Yahoo Groups archive

Digital BW, The Print

Index last updated: 2026-04-28 22:56 UTC

Thread

LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking for recommendations

LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking for recommendations

2007-03-06 by Danny Raphael

I surfed the msg. archives. It's been awhile since there has been a 
thread of this nature. Models, technology and prices change so 
quickly. 

Like many have done before me, I'm about to take the leap away from a 
CRT monitor to an LCD.

==========

What brand/model and size LCD do you use specifically for BW work?

Would you recommend it? 

What do you like/not like about it?

Lowest LCD dot pitch I've found is .256. DP on my CRT is .22? Seems 
like .256 is a step down, or does it matter? 

----------

Also, I would appreciate opinions on things like:
* Among all the specs, features: Which do you think are important? 
* S-IPC panels: Better for BW than PVA panels or it don't matter?
* Any other pearls of wisdom you are willing to share

========== 

Thanks in advance.

   ~Danny~

RE: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking for recommendations

2007-03-06 by Ken Carney

Danny,

I can recommend the Samsung 214T.  It is 1600x1200, dvi, and about $600.  I
wouldn't want to go larger than 21".  Even at 21", when soft-proofing I have
to put two smaller images side by side in the middle.  With two larger
images, the viewing angle may cause some visual differences.  I have a 15"
LCD to the side and behind for the Photoshop tool palettes.  You will need a
digital (dvi) card if you don't have one, but I just got a GEForce 7600 dual
dvi and VGA (PC Express) for my son for $100.  This combo works fine for
color and b&w, and you don't have to spend a fortune.

With an LCD, things are reversed from a CRT.  With a CRT it is low room
light.  With an LCD, it is brighter room light and a less bright image.
They all need to be calibrated with a colorimeter like the Spyder Pro
anyway.  Note that with a PC, only the dvi monitor can be calibrated, but
the second monitor is just for tool palettes anyway, so no big deal.  Hope
this helps.

Ken
www.kencarney.com
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny
> Raphael
> Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 7:13 PM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using?
> Looking for recommendations
> 
> I surfed the msg. archives. It's been awhile since there has been a
> thread of this nature. Models, technology and prices change so
> quickly.
> 
> Like many have done before me, I'm about to take the leap away from a
> CRT monitor to an LCD.
> 
> ==========
> 
> What brand/model and size LCD do you use specifically for BW work?
> 
> Would you recommend it?
> 
> What do you like/not like about it?
> 
> Lowest LCD dot pitch I've found is .256. DP on my CRT is .22? Seems
> like .256 is a step down, or does it matter?
> 
> ----------
> 
> Also, I would appreciate opinions on things like:
> * Among all the specs, features: Which do you think are important?
> * S-IPC panels: Better for BW than PVA panels or it don't matter?
> * Any other pearls of wisdom you are willing to share
> 
> ==========
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
>    ~Danny~
>

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking for recommendations

2007-03-08 by Danny Raphael

Thanks, Ken, for your reply and valuable insights. 

Considering the number of experienced and exceptionally talented 
folks who participate in this group who seem so willing to help, it's 
surprising and a bit disappointing that yours is the only reply so 
far. 

How hard can it be to type the brand and model of an LCD that works 
well in a BW print workflow?

> 
> I can recommend the Samsung 214T.  It is 1600x1200, dvi, and about 
$600.  I
> wouldn't want to go larger than 21".  Even at 21", when soft-
proofing I have
> to put two smaller images side by side in the middle.  With two 
larger
> images, the viewing angle may cause some visual differences.  I 
have a 15"
> LCD to the side and behind for the Photoshop tool palettes.  You 
will need a
> digital (dvi) card if you don't have one, but I just got a GEForce 
7600 dual
> dvi and VGA (PC Express) for my son for $100.  This combo works 
fine for
> color and b&w, and you don't have to spend a fortune.
> 
> With an LCD, things are reversed from a CRT.  With a CRT it is low 
room
> light.  With an LCD, it is brighter room light and a less bright 
image.
> They all need to be calibrated with a colorimeter like the Spyder 
Pro
> anyway.  Note that with a PC, only the dvi monitor can be 
calibrated, but
> the second monitor is just for tool palettes anyway, so no big 
deal.  Hope
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> this helps.
> 
> Ken
> www.kencarney.com

