AETHERPHON, global theremin family

Well, I can understand David wanting to rename the list. Spellbound is
a wonderful name, though. But perhaps keep it for the radio show.
Ethermail is clever, but I would think Theremin-L would be best from
the simple point of view of making it immediately clear what the group
is about.

Two things... A possible fun thread: where did theremin players first
encounter the theremin? Or what first turned them on to the
instrument... I think in my case it would probably be the ?1969 film
_Captain Nemo and the Underwater City_. Does anybody remember that? I
don't think it's critically loved, but it was one of my favourites as a
child and I found the scene where the woman plays her
golden-tree-type-theremin-thingie enchanting... spellbinding.

Secondly, on more mundane matters, how can I control the world with my
theremin? That is, can I get a midi converter for it? Mine is a
Wavefront case model. In fact Wavefront (if he is still going) do a
midi box for the theremin, but it's $600+.

Gerard xx 



http://www.culturalamnesia.com 

http://www.myspace.com/ggreenway

I think my first encounter with the theremin was a vague recollection of 
a M*A*S*H episode (which I am trying to relocate, BTW, to get a 
soundbite of it) where Hawkeye Pierce is bored and trying to engage 
everyone he encounters into a game of Scrabble, and he plays "theremin" 
against Radar.

As for when I first began listening, it's also pretty vague.  Somewhere 
along the line I was introduced to the idea and I began playing one 
theremin song a week on Escape From Noise, a recurring feature titled 
simply "the Theremin Song of the Week".  I can't remember how I got the 
idea, but since EFN's playlist policy requires vocals, I'm pretty sure 
one of the first artists I played was Project: Pimento.  It's bugging me 
now that I can't remember.

I'm pretty sure, though, that the first theremin track I possessed was 
"Probably Likely No" by Cultural Amnesia, but it took me over a year to 
realize it was a theremin in the song.


-----
DAVID VESEL -- synthetic music for humans
http://davidv.purplenote.com
porphyrous@...
-----
The Purple Note Radio Network:
Escape From Noise, vocal electronica, 10PM Sats http://efn.purplenote.com
Spellbound, music for theremin, 11PM Suns http://spellbound.purplenote.com
-----




Gerard wrote:

> Well, I can understand David wanting to rename the list. Spellbound is
> a wonderful name, though. But perhaps keep it for the radio show.
> Ethermail is clever, but I would think Theremin-L would be best from
> the simple point of view of making it immediately clear what the group
> is about.
> 
> Two things... A possible fun thread: where did theremin players first
> encounter the theremin? Or what first turned them on to the
> instrument... I think in my case it would probably be the ?1969 film
> _Captain Nemo and the Underwater City_. Does anybody remember that? I
> don't think it's critically loved, but it was one of my favourites as a
> child and I found the scene where the woman plays her
> golden-tree-type-theremin-thingie enchanting... spellbinding.
> 
> Secondly, on more mundane matters, how can I control the world with my
> theremin? That is, can I get a midi converter for it? Mine is a
> Wavefront case model. In fact Wavefront (if he is still going) do a
> midi box for the theremin, but it's $600+.
> 
> Gerard xx 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.culturalamnesia.com 
> 
> http://www.myspace.com/ggreenway
> 
> 
> 
> SPELLBOUND-L, the glocal thereminist community
> 
> To contact the moderator, e-mail porphyrous@...
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

> Secondly, on more mundane matters, how can I control the world with my
 > theremin? That is, can I get a midi converter for it? Mine is a
 > Wavefront case model. In fact Wavefront (if he is still going) do a
 > midi box for the theremin, but it's $600+.

I think it depends on what type of converter you want.  Pitch to MIDI 
converters are expensive and I hear they don't work very well.  What 
seems more likely would be to affect some kind of retrofit for a control 
voltage output, which could then be used directly by any analog 
synthesizer with an CV in, or there are a few MIDI to CV converters 
(though I don't know if they go the other direction) that are much less, 
tending around $100.  I think Kenton used to make one of those.


-----
DAVID VESEL -- synthetic music for humans
http://davidv.purplenote.com
porphyrous@...
-----
The Purple Note Radio Network:
Escape From Noise, vocal electronica, 10PM Sats http://efn.purplenote.com
Spellbound, music for theremin, 11PM Suns http://spellbound.purplenote.com
-----




Gerard wrote:

> Well, I can understand David wanting to rename the list. Spellbound is
> a wonderful name, though. But perhaps keep it for the radio show.
> Ethermail is clever, but I would think Theremin-L would be best from
> the simple point of view of making it immediately clear what the group
> is about.
> 
> Two things... A possible fun thread: where did theremin players first
> encounter the theremin? Or what first turned them on to the
> instrument... I think in my case it would probably be the ?1969 film
> _Captain Nemo and the Underwater City_. Does anybody remember that? I
> don't think it's critically loved, but it was one of my favourites as a
> child and I found the scene where the woman plays her
> golden-tree-type-theremin-thingie enchanting... spellbinding.
> 

