Digital BW, The Print

After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in photoshop,
I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could write a better
tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" version
(read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe
There is also a jpg screenshot in the same directory there.

Sorry MAC people, but I can only write software for the PC.

It reads and writes photoshop curve (.acv) files, so you can load your
existing curve files and modify them as well as creating new ones.  Once you
save them, they can be loaded into photoshop.

Here are some tips:
-- Add a point by clicking on the curve between other points.
-- Move an existing point by clicking and dragging it.
-- Delete a point by right-clicking on it.
-- You can also fine-tune a point by clicking either on it in the graph or
on it's entry in the numerical table.
    Then you can either type new values directly in the table, or use the
arrow keys to move the point in unit steps.

Following the example set by Paul, the program is free for any use.  I hope
it will make it easier for more people to create curves for their
printer/paper/ink combos and in turn provide them for others to use.

I'd be happy to hear any suggestions you have for improvements. Some ideas I
have for the next version are:
-- Ability to print curve and data points to a printer.
-- Undo
-- I used the same curve algorithm that photoshop uses (natural cubic
splines) which has the drawback that anytime you move a point, it affects
more of the curve than just the local area that you're adjusting.  It may be
possible to use a better algorithm for making the fine-tune adjustments
without affecting so much of the curve and then have the program fit the
appropriate points that photoshop needs to describe the curve.
-- Some method of having the computer automatically tweak the curve based on
a scan of a printed step wedge.

--Tom

on 1/7/02 1:49 AM, Thomas Fors wrote:

> After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in photoshop,
> I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could write a better
> tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" version
> (read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
> http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe

snip

> Following the example set by Paul, the program is free for any use.  I hope
> it will make it easier for more people to create curves for their
> printer/paper/ink combos and in turn provide them for others to use.

Wow! 

I'm on a Mac so I can't use it, but this is the kind of spirit I like to
see.

Bravo!

Todd

Very nice from you,I\ufffdll try it too.BTW,where can I find Paul\ufffds curves? I
looked in his site,but couldn\ufffdt locate them...
Andr\ufffd

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas Fors" <tom@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2002 4:49 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] new curve editor for photoshop


> After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in
photoshop,
> I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could write a
better

> tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" version
> (read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
> http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe

Andre,

There are several curves and workflows posted at the MIS page:
http://www.inksupply.com/index.cfm?source=html/workflow.html

More specifically, you can find Paul's curves for the MIS Variable Mix inkset at:
http://www.inksupply.com/index.cfm?source=html/workflow_roark.html

--Tom 

Original Message:
-----------------

From: Andre Vallejo avs@...

Very nice from you,I´ll try it too.BTW,where can I find Paul´s curves? I
looked in his site,but couldn´t locate them...
André



--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .

Thomas-

Congratulations... You just joined the "Internet Spirits" (a team of 
honor).

I can't wait to try these (though I'm just getting used to using 
Paul's curves and probably won't be creating anything too unique for 
some time... This is the kind of development that Piezography would 
benefit from if it welcomed it...

Tom O'Connell



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Thomas Fors" <tom@f...> 
wrote:
> After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in 
photoshop,
> I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could write 
a better
> tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" 
version
> (read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
> http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe
> There is also a jpg screenshot in the same directory there.
> 
> Sorry MAC people, but I can only write software for the PC.
> 
> It reads and writes photoshop curve (.acv) files, so you can load 
your
> existing curve files and modify them as well as creating new ones.  
Once you
> save them, they can be loaded into photoshop.
> 
> Here are some tips:
> -- Add a point by clicking on the curve between other points.
> -- Move an existing point by clicking and dragging it.
> -- Delete a point by right-clicking on it.
> -- You can also fine-tune a point by clicking either on it in the 
graph or
> on it's entry in the numerical table.
>     Then you can either type new values directly in the table, or 
use the
> arrow keys to move the point in unit steps.
> 
> Following the example set by Paul, the program is free for any 
use.  I hope
> it will make it easier for more people to create curves for their
> printer/paper/ink combos and in turn provide them for others to use.
> 
> I'd be happy to hear any suggestions you have for improvements. 
Some ideas I
> have for the next version are:
> -- Ability to print curve and data points to a printer.
> -- Undo
> -- I used the same curve algorithm that photoshop uses (natural 
cubic
> splines) which has the drawback that anytime you move a point, it 
affects
> more of the curve than just the local area that you're adjusting.  
It may be
> possible to use a better algorithm for making the fine-tune 
adjustments
> without affecting so much of the curve and then have the program 
fit the
> appropriate points that photoshop needs to describe the curve.
> -- Some method of having the computer automatically tweak the curve 
based on

> a scan of a printed step wedge.
> 
> --Tom

Hello.  I cannot load the file in curves.  photoshop says that this file is 
not compatible w/ my version of phohotoshop, which is 6.0.  Have you 
experience with this?
What is your solution?