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking for recommendations

2007-03-08 by Mark Savoia

Eizo ColorEdge CE210W
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Mar 8, 2007, at 1:08 PM, Danny Raphael wrote:

> Thanks, Ken, for your reply and valuable insights.
>
> Considering the number of experienced and exceptionally talented
> folks who participate in this group who seem so willing to help, it's
> surprising and a bit disappointing that yours is the only reply so
> far.
>
> How hard can it be to type the brand and model of an LCD that works
> well in a BW print workflow?
>
>>
>> I can recommend the Samsung 214T.  It is 1600x1200, dvi, and about
> $600.  I
>> wouldn't want to go larger than 21".  Even at 21", when soft-
> proofing I have
>> to put two smaller images side by side in the middle.  With two
> larger
>> images, the viewing angle may cause some visual differences.  I
> have a 15"
>> LCD to the side and behind for the Photoshop tool palettes.  You
> will need a
>> digital (dvi) card if you don't have one, but I just got a GEForce
> 7600 dual
>> dvi and VGA (PC Express) for my son for $100.  This combo works
> fine for
>> color and b&w, and you don't have to spend a fortune.
>>
>> With an LCD, things are reversed from a CRT.  With a CRT it is low
> room
>> light.  With an LCD, it is brighter room light and a less bright
> image.
>> They all need to be calibrated with a colorimeter like the Spyder
> Pro
>> anyway.  Note that with a PC, only the dvi monitor can be
> calibrated, but
>> the second monitor is just for tool palettes anyway, so no big
> deal.  Hope
>> this helps.
>>
>> Ken
>> www.kencarney.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -------------------- 
> ~-->
> Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design.
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/hOt0.A/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/ucIolB/TM
> -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> ~->
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

Epson 4000 vs. 3800

2007-03-08 by aitor Peña Inclán

Hi,
I am going to buy a Epson 3800 ( 1350 euros ) in the next days and have been
offered a used 4000 ( 1000 euros ). And I doubt now which could be the best
option. I want it for both , color and BW ( I have a 2100 to BW with UT7 too
). 
Which do you think I must choose?
regards

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Robert Lee

It's possible that those folks may not be using LCDs, or are not
satisfied with theirs. Serious photogs are among the last of the CRT
holdouts. You must know that LCD's still have shortcomings relative
to CRT's that affect photographic work, especially in greyscale. LCD's
have many advantages, and they are getting better all the time,
but someone used to thousands of dollars' worth of gorgeously rich,
high-end CRT (or even a well-adjusted merely good CRT) would be
trading off some critical performance for those advantages. There are
very expensive, high-end LCD's as well, but I don't know much about them.

I'm strictly amateur, but FWIW, I use a Dell 2007WFP. When I bought
it, panels with glossy finishes were being touted as a solution at
least to the weaker colors and wimpier blacks of LCD panels. I don't
know where things stand today.

Bob L

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Danny Raphael"
<dannyraphael@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Thanks, Ken, for your reply and valuable insights. 
> 
> Considering the number of experienced and exceptionally talented 
> folks who participate in this group who seem so willing to help, it's 
> surprising and a bit disappointing that yours is the only reply so 
> far. 
> 
> How hard can it be to type the brand and model of an LCD that works 
> well in a BW print workflow?
> 
> > 
> > I can recommend the Samsung 214T.  It is 1600x1200, dvi, and about 
> $600.  I
> > wouldn't want to go larger than 21".  Even at 21", when soft-
> proofing I have
> > to put two smaller images side by side in the middle.  With two 
> larger
> > images, the viewing angle may cause some visual differences.  I 
> have a 15"
> > LCD to the side and behind for the Photoshop tool palettes.  You 
> will need a
> > digital (dvi) card if you don't have one, but I just got a GEForce 
> 7600 dual
> > dvi and VGA (PC Express) for my son for $100.  This combo works 
> fine for
> > color and b&w, and you don't have to spend a fortune.
> > 
> > With an LCD, things are reversed from a CRT.  With a CRT it is low 
> room
> > light.  With an LCD, it is brighter room light and a less bright 
> image.
> > They all need to be calibrated with a colorimeter like the Spyder 
> Pro
> > anyway.  Note that with a PC, only the dvi monitor can be 
> calibrated, but
> > the second monitor is just for tool palettes anyway, so no big 
> deal.  Hope
> > this helps.
> > 
> > Ken
> > www.kencarney.com
>

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Tyler Boley

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Lee" <l33ry@...> wrote:
>
> It's possible that those folks may not be using LCDs, or are not
> satisfied with theirs. Serious photogs are among the last of the CRT
> holdouts...