> 
> Gerard xx 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.culturalamnesia.com 
> 
> http://www.myspace.com/ggreenway
> 
> 
> 
> SPELLBOUND-L, the glocal thereminist community
> 
> To contact the moderator, e-mail porphyrous@...
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

Quoting David V <porphyrous@...>:

> > Secondly, on more mundane matters, how can I control the world with my
> > theremin? That is, can I get a midi converter for it? Mine is a
> > Wavefront case model. In fact Wavefront (if he is still going) do a
> > midi box for the theremin, but it's $600+.
>
> I think it depends on what type of converter you want.  Pitch to MIDI
> converters are expensive and I hear they don't work very well.  What
> seems more likely would be to affect some kind of retrofit for a control
> voltage output, which could then be used directly by any analog
> synthesizer with an CV in, or there are a few MIDI to CV converters
> (though I don't know if they go the other direction) that are much less,
> tending around $100.  I think Kenton used to make one of those.

Since the Wavefront doesn't have CV (Control Voltage) outputs, you 
would have to
convert the pitch to a CV and then the CV to Midi messages.

Pitch-to-Voltage converters do not work well with ACOUSTIC or 
polyphonic sources
because the converter must extract the note to be converted.  In an acoustic
setting, any reverb, ambience, or resonanant vibrations (i.e., guitar strings)
will mess up the conversion.

However -- a pitch-to-voltage converter works GREAT with a pure 
Theremin signal.

(this next paragraph is technical -- beware! :) )

In fact, the Paia Theremax's CV output is created from the Tmax's internal
pitch-to-voltage converter.  If you check Paia's website and the schematic for
the Theremax, look at the circuit in the area of IC1.  The Theremax's pitch
signal is input to a comparator chip that outputs a pulse wave at the same
frequency as the input.  Besides the pulse wave's use on the bright 
side of the
timbre control, the pulse wave is also used to charge a capacitor.  Since the
capacitor discharges at a set rate and the frequency of the pulse wave 
changes,
then the amount of charge present in the capacitor is proportional to the
frequency.  Send that voltage thru another cap to remove the "ripple" and
voila: you now have a DC voltage proportional to the pitch!

Once obtaining a CV, in order to implement MIDI, the next step would be to
convert the CV to MIDI.

Since my Theremins have CV outputs, I am considering ordering the Paia "Midi
Brain" which is a Voltage-to-Midi converter.  I'm not sure how well it will
work however it is inexpensive so, what the heck!

Another possibility is to create a converter that converts CV to 
resistance that
would, in turn, be compatible with a breath-controller input.  I have played
with this a little bit with patch cords, alligator clips, etc... however I'll
have to do some serious breadboarding I spose.  I have heard that optocouplers
work for this application.

Has anyone been able to accomplish this?  Would appreciate any information!

The TOUGHEST thing about the whole Theremin / Electronic music field is to
balance musical projects with technical projects (and day jobs, mowing the
lawn, etc etc).

OK -- regarding the original question about the Wavefront.  It seems that
Wavefront sells the converter for around $495 according to their website.  I
s'pose with shipping and installation you are pushing the $600 price 
point. And, yes, that seems a bit pricey.

I will keep you posted on my MIDI-brain project -- though it will be a summer
project.  I think it would be easy (only a few bucks) to add a Pitch-to-cv
front end to the MIDI brain and I'll keep you posted on this.

Good day to all!

-- Kevin

I know extremely little about this kind of thing, and not sure if it 
involves midi even; but as I remember, Wilco Botermans 
(http://theremin.nl) used a "Moogerfooger" from Moog Music for theremin 
control translation of some kind, in a demonstration at the Moog Music 
Ether Festival in Asheville last August.

Here's a picture of his demonstration:

   http://www.cantelow.com/vanity/theremin/WilcoSetup.jpg

and here's a large format version of the same pic for closer inspection:

   http://www.cantelow.com/vanity/theremin/WilcoSetupBig.jpg

You'll see in this pic he's also demonstrating a motion sensor glove that 
he put together that is also a controller.  Pretty neat!

He fed all of this, theremin (and glove, IIRC) into Max/MSP, a synthesizer 
program, on his Mac laptop.

That's about everything I know about it.  I bet Wilco would be very happy 
to answer any inquiries about how he puts it together.

