Bc2000 (for the BCF2000 & BCR2000)

Hi

I think I may have a problem with my BCR2000, the trouble is I'm not sure if it's something that is normal because it is a Behringer product & I should expect it to have quirky behaviour or if I should try & return it to where I bought it. I think that it probably is broken but I wanted to check here to see what other people thought.

I'll try & describe what it is doing

The Edit/Store/Exit/Learn buttons don't always do what they should when I press them, it can sometimes be difficult to enter Global Setup by holding Edit then pressing Store - the Edit button doesn't light up when pressed & sometimes the Learn button will light up as I press Store. Occasionally the display will show PANc

Pressing Edit & turning any knob or pressing any button isn't taking me to any kind of edit mode.

Pressing Learn & turning a knob sometimes takes me into Global Setup (the Edit & Store buttons light up when it does)

The preset right button works ok, the left one is intermittent - usually I'm having to press the right one & turn encoder 1 to get back down the presets. Both of the buttons seem to function normally if I press store then try to select a destination preset.

The LEDs around the knobs seem to light up in sympathy when other knobs in that row are being turned, with all the knobs in a row on a different setting all the knobs have a halo of lit LEDs surrounding them. When I have been trying to set these LEDs up I've always been going for the 1d option.

I tried re-installing the firmware 1.10 to see if that would help but it hasn't made any difference.

What do you think, does it sound like this is broken?

I've only had it a couple of weeks, I bought it second hand. I could live with the LEDs being a bit funny but it's very frustrating trying to programme it with the Store/Edit/Learn/Exit buttons only working properly every now & then.

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "oversampler" <nice1ruari@...> wrote:
> The Edit/Store/Exit/Learn buttons don't always do what they should when I press them, it can sometimes be difficult to enter Global Setup by holding Edit then pressing Store - the Edit button doesn't light up when pressed & sometimes the Learn button will light up as I press Store. Occasionally the display will show PANc
> 
> Pressing Edit & turning any knob or pressing any button isn't taking me to any kind of edit mode.
> 
> Pressing Learn & turning a knob sometimes takes me into Global Setup (the Edit & Store buttons light up when it does)
> 
> The preset right button works ok, the left one is intermittent - usually I'm having to press the right one & turn encoder 1 to get back down the presets. Both of the buttons seem to function normally if I press store then try to select a destination preset.

I'm not completely sure, but all this does suggest to me there's indeed a hardware problem, maybe with one or more (sticky?) buttons.

However, you should be aware that a BCR preset may redefine the "special buttons" ("EDIT" etc.) as "normal" buttons, so then they don't perform their special functions.
From what you're saying, it doesn't seem like this is the case in your situation, but you can try this to make absolutely sure:
hold STORE and EXIT while switching the BCR on (i.e. by pressing POWER): this should lead to "Init" in the display briefly and a completely neutral/empty preset. (Of course this presupposes that the STORE and EXIT buttons do work...!)
See "BC MIDI Implementation.pdf", sections 22 and 23 for more tricks like this.

> The LEDs around the knobs seem to light up in sympathy when other knobs in that row are being turned, with all the knobs in a row on a different setting all the knobs have a halo of lit LEDs surrounding them. When I have been trying to set these LEDs up I've always been going for the 1d option.

You might try BC Manager's "Test hardware" routine, a kind of light show to test the LEDs.

> I tried re-installing the firmware 1.10 to see if that would help but it hasn't made any difference.

No, that can never help:
If the display shows "1.10" during startup, the firmware is guaranteed to be completely OK, because the BCR checks the checksum of the firmware: if there's any error, you get "noOS".

Hope this helps,
Mark.

Hi

Thanks for your reply, I've borrowed a Windows laptop to allow me to run BC Manager so I can try & get this unit properly setup.

When I tried holding Store & Exit on start up I did briefly see Init in the display, but, I still couldn't use the Edit or Learn buttons  to programme or edit any knobs or buttons. I would still get the kind of problems I listed in my first post.

Now I've managed to connect it up to this laptop with BC Manager I think I might be able to start getting somewhere with it - I ran the Hardware test & all the leds & buttons were flashing away so I don't know if that means I've possibly got a sticky button problem or something may have been spilled on the unit before I got it.