You got that right, I'm eaking every last minute I can out of my CRTs before making any 
switch. Paying twice as much for new equipment that works half as well is not my idea of 
wisdom...
Mark mentioned Eizo, that seems to be the common recomendation by those in the know.
Tyler

Re: [Digital BW] Epson 4000 vs. 3800

2007-03-08 by CorrPro96@aol.com

The 4000 is priced too high. They are selling for 1/2 that price. The 3800 is a better choice for the money. 
If you had another alternative timewise, a used 4000 with ImagePrint 6.1 could be gotten here in the US for about USD 1100.00, and would be the best choice with that package IMO.
 
Richard (Brooklyn)
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: aitor.pinclan@...
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thu, 8 Mar 2007 1:22 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Epson 4000 vs. 3800


Hi,
I am going to buy a Epson 3800 ( 1350 euros ) in the next days and have been
offered a used 4000 ( 1000 euros ). And I doubt now which could be the best
option. I want it for both , color and BW ( I have a 2100 to BW with UT7 too
). 
Which do you think I must choose?
regards





Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as they 
are often being updated.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to 
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them 
short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. Hostile, 
aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the membership without 
notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W 
printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from the 
membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and guidelines, 
and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See 
“Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the Files section:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/

BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! 
GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF 
DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, 
INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT 
NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER 
INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE 
PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), 
RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT 
YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR 
DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE 
PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE 
PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
 
Yahoo! Groups Links



________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone.  Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Mark Savoia

Truly out of the box accurate to all the black and white printing. I  
was last on a CRT and thought that was good, no way. The price on  
this is much less then I spent on my old PressView many years ago  
(like one third) that I had put on the train tracks to get rid of, it  
weights as much as a train, .....looked comfortable there.

On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:32 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:

> Mark mentioned Eizo, that seems to be the common recomendation by  
> those in the know.
> Tyler



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Tyler Boley

Well, OK, a PressView. You must be almost as old as me.
I'm talking the $1k or so I spent on nice big Lacie's and Mitsu's, aren't those Eizos about 
$2k?
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia <mark@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Truly out of the box accurate to all the black and white printing. I  
> was last on a CRT and thought that was good, no way. The price on  
> this is much less then I spent on my old PressView many years ago  
> (like one third) that I had put on the train tracks to get rid of, it  
> weights as much as a train, .....looked comfortable there.
> 
> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:32 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:
> 
> > Mark mentioned Eizo, that seems to be the common recomendation by  
> > those in the know.
> > Tyler
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Mark Savoia

This one was just over $1K 21" Wide, they make a 24" Wide for around  
$1.7K
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:51 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:

> Well, OK, a PressView. You must be almost as old as me.
> I'm talking the $1k or so I spent on nice big Lacie's and Mitsu's,  
> aren't those Eizos about
> $2k?
> Tyler
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia  
> <mark@...> wrote:
>>
>> Truly out of the box accurate to all the black and white printing. I
>> was last on a CRT and thought that was good, no way. The price on
>> this is much less then I spent on my old PressView many years ago
>> (like one third) that I had put on the train tracks to get rid of, it
>> weights as much as a train, .....looked comfortable there.
>>
>> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:32 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:
>>
>>> Mark mentioned Eizo, that seems to be the common recomendation by
>>> those in the know.
>>> Tyler
>>
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -------------------- 
> ~-->
> See what's inside the new Yahoo! Groups email.
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/0It09A/bOaOAA/yQLSAA/ucIolB/TM
> -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> ~->
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

RE: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Alan Kearney

Depends on the model. I paid $2600 for my EIZO CG210 a year ago.

