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UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-05-30 by Paul Roark

I found the photos in the latest Lens Work magazine particularly appealing.
This included the warm tone that was used to print them.

 

So, in part as just an exercise, I duplicated the tones on the PermaJet
Fibre Based Gloss with the UT-3D inkset.  You can see a graphical comparison
of the tones at http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/LensWork-Warm.pdf   It looks
very close.

 

 

Paul

www.PaulRoark.com <http://www.paulroark.com/>  

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-05-30 by Carl Schofield

Paul,

I've been using Create-icc profiles to make toned monochrome RGB  
images for printing via the Colorburst RIP.  If you have the 220  
Lenswork icc profile available I would like to give it a try with my  
workflow.

Thanks,
Carl
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On May 30, 2006, at 2:44 AM, Paul Roark wrote:

> I found the photos in the latest Lens Work magazine particularly  
> appealing.
> This included the warm tone that was used to print them.
>
>
>
> So, in part as just an exercise, I duplicated the tones on the  
> PermaJet
> Fibre Based Gloss with the UT-3D inkset.  You can see a graphical  
> comparison
> of the tones at http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/LensWork-Warm.pdf    
> It looks
> very close.
>
>
>
>
>
> Paul
>
> www.PaulRoark.com <http://www.paulroark.com/>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -------------------- 
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>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
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> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
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> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
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> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
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> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
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> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
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> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
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> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
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> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-05-30 by Richard Cooke

Hi Paul,

This is great news as I've been trying to get a nice warm tone but
haven't mastered the curve generation (yet).

Do you have a link to this curve on your site yet?  I'm going to try
and use this curve to make a Kirkland Glossy version.  

With the Kirkland glossy paper I know Eboni can't be used so which
UT-3D inks do you recommend I stick with for the Lenswork tone?

Looking at the swab tests for the various inks it looks like C and LC
are warm so they'll probably be used but I'm a bit in the dark on what
other inks to use.

Thanks,

Richard Cooke

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
<paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> I found the photos in the latest Lens Work magazine particularly
appealing.
> This included the warm tone that was used to print them.
> 
>  
> 
> So, in part as just an exercise, I duplicated the tones on the PermaJet
> Fibre Based Gloss with the UT-3D inkset.  You can see a graphical
comparison
> of the tones at http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/LensWork-Warm.pdf   It
looks
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> very close.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Paul
> 
> www.PaulRoark.com <http://www.paulroark.com/>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

RE: [Digital BW] Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-05-31 by Paul Roark

Richard,

> Do you have a link to this curve on your site yet?  I'm going to try
> and use this curve to make a Kirkland Glossy version.

I just posted Permajet Fiber Gloss and Kirkland "LW-Warm" curves and ICCs.

See http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT-3D_Downloads.html

The Kirkland paper printed way too cool with the PJ Fibre Gloss ICC.  I also
decided the 100% black should be more neutral (i.e., cooler) on the Kirkland
curve.  To me it looks darker with no visible color distinction. 

I have not verified that the Permajet version is identical to the Innova
version sold in the U.S., but it probably at least has the same coating. 


> 
> With the Kirkland glossy paper I know Eboni can't be used so which
> UT-3D inks do you recommend I stick with for the Lenswork tone?

I assume UT-3D with Eboni installed.

Hope they work for you.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
> <paul.roark@...> wrote:
> >
> > I found the photos in the latest Lens Work magazine particularly
> appealing.
> > This included the warm tone that was used to print them.
> >
> >
> >
> > So, in part as just an exercise, I duplicated the tones on the PermaJet
> > Fibre Based Gloss with the UT-3D inkset.  You can see a graphical
> comparison
> > of the tones at http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/LensWork-Warm.pdf   It
> looks
> > very close.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > www.PaulRoark.com <http://www.paulroark.com/>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
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> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
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> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
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> section:
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> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND
> “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

RE: [Digital BW] Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-05-31 by Jim Doyle

Paul

 

By The way Send Me The Address To send This to you at..for some reason I
cant find It and I will send The F Type via priority mail..