After I ran the hardware test I tried to see what, if anything, was programmed onto the Edit buttons. The BCR Layout view of BC Manager just has those buttons pinked out, if I double click on them the new window that opens doesn't give any info on what they are trying to do when I press them - so I'm thinking that perhaps the buttons are still programmed to their defaults but for some reason just aren't sending the correct signals when pressed, either due to spillage or something else occurring in it's past life.

I'm in two minds about what I should do next, if the only buttons I'm having any real kind of problem with are the Edit/Learn/Store/Exit buttons but I can bypass those by using BC Manager to programme the machine then maybe I'll be fine - on the other hand is this the tip of the iceberg & is there a potential of more problems creeping in over time.

If I was going to keep it then I will open the unit up to see if it needs a clean inside, I can't open it up if I'm going to send it back though.

Based on my findings there, what do you think? Should I just keep it & try to work around these problems?


Thanks

Are you able to use the USB connection OK or is it just the Midi connections?
Can you access the presets on the bcr using a manager software ie see what's installed on the BCR?
Was it new, used or B-stock?
Could be a memory chip problem( I think the memory chip is in a socket and can be changed)

Martin



________________________________

 From: oversampler <nice1ruari@hotmail.com>
To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 13:01
Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
 

  


Hi

Thanks for your reply, I've borrowed a Windows laptop to allow me to run BC Manager so I can try & get this unit properly setup.

When I tried holding Store & Exit on start up I did briefly see Init in the display, but, I still couldn't use the Edit or Learn buttons  to programme or edit any knobs or buttons. I would still get the kind of problems I listed in my first post.

Now I've managed to connect it up to this laptop with BC Manager I think I might be able to start getting somewhere with it - I ran the Hardware test & all the leds & buttons were flashing away so I don't know if that means I've possibly got a sticky button problem or something may have been spilled on the unit before I got it.

After I ran the hardware test I tried to see what, if anything, was programmed onto the Edit buttons. The BCR Layout view of BC Manager just has those buttons pinked out, if I double click on them the new window that opens doesn't give any info on what they are trying to do when I press them - so I'm thinking that perhaps the buttons are still programmed to their defaults but for some reason just aren't sending the correct signals when pressed, either due to spillage or something else occurring in it's past life.

I'm in two minds about what I should do next, if the only buttons I'm having any real kind of problem with are the Edit/Learn/Store/Exit buttons but I can bypass those by using BC Manager to programme the machine then maybe I'll be fine - on the other hand is this the tip of the iceberg & is there a potential of more problems creeping in over time.

If I was going to keep it then I will open the unit up to see if it needs a clean inside, I can't open it up if I'm going to send it back though.

Based on my findings there, what do you think? Should I just keep it & try to work around these problems?

Thanks

Yes, I can use USB or MIDI with my BCR2000.

I've borrowed a windows laptop so I can run BC Manager to access the presets, I have been able to tweak my settings this morning using BC Manager. When I first got the unit I tried to run BC Manager on my Mac but I couldn't get it to talk to the controller, it seems fine when I'm using the laptop though.

I bought it second hand, it was a private sale.

Where can I buy a new memory chip, what should I ask for?

Thanks

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, Martin Ator <cyllall@...> wrote:

>
> Are you able to use the USB connection OK or is it just the Midi connections?
> Can you access the presets on the bcr using a manager software ie see what's installed on the BCR?
> Was it new, used or B-stock?
> Could be a memory chip problem( I think the memory chip is in a socket and can be changed)
> 
> Martin
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
>  From: oversampler <nice1ruari@...>
> To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 13:01
> Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
>  
> 
> Â  
> 
> 
> Hi
> 
> Thanks for your reply, I've borrowed a Windows laptop to allow me to run BC Manager so I can try & get this unit properly setup.
> 
> When I tried holding Store & Exit on start up I did briefly see Init in the display, but, I still couldn't use the Edit or Learn buttons  to programme or edit any knobs or buttons. I would still get the kind of problems I listed in my first post.
> 
> Now I've managed to connect it up to this laptop with BC Manager I think I might be able to start getting somewhere with it - I ran the Hardware test & all the leds & buttons were flashing away so I don't know if that means I've possibly got a sticky button problem or something may have been spilled on the unit before I got it.
> 
> After I ran the hardware test I tried to see what, if anything, was programmed onto the Edit buttons. The BCR Layout view of BC Manager just has those buttons pinked out, if I double click on them the new window that opens doesn't give any info on what they are trying to do when I press them - so I'm thinking that perhaps the buttons are still programmed to their defaults but for some reason just aren't sending the correct signals when pressed, either due to spillage or something else occurring in it's past life.
> 
> I'm in two minds about what I should do next, if the only buttons I'm having any real kind of problem with are the Edit/Learn/Store/Exit buttons but I can bypass those by using BC Manager to programme the machine then maybe I'll be fine - on the other hand is this the tip of the iceberg & is there a potential of more problems creeping in over time.
> 
> If I was going to keep it then I will open the unit up to see if it needs a clean inside, I can't open it up if I'm going to send it back though.
> 
> Based on my findings there, what do you think? Should I just keep it & try to work around these problems?
> 
> Thanks
>

I might have a sniff inside mine and post some pictures if there aren't any around. It might not be a memory chip. If I remember there are 2 chips inside in sockets that could be replaced easily. After that it gets complicated.

Mine has a faulty USB controller which is common it seems.

Can you control synths and software mixer faders etc OK with it? Could be a problem with the led driver section if it outputs cc's OK etc.



________________________________
 From: oversampler <nice1ruari@...>
To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 14:19
Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
 

  


Yes, I can use USB or MIDI with my BCR2000.

I've borrowed a windows laptop so I can run BC Manager to access the presets, I have been able to tweak my settings this morning using BC Manager. When I first got the unit I tried to run BC Manager on my Mac but I couldn't get it to talk to the controller, it seems fine when I'm using the laptop though.

I bought it second hand, it was a private sale.

Where can I buy a new memory chip, what should I ask for?

Thanks

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, Martin Ator <cyllall@...> wrote:

>
> Are you able to use the USB connection OK or is it just the Midi connections?
> Can you access the presets on the bcr using a manager software ie see what's installed on the BCR?
> Was it new, used or B-stock?
> Could be a memory chip problem( I think the memory chip is in a socket and can be changed)
> 
> Martin
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
>  From: oversampler <nice1ruari@...>
> To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 13:01
> Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
> 
> 
> Â  
> 
> 
> Hi
> 
> Thanks for your reply, I've borrowed a Windows laptop to allow me to run BC Manager so I can try & get this unit properly setup.
> 
> When I tried holding Store & Exit on start up I did briefly see Init in the display, but, I still couldn't use the Edit or Learn buttons  to programme or edit any knobs or buttons. I would still get the kind of problems I listed in my first post.
> 
> Now I've managed to connect it up to this laptop with BC Manager I think I might be able to start getting somewhere with it - I ran the Hardware test & all the leds & buttons were flashing away so I don't know if that means I've possibly got a sticky button problem or something may have been spilled on the unit before I got it.
> 
> After I ran the hardware test I tried to see what, if anything, was programmed onto the Edit buttons. The BCR Layout view of BC Manager just has those buttons pinked out, if I double click on them the new window that opens doesn't give any info on what they are trying to do when I press them - so I'm thinking that perhaps the buttons are still programmed to their defaults but for some reason just aren't sending the correct signals when pressed, either due to spillage or something else occurring in it's past life.
> 
> I'm in two minds about what I should do next, if the only buttons I'm having any real kind of problem with are the Edit/Learn/Store/Exit buttons but I can bypass those by using BC Manager to programme the machine then maybe I'll be fine - on the other hand is this the tip of the iceberg & is there a potential of more problems creeping in over time.
> 
> If I was going to keep it then I will open the unit up to see if it needs a clean inside, I can't open it up if I'm going to send it back though.
> 
> Based on my findings there, what do you think? Should I just keep it & try to work around these problems?
> 
> Thanks
>

My mistake, the only chip in a socket holds the OS



________________________________
 From: Martin Ator <cyllall@...>
To: "bc2000@yahoogroups.com" <bc2000@yahoogroups.com> 
Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 14:25
Subject: Re: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
 

  
I might have a sniff inside mine and post some pictures if there aren't any around. It might not be a memory chip. If I remember there are 2 chips inside in sockets that could be replaced easily. After that it gets complicated.