 

Alan

 

  _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tyler
Boley
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 11:51 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you
using? Looking fo

 

Well, OK, a PressView. You must be almost as old as me.
I'm talking the $1k or so I spent on nice big Lacie's and Mitsu's, aren't
those Eizos about 
$2k?
Tyler 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Tyler Boley

do you like it for color too? I think there are a couple of price tiers, depending on feature 
or something...
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia <mark@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> This one was just over $1K 21" Wide, they make a 24" Wide for around  
> $1.7K
> Mark
> 
> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:51 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:
> 
> > Well, OK, a PressView. You must be almost as old as me.
> > I'm talking the $1k or so I spent on nice big Lacie's and Mitsu's,  
> > aren't those Eizos about
> > $2k?
> > Tyler
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia  
> > <mark@> wrote:
> >>
> >> Truly out of the box accurate to all the black and white printing. I
> >> was last on a CRT and thought that was good, no way. The price on
> >> this is much less then I spent on my old PressView many years ago
> >> (like one third) that I had put on the train tracks to get rid of, it
> >> weights as much as a train, .....looked comfortable there.
> >>
> >> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:32 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:
> >>
> >>> Mark mentioned Eizo, that seems to be the common recomendation by
> >>> those in the know.
> >>> Tyler
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -------------------- 
> > ~-->
> > See what's inside the new Yahoo! Groups email.
> > http://us.click.yahoo.com/0It09A/bOaOAA/yQLSAA/ucIolB/TM
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> > ~->
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> > resources as they are often being updated.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> > wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> > visiting this same page.
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> > to keep them short.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> > from the membership without notice.
> > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> > removed from the membership.
> > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> > and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> > group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines"  
> > in the Files section:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> >
> > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> > "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> > NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> > INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL  
> > BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> > SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> > THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> > OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> > CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> > GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Mark Savoia

Works great with the color. I noticed much less eye strain after a  
day of using it too.
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:59 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:

> do you like it for color too? I think there are a couple of price  
> tiers, depending on feature
> or something...
> Tyler
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia  
> <mark@...> wrote:
>>
>> This one was just over $1K 21" Wide, they make a 24" Wide for around
>> $1.7K
>> Mark
>>
>> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:51 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:
>>
>>> Well, OK, a PressView. You must be almost as old as me.
>>> I'm talking the $1k or so I spent on nice big Lacie's and Mitsu's,
>>> aren't those Eizos about
>>> $2k?
>>> Tyler
>>>
>>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia
>>> <mark@> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Truly out of the box accurate to all the black and white  
>>>> printing. I
>>>> was last on a CRT and thought that was good, no way. The price on
>>>> this is much less then I spent on my old PressView many years ago
>>>> (like one third) that I had put on the train tracks to get rid  
>>>> of, it
>>>> weights as much as a train, .....looked comfortable there.
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:32 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Mark mentioned Eizo, that seems to be the common recomendation by
>>>>> those in the know.
>>>>> Tyler
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------
>>> ~-->
>>> See what's inside the new Yahoo! Groups email.
>>> http://us.click.yahoo.com/0It09A/bOaOAA/yQLSAA/ucIolB/TM
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> ~->
>>>
>>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
>>> resources as they are often being updated.
>>>
>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>>>
>>> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you
>>> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by
>>> visiting this same page.
>>>
>>> Please follow these basic guidelines:
>>> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages
>>> to keep them short.
>>> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
>>> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed
>>> from the membership without notice.
>>> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital
>>> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
>>> removed from the membership.
>>> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules
>>> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the
>>> group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines"
>>> in the Files section:
>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>>>
>>> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
>>> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE
>>> "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL
>>> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,
>>> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,
>>> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER
>>> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL
>>> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF
>>> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE
>>> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO
>>> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR
>>> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
>>> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
>>> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>>>
>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -------------------- 
> ~-->
> Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design.
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/hOt0.A/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/ucIolB/TM
> -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> ~->
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by Clayton Jones

Hello Danny,

>Considering the number of experienced and exceptionally talented 
>folks who participate in this group who seem so willing to help, 
>it's surprising and a bit disappointing that yours is the only 
>reply so far. 
>How hard can it be to type the brand and model of an LCD that works 
>well in a BW print workflow?

Usually if people don't reply to something it's because they don't
feel they have anything worth sharing.  I doubt you were being
ignored.  I didn't reply because I'm using a rather plain jane 17"
Samsung 710n and I have no idea how good or bad it is compared to
something else.  It seems pretty good.  I push the button, it turns on
every time without fail.  I can't say much about it beyond that.  I
didn't feel that was information that would be helpful to you.  But
there you have it.


Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by elwood@wsnconsult.com

Tyler

Congratulations on your feature in this months Lenswork extended CD. I haven't received it yet but I really look forward to reading it.

Woody Spedden
Show quoted textHide quoted text
----- Original Message ----
From: Tyler Boley <tyler@...m>
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, March 8, 2007 12:59:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo









  


    
            do you like it for color too? I think there are a couple of price tiers, depending on feature 

or something...

Tyler



--- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, Mark Savoia <mark@...> wrote:

>

> This one was just over $1K 21" Wide, they make a 24" Wide for around  

> $1.7K

> Mark

> 

> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:51 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:

> 

> > Well, OK, a PressView. You must be almost as old as me.

> > I'm talking the $1k or so I spent on nice big Lacie's and Mitsu's,  

> > aren't those Eizos about

> > $2k?

> > Tyler

> >

> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, Mark Savoia  

> > <mark@> wrote:

> >>

> >> Truly out of the box accurate to all the black and white printing. I

> >> was last on a CRT and thought that was good, no way. The price on

> >> this is much less then I spent on my old PressView many years ago

> >> (like one third) that I had put on the train tracks to get rid of, it

> >> weights as much as a train, .....looked comfortable there.

> >>

> >> On Mar 8, 2007, at 2:32 PM, Tyler Boley wrote:

> >>

> >>> Mark mentioned Eizo, that seems to be the common recomendation by

> >>> those in the know.

> >>> Tyler

> >>

> >>

> >>

> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >>

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------ --------- --- Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ------------ -------- 

> > ~-->

> > See what's inside the new Yahoo! Groups email.

> > http://us.click. yahoo.com/ 0It09A/bOaOAA/ yQLSAA/ucIolB/ TM

> > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - 

> > ~->

> >

> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  

> > resources as they are often being updated.

> >

> > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/DigitalBla ckandWhiteThePri nt

> >

> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  

> > wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  

> > visiting this same page.

> >

> > Please follow these basic guidelines:

> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  

> > to keep them short.

> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  

> > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  

> > from the membership without notice.

> > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  

> > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  

> > removed from the membership.

> > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  

> > and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  

> > group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines"  

> > in the Files section:

> > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/DigitalBla ckandWhiteThePri nt/files/

> >

> > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  

> > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  

> > "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  

> > NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  

> > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  

> > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  

> > INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL  

> > BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  

> > SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  

> > THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  

> > OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  

> > CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  

> > GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  

> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP.

> >

> > Yahoo! Groups Links

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>





    
  

    
    




<!--

RE: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-08 by John Moody

I’m only buying mid-level monitors right now.
The “new” large gamut monitors with fully configurable white point are
coming down in price, but I believe they require more than 8 bits/channel to
render smoothly for color photographic editing (when used with the larger
gamut).
That means waiting till software(s) and video card allows >8-bit data pipe
to the monitor, and that is some time off yet for the consumer market.  When
that day comes, I’ll likely be an early adopter.

One thought; the longer you _make_ a crt last, the more abrupt the
transition to sharp pixels will be.  I had to re-learn the display-to-print
sharpness function by holding too long onto a favorite 24” Sony.

Best regards,
John Moody
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Tyler
Boley
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 2:59 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you
using? Looking fo

do you like it for color too? I think there are a couple of price tiers,
depending on feature
or something...
Tyler



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

PMA, Any Epson surprises?

2007-03-09 by Mark Savoia

Tyler or anyone else at PMA, did Epson make any surprise  
announcements of new large format 12 color printers? With the Canons  
out for some time now I would think Epson can not be too far behind.
Mark

Re: [Digital BW] Epson 4000 vs. 3800

2007-03-09 by lindstromdick

I totally agree with all the answers in this thread.
However ther is a slight problem with the 3800 that I posted on Epson 
Wide format group, but with no answer. I have also confronted Swedish 
support with this.

"When using the front feed function with the 3800printer, I enden up
with a very destroyed hahnemulepaper. I then discovered two plastic
things interferring with the paper path, catching the paper before it
leaves the printer. Is this a mistake in my printer, or is it built in
this stupid way?"

So take care when printing on expensive but beautiful paper.

Re: [Digital BW] PMA, Any Epson surprises?

