. No 
>personal attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive 
>or argumentative users may be removed from the 
>membership without notice.
>- Keep your posts and threads related to the 
>group topic of digital B&W printing. Users who 
>persistently make off-topic posts may be removed 
>from the membership.
>- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by 
>the group rules and guidelines, and to abide by 
>the actions and decisions of the group Owner and 
>Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and 
>Guidelines” in the Files section:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
>BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO 
>THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU 
>EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” 
>AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO 
>GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, 
>INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR 
>EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, 
>DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA 
>OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” 
>AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO 
>GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF 
>SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR 
>THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT 
>YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR 
>ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) 
>STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE 
>DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY 
>OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE 
>PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>


-- 
Atelier Pictoform
Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
Hedåsgatan 5
SE-412 53 Göteborg
SWEDEN

+46  (0)31181414
Mobile: 073 974 44 24
(Besök/visit Hedåsgatan 6)

http://www.pictoform.nu
http://www.etsabild.se
http://www.artphotocollection.com

Maybe it is not the same product but I find that Lyson Print Guard simply
"blisters" on contact with glop coated prints - no matter how you spray it.
I see this as an amplification of the problem I was having with non-glop
coated prints.  At the end of the day I don't think these sprays work very
well.  I am off to NY this w/e and perhaps I will try to find some
Printshield and do a side-by-side comparison.  Anyone know where I can get
some in NYC?

> From: "Nick H. Nugent" <nghin@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 07:38:53 -0000
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] 1280 EZ-REFILL CARTS ARE HERE!
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Douglas,
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Douglas
> Stockdale 
> <dstockdale@s...> wrote:
>> ... Are you spraying directly on the image or "fogging" it? ... you
>> do not directly spay on the print, but spray horizontal above the
>> image about a foot or two above the print (e.g. create a fog) that
>> then coats the image.
> 
> Might it be that the purpose of your coating is to create a fine
> layer of separation between the print surface and the glazing? If so
> I'm afraid that is not exactly what most inkjet coaters are trying to
> do. I think they want a coating that is not quite like liquid
> lamination but gives additional strength to the otherwise fragile
> inkjet media.
> 
>> Carl Schofield <scho@m...> wrote:
>> Paul, I've recently had some problems spraying Epson Premium
>> Semimatte with PremierArt PrintShield.  I think it might be
>> partially due to the low humidity and low temps around here, but
>> I'm not sure.  Surface coating looks reticulated and uneven as if
>> the spray was drying on the surface before being absorbed ...
> 
> Yes, you might be spraying too far from the print surface. It takes
> some practice to get consistent results. Get in closer and move
> across a little more slowly but not so slow that you may get streaks.
> Just practice alot and you'll get really good at it.
> 
> --nick
> 
> 
>

I respectfully request that if we change the subject of our messages
we change the subject of the header to match.

The message below, for instance, has nothing to do with the new carts.

Thanks

Drime


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Nick H. Nugent"
<nghin@p...> wrote:

> 
> Hi Douglas,
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Douglas
> Stockdale 
> <dstockdale@s...> wrote:
> > ... Are you spraying directly on the image or "fogging" it? ... you 
> > do not directly spay on the print, but spray horizontal above the 
> > image about a foot or two above the print (e.g. create a fog) that 
> > then coats the image.
> 
> Might it be that the purpose of your coating is to create a fine
> layer of separation between the print surface and the glazing? If so 
> I'm afraid that is not exactly what most inkjet coaters are trying to 
> do. I think they want a coating that is not quite like liquid 
> lamination but gives additional strength to the otherwise fragile 
> inkjet media.

Nick et all; (I also changed the subject line, that was a good suggestion)
 
From the couple of replies to my message that I reviewed, it depends on what your purpose of the spraying is. We used the spraying to protect the artwork (e.g. fixative spray over charcol or graphic drawings that locked the artwork onto the medium and prevented smugging). That would be the same purpose that I would spray a digital print. The spray coating would also protect the ink/pigment from atmospherice gasses and relative humidity that can also degrade the image over time.
 
