EXS 24 Logic Sampler Users Group

Message posted by ALEX BIAGI <alexdbiagi@...>:

hi all, im new here been using logic for about 3 years now, and i produce
trance and house music.  I was wondering how to make a really good kick.  i
use ultrabeat house or trance presets but cant seem to figure out to make it
really stand out from the rest of the track.  anyone have a good templete on
how to make a kick that will soud good on club speakers?  if so it would be
much appreciated.  my sound ok but not quite up to pro standards, like the
rest of my productions are.  or if anyone has basic 4 on the floor kicks
already made i would love a aiff file of it if posible:) thx all.

Take Care

Message posted by ALEX BIAGI <alexdbiagi@...>:

hi all, im new here been using logic for about 3 years now, and i produce
trance and house music.  I was wondering how to make a really good kick.  i
use ultrabeat house or trance presets but cant seem to figure out to make it
really stand out from the rest of the track.  anyone have a good templete on
how to make a kick that will soud good on club speakers?  if so it would be
much appreciated.  my sound ok but not quite up to pro standards, like the
rest of my productions are.  or if anyone has basic 4 on the floor kicks
already made i would love a aiff file of it if posible:) thx all.

Take Care



I'm no house producer, but I'd layer a 909 kick with a bright acoustic kick
to get the attack of the acoustic and the thud of the 909.  Put a highpass
EQ on the acoustic kick to roll off the low end so you just get the high
end. You might even stick a third one in there that has some other good
characteristics.  Just duplicate your MIDI track and off you go into layer
land.

Regards,
Lenny

Lenny Stearns wrote:
> Message posted by ALEX BIAGI <alexdbiagi@...>:
> 
> hi all, im new here been using logic for about 3 years now, and i produce
> trance and house music.  I was wondering how to make a really good kick.  i
> use ultrabeat house or trance presets but cant seem to figure out to make it
> really stand out from the rest of the track.  anyone have a good templete on
> how to make a kick that will soud good on club speakers?  if so it would be
> much appreciated.  my sound ok but not quite up to pro standards, like the
> rest of my productions are.  or if anyone has basic 4 on the floor kicks
> already made i would love a aiff file of it if posible:) thx all.
> 
> Take Care
> 
> 
> 
> I'm no house producer, but I'd layer a 909 kick with a bright acoustic kick
> to get the attack of the acoustic and the thud of the 909.  Put a highpass
> EQ on the acoustic kick to roll off the low end so you just get the high
> end. You might even stick a third one in there that has some other good
> characteristics.  Just duplicate your MIDI track and off you go into layer
> land.

I'd also put some distortion on the 909.

-- 
Pete Thomas
www.petethomas.co.uk

Logic Tutorials, Hints, Tips, free Icons, Environments
EXS Instruments (donationware)

***Please support my trek in the Andes in aid of APEC***
***info & sponsorship: http://www.justgiving.com/petethomas***

Hi,

You might also want to try using your kick drum as a trigger for a
bass synth sound to give it extra OOMPH. Gate it.

On Sep ,4, 2006, at 6:45 PM, ALEX BIAGI wrote:

> Message posted by ALEX BIAGI <alexdbiagi@...>:
>
>  hi all, im new here been using logic for about 3 years now, and i 
> produce
>  trance and house music. I was wondering how to make a really good 
> kick. i
>  use ultrabeat house or trance presets but cant seem to figure out to 
> make it
>  really stand out from the rest of the track. anyone have a good 
> templete on
>  how to make a kick that will soud good on club speakers?

Hi Alex,

Try this:

* Sequence up a long sustained note through the whole song. A low note, 
on maybe a C1 or something like that.

* Play it back on an EXS 24 track with no sound loaded ion, so you are 
triggering the default sine wave, in a very low register.

* Put a Logic noise gate plugin on that EXS track with the sine wave.

* Set the side chain input of the gate to the kik drum track. If that 
kick drum track is another audio instrument track instrument, you'll 
need to assign it's output to a bus in order to be available as a side 
chain input source.

* Keep the release and hold parameters on the gate at fairly low values 
in order to keep the triggered sine wave nice and short and tight.

* Mix it in with the regular kik.


--------
Eli Krantzberg
http://www.nightshiftorchestra.com
Almat Productions

>
> Hi Alex,
>
> Try this:
>
> * Sequence up a long sustained note through the whole song. A low  
> note,
> on maybe a C1 or something like that.
>
> * Play it back on an EXS 24 track with no sound loaded ion, so you are
> triggering the default sine wave, in a very low register.
>
> * Put a Logic noise gate plugin on that EXS track with the sine wave.
>
> * Set the side chain input of the gate to the kik drum track. If that
> kick drum track is another audio instrument track instrument, you'll
> need to assign it's output to a bus in order to be available as a side
> chain input source.
>
> * Keep the release and hold parameters on the gate at fairly low  
> values
> in order to keep the triggered sine wave nice and short and tight.
>
> * Mix it in with the regular kik.
>
> --------
> Eli Krantzberg