2007-03-09 by Ernst Dinkla

Mark Savoia wrote:
> Tyler or anyone else at PMA, did Epson make any surprise  
> announcements of new large format 12 color printers? With the Canons  
> out for some time now I would think Epson can not be too far behind.
> Mark

Rumours I heard a month or more ago are aimed at size: a 60"
Epson and a 60" HP. With Canon's full range in wide formats as
the competition and a supposed 10 years agreement of Epson
with? on max. size ending soon. That's the gossip one hears on
any show I guess. Wonder whether HP will fill in the A2 size
as well.
I'm not convinced the next wide format Epson will have more
than 9 inks and 8 heads, more 3800 style I think but bigger.


Met vriendelijke groeten,Ernst


|  Dinkla Grafische Techniek  |
|     www.pigment-print.com    |
|             ( unvollendet )            |

Re: [Digital BW] PMA, Any Epson surprises?

2007-03-09 by Tom Baker

I believe that many, many people would be quite happy with a larger printer based on the 3800. Especially if they managed to keep the relative price point.
   
  Tom Baker

Ernst Dinkla <E.Dinkla@...> wrote:
          Mark Savoia wrote:
> Tyler or anyone else at PMA, did Epson make any surprise 
> announcements of new large format 12 color printers? With the Canons 
> out for some time now I would think Epson can not be too far behind.
> Mark

Rumours I heard a month or more ago are aimed at size: a 60"
Epson and a 60" HP. With Canon's full range in wide formats as
the competition and a supposed 10 years agreement of Epson
with? on max. size ending soon. That's the gossip one hears on
any show I guess. Wonder whether HP will fill in the A2 size
as well.
I'm not convinced the next wide format Epson will have more
than 9 inks and 8 heads, more 3800 style I think but bigger.

Met vriendelijke groeten,Ernst

| Dinkla Grafische Techniek |
| www.pigment-print.com |
| ( unvollendet ) |



         


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] LCDs for BW prints - what brand/model are you using? Looking fo

2007-03-10 by Danny Raphael

Thanks to all who jumped in with feedback. Got some good info.

- - - - - - - 

Clayton:

> Usually if people don't reply to something it's because they don't
> feel they have anything worth sharing.

Understood. I'm am a participant [not just a lurker] in other Yahoo 
groups and various forums. In fact I moderate a forum at RetouchPRO, 
so I know the drill in this regard. [I've lurked here so far because 
I'm just getting into "serious" BW printing and to date haven't 
had "anything worth sharing" — so you hit this one on the head.] 

20/20 hindsight:

Had I limited the post to something like, "If you're using an LCD for 
your BW work, what brand/model are you using?" there would have been 
more bites initially. Even old dogs like me need to be reminded 
sometimes of how to best leverage this type of communication medium: 
Keep it Simple

Turned out OK... got some very valuable info, including yours. :-) 
It's all good.

Thanks for your sage words.

    ~Danny~

A bit OT: Any Epson surprises?

2007-03-10 by Sergei Antonov

I looked in Seattle store at both 3800 and Canon IPF5000. Price 
generally is quite close with Canon rebate, and there is no after-
market carts for any of those machine. Side by side, Epson looked quite 
flimsy compared to Canon. I am wondering, is there any benefit in 
getting Epson 3800 compared to Canon besides of $100 and smaller 
footprint? Glazer's associate wasn't able to show me any samples, or 
tell anythyng beyond usual marketing crap about both printers, but 
that's expected. Does anyone here have good reasons to prefer Epson?

I see IPF5000 on shades of paper and other places for about $1400, and 
3800 is generally goes for $1300. After looking for years how my 2200 
is spitting inks to waste I lost my trust to Epson, even when my inks 
are not OEM anymore. In a long run it seems that Canon will save $100 
difference in inks expences pretty soon after purchase. I am looking 
for the printer for both color and B/W, any opinions. please? 
I could and will experiment with 2200 and R200 using MIS B/W inks, but 
I also want to have a machine that will do decent color, B/W, will not 
require hassling around with RIP and black magic, and will not be 
designed as money syphone.

Thanks,
Sergei

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Tom Baker 
<tbaker1328@...> wrote:
>
> I believe that many, many people would be quite happy with a larger 
printer based on the 3800. Especially if they managed to keep the 
relative price point.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>    
>   Tom Baker
>

Move to quarantaine

This moves the raw source file on disk only. The archive index is not changed automatically, so you still need to run a manual refresh afterward.