As to the "spray on glop" (not sure what glop is), but I can tell you that you have to be careful of how you stack the spay layers on top of the image. Old rule of thumb, you can paint oil on a watercolor painting, but you can't paint watercolor onto an oil painting. Likewise, we only provided one spray coating, you just need to determine at what stage the artwork is and chose the right spray to apply. I don't think that I would spray anything over an already coated artwork, e.g. spray on glob.
 
We did not ever coat a print to help with fingerprints, if we thought that the artwork was going to potentially get touched and that would be detrimental to the print, then we would add a matte and glass (also called "glazing", see below)
 
You should never spray to protect from the glazing (nice catch, most would just glass, but then you would miss the plexi or other clear protective interface for the artwork). To protect from the from the glazing, you would use a (archival, rag) matte that provide separation between the artwork and the glazing in the picture frame. Glass contacting artwork has issues with the sodium that can leach out of the glass or bonding to the photograph, and their are other issues with each type of glazing and artwork. If you have ever tried to pry an old photograph (silver print) off a sheet of glass that maybe your grandmother had framed, you will know the consequences of having glazing directly contact prints. (if you do have to have direct contact, then use non-glare glass with the treated side contacting the print)
 
There are numerous pros & cons for glazing; and there are a lot of choices. For long term display, I would make sure that it was a UV glazing to protect from UV light, and to furhter protect the art from accidental damage if dropped, that additiona investment into UV plexi. UV is not good for almost any artwork.
 
Best regards,

"Nick H. Nugent" <nghin@...> wrote:

Hi Douglas,

Might it be that the purpose of your coating is to create a fine
layer of separation between the print surface and the glazing? If so 
I'm afraid that is not exactly what most inkjet coaters are trying to 
do. I think they want a coating that is not quite like liquid
lamination but gives additional strength to the otherwise fragile 
inkjet media.

...

Yes, you might be spraying too far from the print surface. It takes 
some practice to get consistent results. Get in closer and move
across a little more slowly but not so slow that you may get streaks. 
Just practice alot and you'll get really good at it.

--nick


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Steve,

One of the big problems with the solvent-based sprays is that they can't be
shipped via air.  You won't get the Print Shield back to England with you.
I suspect this might also be the reason the Lyson product here may be
different than in Europe.  Each is probably being made locally.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steve Kale [mailto:stevekale@...]
> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 1:36 AM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] 1280 EZ-REFILL CARTS ARE HERE!
> 
> 
> Maybe it is not the same product but I find that Lyson Print Guard simply
> "blisters" on contact with glop coated prints - no matter how you spray
> it.
> I see this as an amplification of the problem I was having with non-glop
> coated prints.  At the end of the day I don't think these sprays work very
> well.  I am off to NY this w/e and perhaps I will try to find some
> Printshield and do a side-by-side comparison.  Anyone know where I can get
> some in NYC?
>

Hi Douglas,

You sound like a man I'd have learned a lot from and saved hundreds of
hours of experimenting with various coating techniques. 

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Stockdale
<dstockdale@s...> wrote:
> ...
> As to the "spray on glop" (not sure what glop is), but I can tell
you that you have to be careful of how you stack the spay layers on
top of the image. Old rule of thumb, you can paint oil on a watercolor
painting, but you can't paint watercolor onto an oil painting....

Yes, this is also what I have learned from reading art related posts
on water versus solvent based coatings.

Earlier Steve Kale mentioned the blistering of the glop upon contact
with Lyson Print Guard. I have never used glop but I suspect it might
be the same stuff they use on swellable polymer media. I learned that
to coat this sort of material I need to do something you called
"fogging", and the spray must be water-based because solvent would
interact horribly with the glop-liked coating. Once I have this layer
of fogging I can spray on stop with almost anything.