 

Cheers

 

Jim Doyle

 

J. Doyle Enterprises LLC

114 Old Orchard Rd

Cherry Hill NJ 08003

856-424-8660

HYPERLINK "http://www.shadesofpaper.com"www.shadesofpaper.com

 

   _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul
Roark
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 2:34 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Digital BW] Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm
profile

 

Richard,

> Do you have a link to this curve on your site yet?  I'm going to try
> and use this curve to make a Kirkland Glossy version.

I just posted Permajet Fiber Gloss and Kirkland "LW-Warm" curves and ICCs.

See HYPERLINK
"http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT-3D_Downloads.html"http://home1.gte.net/res
09aij/UT-3D_Downloads.html

The Kirkland paper printed way too cool with the PJ Fibre Gloss ICC.  I also
decided the 100% black should be more neutral (i.e., cooler) on the Kirkland
curve.  To me it looks darker with no visible color distinction. 

I have not verified that the Permajet version is identical to the Innova
version sold in the U.S., but it probably at least has the same coating. 


> 
> With the Kirkland glossy paper I know Eboni can't be used so which
> UT-3D inks do you recommend I stick with for the Lenswork tone?

I assume UT-3D with Eboni installed.

Hope they work for you.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 


> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
> <paul.roark@...> wrote:
> >
> > I found the photos in the latest Lens Work magazine particularly
> appealing.
> > This included the warm tone that was used to print them.
> >
> >
> >
> > So, in part as just an exercise, I duplicated the tones on the PermaJet
> > Fibre Based Gloss with the UT-3D inkset.  You can see a graphical
> comparison
> > of the tones at HYPERLINK
"http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/LensWork-Warm.pdf"http://home1.gte.net/res09a
ij/LensWork-Warm.pdf   It
> looks
> > very close.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > www.PaulRoark.com <HYPERLINK
"http://www.paulroark.com/"http://www.paulroark.com/>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> HYPERLINK
"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint"http://groups.ya
hoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See �Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines� in the Files
> section:
> HYPERLINK
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oups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE �OWNER� AND
> �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> �OWNER� AND �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
they are often being updated.

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hoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

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Please follow these basic guidelines:
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Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
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printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
the membership.
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FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY
DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  �OWNER� AND
�MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-05-31 by Jim Doyle

Paul

 

By The Way Send Me Your address So I can send you a box OK..

 

For some reason I cant find it..

 

Jim Doyle

 

J. Doyle Enterprises LLC

114 Old Orchard Rd

Cherry Hill NJ 08003

856-424-8660

HYPERLINK "http://www.shadesofpaper.com"www.shadesofpaper.com

 

   _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul
Roark
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 2:34 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Digital BW] Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm
profile

 

Richard,

> Do you have a link to this curve on your site yet?  I'm going to try
> and use this curve to make a Kirkland Glossy version.

I just posted Permajet Fiber Gloss and Kirkland "LW-Warm" curves and ICCs.

See HYPERLINK
"http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT-3D_Downloads.html"http://home1.gte.net/res
09aij/UT-3D_Downloads.html

The Kirkland paper printed way too cool with the PJ Fibre Gloss ICC.  I also
decided the 100% black should be more neutral (i.e., cooler) on the Kirkland
curve.  To me it looks darker with no visible color distinction. 

I have not verified that the Permajet version is identical to the Innova
version sold in the U.S., but it probably at least has the same coating. 


> 
> With the Kirkland glossy paper I know Eboni can't be used so which
> UT-3D inks do you recommend I stick with for the Lenswork tone?

I assume UT-3D with Eboni installed.

Hope they work for you.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 


> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
> <paul.roark@...> wrote:
> >
> > I found the photos in the latest Lens Work magazine particularly
> appealing.
> > This included the warm tone that was used to print them.
> >
> >
> >
> > So, in part as just an exercise, I duplicated the tones on the PermaJet
> > Fibre Based Gloss with the UT-3D inkset.  You can see a graphical
> comparison
> > of the tones at HYPERLINK
"http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/LensWork-Warm.pdf"http://home1.gte.net/res09a
ij/LensWork-Warm.pdf   It
> looks
> > very close.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > www.PaulRoark.com <HYPERLINK
"http://www.paulroark.com/"http://www.paulroark.com/>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> HYPERLINK
"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint"http://groups.ya
hoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See �Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines� in the Files
> section:
> HYPERLINK
"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/"http://gr
oups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE �OWNER� AND
> �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> �OWNER� AND �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
they are often being updated.