>From: "Thomas Fors" <tom@...>
>Reply-To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: [Digital BW] new curve editor for photoshop
>Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2002 00:49:09 -0600
>
>After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in 
>photoshop,
>I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could write a 
>better
>tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" version
>(read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
>http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe
>There is also a jpg screenshot in the same directory there.
>
>Sorry MAC people, but I can only write software for the PC.
>
>It reads and writes photoshop curve (.acv) files, so you can load your
>existing curve files and modify them as well as creating new ones.  Once 
>you
>save them, they can be loaded into photoshop.
>
>Here are some tips:
>-- Add a point by clicking on the curve between other points.
>-- Move an existing point by clicking and dragging it.
>-- Delete a point by right-clicking on it.
>-- You can also fine-tune a point by clicking either on it in the graph or
>on it's entry in the numerical table.
>     Then you can either type new values directly in the table, or use the
>arrow keys to move the point in unit steps.
>
>Following the example set by Paul, the program is free for any use.  I hope
>it will make it easier for more people to create curves for their
>printer/paper/ink combos and in turn provide them for others to use.
>
>I'd be happy to hear any suggestions you have for improvements. Some ideas 
>I
>have for the next version are:
>-- Ability to print curve and data points to a printer.
>-- Undo
>-- I used the same curve algorithm that photoshop uses (natural cubic
>splines) which has the drawback that anytime you move a point, it affects
>more of the curve than just the local area that you're adjusting.  It may 
>be
>possible to use a better algorithm for making the fine-tune adjustments
>without affecting so much of the curve and then have the program fit the
>appropriate points that photoshop needs to describe the curve.
>-- Some method of having the computer automatically tweak the curve based 
>on
>a scan of a printed step wedge.
>
>--Tom
>




_________________________________________________________________
Join the world\ufffds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. 
http://www.hotmail.com

I had no problem loading the vm curves, or any others for that 
matter, into Thomas' tool. Open the tool, go to File and browse for 
the .acv files.

 --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "mike kless" 
<mgkless@h...> wrote:
> Hello.  I cannot load the file in curves.  photoshop says that this 
file is 
> not compatible w/ my version of phohotoshop, which is 6.0.  Have 
you 
> experience with this?
> What is your solution?
> 
> 
> >From: "Thomas Fors" <tom@f...>
> >Reply-To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...
> >To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> >Subject: [Digital BW] new curve editor for photoshop
> >Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2002 00:49:09 -0600
> >
> >After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in 
> >photoshop,
> >I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could 
write a 
> >better
> >tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" 
version
> >(read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
> >http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe
> >There is also a jpg screenshot in the same directory there.
> >
> >Sorry MAC people, but I can only write software for the PC.
> >
> >It reads and writes photoshop curve (.acv) files, so you can load 
your
> >existing curve files and modify them as well as creating new 
ones.  Once 
> >you
> >save them, they can be loaded into photoshop.
> >
> >Here are some tips:
> >-- Add a point by clicking on the curve between other points.
> >-- Move an existing point by clicking and dragging it.
> >-- Delete a point by right-clicking on it.
> >-- You can also fine-tune a point by clicking either on it in the 
graph or
> >on it's entry in the numerical table.
> >     Then you can either type new values directly in the table, or 
use the
> >arrow keys to move the point in unit steps.
> >
> >Following the example set by Paul, the program is free for any 
use.  I hope
> >it will make it easier for more people to create curves for their
> >printer/paper/ink combos and in turn provide them for others to 
use.
> >
> >I'd be happy to hear any suggestions you have for improvements. 
Some ideas 
> >I
> >have for the next version are:
> >-- Ability to print curve and data points to a printer.
> >-- Undo
> >-- I used the same curve algorithm that photoshop uses (natural 
cubic
> >splines) which has the drawback that anytime you move a point, it 
affects
> >more of the curve than just the local area that you're adjusting.  
It may 
> >be
> >possible to use a better algorithm for making the fine-tune 
adjustments
> >without affecting so much of the curve and then have the program 
fit the
> >appropriate points that photoshop needs to describe the curve.
> >-- Some method of having the computer automatically tweak the 
curve based 

> >on
> >a scan of a printed step wedge.
> >
> >--Tom
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. 
> http://www.hotmail.com

got it. thanks.