> We did not ever coat a print to help with fingerprints, if we
thought that the artwork was going to potentially get touched and that
would be detrimental to the print, then we would add a matte and glass
(also called "glazing", see below) ...

Thanks for various tips on glazing.

I would also appreciate further sharing of knowledge on coating
especially matte inkjet prints with the goal of achieving a more
forgiving surface and little reduction in dmax.

I guess sooner or later I will find matte papers that don't flake and
give as deep a black as glossy papers so I don't have to play with
coatings anymore. Until then ...

--nick

Sorry - maybe I missed it  but what do you fog with and how?

> From: "Nick H. Nugent" <nghin@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:12:35 -0000
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Print spraying & glazing
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Douglas,
> 
> You sound like a man I'd have learned a lot from and saved hundreds of
> hours of experimenting with various coating techniques.
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Stockdale
> <dstockdale@s...> wrote:
>> ...
>> As to the "spray on glop" (not sure what glop is), but I can tell
> you that you have to be careful of how you stack the spay layers on
> top of the image. Old rule of thumb, you can paint oil on a watercolor
> painting, but you can't paint watercolor onto an oil painting....
> 
> Yes, this is also what I have learned from reading art related posts
> on water versus solvent based coatings.
> 
> Earlier Steve Kale mentioned the blistering of the glop upon contact
> with Lyson Print Guard. I have never used glop but I suspect it might
> be the same stuff they use on swellable polymer media. I learned that
> to coat this sort of material I need to do something you called
> "fogging", and the spray must be water-based because solvent would
> interact horribly with the glop-liked coating. Once I have this layer
> of fogging I can spray on stop with almost anything.
> 
>> We did not ever coat a print to help with fingerprints, if we
> thought that the artwork was going to potentially get touched and that
> would be detrimental to the print, then we would add a matte and glass
> (also called "glazing", see below) ...
> 
> Thanks for various tips on glazing.
> 
> I would also appreciate further sharing of knowledge on coating
> especially matte inkjet prints with the goal of achieving a more
> forgiving surface and little reduction in dmax.
> 
> I guess sooner or later I will find matte papers that don't flake and
> give as deep a black as glossy papers so I don't have to play with
> coatings anymore. Until then ...
> 
> --nick
> 
> 
>

Fogging is the spraying of an aresol directly over the print you want to have overcoated, not spraying the can with it's contects directly at the print. Process is to spray your aresol product parallel to the print surface about one to two feet above the print surface (depends on the aresol product formulation, spray needle size and the density of the fog you create). The effect you achive is to have the solution contents fall like a mist on your print. It should provide a very even coating and since the coating will be a very thin layer, you would allow that first application to dry ("tackless") and then apply a second coat. A digital print with either dye or pigments on a matte print has a lot of the image absorpted into the fibers, so if this process works with a very loose structure such as a charcoal print, you should not be having any issues using this process with digital images. Also, do this in an area with a lot of ventilation, and yes, with fogging you may use more of you
 product, but it was our experience that you used about the same amount of product for the effect we wanted to achieve. Overkill of your coatings does not neccessarily help matters.
 
Best regards,

Steve Kale <stevekale@...> wrote:
Sorry - maybe I missed it  but what do you fog with and how?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Steve,

It was Douglas Stockdale who mentioned "fogging" in an earlier post
with the misleading subject line "RE: 1280 EZ-REFILL CARTS ARE HERE!"
(Thanks, Drime for pointing this out  :^). You spray from 1-2 feet
above the print so the mist settles down on the print's surface
without getting absorbed into the substrate.

This may indeed turn out to be an excellent way to coat a print but
I'm sure it leaves it feeling gritty to the touch. This is meant for
framing under glass so the gritty feel doesn't matter. Also in my
experience "fogging" also cuts down the reflection on a glossy print
which some may find to be a good thing.

Douglas, feel free to elaborate more on this if you like.

--nick

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Steve Kale
<stevekale@b...> wrote:
> Sorry - maybe I missed it  but what do you fog with and how?