HYPERLINK
"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint"http://groups.ya
hoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

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Please follow these basic guidelines:
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Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-05-31 by Richard Cooke

Paul,

I wasn't very clear in my oringal post - sorry about that but I'm
trying to figure out how to work with the UT-3D inkset in my 2200 so I
think a better way to ask this might be required.

In your PDF "http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/Profiling%20UT-3D.pdf"  you
state:

"In general, moving a point down increases the amount of ink. So, Red
(C = Carbon) moved down makes the print warmer, up cooler. Green (M =
Main cool toner) moved down makes the print cooler, up warmer."

What does the Blue curve do?

What would help me wrap my head around this whole concept is what inks
are being manipulated by the Red curve?  Green curve? and Blue curve?
 Or is it not that simple?  I'd ultimately like to be able to print to
EEM and Innova PhotoSmooth and also to the Kirkland glossy with the
warm toned Lenswork look.  I will certainly use your 220 curves as a
starting point but the mystery of which specific inks are used to make
the warm tones will help me out.

I hope this makes sense.

Thanks,

Richard Cooke

 <paul.roark@...> wrote:
>
> Richard,
> 
> > Do you have a link to this curve on your site yet?  I'm going to try
> > and use this curve to make a Kirkland Glossy version.
> 
> I just posted Permajet Fiber Gloss and Kirkland "LW-Warm" curves and
ICCs.
> 
> See http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT-3D_Downloads.html
> 
> The Kirkland paper printed way too cool with the PJ Fibre Gloss ICC.
 I also
> decided the 100% black should be more neutral (i.e., cooler) on the
Kirkland
> curve.  To me it looks darker with no visible color distinction. 
> 
> I have not verified that the Permajet version is identical to the Innova
> version sold in the U.S., but it probably at least has the same
coating. 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> 
> 
> > 
> > With the Kirkland glossy paper I know Eboni can't be used so which
> > UT-3D inks do you recommend I stick with for the Lenswork tone?
> 
> I assume UT-3D with Eboni installed.
> 
> Hope they work for you.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com 
> 
>

RE: [Digital BW] Re: UT-3D, Fiba Print Gloss, Lens Work warm profile

2006-06-01 by Paul Roark

Richard,

> ... I'm trying to figure out how to work with the UT-3D inkset in my 2200
...

> 
> In your PDF "http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/Profiling%20UT-3D.pdf"  you
> state:
> 
> "In general, moving a point down increases the amount of ink. So, Red
> (C = Carbon) moved down makes the print warmer, up cooler. Green (M =
> Main cool toner) moved down makes the print cooler, up warmer."
> 
> What does the Blue curve do?

The blue curve controls the Y-position ink.  That ink is a light toner that
lies roughly on the Lab a* axis (it varies somewhat with paper type and
density).  So, after I set the approximate density and lab b* value
(yellow-blue axis) I want, I move the blue curve to adjust the print to the
a* tone a want.  Usually something just below 1 looks good with a neutral
print.  With warmer prints more looks good.


> 
> What would help me wrap my head around this whole concept is what inks
> are being manipulated by the Red curve?  Green curve? and Blue curve?

The inkjet printers work on complementary colors.  So, the red curve
controls the cyan jet.  With the 3D insket, the cyan jet is where the carbon
ink is.  So, red curve = carbon ink.  Green curve = M-position ink (main
cool toner).  The blue curve = Y-position ink (a light red/magenta hue).


>  I'd ultimately like to be able to print to
> EEM and Innova PhotoSmooth and also to the Kirkland glossy with the
> warm toned Lenswork look.

With lots of different printers out there using this inkset, making curves
for them all is going to be a challenge.  I'll be looking at QTR and Roy's
approach also, which might be able to more efficiently port curves for one
system to another.  It would be nice to have a universal inkset and a system
of curves that will work on virtually any printer with just an application
of an ink load adjuster. 

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

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