>From: "tzinzunzan2000" <ldmr@...>
>Reply-To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [Digital BW] new curve editor for photoshop
>Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2002 18:18:13 -0000
>
>I had no problem loading the vm curves, or any others for that
>matter, into Thomas' tool. Open the tool, go to File and browse for
>the .acv files.
>
>  --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "mike kless"
><mgkless@h...> wrote:
> > Hello.  I cannot load the file in curves.  photoshop says that this
>file is
> > not compatible w/ my version of phohotoshop, which is 6.0.  Have
>you
> > experience with this?
> > What is your solution?
> >
> >
> > >From: "Thomas Fors" <tom@f...>
> > >Reply-To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...
> > >To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> > >Subject: [Digital BW] new curve editor for photoshop
> > >Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2002 00:49:09 -0600
> > >
> > >After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in
> > >photoshop,
> > >I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could
>write a
> > >better
> > >tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta"
>version
> > >(read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
> > >http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe
> > >There is also a jpg screenshot in the same directory there.
> > >
> > >Sorry MAC people, but I can only write software for the PC.
> > >
> > >It reads and writes photoshop curve (.acv) files, so you can load
>your
> > >existing curve files and modify them as well as creating new
>ones.  Once
> > >you
> > >save them, they can be loaded into photoshop.
> > >
> > >Here are some tips:
> > >-- Add a point by clicking on the curve between other points.
> > >-- Move an existing point by clicking and dragging it.
> > >-- Delete a point by right-clicking on it.
> > >-- You can also fine-tune a point by clicking either on it in the
>graph or
> > >on it's entry in the numerical table.
> > >     Then you can either type new values directly in the table, or
>use the
> > >arrow keys to move the point in unit steps.
> > >
> > >Following the example set by Paul, the program is free for any
>use.  I hope
> > >it will make it easier for more people to create curves for their
> > >printer/paper/ink combos and in turn provide them for others to
>use.
> > >
> > >I'd be happy to hear any suggestions you have for improvements.
>Some ideas
> > >I
> > >have for the next version are:
> > >-- Ability to print curve and data points to a printer.
> > >-- Undo
> > >-- I used the same curve algorithm that photoshop uses (natural
>cubic
> > >splines) which has the drawback that anytime you move a point, it
>affects
> > >more of the curve than just the local area that you're adjusting.
>It may
> > >be
> > >possible to use a better algorithm for making the fine-tune
>adjustments
> > >without affecting so much of the curve and then have the program
>fit the
> > >appropriate points that photoshop needs to describe the curve.
> > >-- Some method of having the computer automatically tweak the
>curve based
> > >on
> > >a scan of a printed step wedge.
> > >
> > >--Tom
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
> > http://www.hotmail.com
>




_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com

Nice job Thomas It will be very helpful next week when I get my 1280.
Renan

Thomas Fors gravada:

> After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in photoshop,
> I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could write a better
> tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" version
> (read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:

I was wondering if it is possible to add more than 14 points to the
curve of this software (Curvacious) or is this a limitation of Photoshop
being able to use it? Seems like more points would be a better way to go
for fine tuning the VM curves.

*****************





After reading several of Paul Roark's posts on creating curves in
photoshop,
I tried my hand at it and came to the conclusion that I could write a
better
tool for editing curves.  I've just completed the initial "beta" version
(read I just got it working) and have posted it for download here:
http://www.fors.net/curves/curvaceous.exe
There is also a jpg screenshot in the same directory there.

Sorry MAC people, but I can only write software for the PC.

It reads and writes photoshop curve (.acv) files, so you can load your
existing curve files and modify them as well as creating new ones.  Once
you
save them, they can be loaded into photoshop.

Here are some tips:
-- Add a point by clicking on the curve between other points.
-- Move an existing point by clicking and dragging it.
-- Delete a point by right-clicking on it.
-- You can also fine-tune a point by clicking either on it in the graph
or
on it's entry in the numerical table.
    Then you can either type new values directly in the table, or use
the
arrow keys to move the point in unit steps.

Following the example set by Paul, the program is free for any use.  I
hope
it will make it easier for more people to create curves for their
printer/paper/ink combos and in turn provide them for others to use.

I'd be happy to hear any suggestions you have for improvements. Some
ideas I
have for the next version are:
-- Ability to print curve and data points to a printer.
-- Undo
-- I used the same curve algorithm that photoshop uses (natural cubic
splines) which has the drawback that anytime you move a point, it
affects
more of the curve than just the local area that you're adjusting.  It
may be
possible to use a better algorithm for making the fine-tune adjustments
without affecting so much of the curve and then have the program fit the
appropriate points that photoshop needs to describe the curve.
-- Some method of having the computer automatically tweak the curve
based on
a scan of a printed step wedge.