Nick, this is where technique and testing comes to play. You choose your fogging process per the product you are using, as we developed techniques that ensure that the aresol "fog" was still a liquid (wet) when it fell on the print. That way the thin layer would be able to also slighly absorb and link between droplets (sounds little like inkjet doesn't it?). We did not achieve gritty prints, but very silky smoothy if you touched it. I am not a big fan of coating any glossy prints, whether silver bromide photos or glossy digitals. We did not coat glossy's in our gallery, and recommended against it. So that is just my opion and I do not want to start pro/con on coating glossy prints. You choose what works for you. Thanks.
 
Best regards,

"Nick H. Nugent" <nghin@...> wrote:

This may indeed turn out to be an excellent way to coat a print but
I'm sure it leaves it feeling gritty to the touch. This is meant for
framing under glass so the gritty feel doesn't matter. Also in my
experience "fogging" also cuts down the reflection on a glossy print
which some may find to be a good thing.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ok - I can tell you then that Lyson Print Guard will disintegrate a print
even with fogging.  I have tried misting in the spray, spraying with the
print flat and with the print hanging.  No joy.  The reaction (on MIS
pigment inks) was amplified if they were coated with gloss optimiser.  I
have several cans of the stuff (unused) in my closet and if anyone in the UK
wants it they should contact me off-list.  I still think some sort of
printer applied lacquer is what we all need for protective coatings that are
water, dust and fingerprint proof for ideal display without glazing.

> From: "Nick H. Nugent" <nghin@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 19:20:15 -0000
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Print spraying & glazing
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Steve,
> 
> It was Douglas Stockdale who mentioned "fogging" in an earlier post
> with the misleading subject line "RE: 1280 EZ-REFILL CARTS ARE HERE!"
> (Thanks, Drime for pointing this out  :^). You spray from 1-2 feet
> above the print so the mist settles down on the print's surface
> without getting absorbed into the substrate.
> 
> This may indeed turn out to be an excellent way to coat a print but
> I'm sure it leaves it feeling gritty to the touch. This is meant for
> framing under glass so the gritty feel doesn't matter. Also in my
> experience "fogging" also cuts down the reflection on a glossy print
> which some may find to be a good thing.
> 
> Douglas, feel free to elaborate more on this if you like.
> 
> --nick
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Steve Kale
> <stevekale@b...> wrote:
>> Sorry - maybe I missed it  but what do you fog with and how?
> 
>

Just as an aside, the MIS website makes the claim that if an image is glop
coated then light scratches can be polished out with Pledge.  DO NOT try
this!  I just tested it on an image that had a 50% overcoat of glop.  The
ink was stripped off the page immediately.

Giclee remover, what a concept!
:0
Mark

On Mar 10, 2005, at 4:07 PM, Steve Kale wrote:
> The ink was stripped off the page immediately.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Paul,

Regarding the last weeks struggling with the 
printer it's now confirmed that the ink is badly 
filtered.
From another list member I also got the 
information that this was a problem at the time 
when I bought all the inks.
As I dont have any old dampers I have to find a sieve.
Do you know what kind of sieve to use?
Micron - type of weaving?

Hans
-- 
Atelier Pictoform
Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
Hedåsgatan 5
SE-412 53 Göteborg
SWEDEN

+46  (0)31181414
Mobile: 073 974 44 24
(Besök/visit Hedåsgatan 6)

http://www.pictoform.nu

I've read that many of the inks are run through a 4 micron filter 
before going into the large containers, I think one manufacturer says 
2 micron, but can't be sure. Hopefully you can flush the clogged 
dampers out, but sometimes that is not possible.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Hans & Chia 
<chiahans@t...> wrote:

> Hi Paul,
> 
> Regarding the last weeks struggling with the 
> printer it's now confirmed that the ink is badly 
> filtered.
> From another list member I also got the 
> information that this was a problem at the time 
> when I bought all the inks.
> As I dont have any old dampers I have to find a sieve.
> Do you know what kind of sieve to use?
> Micron - type of weaving?
> 
> Hans
> -- 
> Atelier Pictoform
> Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
> Hedåsgatan 5
> SE-412 53 Göteborg
> SWEDEN
> 
> +46  (0)31181414
> Mobile: 073 974 44 24
> (Besök/visit Hedåsgatan 6)
> 
> http://www.pictoform.nu

Hans,

I have some filters made by Baxa.  The company has a representative in the
UK that may be the best way to see if the product is available there.  The
UK agent e-mail appears to be enquiries@....  In the U.S. I bought
the filters through Health Care Logistics at 800-848-1633.

The packaging indicates they have a variety of filters.  They fit onto
syringes, are easy to use, and were not expensive.  The filters are easy to
back flush.  I totally clogged one with an experimental ink I'd made (not
from MIS), and back flushing opened the filter right back up for re-using.

I just tried to compare UC PK with MIS PK, pulling 10 cc into the syringe
and pushing it through a 1.2 micron filter.  Both inks went through easily.
It would take a lot more UC ink than I have to make any accurate comparison.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Hans & Chia [mailto:chiahans@...]
> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2005 1:47 PM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] To Paul R, UT1 and 7500
> 
> 
> Hi Paul,
> 
> Regarding the last weeks struggling with the
> printer it's now confirmed that the ink is badly
> filtered.
> From another list member I also got the
> information that this was a problem at the time
> when I bought all the inks.
> As I dont have any old dampers I have to find a sieve.
> Do you know what kind of sieve to use?
> Micron - type of weaving?
> 
> Hans
> --
> Atelier Pictoform
> Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
> Hedåsgatan 5
> SE-412 53 Göteborg
> SWEDEN
> 
> +46  (0)31181414
> Mobile: 073 974 44 24
> (Besök/visit Hedåsgatan 6)
> 
> http://www.pictoform.nu
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
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Paul Roark wrote:

>Hans,
>
>I have some filters made by Baxa.  The company has a representative in the
>UK that may be the best way to see if the product is available there.  The
>UK agent e-mail appears to be enquiries@....  In the U.S. I bought
>the filters through Health Care Logistics at 800-848-1633.
>
>The packaging indicates they have a variety of filters.  They fit onto
>syringes, are easy to use, and were not expensive.  The filters are easy to
>back flush.  I totally clogged one with an experimental ink I'd made (not
>from MIS), and back flushing opened the filter right back up for re-using.
>
>I just tried to compare UC PK with MIS PK, pulling 10 cc into the syringe
>and pushing it through a 1.2 micron filter.  Both inks went through easily.
>It would take a lot more UC ink than I have to make any accurate comparison.
>
>Paul
>www.PaulRoark.com 
>
>  
>
Paul,

The sieve itself of the filter is that made of SS or a polyamide or 
something else ?  I have tried some filters in the past made by 
Schleicher and Schuell but that didn't work so I gathered some old 
dampers and filtered with them. Looking for a better method though.

This type 1.2 micron may be a better choice:

http://www.schleicher-schuell.com/icm11be.nsf/(html)/Frameset_load?OpenDocument&003MicroScience_001Products_005PaperFiltration_001Generalpaperfiltration?OpenDocument&AllgNav_dsp?OpenForm&Kat0_root

Ernst

dfaprinting wrote:

>I've read that many of the inks are run through a 4 micron filter
>before going into the large containers, I think one manufacturer says
>2 micron, but can't be sure. Hopefully you can flush the clogged
>dampers out, but sometimes that is not possible.

Had problem with one but I filled it with MIS 
cleaning fluid and left it for an hour or so.
That cure helped dramaticly so now do I use the cleaning stuff every time.