Mine has a faulty USB controller which is common it seems.

Can you control synths and software mixer faders etc OK with it? Could be a problem with the led driver section if it outputs cc's OK etc.



________________________________
 From: oversampler <nice1ruari@...>
To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 14:19
Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
 

  


Yes, I can use USB or MIDI with my BCR2000.

I've borrowed a windows laptop so I can run BC Manager to access the presets, I have been able to tweak my settings this morning using BC Manager. When I first got the unit I tried to run BC Manager on my Mac but I couldn't get it to talk to the controller, it seems fine when I'm using the laptop though.

I bought it second hand, it was a private sale.

Where can I buy a new memory chip, what should I ask for?

Thanks

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, Martin Ator <cyllall@...> wrote:

>
> Are you able to use the USB connection OK or is it just the Midi connections?
> Can you access the presets on the bcr using a manager software ie see what's installed on the BCR?
> Was it new, used or B-stock?
> Could be a memory chip problem( I think the memory chip is in a socket and can be changed)
> 
> Martin
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
>  From: oversampler <nice1ruari@...>
> To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 13:01
> Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
> 
> 
> Â  
> 
> 
> Hi
> 
> Thanks for your reply, I've borrowed a Windows laptop to allow me to run BC Manager so I can try & get this unit properly setup.
> 
> When I tried holding Store & Exit on start up I did briefly see Init in the display, but, I still couldn't use the Edit or Learn buttons  to programme or edit any knobs or buttons. I would still get the kind of problems I listed in my first post.
> 
> Now I've managed to connect it up to this laptop with BC Manager I think I might be able to start getting somewhere with it - I ran the Hardware test & all the leds & buttons were flashing away so I don't know if that means I've possibly got a sticky button problem or something may have been spilled on the unit before I got it.
> 
> After I ran the hardware test I tried to see what, if anything, was programmed onto the Edit buttons. The BCR Layout view of BC Manager just has those buttons pinked out, if I double click on them the new window that opens doesn't give any info on what they are trying to do when I press them - so I'm thinking that perhaps the buttons are still programmed to their defaults but for some reason just aren't sending the correct signals when pressed, either due to spillage or something else occurring in it's past life.
> 
> I'm in two minds about what I should do next, if the only buttons I'm having any real kind of problem with are the Edit/Learn/Store/Exit buttons but I can bypass those by using BC Manager to programme the machine then maybe I'll be fine - on the other hand is this the tip of the iceberg & is there a potential of more problems creeping in over time.
> 
> If I was going to keep it then I will open the unit up to see if it needs a clean inside, I can't open it up if I'm going to send it back though.
> 
> Based on my findings there, what do you think? Should I just keep it & try to work around these problems?
> 
> Thanks
>

No worries.

Yes I can control everything I've tried to so far with it, I've also managed to programme Sysex knobs & buttons via Sysex Librarian. With BC Manager I've been able to limit both the resolution & the ranges being transmitted by the knobs - which has made a huge difference in some cases.

It would be nice if the LEDs were working a bit better but I can live with the LEDs round the knobs being a bit temperamental, so I'd say my biggest issue now seems to be with the function buttons - is there anything I might need them for that I wouldn't be able to do with BC Manager?

I think I'm going to have to buy a cheapy laptop just to use with BC Manager, it's been so much quicker & easier for me when I've been able to use it - please bring out a Mac OS X version.

I've posted some photos to the group. While taking the photos I noticed loads of crappy soldering so I've just re-soldered about 100 joints just on one board, still haven't finished.(I am amazed that mine could work like this)


You might have badly soldered joins on an encoder or two, or you may have a slightly loose cable ( they are hot glued in to stop them coming loose )

Martin



________________________________

 From: oversampler <nice1ruari@...>
To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 15:08
Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
 

  


No worries.