--Tom

I have just printed out the 729 patch ProfilerPRO targets on these two
papers and they printed IDENTICAL to my eye. What is the likelihood that
the BC Eclipse Satin is at least coated with the same inkjet receiving
layer as the Photo Rag? Is it likely that BC Satine is made by Hahnemule
as well?
I am thinking that I may only need to have a profile made for one and it
will print identical on the other. Has anyone had both papers profiled
with Generations ink and what were the results?

MZ

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Murray Zaharia" 
<zaharia@t...> wrote:
> 
> I have just printed out the 729 patch ProfilerPRO targets on these 
two
> papers and they printed IDENTICAL to my eye. What is the likelihood 
that
> the BC Eclipse Satin is at least coated with the same inkjet 
receiving
> layer as the Photo Rag? Is it likely that BC Satine is made by 
Hahnemule
> as well?
> I am thinking that I may only need to have a profile made for one 
and it
> will print identical on the other. Has anyone had both papers 
profiled
> with Generations ink and what were the results?
> 
> MZ

There is 0 chance that the papers have the same coatings. The 
Hahnemuhle Photo Rag is produced in Germany and imported into the 
U.S. The Eclipse Satine is produced entirely in the US at the moment 
and the coatings are very different. They do print similarly however. 
I've been able to use the Generations ink on both papers with very 
similar but different profiles on a 1200.

On this same subject about the Eclipse Satine, someone in an earlier 
post asked about some of the specs on the materials used and I didn't 
have time to respond at the time. The paper is 100% cotton, is 
buffered with 3% Calcium Carbonate and is pH neutral. There are no 
optical brighteners in the base, but there is < 1% OB's in the 
coating. The soft white contains no OB's whatsoever.

I'm working on getting better specs from Hahnemuhle as well and will 
post them here when I get a chance.

Gregory Schern

inkjetgoodies.com
866 330-4514
info@...

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Gregory Schern" 
<gschern@y...> wrote:
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Murray Zaharia" 
> <zaharia@t...> wrote:
> > 
> > I have just printed out the 729 patch ProfilerPRO targets on these 
> two
> > papers and they printed IDENTICAL to my eye. What is the 
likelihood 
> that
> > the BC Eclipse Satin is at least coated with the same inkjet 
> receiving
> > layer as the Photo Rag? Is it likely that BC Satine is made by 
> Hahnemule
> > as well?
> > I am thinking that I may only need to have a profile made for one 
> and it
> > will print identical on the other. Has anyone had both papers 
> profiled
> > with Generations ink and what were the results?
> > 
> > MZ
> 
> There is 0 chance that the papers have the same coatings. The 
> Hahnemuhle Photo Rag is produced in Germany and imported into the 
> U.S. The Eclipse Satine is produced entirely in the US at the moment 
> and the coatings are very different. They do print similarly 
however. 
> I've been able to use the Generations ink on both papers with very 
> similar but different profiles on a 1200.
> 
> On this same subject about the Eclipse Satine, someone in an earlier 
> post asked about some of the specs on the materials used and I 
didn't 
> have time to respond at the time. The paper is 100% cotton, is 
> buffered with 3% Calcium Carbonate and is pH neutral. There are no 
> optical brighteners in the base, but there is < 1% OB's in the 
> coating. The soft white contains no OB's whatsoever.
> 
> I'm working on getting better specs from Hahnemuhle as well and will 
> post them here when I get a chance.
> 
> Gregory Schern
> 
> inkjetgoodies.com
> 866 330-4514
> info@i...


Just to add that I found that Hahnemule papers (William Turner and a 
little experience with PhotoRag) flake more than Eclipse...
Jim H.

Gregory

Thanks for the information. After letting the targets sit overnight I
can see a few VERY slight differences in a small number of patches
between Eclipse and Photo Rag. I think that I will try a profile for the
Eclipse first and am pretty sure that it will be very satisfactory on
the Photo Rag.
On the other hand, Hahnemuhle Photo Rag and German Etching (Royal Plush)
almost certainly must use the same coating as the targets are identical.
Which makes sense, seeing as they both are Hahnemuhle papers. :-)
 Btw, thanks for the great service concerning my order.

MZ
*************************8

There is 0 chance that the papers have the same coatings. The 
Hahnemuhle Photo Rag is produced in Germany and imported into the 
U.S. The Eclipse Satine is produced entirely in the US at the moment 
and the coatings are very different. They do print similarly however. 
I've been able to use the Generations ink on both papers with very 
similar but different profiles on a 1200.


Gregory Schern