Hans
-- 
Atelier Pictoform
Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
Hedåsgatan 5
SE-412 53 Göteborg
SWEDEN

http://www.pictoform.nu

Ernst wrote:

>The sieve itself of the filter is that made of SS or a polyamide or
>something else ?  I have tried some filters in the past made by
>Schleicher and Schuell but that didn't work so I gathered some old
>dampers and filtered with them. Looking for a better method though.
>
>This type 1.2 micron may be a better choice:
>
>http://www.schleicher-schuell.com/icm11be.nsf/(html)/Frameset_load?OpenDocument&003MicroScience_001Products_005PaperFiltration_001Generalpaperfiltration?OpenDocument&AllgNav_dsp?OpenForm&Kat0_root

Hi Ernst,
Tried to find the filter but couldn't find it.
Do you have an item number?

Hans
-- 
Atelier Pictoform
Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
Hedåsgatan 5
SE-412 53 Göteborg
SWEDEN

http://www.pictoform.nu

Hello Paul,

>Hans,
>
>I have some filters made by Baxa.  The company has a representative in the
>UK that may be the best way to see if the product is available there.  The
>UK agent e-mail appears to be enquiries@....  In the U.S. I bought
>the filters through Health Care Logistics at 800-848-1633.

Will try to find it do you have any item# ?

>The packaging indicates they have a variety of filters.  They fit onto
>syringes, are easy to use, and were not expensive.

Do you know if there are bigger filters?
Have to filter some pints!

>The filters are easy to
>back flush.  I totally clogged one with an experimental ink I'd made (not
>from MIS), and back flushing opened the filter right back up for re-using.
>
>I just tried to compare UC PK with MIS PK, pulling 10 cc into the syringe
>and pushing it through a 1.2 micron filter.  Both inks went through easily.
>It would take a lot more UC ink than I have to make any accurate comparison.

Bought a lot of ink about a year ago so it's from 
one of the first or second batches.
The bottles are chaked every second week ;­)

BTW, take a look in your Yahoo box.

Hans
-- 
Atelier Pictoform
Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
Hedåsgatan 5
SE-412 53 Göteborg
SWEDEN

http://www.pictoform.nu

Hans,

> >
> >I have some filters made by Baxa.  The company has a representative in
> the
> >UK that may be the best way to see if the product is available there.
> The
> >UK agent e-mail appears to be enquiries@....  In the U.S. I bought
> >the filters through Health Care Logistics at 800-848-1633.
> 
> Will try to find it do you have any item# ?

The Health Care Logistics item # is 12549, but this is probably not what you
want.

Inside that bag was another small container with the actual filter in it.
Aside from the name "Baxa" on it, the following also appears:  Supor 1.2 um
Syringe Filter Order No. REF: H938 21012 3."  This may be what will get you
to the product.



> 
> >The packaging indicates they have a variety of filters.  They fit onto
> >syringes, are easy to use, and were not expensive.
> 
> Do you know if there are bigger filters?
> Have to filter some pints!


I'm not sure what all they have.  I purchases 25 mm diameter filters in 1.2
and 0.4 micron sizes.  They 5 micron filter on the list I have is 32 mm
wide.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Hans & Ernst,


Here is a URL & photo of what I used:

http://www.healthcarelogistics.com/mall/more.asp?fmmore=12549

I notice they have filtration capacity listed.  I'm wondering if the filter
loses effectiveness after that volume.


Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Paul wrote:

>Here is a URL & photo of what I used:
>
>http://www.healthcarelogistics.com/mall/more.asp?fmmore=12549
>
>I notice they have filtration capacity listed.  I'm wondering if the filter
>loses effectiveness after that volume.


Thanks, I have managed to find something similar (2 micron) here.
Just some problems to buy things from that firm.
In the meantime I have used an existing damper 
and with a syringe I pulled a pint of ink through 
it, twice.
Unfortunately it didn't help. When done 5-6 
prints (ca 57x57 cm) I have to clean the damper.

Take a look in your Yahoo box.

Hans

-- 
Atelier Pictoform
Chia N-Löfqvist & Hans Nohlberg
Hedåsgatan 5
SE-412 53 Göteborg
SWEDEN

http://www.pictoform.nu