Hi Eli,
I have tried things like this in the past with mixed results. The  
main problem I came up against when doing this, was that the phase  
relationship of the low wave, was not consistent at various trigger  
points... and you could also get some clicking if the zero crossing  
wasn't there when the low wave was opened.
Also, you need to have 'chase notes' active.
I found it much easier to simply trigger a new exs, with the low  
wave, with the same midi data as the original kick and vary the delay  
of the midi regions with the extended region parameters delay  
setting, until a happy place was found! ;-)


Best Regards,
Matt
_   _   _  _ _    ___  __ _   _ _______________

MATT MCKENZIE-SMITH
MUSIC � AUDIO DESIGN � PRODUCTION
PO Box 10395, Adelaide 5000, South Australia.
Ph.+61 416 197 883
iCHATav.  mattrixx@mac.com
http://www.mattrixx.net
_ _   ___  _      ____  _  _ ________________





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Sep ,5, 2006, at 7:55 PM, Matt McKenzie-Smith wrote:

> Hi Eli,
> I have tried things like this in the past with mixed results. The
> main problem I came up against when doing this, was that the phase
> relationship of the low wave, was not consistent at various trigger
> points... and you could also get some clicking if the zero crossing
> wasn't there when the low wave was opened.
> Also, you need to have 'chase notes' active.
> I found it much easier to simply trigger a new exs, with the low
> wave, with the same midi data as the original kick and vary the delay
> of the midi regions with the extended region parameters delay
> setting, until a happy place was found! ;-)

I've only tried it on short loops and didn't notice any phasing or 
chase problems. Your idea of duplicating the midi data to trigger the 
sine wave is a good idea for solving the potential chase problems. I 
didn't notice any delay problems either. Can't you use the attack 
setting on the gate to negotiate that. I have always used very low 
attack times - almost zero, so as to have the sine wave attack happen 
right in time with the main transient of the kik drum.


--------
Eli Krantzberg
http://www.nightshiftorchestra.com
Almat Productions

>
> I've only tried it on short loops and didn't notice any phasing or
> chase problems. Your idea of duplicating the midi data to trigger the
> sine wave is a good idea for solving the potential chase problems. I
> didn't notice any delay problems either. Can't you use the attack
> setting on the gate to negotiate that. I have always used very low
> attack times - almost zero, so as to have the sine wave attack happen
> right in time with the main transient of the kik drum.
>
> --------
> Eli Krantzberg

Hi Eli,
There are no rules of course.. I like the idea you suggest to  
manipulate the attack time, so as to only enhance the back end of the  
kick.
I think the point I was trying to make yesterday, was in relation to  
layering and maintaining phase relationship. I seen some people layer  
up some kicks only to have them disappear in the low end, because  
they added two opposing low frequency waveforms. By shifting one of  
the waveforms, by ms or ticks, you can get things back on track...  
that is, if you desperately need to use those exact waveforms.

Best Regards,
Matt
_   _   _  _ _    ___  __ _   _ _______________

MATT MCKENZIE-SMITH
MUSIC � AUDIO DESIGN � PRODUCTION
PO Box 10395, Adelaide 5000, South Australia.
Ph.+61 416 197 883
iCHATav.  mattrixx@...
http://www.mattrixx.net
_ _   ___  _      ____  _  _ ________________





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Matt McKenzie-Smith wrote:
>> I've only tried it on short loops and didn't notice any phasing or
>> chase problems. Your idea of duplicating the midi data to trigger the
>> sine wave is a good idea for solving the potential chase problems. I
>> didn't notice any delay problems either. Can't you use the attack
>> setting on the gate to negotiate that. I have always used very low
>> attack times - almost zero, so as to have the sine wave attack happen
>> right in time with the main transient of the kik drum.
>>
>> --------
>> Eli Krantzberg
> 
> Hi Eli,
> There are no rules of course.. I like the idea you suggest to  
> manipulate the attack time, so as to only enhance the back end of the  
> kick.
> I think the point I was trying to make yesterday, was in relation to  
> layering and maintaining phase relationship. I seen some people layer  
> up some kicks only to have them disappear in the low end, because  
> they added two opposing low frequency waveforms. By shifting one of  
> the waveforms, by ms or ticks, you can get things back on track...  
> that is, if you desperately need to use those exact waveforms.
> 

Eh just buy a TR-909 and run it through a Sherman Filterbank or some 
nice fat distortion.
Instant house gratification the way it was really done before every 'dj' 
owned a laptop and a cracked Ableton Live!!

-- 
Chris

http://www.monotrematamusic.com
http://www.myspace.com/monotremata
http://www.descentrecords.com

Message posted by ALEX BIAGI <alexdbiagi@...>:

THX a ton all. got some really good info, time to start experamenting.  appreciate all the help :) 

take care

Alex