Yes I can control everything I've tried to so far with it, I've also managed to programme Sysex knobs & buttons via Sysex Librarian. With BC Manager I've been able to limit both the resolution & the ranges being transmitted by the knobs - which has made a huge difference in some cases.

It would be nice if the LEDs were working a bit better but I can live with the LEDs round the knobs being a bit temperamental, so I'd say my biggest issue now seems to be with the function buttons - is there anything I might need them for that I wouldn't be able to do with BC Manager?

I think I'm going to have to buy a cheapy laptop just to use with BC Manager, it's been so much quicker & easier for me when I've been able to use it - please bring out a Mac OS X version.

Just a final note. I'm guessing that the leds are controlled by the cpu and are not connected directly to the encoder itself. Are the leds on the top section OK ie the row with the LED display next to them or is there a problem with every one of them?
If it's only a few then it could be just a single ic with a problem on one of the 2 encoder boards

                      



________________________________

 From: oversampler <nice1ruari@...>
To: bc2000@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012, 15:08
Subject: [bc2000] Re: Does my BCR2000 sound like it's broken?
 

  


No worries.

Yes I can control everything I've tried to so far with it, I've also managed to programme Sysex knobs & buttons via Sysex Librarian. With BC Manager I've been able to limit both the resolution & the ranges being transmitted by the knobs - which has made a huge difference in some cases.

It would be nice if the LEDs were working a bit better but I can live with the LEDs round the knobs being a bit temperamental, so I'd say my biggest issue now seems to be with the function buttons - is there anything I might need them for that I wouldn't be able to do with BC Manager?

I think I'm going to have to buy a cheapy laptop just to use with BC Manager, it's been so much quicker & easier for me when I've been able to use it - please bring out a Mac OS X version.

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "oversampler" <nice1ruari@...> wrote:
> When I tried holding Store & Exit on start up I did briefly see Init in the display, but, I still couldn't use the Edit or Learn buttons  to programme or edit any knobs or buttons. I would still get the kind of problems I listed in my first post.

To me this strongly suggests that these buttons (or the hardware controlling them) are defective.

> Now I've managed to connect it up to this laptop with BC Manager I think I might be able to start getting somewhere with it - I ran the Hardware test & all the leds & buttons were flashing away so I don't know if that means I've possibly got a sticky button problem or something may have been spilled on the unit before I got it.

In BC Manager's "Test hardware" mode you can also press buttons (and rotate knobs) manually (you don't even have to press "Start").
E.g. pressing any button should toggle the LEDs of ALL the buttons. This way you may be able to find out which buttons exactly are defective.

> After I ran the hardware test I tried to see what, if anything, was programmed onto the Edit buttons.

In which preset?
Remember that you should synchronize BC Manager's "temporary" (current) preset (also called "preset 0") with the BCR's temporary preset - one way or the other, literally!

> The BCR Layout view of BC Manager just has those buttons pinked out, if I double click on them the new window that opens doesn't give any info on what they are trying to do when I press them - so I'm thinking that perhaps the buttons are still programmed to their defaults but for some reason just aren't sending the correct signals when pressed, either due to spillage or something else occurring in it's past life.

Pink means that these buttons are being used as "special" keys (Edit, Store etc.). In this situation these buttons never send out any MIDI data: they just perform actions locally on the BCR.

The color changes to "normal" when you change the preset's "Function of function/preset keys" on the Settings tab in the Preset dialog box: then these buttons become "ordinary" (assignable) buttons.
(And again: don't forget to synchronize the BCR itself to any changes you make.)

Hope this helps,
Mark.

> In BC Manager's "Test hardware" mode you can also press buttons (and rotate knobs) manually (you don't even have to press "Start").
> E.g. pressing any button should toggle the LEDs of ALL the buttons. This way you may be able to find out which buttons exactly are defective.