Ann

> > Secondly, on more mundane matters, how can I control the world with my
> > theremin? That is, can I get a midi converter for it? Mine is a
> > Wavefront case model. In fact Wavefront (if he is still going) do a
> > midi box for the theremin, but it's $600+.
>

The mention of Cultural Amnesia - of which obscure unit I am a member
and the occasional thereminist - reminds me of another path to the
theremin for me. When the band was first active - back in the
industrial early 80s - I used to play the metal detector. 
This sounds very silly to most people, but will sound slightly less
silly to thereminists. 
The metal detector is the easier instrument, of course.

Thanks for the midi info.

Gerard



--- David V <porphyrous@...> wrote:


---------------------------------
I think my first encounter with the theremin was a vague recollection
of 
a M*A*S*H episode (which I am trying to relocate, BTW, to get a 
soundbite of it) where Hawkeye Pierce is bored and trying to engage 
everyone he encounters into a game of Scrabble, and he plays "theremin"

against Radar.

As for when I first began listening, it's also pretty vague.  Somewhere

along the line I was introduced to the idea and I began playing one 
theremin song a week on Escape From Noise, a recurring feature titled 
simply "the Theremin Song of the Week".  I can't remember how I got the

idea, but since EFN's playlist policy requires vocals, I'm pretty sure 
one of the first artists I played was Project: Pimento.  It's bugging
me 
now that I can't remember.

I'm pretty sure, though, that the first theremin track I possessed was 
"Probably Likely No" by Cultural Amnesia, but it took me over a year to

realize it was a theremin in the song.


-----
DAVID VESEL -- synthetic music for humans
http://davidv.purplenote.com
porphyrous@...
-----
The Purple Note Radio Network:
Escape From Noise, vocal electronica, 10PM Sats
http://efn.purplenote.com
Spellbound, music for theremin, 11PM Suns
http://spellbound.purplenote.com
-----




Gerard wrote:
> Well, I can understand David wanting to rename the list. Spellbound
is
> a wonderful name, though. But perhaps keep it for the radio show.
> Ethermail is clever, but I would think Theremin-L would be best from
> the simple point of view of making it immediately clear what the
group
> is about.
> 
> Two things... A possible fun thread: where did theremin players first
> encounter the theremin? Or what first turned them on to the
> instrument... I think in my case it would probably be the ?1969 film
> _Captain Nemo and the Underwater City_. Does anybody remember that? I
> don't think it's critically loved, but it was one of my favourites as
a
> child and I found the scene where the woman plays her
> golden-tree-type-theremin-thingie enchanting... spellbinding.
> 
> Secondly, on more mundane matters, how can I control the world with
my
> theremin? That is, can I get a midi converter for it? Mine is a
> Wavefront case model. In fact Wavefront (if he is still going) do a
> midi box for the theremin, but it's $600+.
> 
> Gerard xx 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.culturalamnesia.com 
> 
> http://www.myspace.com/ggreenway
> 
> 
> 
> SPELLBOUND-L, the glocal thereminist community
> 
> To contact the moderator, e-mail porphyrous@...
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 


SPELLBOUND-L, the glocal thereminist community

To contact the moderator, e-mail porphyrous@...




      

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http://www.culturalamnesia.com 

http://www.myspace.com/ggreenway

I think a sensible question to ask is how does your pitch to midi (or  
pitch to cv to midi) converter deal with glisses. Does it try to map  
the pitch to the nearest keyboard note, making the smooth gliss turn  
into a strummed harp, or does it do something clever with pitch bending?

My guess would that smooth glisses are going to be an option on high  
end models only.

Gordon

Quoting Gordon Charlton <gordon@...>:

> I think a sensible question to ask is how does your pitch to midi (or
> pitch to cv to midi) converter deal with glisses. Does it try to map
> the pitch to the nearest keyboard note, making the smooth gliss turn
> into a strummed harp, or does it do something clever with pitch bending?
>
> My guess would that smooth glisses are going to be an option on high
> end models only.
>
> Gordon

The Ethervox Theremin (very high end!) has different programs for MIDI.

The ethervox's imbedded software can produce CC (continuous controller) 
messages
that reproduce the glisses.  The Ethervox can also produce discrete
note-on/note-off messages for all or selected notes.  Peter Pringle describes
it as an "aerial autoharp".

The Paia Midi-brain that I mentioned in a previous post converts 
control voltage
to CC events.  Since I have a spare computer with MIDI interfaces, I 
can create
software that can map the CC messages to note-on/off messages.  Of course, for
live performance, such a setup would be cumbersome.

If I could even find an Ethervox for sale, it would cost around $5000 which is
uh... above my price point.  (that is, way wayyyyyy beyond my price point!)

I am convinced that the best way to make a small fortune in music is to start
out with a large fortune!  :)

On 23 May 2006, at 16:39, Gerard wrote:

> back in the
> industrial early 80s - I used to play the metal detector.
> This sounds very silly to most people, but will sound slightly less
> silly to thereminists.

That is so clever. I like it!

Gordon