Right, I didn't notice I could test like that - here's my results

All rotary knobs - ok
Top row push function not responding - 2, 3, 5
1st row buttons not responding - 2, 3, 5
2nd row buttons not responding - 2, 3, 5
Encoder group buttons not responding - top right, bottom left
Function buttons not responding - edit, learn
Preset button not working - left
Last group of 4 buttons not working - top left


Seeing it like that, I'm thinking that's quite a long list of buttons not working as they should - there's a bit of a pattern to it though.

I still haven't opened the unit up in case I'm going to send it back but now I think it's crunch time for it - with all your help I feel we've managed to really zone in to the problem, but now I feel I can't go any further unless I open it up.

Do you think it's something I might be able to fix or would I be better off trying to get my money back & buying another one elsewhere?

Yes, the top row of LEDs does seem to be ok - it's the bottom 3 rows that seem to be affected the most when I turn knobs, but it's only the LEDs on the same row which are affected by the turning.

All the screwheads look fine, none of them have had the paint scratched off them & there is no marks around them to suggest someone has taken a screwdriver to them.

I'll email the guy I bought it from to see what we can do.


Thanks

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, Martin Ator <cyllall@...> wrote:
> If you can send it back, then I think that would be the best thing to do.

I totally agree.
If it was just one or two buttons, you might live with it, but not this.
And given the severity of the problem and the fact that even new BCRs are very cheap, I doubt very much whether it would be worth the time and effort to try to fix it.

A small tip if you want to open the BCR at any point in time:
to avoid breaking the tabs on the side panels, see "How to open a B-Control.pdf" at http://home.kpn.nl/f2hmjvandenberg281/bc2000.html .

Mark.

I've been in touch with the guy I bought it from & he's willing to take it back & refund me.

In the meantime I'll look into getting a replacement for it, hopefully I'll have a bit more luck with the next one.

Thanks for all your help with this guys.

I really appreciate it.



Ruari

Hi, 

Best care tips : 

 - eventually remove the side panels for easier access
 - get yourself compressed air; like they got in diving bottles
 - blow away all dust and dirt 
 - use teflon on the outside / contact spray on the inside
 - do not use contact-spray in excessive amounts
 - let dry for a few hours

After this maintenance; your buttons might be working again. 

If not; there might be a soldering which went bad or a button not making contact as it should.

With friendly regards,

Gunther / Freaking Wildchild.

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "oversampler" <nice1ruari@...> wrote:

>
> Hi
> 
> I think I may have a problem with my BCR2000, the trouble is I'm not sure if it's something that is normal because it is a Behringer product & I should expect it to have quirky behaviour or if I should try & return it to where I bought it. I think that it probably is broken but I wanted to check here to see what other people thought.
> 
> I'll try & describe what it is doing
> 
> The Edit/Store/Exit/Learn buttons don't always do what they should when I press them, it can sometimes be difficult to enter Global Setup by holding Edit then pressing Store - the Edit button doesn't light up when pressed & sometimes the Learn button will light up as I press Store. Occasionally the display will show PANc
> 
> Pressing Edit & turning any knob or pressing any button isn't taking me to any kind of edit mode.
> 
> Pressing Learn & turning a knob sometimes takes me into Global Setup (the Edit & Store buttons light up when it does)
> 
> The preset right button works ok, the left one is intermittent - usually I'm having to press the right one & turn encoder 1 to get back down the presets. Both of the buttons seem to function normally if I press store then try to select a destination preset.
> 
> The LEDs around the knobs seem to light up in sympathy when other knobs in that row are being turned, with all the knobs in a row on a different setting all the knobs have a halo of lit LEDs surrounding them. When I have been trying to set these LEDs up I've always been going for the 1d option.
> 
> I tried re-installing the firmware 1.10 to see if that would help but it hasn't made any difference.
> 
> What do you think, does it sound like this is broken?
> 
> I've only had it a couple of weeks, I bought it second hand. I could live with the LEDs being a bit funny but it's very frustrating trying to programme it with the Store/Edit/Learn/Exit buttons only working properly every now & then.
>

Hi

I'm returning the unit that I have now & replacing it with another so I'm going to leave this one as it is - I can't risk opening it up & potentially damaging it any further.

Thanks for the tips though.


Ruari